Aviation

Debate between Jim Fitzpatrick and Theresa Villiers

Wednesday 4th July 2012 Westminster Hall

[Jim Fitzpatrick (Poplar and Limehouse) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to see you in the Chair, Mr Dobbin. I congratulate the hon. Member for Rochester and Strood (Mark Reckless) on securing this important debate. We all keenly anticipate the publication of the Government’s consultation documents—a subject that I will come back to later. If they had already published them, we might not have needed this debate. None the less, this is a great opportunity for the Minister to update us on the documents.

As many Members have said, aviation is a success story, whether we are talking about the Scottish airports, Manchester, Birmingham, East Midlands, or the other regional airports. The focus of this debate, and the focus generally in recent years, has been on London and the south-east. The third runway debate has overshadowed the excellent work, which a number of colleagues have mentioned, being done at Gatwick, London City, Luton and Stansted, but the capacity of the south-east remains the big issue.

Our aviation industry is central to our economic prosperity and should be a key driver of growth, without which we have no prospect of emerging from the dangerous economic situation that we are in. The industry contributes at least £11 billion to UK GDP—more than 1% of the total—although briefings for this debate state that the figure is £23 billion. It also supports up to 200,000 jobs directly and 600,000 indirectly across the UK. However, just as the Government do not have a credible strategy for growth, they have not yet managed to set out a credible strategy for aviation, let alone the role that it could play in our economic situation. Aviation is a crucial sector on which our economy depends, and the reaction from business to the Government’s decision not to set out an aviation strategy until the latter part of this Parliament has ranged from incredulity to plain bemusement.

[Mrs Villiers]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

If the Minister will allow me to get to end of my remarks, I will be happy to give way to her. I hope that I will be able to give way, but I am constrained by time.

The chairman of the Airport Operators Association, Mr Ed Anderson, has said that, while the industry knows what the Government are against,

“we are not sure yet what it is in favour of”.

He went on to describe “better, not bigger” as an “election slogan”, saying:

“Better not bigger doesn’t constitute a strategy.”

Sir David Rowlands, a former permanent secretary at the Department for Transport, has described the Government’s policy as “mildly extraordinary”. Baroness Valentine, who speaks for London First, said earlier this year that the

“government seems content for aviation policy to drift.”—[Official Report, House of Lords, 24 March 2011; Vol. 726, c. 872.]

She has also said, most damningly, that

“the Government’s aviation strategy is damaging our economy and enhancing that of our EU rivals.”

Seventy-four business leaders wrote to The Times, saying that setting a long-term strategic direction for aviation in London, the wider south-east and across the country is a vital part of delivering the growth and jobs the country needs. They concluded that all options must be considered—short term and long term—to address growing demand. Only last week, John Longworth, the director general of the British Chambers of Commerce, said:

“The Government must stop tiptoeing around on aviation because of short-term political considerations. Unless politicians grasp the nettle and make some tough decisions, both our export and inward investment potential will suffer.”

I hope that the Minister will indicate when we will be able to see the consultation documents.

[Mrs Villiers]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I assure the Minister that if I finish what I have to say by 10.47 or 10.48 am, I will give way to her, but I want to get my points on the record.

The hon. Member for Orpington (Joseph Johnson), who is no longer present, gave a couple of quotes from the Mayor of London’s briefing. To save time, I will not repeat what he said, but he did not cite two points—although others have mentioned this—relating to the loss of visitors to the UK. The Mayor’s briefing states:

“While France and Germany each managed to attract between 500,000 and 700,000 visitors from China in 2010, the UK had only 127,000. In total, France earns £1.3bn per year from Chinese tourist spending on visits in the country, compared to the UK’s Chinese tourist spending receipts of £115m.”

It also notes:

“France’s hub airport, Paris Charles de Gaulle (56 departures per week), has better connections to Brazil than Heathrow (27 departures per week). In 2009, inward investment from Brazil totalled $800m in France, and only $1.7m in the UK.”

The Mayor has a strong argument on those figures.

The Government seem to accept that there is a capacity issue. In the Budget statement, the Chancellor referred to south-east capacity, as did the Prime Minister in response to a question from the hon. Member for Richmond Park (Zac Goldsmith) during Prime Minister’s questions. As I have said, we are waiting for the Government’s consultation document to indicate their likely direction of travel. Constraints on aviation, whether from a lack of capacity or lack of investment, will not stop flights happening—or increasing. As Members have said, those constraints will simply displace flights from the UK to Schiphol, Charles de Gaulle or elsewhere.

The hon. Member for Rochester and Strood effectively articulated the arguments against the proposed estuary airport. He made some interesting points about EU competition law, and I will consider them carefully.

My hon. Friend the Member for Blackley and Broughton (Graham Stringer) spoke with great authority on the issue, as he always does. He mentioned in passing other factors that affect aviation, such as air passenger duty, which was also mentioned by other colleagues. Nobody developed the argument, but APD is a huge factor in whether people decide to go to the UK or elsewhere in Europe. Given that it brings in between £2 billion and £3 billion for the Treasury, it will not surrender APD, but that is a factor and it needs to be looked at.

Another big issue that affects our economic performance is visas and the obstacles we place in the way of people who want to come to the UK, particularly from China. Moreover, as we discussed at length during deliberations in the Civil Aviation Bill Committee, the performance of the UK Border Agency—I accept that it is not the Minister’s responsibility—is harming the way that potential tourists and business visitors perceive the UK, because of what they read and hear in the media.

Lack of time meant that we did not have the opportunity to hear a lecture by the hon. Member for Blackpool North and Cleveleys (Paul Maynard) on hub dynamics. I would be interested to read it, so perhaps he could send me a copy. He made the point about the decline in our aviation industry and the rise of Schiphol and Charles de Gaulle.

The hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) reinforced the points about connectivity and regional access, and the hon. Member for Cambridge (Dr Huppert) raised the issue of emissions. That issue has to be addressed, and we were addressing it when we were in government. The industry was confident that it could meet the levels set, but it meant using the emissions trading scheme, with the expectation that emissions would rise and that the industry would have to offset them elsewhere within the industry.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I assure the hon. Gentleman that I have nearly finished—I have three minutes left—and will give way to him when I have done so.

As I was saying, the industry was confident that it could meet the levels set, but the bottom line is that Lib Dem policy on aviation is the obstacle to the Government having any policy at all, certainly before 2015.

The hon. Member for Poole (Mr Syms) mentioned the need for more capacity and made the case for Stansted, and the hon. Member for Amber Valley (Nigel Mills) asked how we can give more support to regional airports and proposed deregulation.

The aviation industry and Britain’s wider business community came together last week to call for a cross-party consensus on aviation that lasts beyond the term of one Parliament. For several months, the shadow Secretary of State, my hon. Friend the Member for Garston and Halewood (Maria Eagle), has repeatedly offered to take the politics out of aviation, put party differences aside and work together on a joint aviation strategy for the good of the nation. It is a clear, unambiguous offer, with no catch. Aviation matters to the country, the economy and businesses and families throughout the country. It is an industry that needs stability in the long term and a long-term plan that straddles Parliaments and Governments. We must not repeat the party political wrangling that turned the proposed third runway at Heathrow into a political football, and we must agree to stick to the agreed strategy, whatever the outcome at the next election.

