Found: u l t u r a l h e r i t a g e w h e n i t e x a m i n e d t h e E s t a t e Strategy.20 Jane Dodds

Found: This funding was secured through the budget deal between the Welsh Government and Jane Dodds, Leader

Found: This funding was secured through the budget deal between the Welsh Government and Jane Dodds, Leader

Found: It includes several funding and policy commitments agreed with Jane Dodds MS, Leader of the Welsh Liberal

Found: In publishing this Final Budget, the Welsh Government has worked closely with Jane Dodds MS, the leader

Found: Budget 2025-26, the Welsh Government agreed a number of funding allocations and policy issues with Jane Dodds

Found: speeches were given by Members of the Senedd, including Adam Price MS, Cefin Campbell MS and Jane Dodds

Found: The budget agreement between the Welsh Government and Jane Dodds MS, leader of the Welsh Liberal Democrats

Found: The details of the agreement, between the Welsh Government and Jane Dodds MS, Leader of the Welsh Liberal

Found: I am pleased the budget agreement between the Welsh Government and Jane Dodds MS, leader of the Welsh

Found: also grateful for the support of David Chadwick, MP for Brecon, Radnor and Cwm Tawe as well as Jane Dodds

Found: 02-07 00:00:00 Cyfweliad/Interview BBC Wales regarding SFS 2024-02-08 00:00:00 Cyfarfod/Meeting Jane Dodds

Found: with the Llywydd 15/11/23 Cyfarfod/Meeting Meeting with NRW 16/11/23 Ymweliad/Visit Visit with Jane Dodds

Found: 2022-05-10 00:00:00 Cyfarfod/Meeting Professor Elwen Evans QC 2022-05-12 00:00:00 Cyfarfod/Meeting Jane Dodds

Found: Reception National Adoption Service for Wales 10 year anniversary 2024-11-06 00:00:00 Cyfarfod/Meeting Jane Dodds

Found: Change Committee 2024-07-16 00:00:00 Cyfweliad/Interview Media 2024-07-16 00:00:00 Cyfarfod/Meeting Jane Dodds

Found: & Cllr Andrew Morgan - Centre for Digital Public Services 2023-06-15 00:00:00 Cyfarfod/Meeting Jane Dodds

Found: Cyfarfod/Meeting Health and Safety Forum meeting [virtual] 2021-08-12 00:00:00 Cyfarfod/Meeting Jane Dodds

Found: High Headteacher 14/10/2022 Cyfarfod/Meeting WLGA Education meeting 17/10/2022 Cyfarfod/Meeting Jane Dodds

Found: plc 2023-02-28 00:00:00 Cyfarfod/Meeting CBI 2023-02-28 00:00:00 Cyfarfod/Meeting Tom Giffard, Jane Dodds

Found: :00:00 Briffio’r cyfryngau/Media Briefing Media 2021-11-30 00:00:00 Cyfarfod/Meeting MF&LG and Jane Dodds

<p>Yes. And can I start by apologising to the Chair and to the Cabinet Secretary, and to the Chamber, for being late for the beginning of this debate. But I'd just like to pick up on those last comments by Jane Dodds, really, and remind us of the connection between what we're discussing today, which is the conduct Order which introduces, through secondary regulations, the existing electoral offences, et cetera, and the fact that we are going to be, very shortly, discussing a new piece of primary legislation, which will create a new electoral offence for deliberate deception. The purpose of doing that, of course, now, is to get it in place by the 2026 election.&nbsp;The Government has committed to doing that and translating that into conduct Orders for future elections. But, if the principle has been accepted, it's important that it's implemented now, because it's this next election when we are going to face, as Jane Dodds was intimating really, a tsunami of disinformation and deceit. And so, we need to use this measure, that we are going to legislate to create—. We need to then turn that into action at this coming Senedd election.</p>
<p>We had a very useful conversation with the Counsel General on this very issue, about how, practically, given, of course, we are getting closer to the Senedd election, we can translate the primary legislation into an amended conduct Order. So, it's important that we put that on the record now, so the Members and, indeed, the public, are aware of this. And where we left the very constructive conversation we had with the Counsel General is that, at the moment, the Government is not convinced that there is a route through, but if we are able to demonstrate a route, which is practical, then the Government is supportive. The Counsel General was supportive of that, so that was, I think, a very, very positive and constructive commitment. And from our perspective, you can't <span style="text-decoration: underline;">delay the defence of democracy.</span>&nbsp;</p>

<p>Well, thanks very much, and I think the early years integration transformation programme that RCT piloted is a great example of what needs to be done. It's a needs-based delivery model across the whole local authority. What it does is create a single front door to deliver the right support at the right time, to make sure, for example, that there's enhanced health visiting interventions, addressing one of the points that Jane Dodds made earlier, in terms of that link between health and low incomes in families with children.</p>
<p>The programme's now come to an end, and they're now embedding the learning and good practice as a core part of the business activity, and I know they're also investing an extra £2 million when it comes to Flying Start in childcare in Rhondda. So, that means around 350 more children will be able to get access. The good news is that that can be delivered, through the outreach element of the programme, to high-need children and families living outside of the Flying Start areas.</p>

