John McDonnell
Main Page: John McDonnell (Labour - Hayes and Harlington)Local Audit and Accountability Bill [Lords]
John McDonnell Excerpts(10 years, 5 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text
John McDonnell (Hayes and Harlington) (Lab)
I wish to speak to new clauses 4 to 6, which stand in my name, and, without wanting to stray from the procedural rules of the House, I may refer to new clause 3, which has not been selected, but I assure you, Mr Deputy Speaker, that it will be a fleeting reference.
As has been said, on Second Reading I referred to the Transparency International report on the potential for corruption in local government. I circulated the report to all Members in advance of this debate and I am grateful that the Minister took up my suggestion to meet Transparency International and that the report became a subject of debate in Committee.
I tabled these new clauses to draw attention to some of the issues raised by the Transparency International report and to seek at least an element of forward momentum with regard to addressing these issues in future. It is critical that we maintain the confidence of the general public in the administration of local government. I think that Transparency International has helped us greatly, although its report says that it is very difficult to identify evidence other than anecdotal evidence about the level of corruption that may exist in UK local government. I believe we all share the view that the vast majority of councillors and council officials do an excellent job to a very high standard of probity and efficiency. Nevertheless, we are plagued with anecdotal information about elements of local government and with doubts about corruption.
Given the lack of data on corruption in local government collected at national level or any other level, Transparency International looks at the systems implemented to make sure that corruption does not take place. Its report says:
“Here, a disturbing picture emerges, and one on which experts and interviewees”
in the study
“were agreed. On the one hand, the conditions are present in which corruption is likely to thrive—low levels of transparency, poor external scrutiny, networks of cronyism, reluctance or lack of resource to investigate, outsourcing of public services, significant sums of money at play and perhaps a denial that corruption is an issue at all.”
My new clauses address those key elements. First, lack of transparency relates to new clause 3, which has not been selected, so I will not dwell on it. On Second Reading, I gave the example of my own local authority—this may happen elsewhere, so I would welcome the views of other Members—regularly putting items in part 2 of its agenda on the basis of spurious commercial confidentiality. When the find of prehistoric flints on one of my sites was reported in part 2 of the agenda, I joked in a previous debate that commercial confidentiality might have been important 3,000 years ago, but it is not now. It is, however, becoming a regular way of stifling debate and of preventing issues from being reported in the local media.
I believe—this is why I tabled new clause 3—that we need to address that. Central Government need to be clear about how often it is happening in local government and about the scale of its use and whether it is being used appropriately. They also need to address whether they have a role to play in providing further and better guidelines on how part 2 items should be addressed and on how items should be deemed to be commercially confidential or otherwise for the purposes of part 2 of the cabinet system.
That relates to the overall system. Under the previous Government’s local government reforms, which I opposed, we now have quite a centralised local council system whereby the leader is elected and then appoints the cabinet. They are all on a relatively high income these days. I do not begrudge anyone being paid the rate for the job, but the leader of the council in my area is on £65,000 a year and is appointing other members of the cabinet on salaries of between £45,000 and £55,000 a year. That gives the leader extremely wide-ranging powers of patronage and it is the leader who decides which items go into the confidential part of the cabinet agenda. They do so after being given some advice, about which I also have concerns, which I will come to.
That centralisation of decision making is dangerous and has the potential to result in not just poor decision making and lack of transparency, but corrupt decision making. That level of centralised control is part of the problem we now have. One of the issues thrown up by Transparency International’s report is that, structurally, we have opened ourselves up to decisions being made by a very limited number of councillors, with limited scrutiny by others. Whatever people thought of the old committee system—to be frank, it might well have been relatively slow at times—it was more open, democratic and transparent.
John McDonnell
I am grateful to the Minister for that information and for his offer of co-operation. Does he have figures for the number of staff employed to investigate fraud in local government in, say, 2007-08 compared with the number employed in that area during the past year?
Brandon Lewis
I cannot give the hon. Gentleman those figures off the top of my head, but I will come back to him on that if he will bear with me.