[Mrs Villiers]

These issues are very important, so why have the Opposition not suggested any ideas for dealing with the long-term capacity challenges in the south-east? They have suggested nothing at all.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

The Minister knows that we had a game plan in place, but we lost the election. Then, as a gesture, to try to achieve national consensus on this important issue, we said that we would drop support for the third runway so that we could have cross-party talks. We have not even had the courtesy of a reply from the Secretary of State for Transport about engaging in talks. Until the Government introduce their consultation—it is they, not the Opposition, who are responsible for creating aviation policy—it is a bit rich of the Minister to ask me about policy.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mrs Villiers]

I am sorry, but I do not have time. If I have time at the end, I will give way.

We have an extensive programme of surface access improvements under way. Hon. Friends were right to raise that as being important for our aviation competitiveness. Manchester is getting a new Metrolink extension and will benefit from Northern Hub improvements. Gatwick station is getting a major upgrade; Thameslink will benefit Gatwick and Luton; Luton is getting improved access from the M1; and tunnelling has started on Crossrail. That project will ultimately see Heathrow connected to the City and Canary Wharf by train directly for the first time.

In the longer term, High Speed 2 will provide greatly improved surface access to Heathrow and Birmingham. As my hon. Friend the Member for Amber Valley (Nigel Mills) mentioned, that is a real game-changer, bringing Birmingham within easy travelling distance of many more people across the country. Of course, our HS2 plans will also provide an attractive rail alternative to thousands of short-haul flights coming into our south-east airports. That will potentially free up even more space for the long-haul destinations that hon. Members have rightly identified as crucial to our economic success.

However, good government is about not only tackling the problems of today, but preparing for the future. That is why the Chancellor announced in last year’s autumn statement that we would explore the options for maintaining the UK’s aviation hub status, with the exception of a third runway at Heathrow. The coalition is clear that it does not support a third runway at Heathrow. The airport is unique in Europe, in terms of the magnitude of its noise impact on densely populated areas. Thousands live daily with a plane overhead every 90 seconds, and have more planes that wake them up at 4.30 in the morning. The quality-of-life impact of a third runway and up to 220,000 more flights over London every year would be massive, and there is no technological solution in sight to ensure that planes become quiet enough quickly enough to make that burden in any way tolerable. We do not support mixed mode, which would see the end of the much-valued respite period that means so much to those who live with Heathrow noise daily.

We need a better solution. Last year, we kicked off the process of deciding what that will be, with the publication of our scoping document on aviation. The 600 or so responses we received are being used to prepare our draft aviation policy framework consultation, which will be published shortly. We plan to adopt the final framework in March next year, as set out in our business plan. It will set out the overarching economic and environmental framework within which we want to see aviation grow. We also intend to issue an open call for evidence on maintaining the UK’s international aviation connectivity. We will fully consider all representations to that consultation. The shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Poplar and Limehouse (Jim Fitzpatrick), wants us to go faster, but had no ideas whatever to share in today’s debate.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

When will we see the documents, Minister?

[Mrs Villiers]

The consultation will be published shortly.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

Does “shortly” mean before the summer recess?

[Mrs Villiers]

The consultation will be published shortly. The decision is a crucial one that requires objective, thorough and evidence-based analysis of our connectivity needs and how best to meet them in a sustainable way. We do not want to make the mistake that the previous Government made of coming up with the wrong solution and seeking to reverse-engineer the evidence. Put simply, that landed them in court and ensured that they failed to deliver any new capacity. We need to get this right. We need to base our decisions on the evidence, and on a process that allows the communities affected by any of the options fully to take part and ensure that their voice is heard.

Civil Aviation Bill

Debate between Jim Fitzpatrick and Theresa Villiers

Tuesday 22nd May 2012 Commons Chamber

[Jim Fitzpatrick (Poplar and Limehouse) (Lab)]

I begin by thanking all my colleagues who sat on the Bill Committee for their support, assistance and advice, as well as those who helped on Report, outside stakeholders who sent submissions and/or gave evidence and the Transport Committee for its scrutiny of the Bill.

We welcome and support the Bill. On Second Reading, my hon. Friend the Member for Garston and Halewood (Maria Eagle) said that we would support the Bill. That was no surprise. Much of it was drafted when we were in government, so there was a legacy. However, the timing of its arrival was a bit of a surprise, so the Transport Committee scrutiny was a little dislocated. Indeed, the Government’s response to the Select Committee was published only last Friday. It is good that it is out, but it demonstrates that there were surprises in the timing.

Not only was the arrival and timing a surprise but the inclusion of the security clauses, which were not in the original Bill, was not expected. Also, importantly from our point of view, the environmental protection measures, which were in the original draft Bill and mentioned in the Department for Transport press releases announcing the publication of the Bill, surprisingly did not appear in the Bill. That was a disappointment to the Opposition, and I shall return to it.

I do not want to appear too critical, however, although it might come across that way in due course, because, as I said, we support the Bill. In Committee, the Minister was as courteous as usual, although she and the Government did not accept a single amendment—she did so quite politely—even when she was injured and might have been a bit more vulnerable. The fact that Ministers did not accept any amendments was a matter of considerable disappointment to us, particularly given that we had the support of many stakeholders and recommendations from the Transport Committee.

The Minister has well covered two of the obviously key elements of the Bill—putting the passenger at the core of the CAA and updating the industry’s economic regulation. However, a number of other issues were raised in Committee, highlighting the strengths and weaknesses of the Bill, and I wish briefly to refer to some of them. We had a good discussion on security and the outcomes-focused, risk-based system. We support those arrangements, but, as my hon. Friend the Member for Bolton West (Julie Hilling) said, we were concerned about the arrangements for staff transfers and the certainty of their entitlements on wages, conditions, pensions and redundancy agreements. The staff side raised concerns that members of staff might be worried and often not accept or apply for transfers. The potential haemorrhaging of staff in such a sensitive area was of concern to the whole Committee, so it was good to hear the Minister provide additional reassurances before and after my hon. Friend’s intervention.

The Minister mentioned the ATOL reforms, which we all support, despite the delays. We will do what we can to help the Secretary of State and the Minister of State introduce and enact the reforms, because that is what we all want. Recent pronouncements have perhaps pointed towards more complications arising, which is obviously frustrating not only to the Department and the Government, but to all concerned.

Let me turn to the opportunities that were missed. On the environment, we proposed a duty, as the Minister mentioned. We also suggested including environmental aspects in the licensing conditions for Heathrow, which we think would be reflected right across the industry. On the passenger experience, we proposed that the responsibility for producing welfare plans should be a matter for the licensing arrangements for Heathrow, given the experiences in recent years of passengers being stranded, with all the difficulties that we have seen, heard about and, in some instances, experienced. It is interesting that the indicative licence produced for the Civil Aviation Authority suggested that the licence that it will produce for Heathrow ought to contain passenger welfare elements. We think that the Government could have given a firmer steer by referring to that in the Bill, which would have helped. We also made various suggestions about the efficiency and scrutiny of the Civil Aviation Authority, although I will return to those presently.