<p>We certainly measure lots of things that tell us things are getting worse, though, so, clearly, it can't be too difficult for us to devise things to try and reverse those figures.</p>
<p>I'm going to move us on. So, Jane Dodds, would you like to come in?</p>

<p>Now, I'm calling Jane Dodds.</p>

<p>Okay, thank you. We need to move on. I just want to remind us that we were supposed to be finishing in 10 minutes. So, if everybody could be speedy in their questions and speedy in their answers—. We will extend it a bit because we want to cover three more areas. So, Jane Dodds.&nbsp;</p>

<p>Okay. We're going to pursue this further. Jane Dodds, you wanted to come in first.</p>

<p>Thank you. Can I call in Jane Dodds now, because we need to move on?</p>

<p>Well, can I thank the Member for his questions? This relates, in part, to questions raised already by Cefin Campbell and Jane Dodds, in that there are capacity issues in some parts of Wales, and we do need to meet that demand in order to ensure that the travelling public are not left stranded, but also to make sure that we're maximising the farebox, which, in turn, can be reinvested in areas of Wales that do not have the sort of frequent services that more urban areas often benefit from. So, we are trying our utmost, through the acquisition of new trains, to deal with capacity issues on the rail network, and in so doing, drive up the amount of revenue that we're raising through rail.</p>
<p>With regard to bus services, the bus Bill will address some of the concerns around capacity. It will also address concerns around networks not meeting the public's needs. Also, we have schemes such as the £1 fare cap that will come in soon, which I think will be of significant benefit for those who are often furthest from the workplace—literally the furthest from the workplace, and furthest in terms of being able to access decent job interviews, never mind the jobs themselves.</p>
<p>The mantra of the new chair of Transport for Wales is to offer safe, reliable and regular services, whether that be by bus or by rail. I know that he will be working with the board and with the executive to ensure that we provide that, not just on our rail services, but also on our bus services.</p>
<p>In terms of energy, the Member is absolutely right. Geopolitical instability has contributed to rising costs. That's having to be absorbed by operators at this moment in time. It's why the £600 million that the Welsh Government is investing over this Senedd term in bus services is so vitally important, because it provides a degree of protection against those fluctuations in energy prices and fuel prices.</p>
<p>The move towards electrification is an exciting move because it has the potential to decarbonise, quite considerably, the transport fleet. But it also means that we have to embrace the most advanced technology. And there are huge technological strides that are taking place at the moment. I think that it's important that we take stock of which are most futureproofed. But Transport for Wales is looking at being a purchaser of new electric buses, and it can then act as the organisation that will lease them to operators across Wales under the new legislation.</p>

<p>Can I thank Jane Dodds for her question, and, again, for the help that she gave in securing the new fifth service on the Heart of Wales line? That's planned to be delivered by Transport for Wales this year in the December timetable change. That service is planned to be better&nbsp;than the service that it replaces, the one that was removed due to low passenger usage.</p>
<p>Low passenger usage is a major issue to contend with. If we're going to put on more services across the network, we have to drive up the farebox. To drive up the farebox, we have to ensure that capacity is where demand is highest. That secures the maximum amount of resource to then cross-subsidise those services that have a higher cost-per-passenger price. So, getting more people onto rail services in other parts of Wales will be of benefit to the rail network in mid Wales as well.</p>
<p>In terms of the rolling stock, Transport for Wales is operating its active travel trains on the route, and it's my understanding that they are proving very popular with the travelling public. On the Cambrian line, Transport for Wales are now operating more services following the May timetable change: a new 16:30 service from Shrewsbury to Aberystwyth has now been initiated, along with more Sunday services.</p>
<p>I just want to say something about performance, because we've heard claims that performance is abysmal on the network. Actually, performance of services on both the Heart of Wales line and the Cambrian line has improved. There have been more services on time, with fewer cancellations compared with last year. I'm pleased to say that the very latest statistics for rail performance for the whole of the UK place Transport for Wales firmly in the top half of the league table.</p>
<p>It wasn't long ago that we did have problems, we were struggling, but they're now well into the top half of the of the table. I'm pleased to say that they are still the best operator in and out of Wales, with 85 per cent of their trains on time to within three minutes, compared with 60 per cent for Avanti West Coast, 67 per cent for CrossCountry and 81 per cent for Great Western.</p>
<p>In terms of on-the-day cancellations, again, I'm pleased to say that Transport for Wales is the best operator in and out of Wales again for the latest period, with just 3.8 per cent cancelled on the day, compared to 3.9 per cent for Great Western, 4.2 per cent for Avanti West Coast, and more than double Transport for Wales's rate for CrossCountry—they're on 8.7 per cent. So, I think it's worth just reflecting and recognising the fact that Transport for Wales is the best operator in and out of Wales.</p>