New clause 6 would require the Secretary of State to report to Parliament on the use by local authorities of compromise agreements that involve confidentiality clauses in relation to staff exiting their organisation. I know that the hon. Gentleman feels strongly about this issue and that he raised it on Second Reading. During that debate, he expressed concern that, if used inappropriately, confidentiality clauses could unreasonably restrict officers’ ability to provide full and frank advice to local members and to protect the public interest. Officers, including those exiting an organisation, must have proper opportunities to provide such advice and to raise concerns. The Secretary of State has made clear his view that so-called gagging clauses should not be used to undermine that principle, and I am happy to reiterate that view today.
The use of compromise agreements in the public sector was recently the subject of a report by the National Audit Office and was also scrutinised by the Public Accounts Committee. Further to this, the Government agreed that there should be greater transparency and accountability on the use of compromise agreements across the whole of the public sector, including local authorities. Importantly, the law is quite clear that compromise agreements—in which an agreement is reached to contract out of statutory employment rights—can be made only when the employee has had access to independent advice on the terms and effect of the proposed agreement.
Furthermore, confidentiality clauses cannot be used to prevent a protected disclosure under the Public Interest Disclosure Act 1998. The Government have recently undertaken a call for evidence to look at whistleblowing, and specifically at whether there is enough support for people who wish to report wrongdoing. The Government will respond to the call for evidence early in the new year. I hope that I have been able to reassure the House that the Government take this matter seriously and are taking action on it.
John McDonnell
I am grateful for that information, but may I suggest that that review of whistleblowing should pay specific attention to the use of compromise agreements, particularly within local government? I do not think that that has been explored or taken into account sufficiently so far.
Brandon Lewis
The hon. Gentleman makes a fair point, and he will appreciate that it is now noted and on record. I hope that I have been able to provide sufficient assurances to persuade him not to press his new clauses and amendments to a vote.
I shall not detain the House for long on Government amendments 1 to 5. Amendment 1 would require an authority to include the period of the auditor’s appointment in the public notice confirming the appointment of the auditor. Clause 8 requires authorities to publish such a notice within 28 days of making the appointment. The hon. Member for Corby will recall that he tabled a similar amendment in Committee and suggested that it would be helpful for the public to know the term of the auditor’s appointment. It was also suggested that knowing when the existing contract would end would be useful to potential bidders for any new appointment.
There was a similar discussion in the other place, where Lord McKenzie tabled an amendment to require that information on the term of appointment should be included in the published notice. At the time, the Government expressed sympathy with the intentions of the amendment, but questioned whether such a requirement needed to be set out in legislation, because it could simply be a matter of good practice and guidance. However, having considered the case further, and in the light of the points made by the hon. Member for Corby in Committee, the Government accept that it might be useful to put the matter beyond doubt through this amendment.
Amendment 2 is a minor and technical amendment to ensure that references throughout the Bill cover subordinate legislation made under part 42 of the Companies Act 2006, as applied by schedule 5 to the Bill. It will make it clear that provisions on eligibility and regulation apply to the whole local audit regime.
Amendment 3 removes from schedule 2 internal drainage boards that are partly in England and partly in Wales. There are two such boards: Powysland and Lower Wye. Both are mainly in Wales but currently fall under the Audit Commission regime. The local audit provisions in the Bill will therefore not apply to those cross-border internal drainage boards after the Audit Commission is abolished. The Welsh Government intend to transfer the functions of the two cross-border IDBs, along with the functions of one IDB that is wholly in Wales, to a single body, Natural Resources Wales, and to bring them under the Welsh audit system. They intend to do this by the time the Audit Commission is abolished—by April 2015. Both bodies will continue to fall under the Audit Commission regime until then.
The Welsh Government supported a legislative consent motion to make audit arrangements for the two bodies under the Bill as a stopgap measure until the new governance arrangements are in place. However, the legislative consent motion was not passed by the National Assembly for Wales. As a result, in line with the devolution settlement, the amendment removes these two bodies from schedule 2. Welsh Ministers have agreed that we should retain the power in clause 2 as a backstop power to add cross-border bodies back into schedule 2 by regulations at a later date, should the transfer of functions take longer than expected. Regulations made under this power will be subject to consultation and the affirmative procedure, and would require consent from the National Assembly for Wales.
Amendment 4 is a minor amendment to clarify that paragraph 6(1) of schedule 4 does not apply in the case of health bodies. The paragraph currently provides that, when an authority uses an existing committee as its auditor panel, wider enactments that usually apply to committees of a local authority do not apply. A corresponding power in paragraph 5 then allows such enactments to be positively applied to the panel, to ensure that arrangements remain proportionate, given the panel’s limited role.