There are two additional areas that the other place will want to take account of: one was mentioned in Committee, whereas the other was not. The first is the honesty and accuracy of ticket prices, particularly from the bucket airlines, and the hidden surcharges. The CAA could clearly play a role in addressing that, and I am sure that the issue will be raised in the other place. The other issue, raised most recently, is the suggestion that certain passengers should be able to fast-track themselves through security and immigration for a price, which has caused quite a bit of consternation among passengers generally. Given that the suggestion has been made since Report, I suspect that the other place will want to see how things could be obviated to ensure fairness for everybody going through our airports.

Let me look briefly at the three areas I have mentioned. On the environment, we had a bit of banter with the Government about their mantra, which we hear all too frequently, of wanting to be the greenest Government ever. We obviously had quite a bit of disagreement about whether the Bill reinforces that claim. Indeed, the Minister for shipping, who is in his place, and I had a discussion this afternoon about this being the greenest Government ever in terms of environmental protection. However, I do not think that Mr Deputy Speaker—[Interruption]—if he was paying attention—will let me go there. [Hon. Members: “Ooh!”] My apologies, Mr Deputy Speaker: I wanted to ensure that you did not allow me to stray, because, seeing the hon. Gentleman in his place, I could easily have gone down that cul-de-sac.

On reporting and giving information to passengers, clauses 83 and 84, which we covered extensively, are welcome. However, we thought that there ought to be a duty on the Civil Aviation Authority, as there is on every other economic regulator, to take account of the environment. Reading between the lines, I am not sure whether the Minister’s comment that she expects the matter to be raised in the other place was perhaps an indication of more openness from the Government or that they might be prepared to look at this again.

One element of licensing to do with the environment that was raised by a number of my hon. Friends concerns protection for neighbourhoods, planning permissions and the rest of it. We think that including that in the licence would give communities greater strength and the certainty that airports and the aviation industry would take account of the sensitivities mentioned by the Minister of State.

The last thing we suggested—which the Government did not think it was appropriate to pick up—was the requirement for ticketing to show the environmental impacts of different modes of travel, thereby helping passengers to make decisions based in part, perhaps, on the difference between the environmental impact of going by air and the impact of travelling by rail or coach. I will be surprised if that suggestion is not examined further in the other place.

On the passenger experience, the reporting, information gathering and publishing will, again, be welcomed. However, as I have said, we think that the welfare plans should have been included in the licence, and that represents a missed opportunity by the Government.

[Mrs Villiers]

I feel that I ought to reiterate the reassurance I gave in Committee and on Report. We, too, are very supportive of a focus on passenger welfare plans. We just do not believe that the content of the licence should be hard-coded in legislation. We believe that the best approach is to give the independent, expert regulator the responsibility to decide what licence conditions are appropriate.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I fully accept that; we have a disagreement over whether this ought to be in the licence. We think that putting this in the Bill would strengthen the requirement and give a much clearer indication to the regulator that the Government expected it to look at this as a key area, particularly given the experience in recent years. We are talking about a difference in emphasis, rather than a difference in principle, because we all want passengers to be better protected against the vagaries of the weather or other factors detrimentally affecting them.

Labour Members raised the whole question of the information on queuing times, and not just in baggage-handling areas. The key area where we disagreed was on whether immigration queues could or should be counted and measured, with information given to the public. Obviously, the Government’s position is that immigration and the immigration service, the UK Border Agency and the UK Border Force are the responsibility of the Home Office, and therefore it is not appropriate to deal with them in this Bill. However, given the further recent confusion over what the queuing time actually is, particularly at Heathrow, and given the disagreements on measuring between the airports and the immigration service, we think that the CAA could have played a very constructive role in that area, authoritatively collating the evidence and publishing it. As with a number of the other amendments that we failed with, I am sure that the Lords will wish to return to that.

On CAA efficiency and National Audit Office scrutiny, we again agree to differ, but at least the Minister did come up with a proposal to strengthen the scrutiny, which, in some way, addressed the concerns we were raising. Obviously, we will monitor how the proposal works in effect. We hope that it will give greater reassurance to the airlines and other customers that the CAA will operate as we would all wish.

In conclusion, this was a good Bill in draft and, in essence, it remains a good Bill, but there is still much room for it to be even better. We hope that the other place will be able to make the improvements that we were, sadly, unable to make.

Civil Aviation Bill

Debate between Jim Fitzpatrick and Theresa Villiers

Wednesday 25th April 2012 Commons Chamber

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

It is almost breathtaking that, when we are proposing an environmental duty that would cover the busiest airport in the UK, the hon. Gentleman should say, “No, let’s not do that. Let’s wait till we get Southend right.” That just does not make sense. We are arguing for the introduction of an environmental duty now. He is arguing that, although he wants one, this one just does not fit the bill. I was not praising him for his consistency, by the way, and just because he is consistently wrong does not mean that I agree with him.

[Mrs Villiers]

I do not think that the hon. Gentleman is in a position to lecture my hon. Friend the Member for Cambridge (Dr Huppert) on consistency. In theory, Labour opposes a third runway, yet every time one of its Back Benchers mentions the subject, they tend to be very supportive of the idea.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

The Minister knows full well that the shadow Secretary of State made our position on the third runway quite clear when she invited Members to attend cross-party talks on the subject. To date, as far as I am aware, my hon. Friend has not even had an answer from the Secretary of State. Our position is clear.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mrs Villiers]

It is important for the hon. Gentleman to appreciate that the difference with those bodies is that a universal jurisdiction applies across an entire sector or industry, whereas we are dealing with a situation in which economic regulation applies only to a few airports. That is why this is not the appropriate or right way to deliver environmental regulation.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I hear what the Minister says. In our Committee discussions, those we are having today and in discussions outside, transport consistently appears as a big contributor to greenhouse gas emissions. Aviation continues to grow. In a recent speech, I believe to The Times transport conference, the Minister quoted the statistics showing that transport will, year on year out to 2030 and beyond, make a bigger contribution to those emissions, simply because the sector is growing. It cannot be right not to address the question of having an environmental duty at a time when we are we are introducing the new powers and duties and the new regulatory authority through the Bill. Surely now is the appropriate time for it.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Jim Fitzpatrick and Theresa Villiers

Thursday 12th January 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Villiers]

We have made it clear that it is vital to get the costs of running the railways down, and it is also vital that the benefits of those cost reductions be shared by both taxpayers and fare payers so that we can give both better value for money. If we can achieve savings on the scale contemplated by McNulty, we could, we hope, see the end of the era of above-inflation fare increases.