<p>Well, can I thank the Member for his question? A lot of work has taken place in the past few weeks since this issue was last discussed, but I'd like to put on record my thanks to the Liberal Democrat Member of the Senedd, Jane Dodds, for bringing forward this proposal. I think it will make an enormous difference to young people across Wales. I was at Ysgol Dinas Brân recently, in Llangollen, and I was chatting with sixth formers there about their main concerns and their challenges in life, and one of them said, 'You know, effectively, our life chances could be locked into this valley unless we can gain affordable access to public transport, and unless we can have frequent and reliable and safe services.' Well, as a result of the £1 fare cap, we are going to provide that affordable public transport. And as a result of the bus Bill, we're going to provide reliable, safe and frequent services. So, we are addressing one of the major inhibitors for young people when they strive to reach their potential.</p>
<p>Now, in terms of the discussions with the bus operators, they have been pretty intense. There are many, many operators. The challenge around young people aged under 16 has been confined though to a comparatively small number of operators that we've been in discussions with. I'm pleased to say that the First Minister herself will be making an announcement about the fare-cap scheme later this month, and I'm hoping that all Members will welcome it.</p>

<p>Thank you very much again, Jane Dodds, for adding your voice to the concerns that have been raised by Members today in the Senedd, adding your voice to all the concerns that have been raised about the plight of people in Gaza, and to recognise again that this is something where, as I said in my statement today, we call for urgent restoration of full, unimpeded humanitarian access across Gaza and the West Bank. Actually, I say in my statement that UNRWA should be supported and empowered to carry out its mandate. We heard about the restrictions, again, at our meeting last week. But also, you've added your voice, as others, in terms of the arms embargo call to the UK Government, and that's on the record, as already raised today. I think it is important that we say that we're urging all parties to re-engage in ceasefire negotiations, to get the hostages out, and to secure a permanent end to the conflict, leading to a two-state solution and a lasting peace, which would end the suffering of those most affected by this conflict.</p>

<p>I'm&nbsp;very grateful to Jane Dodds for that. As she will know, I have made a commitment previously to be publishing more information in relation to waiting times on a more granular basis, so I will take that particular point into consideration when we publish our transparency statement in the autumn. I should say that the figures published last year showed 10,100 orthodontic treatments, which is the second highest on record, after the previous year where nearly 10,700 treatments were started, so that is around a 10 per cent increase in activity compared to 10 years ago.</p>
<p>Obviously, we do not want anybody waiting too long for their treatment. One of the issues that we are identifying as we look at the granularity of some of those longer waits on the waiting lists is a pattern of early referral into orthodontic treatment before the intervention is best timed, <span style="text-decoration: underline;">if I can put it like that,&nbsp;</span></p>

<p>Thank you, Natasha. You tabled a written question about the summit, where I indicated I was very happy to brief you, Cefin Campbell and Jane Dodds, as well as opposition spokespeople, on the outputs of the summit. So far, nobody has taken me up on that. There were 30 Welsh Government officials at the summit, but the purpose of there being that number of Welsh Government officials was because I had been really clear that I didn't want to have an event where everybody sat there listening while there were policy speeches. I wanted this to be about discussing with people on the front line what we need to do to change things. So, the Welsh Government officials who were there were facilitating and noting the table discussion, and I'm really grateful to them for the work that they did on that. And I think it's quite a surprising thing that you've alighted on, really.</p>
<p>I don't agree with you that the press release was light. We set out five immediate actions that we would be taking. As I said to Cefin, I want to make sure that we capture absolutely everything that was said at the summit on the different tables to make sure that everybody's issues and ideas are fed in. Ahead of the summit, we had the round-table on violence in schools, and I was very grateful to the police and others for participating in that. That also provided us with actions. One of those will be to review the guidance in this area, although, as I've told you before, schools can already immediately exclude somebody who is found to have a weapon in school. We also discussed at the round-table the work that's being done in Cardiff, for instance, on their weapons framework. So, we're keen to learn from good practice in that space,&nbsp;and also to work&nbsp;with the work that's being done to promote a Wales without violence. So, there are many actions arising from the summit. There's only so much that you can put in a press release, and I'll repeat that offer again to brief you and Cefin, and, indeed, any Members who would like to have more detail on the work that we did on the summit. And if I can just take this opportunity, Llywydd, to thank everybody who attended. These are really difficult, knotty issues, but we had a really inspiring, uplifting day, where everybody rolled their sleeves up and cracked on with trying to find solutions to complex problems.</p>

<p>Diolch yn fawr, Jane Dodds, and thank you again. It is important that we have these strong statements made by Senedd Members to stop arms to Israel, and that the Welsh Parliament expresses a view on that. Of course, that will be taken back in terms of not just the First Minister's response, as I was asked for earlier on, but also to look at this in terms of what is happening. I hope I can report back on that, again, in terms of the arrangements and the situation where we want to, as you say, Jane, be very clear about how we stop the war, how we stop the humanitarian disaster that is so cruelly affecting Palestinians in Gaza. Stopping arms is crucial to that, as well as, obviously—. Within international law, we have to recognise this call today.</p>
<p>On your second point, it is very welcome to see the fact that there's a really great partnership providing funding and support to Coleg Sir Gâr to set up their green skills academy. Of course, it was supported through the shared prosperity fund in 2023-25, generating awareness across the different age groups of the green skills route. During the project, young people were surveyed to understand their needs and awareness of green skills opportunities.&nbsp;I understand that Green 24 will specifically focus on the need for net-zero training and awareness in the public sector, and also that the green skills academy occupational qualifications and personal learning accounts are all managed within the funding budget by further education institutions and Medr.</p>