In the case of health bodies, however, their audit committees are covered by a specific existing framework, which is different from that applied to local authority committees. That framework reflects the different governance framework for health bodies such as clinical commissioning groups, and will need to continue to apply in full, even when the committee is acting as the panel. As drafted, paragraph 6 of schedule 4 could have the unintended consequence of disapplying that existing framework for audit committees within health bodies when they are acting as the auditor panel. The amendment therefore excludes health bodies from this provision.
Amendment 5 further modifies schedule 10 to the Companies Act 2006, as applied by schedule 5, in respect of auditors qualified in other European economic area countries. It has two main effects in respect of those individuals. First, it will enable the recognised supervisory bodies for local audit to recognise the qualifications of those auditors who hold the equivalent of a UK local audit qualification obtained elsewhere in the EEA. This is necessary to comply with the requirements of the recognition of professional qualifications directive, 2005/36/EC.
Secondly, the amendment specifies that recognised supervisory bodies can require an EEA statutory auditor to pass an aptitude test only if the auditor is seeking to become established as a local auditor in the UK on a permanent basis. The audit directive, which makes provision for an aptitude test, applies only to statutory audit. Unlike the audit directive, however, the recognition of professional qualifications directive does not permit the imposition of an aptitude test if an individual is seeking to provide services on a temporary and occasional basis. The amendment therefore seeks to align the regulatory frameworks for statutory and local auditors, as far as is permitted.
The amendment will also ensure that any indirect discrimination against EEA auditors is avoided and that the requirements for EEA local auditors and EEA statutory auditors are as consistent as possible. It will also ensure that a firm is qualified if it is eligible for appointment as a local or statutory auditor or is eligible for a corresponding appointment. I urge the House to support the Government’s amendments.
Andy Sawford
I am going to make some progress, because the hon. Gentleman spoke extensively on these provisions in Committee and made us more, not less, concerned.
Amendment 15 seeks to delete the astonishing new subsection I mentioned, to extend the time that the authority has to respond to evidence of a breach of the code to 28 days from 14, and, crucially, to require the Secretary of State to publish a report detailing his conclusions, having considered the response from the authority. That seems to us to be a very reasonable amendment that enshrines an evidential basis for taking any action in relation to the code. Amendment 16 seeks to delete the whole of proposed new section 4B, as we feel it is overly proactive meddling from the Secretary of State. We will seek to press amendment 15 to a vote. I hope that hon. Members on both sides of the House will consider it reasonable that if the Government must press ahead with these powers, there is at least a requirement for the process to be evidence-led, for councils to have the right to make representations and for the Secretary of State to publish his findings before any action is taken.
I end by asking the Minister, one more time, to try to persuade us that this approach is necessary by saying how he thinks that the Opposition, the cross-party, Conservative-led Local Government Association, Liberal Democrat-run and Tory-run councils all around the country, the National Association of Local Councils, the National Union of Journalists and my constituents in east Northamptonshire, who are so upset about the end of the Nene Valley News, are all wrong and he is right. Even if he still thinks he is right, can he explain, as someone who purports to be a localist, why it is right to impose central Government’s will? This clause is worthy of a crackpot dictatorship.
John McDonnell
This is barmy. It is absolutely crackers that we are spending parliamentary time on this matter. I receive Hillingdon People from my Conservative-controlled local authority. On virtually every page, there is a picture of a smiling Conservative councillor pointing at something, standing on something or expressing some view. Interspersed with the smiling photographs is genuine information about what is happening in the local community. People tell me that the newspaper is an ideal size for lining a hamster cage, so it serves some useful purpose in the local area.
Today, the Government have announced the commission report on the expansion of aviation, which includes the threat to my constituency from the third runway. I have been assured that there will be cross-party opposition on my council to the Government’s proposals. We will use Hillingdon People to explain the proposals that have been introduced. We have used it in the past to explain the proposals of all political parties. Undoubtedly, views will be expressed by councillors on a cross-party basis condemning the commission’s proposals and, almost certainly, the Government’s approach. Does that mean that we will then be hauled before the Secretary of State to be advised on the words that we can use about this matter and on the way in which Hillingdon People will be used?