[Jim Fitzpatrick (Poplar and Limehouse) (Lab)]

Costs impact on fares, as the Minister has just said. In London, Conservative Mayor Boris Johnson—[Hon. Members: “Hooray!”] I expected a more Pavlovian response, Mr Speaker. Mayor Johnson has approved rises on average of nearly 6%, yet Labour mayoral candidate Ken Livingstone—[Hon. Members: “Hooray!”] Much better, Mr Speaker. Both sides of the House appreciate the Labour candidate; I am sure he would be very reassured. Ken Livingstone says he can cut fares by between 7% and 11% because of Transport for London surpluses. Has the Minister had any discussions with Mayor Johnson about the rises?

[Mrs Villiers]

The hon. Gentleman is completely naive in his approach to Ken Livingstone’s proposals on fares. Livingstone’s numbers simply do not add up, and his track record shows that he promises fare reductions and ends up delivering fare hikes.

Transport (CSR)

Debate between Jim Fitzpatrick and Theresa Villiers

Thursday 25th November 2010 Westminster Hall

[Jim Fitzpatrick (Poplar and Limehouse) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to be here under your chairmanship, Mr Gray. This is the first time that I have spoken from the Opposition side of this Chamber. I would naturally rather be where the Minister is and I certainly was there for a couple of years. It reminds me of the question asked by many people about what it is like being in opposition after 13 years. As a former Minister responsible for road safety, I use a roads analogy. I tell people that it is like when they go to Europe for the first time and drive on the right-hand side of the road. It is strange, but I get it; I know what I am supposed to be doing. However, every junction and every occasion have to be approached with additional care.

Like other hon. Members, I congratulate the Chairman of the Select Committee on Transport, my hon. Friend the Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman), on securing the debate, on the way in which she introduced it and on the way in which she leads her Committee. She is very highly regarded in the House, as all new Members will quickly come to realise, if they have not already.

Conservative Members may not be surprised to hear that I do not accept their rosy view of the impact of the comprehensive spending review on transport. The CSR settlement will mean a scaling back of Labour’s plans for transport infrastructure and a significant increase in the burden that falls on passengers through increased fares. I shall try to comment on hon. Members’ contributions later in my remarks.

The Department’s budget has suffered a 15% cut in real terms. That includes not only savings of 21% from the resource budget but, more worryingly, an 11% reduction in capital spending. The implications of that will be felt not just by the travelling public. Because investment in infrastructure projects is vital to growth, it will also affect the recovery, manufacturing and jobs.

[Mrs Villiers]

rose—

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I am delighted to give way to the Minister.

[Mrs Villiers]

The Budget produced by the Government of whom the hon. Gentleman was a member put in place a predicted 50% reduction in capital spending. In the light of that, is it not the case that an 11% cut for transport is really not a bad result in comparison with what other Departments are subject to?

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I do not for a second, in any way, shape or form, do anything other than congratulate the Ministers on fighting their corner for transport, but when I explain later why I am disappointed with the outcome, the details of the position will become clearer.

The Secretary of State has been over-spinning his settlement as a great success when it is nothing of the kind. Even the Institute for Fiscal Studies listed the Department for Transport as a “loser” in the CSR. Combined with the huge reductions in funding for local government, the impact will be felt by passengers throughout the country.

The Government are trying to get away with these myths: that Labour was planning a much bigger cut in capital spending and that the present Government are proceeding with even more spending on capital projects than was planned by Labour. Both claims are not true. First, the Government have set out spending plans to 2015, for the whole five-year Parliament. They are therefore never comparing like with like. That is classic smoke and mirrors, and I cannot believe that any Government would get up to such tricks.

Secondly, the Government insist on changing the point that they use as their baseline to suit their case. The reality is that even before the CSR, the Government had made £683 million-worth of spending cuts, including £309 million from local transport grants—made up of £61 million from major local authority schemes, £151 million from integrated transport block grant, £8 million from the urban congestion fund, £17 million from the road safety capital grant and £20 million from the road safety revenue grant—£108 million from Transport for London, £100 million from Network Rail, resulting in the scrapping of the better rail stations programme to upgrade 10 key national interchange stations judged the worst in the country, £54 million by deferring schemes and £112 million in internal cuts from the DFT, including staffing.

[Mrs Villiers]

The hon. Gentleman is identifying certain cuts that he alleges are being made, which clearly he is concerned about. If he will not accept reductions in certain transport programmes, where does he expect the reductions to come in order to tackle the deficit that the Government he was a member of left to us?

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

We do not accept for a second, as was clearly outlined by my right hon. Friend the shadow Chancellor in a speech only last month, that it was a Labour deficit. The deficit was created by an international banking crisis that started in the US. Most other countries copied the UK Government’s solution in restabilising their financial institutions and trying to ensure that the economy was in a position to recover.

We accept that cuts have to be made. We do not demur from that in any way, shape or form. I shall come to that in a second.

--- Later in debate ---

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I will do my best to close that down and get back to my text, which I assure you, Mr Gray, is focused on the CSR.

To respond to the hon. Member for Ealing Central and Acton (Angie Bray), spending under Labour was not out of control. It was strongly supported by both coalition partners at the time. Indeed, there were criticisms from the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills and the Chancellor when they were in opposition that we were not spending enough. I therefore do not accept the hon. Lady’s argument.

To follow your admonition, Mr Gray, and return to my text, the shadow Chancellor has proposed additional taxation on the banking industry that would raise £7.5 billion and enable us almost to halve the Government’s cut of a third to infrastructure spending. As I have said to the Minister, there would have been cuts under Labour, but they would not have been so severe and the burden would not have been put on passengers through huge hikes in fares.

As an aside, the UK Chamber of Shipping president, Mr Jan Kopernicki, was recently quoted as saying that not bringing forward the new Type 26 frigates from 2020 to assist in dealing with piracy would cost the UK economy and endanger British and other shipping. I ask the Minister to pass that message back to the Treasury and the Ministry of Defence.

In government, Labour delivered major improvements to our rail network, resulting in greater reliability, faster journey times and more passengers than at any time since the 1940s. We set out an ambitious long-term vision for conventional rail alongside our ambitious high-speed rail plans. Our plans included new capacity, better infrastructure and a strategic freight network. We had no plans to make passengers pay more for less, because if people see fares increasing when plans for new capacity and infrastructure are being cut, fewer people travel by rail and there is increased congestion on our roads.

I welcome the fact that the Government have changed their position and now support the Labour Government’s proposed route for High Speed 2. That was more of a Y-turn than a U-turn. There are clearly splits in the Cabinet over this issue and even, we read, threats of resignation. I assure the Minister that the Opposition understand the economic importance of the project. It will bring the west midlands within about half an hour of London and deliver journey times of 75 minutes or less from Leeds, Sheffield and Manchester to the capital. Connections to existing tracks will enable direct high-speed train services to Glasgow, Edinburgh, Newcastle and Liverpool.

We also welcome the Secretary of State’s confirmation this morning that some of Labour’s plans for additional investment in rail infrastructure will go ahead, including electrification projects, new carriages and station improvements. We do not welcome the delays and reductions in vital projects such as Crossrail, which was mentioned by the hon. Member for Ealing Central and Acton. Crossrail will make journeys across London faster, allow direct access from Heathrow to the City, enable 200 million passenger journeys a year, add 30,000 high-value jobs to London in the first 10 years of its operation and add an estimated £20 billion to the UK’s GDP.