<p>Well, thank you so much, Jane Dodds, for again expressing that enthusiasm, that sense of pride that we have with our well-being of future generations legislation. It's a real sense of pride. I mean, there's so many times when people say, 'We're looking at what you are doing, Wales.' This is Wales that we're proud of, like the Wales we were proud of last night with our nation of sanctuary awards.</p>
<p>And yes, I remember Lesley Griffiths actually declaring Wales as the first nation to declare a climate emergency. We were always first to do this, weren't we? There are so many social policies that, actually, have been shared by not just Welsh Labour, but other political parties, yourselves and Plaid Cymru. We have been very clear about social justice, and I really thank you for your support for the basic income pilot as well, where we're now beginning to get the results of the evaluation.</p>
<p>So, we have a long way to go in terms of tackling child poverty, but we have our milestones and indicators and a monitoring framework, but also very clear what we think should be done in terms of reform of social security, end the two-child benefit limit, and also working towards ways in which we can look at how we can use our powers and levers as well in terms of tackling child poverty.</p>

<p>Ninety-three per cent of respondents have already stated their opposition to pylon construction in their area. Less than 1 per cent of businesses believe that pylons would create economic opportunities, while 81 per cent see no benefits whatsoever. The First Minister, in response to Jane Dodds, noted that they aim to get the balance right in the need to develop renewable energy resources and affordability.</p>
<p>However, this still neglects the vital component of engaging with the local communities. The previous First Minister, Mark Drakeford MS, even stated that:</p>
<p>'The policy is that electricity transmission cables should be placed underground where possible, not just in designated landscapes, but where possible.'</p>
<p>So, that's&nbsp;a clear commitment from this Welsh Government.</p>
<p>Now, I know I have been told, 'Oh, but Janet, it's down to cost.' Well, I'm afraid that if these big companies want—. We need the renewable energy, yes, but, if they want the vast profits that go with that, then I think they've got to respect the value of our countryside. So, what progress have you made, Cabinet Secretary, in delivering an up-to-date cost comparison of overhead and underground cables? Because I understand, although it's more expensive to go underground, that, after seven years, that cost is completely—it doesn't exist anymore, that it balances out. Diolch.</p>

<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">I can't underline enough</span> the importance of that new unit, the value of that evidence unit. But this report explores the potential to improve the disability confident employer scheme, which has come up this afternoon and, indeed, in your report. I think that it's important to say that this report, published today, has been welcomed by the taskforce co-producers, and that does include those members who've been mentioned today: Professor&nbsp;Debbie Foster,&nbsp;Damian Joseph Bridgeman, Dr Natasha Hirst,&nbsp;Willow Holloway and Joe Powell, all contributing generously of their time, expertise and lived experience to this research. I hope you will read the report and see how we are going to use this in terms of discussions with the UK Government about the disability confidence scheme.</p>
<p>It is important, just in terms of the time that we have left in terms of my response, that we fully support the committee's views that public sector bodies in Wales must lead by example in helping reducing the disability employment gap, and, as Jane Dodds has said, this is about leadership. Our employers have got to take the lead, with the public sector at the forefront. I also thank Hefin David and Sioned Williams for, again, reminding us of the positive lessons from the&nbsp;Engage to Change programme, and acknowledging that the Government, from the First Minister to Ministers who actually engaged and visited Engage to Change, that we have actually already started to mainstream supported employment provision, job coaching, into our existing Jobs Growth Wales programme, and provided greater flexibility within our Communities for Work Plus programme, ensuring this can help individuals overcome barriers to employment.&nbsp;</p>
<p>I also think it's very important that we look at the disabled people's employment champions, looking at organisations, such as ELITE,&nbsp;DFN Project SEARCH and further education institutions who offer supported internships for disabled people. Again, it's important that we recognise the specialised job coaching support for people with learning disabilities, as Hefin David has raised.</p>