The one good thing about local newspapers is that they reflect local opinion. There might be an overbalance of photographs of a certain party, but for all that they are a useful tool in mobilising local opinion around a local issue, and they are campaigning tools for a local authority in genuinely reflecting the views of the local populace who elected them.
My local council has certainly consulted local people and supported local meetings to ensure that people can express their views on the extension of Heathrow. It has then reflected those views in Hillingdon People, and launched campaigns on the basis of what local people have said. At my last public meeting on this matter, a campaign called “Back Heathrow” was spuriously launched by the aviation industry to support Heathrow airport expansion. It was completely funded by Heathrow airport and run by its public relations agency. People then said to me that Hillingdon People should be used to put out accurate information, rather than the spurious propaganda that the airport was putting out. I am anxious that my local authority, which will go on the stump on this issue, may be debarred from using Hillingdon People to explain what its views are and to campaign against the expansion of Heathrow airport.
I would be grateful to the Minister if we heard his views. By the looks of it, he will now be the editor-in-chief of Hillingdon People, so I would welcome his views now before we put a foot wrong. Is it in order, under this Bill, for Hillingdon council to use Hillingdon People to campaign against Heathrow expansion and to disseminate information that will be opposed to the commission’s views and what seems to be the emerging view about a third runway at Heathrow?
Chris Williamson
I rise to speak against this Orwellian clause and in favour of the amendment tabled by my hon. Friend the Member for Corby (Andy Sawford). He is absolutely right to say that the Government are seeking to put the Secretary of State in the position of censor-in-chief. We live in the United Kingdom. I thought that the Government believed in freedom of speech and the free press, but it turns out that that is not the case when it comes to publications produced by local authorities. It is clear that the Secretary of State is setting himself up as some sort of Orwellian big brother figure. If the clause goes through, the Department for Communities and Local Government should be renamed the ministry of truth. It is all right for the DCLG to issue draft press releases praising the Government. As my hon. Friend the Member for Corby said, as long as local government is praising the policies of central Government that is okay, but if it has the temerity to point out that in some way what the Government are doing might have a negative impact on the communities that they represent, then woe betide them; that is not acceptable. When the Secretary of State seeks to take that kind of power to himself, we have to ask what kind of country we want to live in. This is completely wrong. Just look at the document—it could be a Tory hand-out. It has even suggested the headline that the local authorities might like to put on their press releases. It reads, “Pickles praises troubled families programme”—so, big up the Secretary of State, but, whatever you do, do not say anything that could be interpreted as negative.
My hon. Friend the Member for Corby pointed out that there is absolutely no evidence suggesting widespread abuse of the voluntary code. Indeed, we would be hard-pressed to find any example, let alone widespread examples, so this provision is completely over the top. We have talked about using a sledgehammer to crack a nut, but it is more like using a pile-driver to crack a minuscule nut. There is no example of any abuse. It is clear, therefore, that the Secretary of State is seeking to set himself up as the censor-in-chief.
In Committee, I challenged Government Members to come up with some examples of the abuses that merit this heavy-handed legislative response. The first out of the traps was the hon. Member for High Peak (Andrew Bingham), who came up with the ludicrous assertion that legislation is merited to stop a photograph of the Labour leader of his local borough council appearing in the council newspaper with a Labour party pen. A pen with the Labour logo on it was an abuse that merited legislation—talk about crackers, as my hon. Friend the Member for Hayes and Harlington (John McDonnell) said. It is unbelievable. We are talking about legislation to stop local authorities publishing their council newspapers, giving information to the local community about matters affecting them, and it is suggested that the Secretary of State should be put in charge because a Labour leader appeared in a council newspaper holding a pen with a Labour logo on it.
The hon. Member for High Peak must have scrutinised that photograph with a magnifying glass to be able to see the logo, let alone to suggest that it would influence people. He dug himself an even bigger hole by comparing it with product placement, which is banned on the television. He said that we do not see packets of cornflakes on the table in “EastEnders”. Crackers really does not cover it.
John McDonnell
I am the secretary of the National Union of Journalists group in Parliament. There needs to be a discussion between Departments. We are working with the Department for Culture, Media and Sport and will hold a seminar in the new year to discuss how we ensure that all Government Departments can assist in the development and support of the local press. A Member on the Government Benches suggested publishing local material in the local media or on a wrap-around basis, which would support the print industry and the local press.