[Mrs Villiers]

I had hoped that the shadow Minister would recognise that it is a great result that we have been able to save Crossrail despite the crisis in the public finances. He should also acknowledge that the lengthening of the delivery time for the central section was the result of an engineering-led review on how to deliver the project in the most cost-effective way for the taxpayer.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I do not want to be churlish and I fully welcome the commitment to Crossrail. This project has been on the stocks since about 1880. The hon. Member for Ealing Central and Acton said that it had been decades, but it has actually been planned in one shape or form for more than a century. I hope that the Minister will be generous enough to congratulate the previous Prime Minister, who ultimately grasped the nettle and said that the project must go ahead, in conjunction with the Mayor of London, the City and the CBI. I would be grateful if she updated us on the time frame for the completion of the branches of Crossrail to Shenfield, Maidenhead and Abbey Wood. I am not sure whether it is on track to meet the time scale mentioned by the Secretary of State this morning.

We oppose the Government’s decisions on fares. They have made two decisions that we believe will drive people off the railways and back on to the roads, increase congestion and hit competitiveness and growth. First, they chose to reverse the decision that Labour took in government to require train companies to apply fare limits to all fares equally, rather than hike some significantly and offset that by making smaller reductions on others. This week, we have seen the result of that change, with commuters being stung by rises of well over 10% on some routes, just at a time when families are being squeezed by wage freezes, the coming VAT increase and cuts to tax credits and child benefit.

Secondly, the Government decided to make things even worse for rail passengers by allowing fares to rise by 3% above inflation. Since 2004, the cap on increases to regulated fares has been RPI plus 1. From 1999 to 2003, it was RPI minus 1, and from 1995 to 1998, it was equal to RPI. The Secretary of State keeps claiming that increases across the CSR period will be only 10%. By our calculations, RPI plus 3 delivers a cumulative increase of more than 30% on the inflation forecasts of the Government’s Office for Budget Responsibility. The Secretary of State’s constituents will see their annual season ticket from Weybridge rise from £2,272 to more than £3,000. As shadow Secretary of State for Transport, the Minister warned that such a rise would price people off the railways. Her Department has confirmed that it expects that passengers will opt for other forms of transport. That is a betrayal of passengers by the coalition, which said in its programme for government that it was

“committed to fair pricing for rail travel.”

It is an even bigger betrayal by the Liberal Democrats, who pledged a real-terms cut in rail fares in their manifesto.

Not only rail passengers but bus users have been hit by Government. The cut to the bus service operators grant, which has been mentioned by several hon. Members, will have a devastating effect on many local bus services, particularly in rural and remote areas, which will not survive without subsidy. The BSOG is a subsidy to bus operators that covers most of the cost of fuel duty. It helps operators to keep fares down and to continue running less profitable or unprofitable services. According to Department for Transport figures, without BSOG we would see a 6.5% increase in fares and a 6.7% fall in bus usage. The social and economic effects would be even greater. With more services becoming unprofitable, more would be taken off the road.

The Government are telling people to get on the bus to find work, but people have to be able to afford to do so. The impact of this cut will be felt especially by those who are out of work and looking for a job. Two thirds of jobseekers do not have a driving licence or access to a car. Research by the social exclusion unit discovered that 38% of jobseekers found that transport was a major obstacle to finding work. People should be getting on the bus to find a job, but there must be a bus there in the first place.

The impact of the CSR settlement on local transport spending will soon be felt by the public. Labour doubled investment in local transport between 1997 and 2010 because we understand how vital local transport schemes are to reducing congestion, to making city and town centres more accessible, and to the creation of local and regional economic growth and jobs. The £309 million a year cut to local transport grants will be followed by significant cuts throughout the spending review period of 28%.

The Secretary of State has cut the number of transport grant schemes from 26 to four under the guise of simplification. We support making the system simpler, saving councils time and money on bids to different funding streams, but he knows that the cut is being used to disguise the significant reduction in the funds available to local government.

Road schemes are being hit hard. We were clear that we would have had to make reductions in the road budget. The Government, however, have pushed back many schemes that we would have taken forward, and even the money allocated to fund the schemes that have been given a green light will require major cuts of, on average, 25%.

Finally, there is real concern at the impact of the cuts on road safety. Cuts to road safety grants to local authorities were part of the Department for Transport’s in-year savings announced in May—£17 million from the road safety capital grant and £20 million from the road safety revenue grant. Following the reform of transport grants to local government announced in the spending review, there is now no specific grant funding for road safety.

Local authorities, facing cuts to their budgets of a third, will be under pressure to cut the funds for road safety and for speed cameras. Only this week, research has shown that 70 more people will die and 700 more will be injured if speed cameras are removed. It is staggering that the Government have admitted, in answer to a parliamentary question this week, that they carried out no assessment of the impact on road accidents and deaths of the decision to cut road safety grants and to end funding for speed cameras.

We have not seen so far the publication of an updated road safety strategy—a parliamentary answer that I received this morning said that it would be published early in the next year. As my hon. Friend the Member for Liverpool, Riverside, the Chair of the Select Committee, remarked, we have seen a gradual and significant 20-year decline in the number of deaths and serious injuries on our roads. I hate to say it, but that trend is in jeopardy as a result of some of the decisions.

On aviation, the coalition is poised to add further increases to air passenger duty. Does the Minister realise that adding air passenger duty to the cost of a visa from, for example, China, means that the cost of visiting the UK will be £612?

[Mrs Villiers]

Does the hon. Gentleman appreciate that the increases to air passenger duty which have just been implemented were legislated for by his Government? They are his decisions. How can he criticise us for going ahead with them?

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

The increases that were being introduced—further increases are being considered—are not being introduced in the way that we planned.

My point is that, if we add the cost of APD to the cost of a visa from China to the UK, it comes to £612, compared with £212 to go to Paris, flying economy. Flying business class, it costs £952 to London, compared with £332 to Paris. Might that explain why France received 688,000 Chinese visitors in 2008, when the UK only managed 108,000?

Will the Minister take that message to the Prime Minister? His recent mission to China was important, and we fully supported it, but to ensure that it is the Chinese destination of choice the UK must be as attractive as possible. Those figures seem to undermine the recent visit and the message that the Prime Minister took to the Chinese Government that UK plc is open to business—the strong message is that the Chinese should come via Paris, because it is much cheaper.

I will not raise the issue of aviation capacity in the south-east again, other than to say that our only international hub losing out to Charles de Gaulle, Frankfurt or Schiphol will act as another disincentive for business people to come to London. Given that Dubai now has six runways and offers access to the Americas for people from India and further east, we need to ensure that the UK is as accessible as possible, to attract those people.

[Mrs Villiers]

Can the hon. Gentleman set out his party’s position on a third runway at Heathrow? Is Labour for it or against it?