<p><span style="text-decoration: underline;">as well as the lack</span> of clear and robust targets and no new funding for implementing the actions. Similarly, Joe Powell, chief executive of All Wales People First,&nbsp;who chaired the disability rights taskforce's access to justice working group said, 'In order for this plan to succeed, we need the appropriate investment into the infrastructure and services to make this aspiration a reality. We need clear targets about how we're going to achieve this. Without&nbsp;these, it's very difficult to see how the plan will make a difference to&nbsp;disabled people in Wales.'</p>
<p>Jane Dodds referenced&nbsp;Damian Bridgeman, who chaired the&nbsp;disability rights taskforce's&nbsp;housing and community working group. He said the draft document was 'a smokescreen' rather than a plan.&nbsp;He pointed to the absence of new money and no mechanism to track delivery of the action plan further, adding,</p>
<p>'Disabled people have been reviewed to death. What we need is action – and there’s none of that here.'</p>
<p>He further criticised the lack of action on some of the most practical, necessary recommendations that came out of the co-production phase of the process, which he said</p>
<p>'never even made it into the final plan'</p>
<p>because the Welsh Government, 'doesn't know how to deliver them.'</p>
<p>The sector is also concerned that the UK Government's current Pathways to Work Green Paper proposals risk further disabling people in Wales by compounding poverty and exclusion, placing further pressures on devolved services, such as health and social care, and on the adequacy of funding through the Barnett formula.</p>
<p>In January, I presented the awards at the work and health programme celebration event in Wrexham.&nbsp;This employment support programme, launched by the previous UK Government and delivered initially by Remploy, then Maximus, with support from local charities, community organisations and public bodies, has been instrumental in helping disabled people, individuals with health conditions, and other groups to find and sustain employment.&nbsp;Although support will continue until July 2026 for all those who had already been referred to the programme, the programme was closed to new referrals on 30 September 2024.</p>
<p>Although the DWP has issued grant guidance for Wales for the UK Government's successor connect to work programme, this is yet to launch, potentially denying disabled people in Wales referral to an equivalent programme for a year or more.&nbsp;Third sector providers in Wales are also expressing evidenced concern that the new programme risks diluting and, therefore, reducing support for the many disabled and autistic people who want to work, but face the most complex barriers to employment, be they process driven, attitudinal, physical, technological, or just plain poor understanding and prejudice. As disabled people have told the cross-party groups on disability, on autism, and on deaf issues, their lack of employment is a consequence of these barriers and not of choice. Diolch.</p>

<p>Thank you very much indeed for all your contributions. I think we covered a lot of new ground, which is very good. Both Altaf Hussain and Jane Dodds highlighted the inadequate response by employers, which is very difficult to understand. It really isn't that difficult to find out the information. Clearly, Business Wales has a role here, and I would say the trade unions have a role with larger companies. They need to also be champions of disabled people.</p>
<p>I was also pleased to hear Altaf Hussain talking about people with invisible health issues, like endometriosis, and we did have evidence in that regard—people who feel reluctant to tell their employer about the particular challenges they face in case they are going to get discriminated against, and they are the first ones to go if people are going to be let go.</p>
<p>We had an excellent intervention on this point from Hefin David. It is the case that some employers do adapt their recruitment policies to align with the life skills, rather than the pieces of paper that have been required. I think Aneurin Bevan Health Board is one that has done that. We need to acknowledge that there is good practice going on. But I think one of the most damning points that was made is the point made by Dan Biddle: if you are not in employment by the age of 26, you are very unlikely you will ever become employed. That was reiterated by both Julie Morgan and by Altaf Hussain.</p>
<p>It was useful for Sioned to raise the issue around the UNDP. I think we should thank the Cabinet Secretary for inviting representatives to go and <span style="text-decoration: underline;">meet the working group</span></p>

<p>Diolch yn fawr, Jane Dodds, and thank you for that question. I think it was the First Minister who did report that we're meeting with the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions later this week. Of course, we have a great deal of evidence, and you have given more evidence from your research, your party's research. We've talked about the Policy in Practice evidence. I've also referred to the disability equality forum, which I've met, and the evidence that has come forward from disabled people's organisations.</p>
<p>We will, when we meet with the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions, say that if the disability benefit reforms are to be introduced in their current design, because this is consultation—. We'll stress the importance of the UK Government taking steps to support people who will lose their current benefit income, to prevent them from falling into poverty. I think, when I met with the disability equality forum—. There were people with lived experience—disabled people—who were working who were receiving personal independence payments and who were concerned that they wouldn't be able to work if they didn't have the personal independence payment. I also heard, and I think it's also been clear, that there are issues around waiting lists for Access to Work, for example. So, in terms of Access to Work, where we know we are doing a great deal to support people who wish to and are able to work, there should routes and there should be the support to enable them to access that work.</p>
<p>So, again, I'm grateful for the questions this afternoon. They are all important feedback as we discuss this and, indeed, as I prepare our response to the consultation on the Green Paper and the impacts that we've already learned about, in terms of the changes, cuts, to personal independence payments. &nbsp;</p>

