Counter-Daesh Update

Debate between Jeremy Hunt and Martin Docherty-Hughes

Monday 11th February 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hunt]

My right hon. Friend of course speaks with great wisdom on this because he was responsible for a lot of the training of overseas armies that makes precisely that strategy possible. We have now trained 70,000 Iraqi forces as a result of the programme that I think he may even have set up when he was Secretary of State for Defence.[Official Report, 14 February 2019, Vol. 654, c. 10MC.] He is absolutely right that coupling that with a programme of political reconciliation is the key. I would go further and say that that is really the key lesson from what happened in the original Iraq conflict, which ended up so much more problematically than anyone in this House was hoping for at the time. Local boots on the ground and proper political reconciliation is the way to make progress.

[Martin Docherty-Hughes (West Dunbartonshire) (SNP)]

I, too, thank the Secretary of State for early sight of the statement. I join him in recognising the risks faced by and the capabilities of members of the armed forces. As someone who comes from a forces family who served in Iraq, and also Afghanistan, I know of the risk that they put themselves in in fulfilling their duties.

The Iraq Government have stated that they need £88 billion to rebuild the country following the prolonged conflict. While, as the Secretary of State said, Daesh’s state-building may be close to defeat, the organisation still holds a powerful sway in many parts of the world, including the Philippines and Somalia. He talked about reconciliation. At the heart of reconstruction, there is a lack of truth and reconciliation for a new Iraq, and that could possibly allow for a resurgence of Daesh. Does he recognise that with less than half of the sums required for reconstruction being available, if we fail to invest adequately in Iraq, that runs the risk of allowing Daesh to regain a foothold?

Will the Secretary of State expand slightly more on what we have learned in this process to enable us to combat fanaticism in this region and beyond?

Finally, does the Secretary of State recognise that more work is required to be done through truth and reconciliation, especially if Iraq is to be fully reintegrated, and that that includes the innocent women and children whose Daesh husbands and fathers cast them aside for the sake of fanaticism—an issue that was most recently given steam in The New Yorker by journalist Ben Taub?

[Mr Hunt]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his comments. He speaks of some very important issues.

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right that reconciliation has to be central. Sometimes that costs money. In this country, we can be proud of the fact that we have put £2.7 billion into that process, which has had a huge humanitarian impact.[Official Report, 14 February 2019, Vol. 654, c. 10MC.] But part of reconciliation in this case, which is a specific case different from the original Iraq war, is the need for justice against the perpetrators of the genocide that Daesh was responsible for. On 17 January, I had the privilege of meeting Nadia Murad, the Nobel prize-winning Yazidi campaigner against sexual violence in conflict. In her book, she talks about the perpetrators of sexual violence against her who have still not faced justice and are still in the region somewhere. She says that for someone like her, there will be no closure until those people face justice. Part of that process of closure is justice, but part of it is also for people like her to be able to go back to the villages near Mount Sinjar that they were driven out of, at a time when many of their family members had been murdered. That is beginning to happen. All these things matter.

I think we have learned a number of things, but probably the most significant has been the need to engage in cyberspace as well as with boots on the ground, because it was the dissemination of propaganda that probably allowed Daesh to grow much further than we anticipated in the early days.