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

The Minister is teasing me. She knows full well that we just lost a general election on a policy of an additional runway at Heathrow and that my new leader—who, as the hon. Member for Cheltenham (Martin Horwood) mentioned earlier, had a particular view when Secretary of State at the Department of Energy and Climate Change—has announced that we are reviewing all our transport policy. I do not accept, by the way, that the methodology was flawed, although I accept that it has been upgraded and improved—“flawed” suggests that there was some skulduggery somewhere, which I do not buy in any way, shape or form.

The last question on aviation hubs is whether the Minister is worried that Brussels might be happy for Heathrow to lose its international hub role in favour of other parts of Europe.

--- Later in debate ---

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Mrs Theresa Villiers)]

It is a pleasure, Mr Gray, to serve under your chairmanship. I am delighted that the Backbench Business Committee chose to put this debate on the agenda, and I pay tribute to all who have taken part, especially the Chairman of the Select Committee on Transport, the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman), and I thank the hon. Lady for her cogent and thorough introduction to the important issues that we have been debating this afternoon.

On 20 October, my right hon. Friend the Chancellor set out the coalition Government’s four-year plan to tackle the most urgent issue facing Britain today—mending our public finances and putting them on a sustainable footing. Several Members, including my hon. Friend the Member for Pudsey (Stuart Andrew), said that the situation that the Government inherited from our predecessors has put us in an extremely difficult position. Left unchanged, the spending position that we inherited would have seen Britain paying out £70 billion a year by the end of this Parliament, which is more than we spend on educating our children and defending our country put together.

We heard from the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside that, as part of the CSR settlement, the Department for Transport will reduce overall spending by 15%. Savings of 21% will need to be made from resource budgets, and 11% from capital. There is no doubt that cuts on that scale mean that difficult choices will have to be made. We very much wish that we did not have to make them, but the reality is, as many Members have acknowledged, that transport has come out of the spending review in a far stronger position than many expected. Among those who made that point were the hon. Member for Cheltenham (Martin Horwood) and my hon. Friends the Members for Pudsey, for Thurrock (Jackie Doyle-Price) and for Ealing Central and Acton (Angie Bray).

The Government want to break away from the recurrent pattern of spending squeezes of past years when, more or less inevitably, the axe fell first and hardest on transport infrastructure projects. As my hon. Friend the Member for Milton Keynes South (Iain Stewart) acknowledged, transport has been given a high priority in the spending review, which reflects the economic benefits that can be generated by investing in our transport infrastructure. Cutting waste, reforming the welfare system and scaling back lower priority programmes has enabled us to prioritise spending in order to boost long-term economic growth. That includes an extensive programme of investment in the nation’s transport infrastructure. As the hon. Member for Cheltenham said, it also recognises the importance of addressing climate change by supporting programmes to decarbonise mobility and travel.

I turn to a matter that was of huge importance to many who spoke this afternoon, albeit from different perspectives. That, of course, is balancing the needs of the various parts of the United Kingdom. My hon. Friend the Member for Cleethorpes (Martin Vickers) made a passionate plea for priority for north Lincolnshire and for the needs of peripheral regions. As ever, my hon. Friend the Member for Pudsey made a case for Yorkshire; those of my hon. Friends who represent Yorkshire constituencies always make articulate representations in transport debates. My hon. Friend the Member for Ealing Central and Acton pointed out the benefits that can accrue to the whole of the UK through investment in the capital’s infrastructure, as it is a major generator of economic growth.

We have a clear commitment to rebalance our economy; we are committed to addressing the north-south divide; and we are clearly committed to dealing with the challenges faced by regions such as the north-east, which have a particularly strong dependence on jobs in the public sector. In making our decisions on transport spending, we sought to take account of those priorities and commitments, as well as the competing needs of the different regions. We can never come up with a solution that pleases everyone, but we have made great efforts to be fair, and we are proceeding with a number of major schemes in the English regions, many of which are in the north.

The hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside rightly emphasised the importance of local involvement in prioritising transport projects. It was not possible to get the entire local enterprise partnership decision-making process up and running in time to influence and inform the decisions that we had to make in the CSR. We have to get on with those projects, as many have argued. We could not stand still and wait for the new structures to be created, so we depended on the advice of the older structures—the regional ones. When taking future decisions on transport priorities, we will seek to engage with local stakeholders and LEPs as soon as practicably possible. We cannot just wait for five years and not engage locally. As soon as the LEP structure is up and running, we will seek to engage LEPs in our transport decisions.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

Forgive me, I should know the answer, but do LEPs cover the whole country, or only parts of it?

[Mrs Villiers]

I understand that all local authorities will have the opportunity to set up LEPs, but I am not an expert in how the process works. As has been acknowledged, there is a good case for LEPs getting together, so that we can consider transport matters across a wider area. It obviously makes a great deal of sense to consider units such as travel-to-work areas, which may be considerably larger than the LEP areas themselves. LEPs working together will be constructive.

[Mrs Villiers]

As soon as LEPs are up and running, we will engage with them about our decisions on transport projects. If there are gaps in the LEP map, we will engage with the local authorities in those areas that are not covered by LEPs and take on board their views and concerns.

The hon. Member for Cheltenham mentioned reform of the appraisal system. As he acknowledged, we have made efforts to reform the New Approach to Appraisal system to put a more realistic price on carbon, and to address the anomalous emphasis on additional fuel duty revenues for the Exchequer being discounted from the overall cost of the project. Further reform is planned, but it is important to reform the system so that we have a more realistic assessment of the carbon impact of different transport choices because we want to choose the projects that are consistent with our climate change goals.

The Chairman of the Transport Committee expressed concerns about emergency towing vehicles. Ship salvage is a commercial matter between a ship’s operator and the established salvage industry, and we have every confidence that there is capacity in the salvage industry to support ships in difficulty from September 2011 at commercial rates.

As for rail, it is very clear that we have had to take a difficult decision on fares. Of course, I wish that we could have avoided that, but the scale of the deficit that we inherited severely constrains our choices. Without the three years of retail prices index plus 3% increases that we announced, it simply would not be possible to deliver vital capacity improvements that passengers need.

The hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside emphasised the importance of rail services in tackling climate change; I agree and that is why we have made such a major commitment to investment in rail. She also emphasised the importance both to passengers and taxpayers of getting value for money from the railways. She asked me to pre-empt the publication of the McNulty review. I had better not do that, but she will appreciate that one of the key problems that has been identified across the industry is the mismatch between incentives. Aligning incentives more effectively between the train operators and those responsible for maintaining and running the tracks is one possible way in which we can start to reduce costs in the rail industry and put our railways on a more sustainable financial footing. That is essential if we are to deliver value for money for passengers.

The hon. Lady also called for more transparency around fares; there is scope for that. Greater efforts are under way to ensure that consumers know exactly what deals are available. Increasing consumer understanding of the range of rail fares is an important goal. She also recognised that some fares are considerably lower than in past years. That is not something that one would recognise from reading the papers, but lower fares are out there, and increasing numbers of passengers are taking advantage of them. That said, we understand the concerns of many commuters about rail fares. As I have said, we have been forced into a difficult decision by the deficit that we inherited.