<p>Diolch yn fawr, Jane Dodds. Thank you for that first question, which has already come up this afternoon, in terms of the desperate closure, the ongoing closure of all our bank branches across Wales. In fact, the Cabinet Secretary for Economy, Energy and Planning and I spoke at a really important meeting recently with all banks, to talk about the issues of loss of banks and financial inclusion—a key priority for Welsh Government. Financial services are reserved, but we have regular meetings with LINK, Cash Access UK—the provision of ATMs is also diminishing—and also we had our credit unions represented, and building societies.</p>
<p>So, it is good to hear about the Ystradgynlais banking hub. Of course, that's a shared banking space, where different mainstream banks and their community bankers work on a rotating basis, with each present on one designated working day per week. There are just nine open, and a further four, I think, not just Ystradgynlais, but initial stages have set up in Flint, Holyhead and Monmouth. So, again, that is important that we've raised this today, that you've raised this today, and that we can again take this forward. And looking also at mobile banking vans, which NatWest Group and Lloyds Bank also offer, and Barclays as well. I was very proud to open the first mobile credit union van at Easter, for Neath Port Talbot—not just Neath Port Talbot, but a much wider area.&nbsp;We launched it at Easter.</p>
<p>On your second question, you did challenge me, I recall, Jane, to meet with Patriotic Millionaires when we were discussing the whole issue of child poverty and disability benefits changes. I met with them in April, with the Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Welsh Language, and indeed you also joined and helped convene that meeting. The Cabinet Secretary for finance, I know, would like to inform Members of the content and outcomes of that meeting with me, and we will do so, and we will engage, because it was very valuable to see the issues that they discussed.</p>
<p>They talked about the ways in which taxes could be raised for the highest earners for the benefit of all in society, including those high earners, and I know that the Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Welsh Language is intending to raise this at a future meeting with the Chief Secretary to the Treasury and the Finance: Interministerial Standing Committee. It would be good to discuss these issues as a Senedd. I think one of the discussions we had was about an annual wealth tax, a ready-made piece of work that has already been done by PM UK. I think it was very valuable and we would like to share the learning in terms of what that could mean and understanding this in terms of the need to raise that all-important finance to support our most vulnerable in Wales.</p>

<p>Motion NDM8812 Luke Fletcher, Llyr Gruffydd, Samuel Kurtz, Jane Dodds, Rhys ab Owen, Peredur Owen Griffiths</p>
<p>Supported by Delyth Jewell, Hefin David, Jenny Rathbone, Joel James, Sioned Williams</p>
<p>To propose that the Senedd:</p>
<p>1. Notes:</p>
<p>a) that firefighting exposes individuals to carcinogenic effluents, including benzene and toluene, which significantly increases mortality rates among firefighters relative to the general population;</p>
<p>b) the work of the World Health Organisation’s International Agency for Research on Cancer and their classification of cancer among firefighters as a Group 1 occupational hazard;</p>
<p>c) that countries such as the United States, Canada, and Australia have officially recognised the link between exposure to toxic effluents and increased incidences of cancers; and</p>
<p>d) the Fire Brigades Union’s ‘DECON’ campaign and its vital efforts to help firefighters reduce harmful exposure to contaminants.</p>
<p>2. Recognises the findings of scientific research led by Professor Anna Stec at the Centre for Fire and Hazards Sciences, University of Central Lancashire, commissioned by the Fire Brigades Union, which reveals that surveyed firefighters aged 35 to 39 faced an age-specific cancer rate up to 323 per cent higher than that of the general population of the same age group.</p>
<p>3. Calls on the Welsh Government to:</p>
<p>a) collaborate with the Fire Brigades Union, fire and rescue services, and leading specialists in fire toxicology to mitigate the effects of carcinogenic effluents on firefighters in Wales;</p>
<p>b) establish a preventative health programme to monitor and record exposures for all firefighters in Wales, including annual cancer screening as a minimum standard; and</p>
<p>c) align Wales with international best practices in safeguarding firefighter health.</p>

<p>Thank you. Can I now call in Jane Dodds, please?</p>

<p>Can I just bring in Jane Dodds?&nbsp;</p>

<p>Well, I think we all want to see that come to an end. I think the issue is whether it should be this committee or the children's committee who should be pushing forward on that. Jane Dodds.</p>

<p>As the provisions tabled were as amendments to the Bill, for confidentiality reasons, I wasn't able to share the detail&nbsp;of these before they were made public through their tabling. We had very scarce information on the Bill up until its publication in December. Members of the committee will be aware that there are provisions in the Bill to prevent parents removing their children from education if they are subject to child protection proceedings, and that&nbsp;announcement was made immediately following the conclusion of the murder trial of Sara Sharif's parents, which I'm sure you'll all be aware of.</p>
<p>In December, when we had the further information on the Bill, I informed the UK Government I would like to consider applying certain provisions in the Bill to Wales. Discussions on that continued in the early part of this year. Policy instructions were passed to the Office of the Parliamentary Counsel at the end of January with some further exchanges on the provisions. The Secretary of State for Education wrote to me on 10 March ahead of the Commons Report Stage on 17 and 18 March, confirming that the necessary amendments to what were then clauses 11, 20 and 25 to 29 had been tabled, and that the UK Government considered a legislative consent motion would be required.</p>
<p>I replied to that letter to confirm that I would be tabling one of those, and then myself and Dawn tabled a written statement on the 10 March to inform Members that the UK Government would be tabling amendments to the Bill to include Wales in some of the measures. I was keen to make sure that Members had prior notice ahead of those being laid by the UK Government later that day, and I did that, obviously, to ensure as much transparency as we could ahead of the laying of the LCM. That reflects previous practice where Welsh Government has proactively engaged with the UK Government with a view to developing devolved provisions within a UK Bill.</p>
<p>I should say to the committee as well that as these discussions were ongoing I did endeavour to keep key Members of the Senedd informed. I met with Cefin Campbell as spokesperson for Plaid Cymru, Jane Dodds for the Liberal Democrats, with Buffy Williams as Chair of the Children, Young People, and Education Committee, and I also met with yourself, Chair, as a courtesy. We also kept the Children's Commissioner for Wales informed of our plans as far as we were able to, bearing in mind the very late information we had on the legislation.</p>

<p>Diolch yn fawr, Jane Dodds. It is important when we look at your first question, in terms of Powys Teaching Health Board and cross-border waiting times, of course, the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care—. We provided an additional £5.5 million funding to Powys Teaching Health Board last financial year, on top of its core financial allocation, which included that acknowledgement of the additional cost to the health board of the commissioning position for Powys residents being treated in England, to meet the Welsh waiting times target. It's important that the Welsh Government and NHS partners are working with the health board to help it make those improvements to deliver sustainable improvements. Of course, you will be aware of the Better Together programme, launched on 28 April, seeking the views of the public and key stakeholders—that's the health board—and looking at each area of its services in turn. And it is focusing, in fact, in 2025 on community and adult mental health services.</p>
<p>Thank you for raising again the deeply troubling situation of the ongoing conflict and the humanitarian crisis in Gaza, which has already been aired this afternoon. Of course, matters relating to foreign policy are for the UK Government, but we look outwards, don't we? We have concern, an international view, in terms of how we seek to engage and support, and we have engaged and supported, as I've already said. It is really important that we look at this, that we air it. It's very much in the news at the moment in terms of what's happening. And indeed, the disagreements within Israel, I think it is important to recognise that in terms of just the plight of the hostages as well and their families. And then the situation where those in Gaza, not just in terms of the humanitarian situation and the risk and the suffering of those children and families, but then the political discussion now, which I'm sure that the UK Government will be seeking to influence, to support those in Gaza and indeed Palestine as a whole.</p>

<p>Thank you, Russell George. Can I assure you, and make it very clear, that residents and citizens of Powys are not being treated as second-class citizens in terms of our expectations and in terms of cross-border waiting times? Of course, you can put your questions and, as you say, you've already raised this question. You can put your questions to the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care. What the Welsh Government is committed to is ensuring that people have equitable and timely access to good-quality healthcare services in all parts of Wales. And Powys is in a different situation in terms of how the needs of the patients are met in terms of secondary and specialist care, but, of course, that's long-standing. And that extra funding, I think, for Powys Teaching Health Board, on top of its core financial allocation, was that acknowledgement, as I said in response to Jane Dodds, of the additional cost of the health board commissioning position for Powys residents being treated in England.&nbsp;Of course, we do have that expectation of all our health boards meeting the Welsh waiting times target. That's what the people of Wales want and that's what the people of Powys want, that we do actually meet that Welsh waiting times target, and we've given them resources to do it.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>

<p>Well,&nbsp;I think I've made my position quite clear, Jane Dodds. I have said that this is the key lever to tackling child poverty—ending the two-child benefit cap. And I would hope that the Labour Government in Westminster will. We hope that it will listen to all of those and take the evidence. They have tough decisions that they've got to make though, haven't they? They have, because of the black hole that was left by the Conservative Government. But we have said continuously that this should be a priority in terms of social security for children and tackling child poverty.</p>

<p>I therefore move straight on to our fifth evidence session in our inquiry on social cohesion. I'd very much like to welcome&nbsp;Dr Anwen Elias, reader in politics at the Department of International Politics at Aberystwyth University, who's joining us online; Joe Rossiter, who's co-director of the Institute of Welsh Affairs; and Professor Matt Ryan from Southampton University, and I believe you're involved in the Wales Centre for Public Policy. Thank you very much, all of you, for joining us. Jane is going to start off the conversation. Jane Dodds.</p>

<p>Jane Dodds.</p>

<p>Jane Dodds.</p>

<p>Thank you. Jane Dodds and then I'll come to Heledd Fychan.</p>

<p>Thank you very much. Jane Dodds.</p>

<p>Thank you very much. Jane Dodds now has some questions to follow on with the role of Government in all this.</p>

<p>Members,&nbsp;there are nine papers to note. Are there any issues you wish to raise before we go into private session? Jane Dodds.&nbsp;</p>

<p>Thank you very much, Jane Dodds. Of course, you will know what our position is in Wales. I gave a nation of sanctuary statement last week, and we are very proud of any sanctuary seekers and their host communities when anyone takes the decision to seek and gain UK citizenship. And we do believe seeking asylum—I'm speaking as Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice in the Welsh Government—is a right for those fleeing from persecutions.</p>
<p>Of course, decisions around the status of those migrating to the UK are not devolved, are a matter for the UK Government. But I would say that we believe that those provided with international protection, including refugees, are welcome contributors to Welsh communities, and we're very committed to doing everything we can to ensure the integration of arrivals within Welsh communities. And I do think, as I've said on so many occasions, we do need safe and legal routes to the UK and to becoming a UK citizen.</p>