We have seen a shift in departmental priorities. Rail has come out much better from the spending review than other transport programmes. The programme of rail capacity upgrades is extensive—arguably, the most extensive in modern history. Crossrail is going ahead according to its original scope. Despite all the scare stories, there has been no announcement that the limbs will be amputated. We expect services to be phased in from 2018 across the Crossrail network. Savings worth some £1 billion have been identified through addressing risks and undertaking an engineering-led review of the most cost-effective way to deliver the central section, including lengthening the delivery time by around a year. We continue to work with Crossrail Ltd, the Mayor and Transport for London to optimise the scheme’s value for money.

My hon. Friend the Member for Ealing Central and Acton emphasised the importance of pressing ahead with work on the new stations. I am pleased to hear that she will be able to see the station designs for Ealing Broadway soon. Our goal is to keep up the pressure to ensure that we meet the delivery timetable that has been set.

The Chairman of the Transport Committee expressed concern about the position of TRANSEC and the budget allocated to transport security. There will be reductions of 25%, but it is well worth emphasising that the total industry spend on aviation security is more than £350 million. The bulk of the spending on aviation security is made by the industry because it delivers aviation security on the ground. She will appreciate that the 25% reduction that was discussed in the Committee yesterday relates to departmental activity, which is the overview, the policy, and the regulatory and supervision aspects. The savings are deliverable without compromising security outcomes. We recognise that maintaining passenger safety and security is of paramount importance. Administrative reform and reorganisation—rationalising certain training programmes, having to target our research programme and reducing some of our network of aviation advisers around the world—will enable us to deliver those savings without compromising passenger security.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

Will the right hon. Lady confirm that the 25% savings will not have a negative impact on security because of redundancies or early retirements?

[Mrs Villiers]

The shadow Minister makes an important point about the reductions in head count that need to be made not just at TRANSEC but across the board. In making those decisions, it is a top priority to keep hold of the people whose skills are most vitally needed. That is the case with TRANSEC and across the Department.

Subject to the outcome of a rigorous and comprehensive consultation, our plan is to proceed towards construction of a new high-speed rail line, connecting London and Birmingham, and then on to Manchester and Leeds. My hon. Friend the Member for Milton Keynes South emphasised the importance of getting the route right; I completely agree with him, which is why we will have an extensive consultation. He also talked about the importance of getting right the connections to airports; I agree on that and work is under way on those issues. We need to look at not just Heathrow but Birmingham airport and then Manchester airport to see how we can connect them effectively to the new high-speed rail network.

The hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside emphasised the importance of ensuring continued investment in the conventional network alongside high-speed rail; I agree and that is what we have committed to do. The coalition has also confirmed £2.1 billion to fund Network Rail’s station improvement programme, which includes £650 million to complete the work on transforming Birmingham New Street into a gateway worthy of the UK’s second city.

Schemes are also going ahead to improve the passenger experience at King’s Cross and Gatwick airport stations. The funding has been confirmed for the works under way at Reading, which will improve reliability across the whole of the Great Western main line. Work on the Midland main line will deliver faster and more reliable journeys in the east midlands and South Yorkshire. Improvements on the east coast main line will improve journeys in the north-east and Scotland.

Funding has been confirmed for vital rail freight improvements between Southampton and the west coast main line, and between Felixstowe and Nuneaton. I welcome the support from the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside on that issue.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I just wanted to ask the right hon. Lady about the impact of the changes at TRANSEC on ports. Obviously, most people associate TRANSEC with aviation and airports. There is no specific reduction in respect of that transport mode. Regarding shipping and interconnectivity, can she tell us what the spend is for upgrading the freight lines from ports?

[Mrs Villiers]

Regarding the changes at TRANSEC, in making the efficiencies that we have to make, of course we will fully take on board any impact on ports and shipping. Obviously, the bulk of TRANSEC’s work and the bulk of its funding tends to be focused on aviation, but that does not mean that we should underrate the importance of ensuring that we maintain high levels of security for our ports and shipping, too.

Regarding the rail freight upgrades, we are committed to carrying forward work on the strategic freight network. I always think that that is one of the programmes on which the previous Government did some of their best work. There was a lot of engagement with the industry to focus on those upgrades that would have the biggest economic impact and that would have the most impact on taking freight off the road and on to rail.

The comprehensive spending review announced electrification of the railways between Preston, Blackpool, Manchester and Liverpool. Work will also go ahead to improve journey times on the crucial route between Liverpool, Manchester and Leeds. The hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside asked me to ensure that careful monitoring was undertaken to ensure delivery. Of course it is absolutely right that she should ask that and I know that the Office of Rail Regulation will be very focused on keeping Network Rail to its timetable. She also asked if electrification would be accompanied in due course by new rolling stock. Yes, of course—there is no point electrifying a railway unless there is some rolling stock to use on it. So that improvement will be part of the improvements that we want to see in the north-west.

This morning, the Secretary of State informed the House that funding for Thameslink had been confirmed. Thameslink will virtually double the number of north-south trains running through London. To reduce risks, we have lengthened the delivery programme, so completion is now expected in 2018. My right hon. Friend also gave the green light for the addition of 650 carriages, which will address some of the worst overcrowding hot spots around the country. Those carriages will be in service by March 2014 and they are in addition to the 800 net additional carriages for Thameslink and for Crossrail.

Several points were made in the debate about rolling stock; I think that we heard from several hon. Members about the importance of introducing more rolling stock. I listened with interest to the references to discussions on the Leeds trolley bus by my hon. Friend the Member for Pudsey. I am not able to give him a “yes” today, even though it is his birthday, but he has made his representations very strongly. I also took on board the statements he made about the Leeds rail proposal, which includes Kirkstall Forge. Officials at the Department for Transport will continue to work with the sponsors and the local authorities to see how best we can make progress on that proposal. He will appreciate that it is one of those schemes that is in with a chance of funding, and we will certainly do our best to work constructively with the people who I know passionately support the project.

This morning, the Secretary of State also confirmed a programme of electrification on the Great Western line between London, Didcot, Oxford and Newbury. An announcement on the extent of further electrification on the Great Western line will be made in the new year, alongside our final decision on the inter-city express programme. My right hon. Friend confirmed to the House that we have ruled out wholesale refurbishment of the High Speed 2 inter-city 125 fleet as the solution to the IEP problem. We will buy a new inter-city train fleet. After careful consideration of the Foster report on the IEP, the Government have narrowed down the options to just two: first, Agility’s revised proposal for a fleet of electric and bi-mode trains; and secondly, procuring a fleet of electric trains that would be hauled by new diesel locomotives at the end of the electrified network. I want to emphasise that both these options allow us to retain through journeys to destinations beyond the electrified network, including through journeys to Inverness and Aberdeen, which I know will be warmly welcomed by colleagues, including the hon. Member for Cheltenham who mentioned such journeys in his remarks.

I turn now to the points made this afternoon about roads and local transport. We propose to drive efficiency and reform at the Highways Agency by appointing a non-executive chair and a performance-monitoring group. Our goal is to reduce the cost of delivering a national road network that is in a safe and serviceable condition, and to deliver a more efficient traffic officer service that prioritises traffic management.

The Chairman of the Select Committee specifically referred to the A14 and her concern was that we had essentially sent that project back to the drawing board. I think that the cost of the project had simply got out of control. We were not convinced that it was the best way to deal with the problems on that transport corridor. We need to think more imaginatively about those types of programmes, to see if there is a more cost-effective alternative, and I think that the work that we are doing on the rail freight routes between Felixstowe and the west Midlands will also make an important contribution to addressing issues around the A14.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I will give the right hon. Lady another opportunity to have a sip of water. She mentioned that a more efficient Highways Agency will look at trying to achieve better traffic management. Does she accept that the other major role of the Highways Agency is about traffic safety, particularly in relation to foreign heavy goods vehicles? They have been a big concern to the Transport Committee and to colleagues right across the country. The enforcement regime at the Vehicle and Operator Services Agency allows these vehicles to be pulled aside, and the new regulations that we introduced only last year allow these vehicles to be impounded and not moved without either the necessary repairs being effected or insurance documentation and other documentation being produced. I hope that she is not saying that that regime will suffer as a result of moving the emphasis to road management as opposed to road safety.

[Mrs Villiers]

I will come on to road safety in a moment, but it remains an extremely high priority for the Government. However, the shadow Minister makes a key point about the importance of enforcement in relation to overseas-run HGVs. We will continue to put a priority on those enforcement mechanisms. I cannot give him the precise figures. Across the board, we will be looking to do things in a more efficient way, but if we can, we will prioritise resources to help us to deal with that very significant problem—I agree with him that it is a major problem.

The hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside also asked whether there was a departure from road-widening and building towards more of a traffic management approach, including a managed motorway approach. I think that there is some truth in that. We want to make greater use of a managed motorway programme as a more cost-effective way to deliver more capacity. Regarding road improvements, our focus is on trying to target the worst traffic bottlenecks, because remedying those bottlenecks will deliver the greatest economic benefit. So we recognise that making better use of our existing road capacity should be a very important part of our strategy.

We also need to look, in a balanced way, at whether we can address a transport problem by using a public transport outcome. We need to look afresh at the way that we approach the national roads programme overall.

The Chairman of the Select Committee also expressed concern about cuts in the budget allocated to road maintenance. We are continuing to allocate very significant funds to road maintenance at both a national and local level. However, we recognise the need to deliver more for less. Safety is, of course, paramount. However, the road network is one of the nation’s most valuable economic assets, so we must ensure that we spend appropriately to maintain it in a good condition. Nevertheless, we feel that better commercial management and better contracting can lead to considerable savings, and we feel the same is true of making the most of collective national buying power, encouraging local authorities to link up together so that they can build their buying power, and reviewing some of the technical standards to extend the life of assets. All those methods are ways to cut costs without compromising safety.

However, there is no doubt that we have had to take some difficult decisions about spending on both local and strategic roads. To help local authorities to deal with spending reductions, we will cut red tape to give them more freedom to make their own decisions. We are carrying out a radical simplification and reform of local transport funding. Our plan is to move from 26 grant streams to four, beginning in 2011-12. That will include £560 million for local sustainable transport projects, including Bikeability cycle training.

Several hon. Members discussed buses. The hon. Members for Cheltenham and for Liverpool, Riverside expressed concern about the reduction in the bus service operator grant commencing in 2012-13. I understand their concerns; that was probably one of the most difficult transport decisions in the CSR. I hope that they recognise that the reduction is far less severe than many predicted. We argued the case passionately with the Treasury. We recognise how crucial bus services are to people on a wide range of incomes and in a wide range of areas, which is why we put the case so strongly in the CSR in order to get a fair outcome on buses.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mrs Villiers]

With all such schemes, the process of assessing value for money is ongoing. The scheme is conditional on the planning process, which is the proper opportunity for the hon. Lady’s constituents to make their voices heard and express their concerns about what will happen. It is not for me to pre-empt the planning process in this debate.

Several hon. Members mentioned the Dartford crossing. The hon. Member for Cheltenham was concerned about the nature of the charges. They were converted by the previous Government to congestion charges; the charges originally imposed related to the construction costs of the bridge. My hon. Friend the Member for Thurrock expressed her concern about the increase in tolls. Again, that is unfortunately another melancholy consequence of the fiscal crisis that we face. Tolls could help us fund a new crossing, which, as the shadow Minister said, would generate significant benefits to the economy and relieve congestion. We continue to work to address the congestion problems and flow of traffic on the Dartford crossing, and that work includes a commitment to lifting the barriers in extreme cases where they are causing congestion.

My hon. Friend the Member for Thurrock also expressed concerns about junction 30 of the M25. As I emphasised, the project has not been cancelled but postponed. There is a good chance that it will go ahead, and the Highways Agency will continue to work on that. She has put on record her concerns about how important it is, not least because of the need to transport Hellmann’s mayonnaise and Fairy liquid around the country. She is no doubt a strong campaigner for the interests of her constituent.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I intervene only because one group of constituents who have not been mentioned are long-suffering West Ham fans from south and west Essex, who must fight their way across the M25 to get to Upton Park every other Saturday.

Crossrail

Debate between Jim Fitzpatrick and Theresa Villiers

Thursday 3rd June 2010 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Villiers]

My hon. Friend has made a strong point. We need to concentrate on the work that is going on, rather than on the speculation and scare stories that have appeared in parts of the London media.

The work under way at Canary Wharf station already provides a clear example of innovative engineering techniques that have offered significant savings without compromising delivery. We need to learn from that example when delivering other key elements of Crossrail. I know that Crossrail Ltd is committed to the highest standards of procurement practice to bear down on costs and ensure that the project remains affordable, and that must continue to be a key goal for the Crossrail team as progress is made towards letting contracts later in the year.

[Jim Fitzpatrick]

I welcome the Minister to her new position, and congratulate her on her appointment. Some of us expected to see her as Secretary of State—but hey, she has plenty of time, and I am sure she will get there in due course.

The Minister referred to the building of the station at Canary Wharf. My understanding is that Canary Wharf undertook the funding of that development. This reinforces the point made by the hon. Member for Cities of London and Westminster (Mr Field). The private sector has put its money where its mouth is. The question that my right hon. Friend the Member for Greenwich and Woolwich (Mr Raynsford) and other Labour Members have been asking is whether the Government are as committed as the private sector.

[Mrs Villiers]

As I have said, we support Crossrail and are committed to it. The project is going ahead. It is vital to ensure that all assumptions about the risk that the scheme involves are tested rigorously by Crossrail Ltd to ensure that those risks are properly identified and reflected in cost estimates, and so that sensible steps can be taken to reduce them. The latest innovative value engineering techniques have the potential to reduce costs significantly, and Crossrail Ltd has already been able to identify 18% savings in overall indirect costs through measures such as reducing administrative and staff costs and renegotiating IT contracts.