<p>Diolch, Llywydd.&nbsp;I do welcome the opportunity to respond to this debate on behalf of the Welsh Government. I think, as Jane Dodds said, it’s right that we do continue to debate and talk about this issue, and I do believe a light has been shone on this issue today across the Chamber.&nbsp;But it is the action—it is the action—that we need to account for, and I will be laying that out in my response in terms of the Welsh Government and our partners.</p>
<p>Any case of grooming or exploitation, especially of children, is a tragedy, and I want to convey my gratitude to all those who’ve bravely shared such devastating experiences. The stories we have heard, including those shared during the independent inquiry into child sexual abuse, by courageous victims and survivors, are deeply upsetting and shocking. We must ensure the voices of victims and survivors are heard and acted upon, and that we do everything possible with our partners to ensure everyone in Wales is safe from harm, and that has been expressed across the Chamber today.</p>
<p>In that context, and in line with the amendments that we will be supporting today, I want to reinforce the importance of learning, learning from and delivering on the recommendations of the comprehensive Independent Inquiry into Child Sexual Abuse, IICSA, in England and Wales, led by Professor Alexis Jay. In Wales, we supported the inquiry’s work comprehensively, providing over 30,000 documents, taking part in nine hearings, including the chief social care officer for Wales providing evidence directly to the inquiry, and more than 300 truth sessions were held in Wales. And while no national inquiry can capture every person’s unique experience, the inquiry has provided a wide and comprehensive range of views and experience on what actions need to be taken to better protect children and young people.</p>
<p>The inquiry did make six specific recommendations for the Welsh Government, which we are implementing. We’ve already progressed legislation to strengthen the safeguarding governance and training requirements on independent schools to register their teaching and learning support staff with the Education Workforce Council, and to regulate special school residential services in a similar manner to children's homes.&nbsp;And importantly, in Wales, we already have an organisational mandatory duty to report children and adults at risk, and that mandate is under the Social Services and Well-being (Wales) Act 2014, which extends to local authorities, health and policing staff. And of course, as Joyce Watson has said, it is that challenge of joined-up working that it is vital that we address and deliver in terms of combating child sexual exploitation.</p>
<p>We are developing a 10-year strategy for preventing and responding to child sexual abuse, which we'll be consulting on shortly. There are four strands to the strategy: prevention; protection; supporting children, young people and their families; and supporting adult survivors. The actions are directly informed by the recommendations of the inquiry, and most importantly, this plan is being developed with an influence by victims and survivors.</p>
<p>As well as the Welsh Government, the UK Government are rightly taking action in a number of ways. On 16 January, the Home Secretary announced a range of work to build on the inquiry across both England and Wales. This includes extending the remit of the independent child sexual abuse review panel, and this is a joint enterprise between the National Police Chiefs Council and the Crown Prosecution Service. So, it covers not just historical cases before 2013, but all cases since, and this means any victim of abuse will have the right to seek an independent review without having to go back to the local institutions who decided not to proceed with their case. This is a significant development.</p>
<p>It also includes commissioning Baroness Louise Casey to oversee a rapid audit of the current scale and nature of organised networks across England and Wales, drawing on information not previously available to the existing inquiry. The audit will make recommendations about further analysis, investigations and actions that are needed to address current and historic failures, including in Wales.</p>
<p>The UK Government has also asked all police forces, including our police forces in Wales, to review historical criminal exploitation of children's cases where no further action was taken. That's a really important development. All police forces are implementing the 2023 recommendations from His Majesty's inspectorate on gang-based exploitation, including producing problem profiles on the nature of activity in their area, with an update on progress due this year. And together, including the contribution of Welsh police forces as called for in the amendment, this presents a robust national audit of historic and current cases.</p>
<p>I met with all four police and crime commissioners to discuss this issue on 20 January, and I met again with the lead police and crime commissioner for Wales, Police and Crime Commissioner Dafydd Llywelyn, on 6 February. And in these meetings, policing leads stress their commitment to do everything possible to learn from historic cases and prevent future harm, and respond to current needs and issues.</p>

<p>Diolch, Llywydd. I have given a minute of my time to Jane Dodds, Luke Fletcher, Altaf Hussain, Joyce Watson and Mick Antoniw.</p>
<p>I would like to thank the petitions process, campaigning from key stakeholders and cross-party collaboration. The future of greyhound racing in Wales has been high on the agenda in the Senedd now since 2022. This journey was started by Vanessa from Hope Rescue when she submitted her petition calling for a ban on greyhound racing at the beginning of the Senedd term. It received an incredible 35,000 signatures, securing an evidence inquiry by the Petitions Committee, and subsequently a debate in the Chamber that received support from cross-party Members. Vanessa and her team have first-hand experience of the horrendous cruelty that has taken place at the Valley track in south Wales, with dogs losing their lives and suffering life-altering injuries at that track on a regular basis.</p>
<p>Hope Rescue started when Vanessa found Last Hope back in 2004, a greyhound from the Valley track that was found shot with a captive bolt gun and with his ears hacked off. This was so he couldn't be identified by his tattoos. At the time, his tail was still wagging. As chair of the cross-party group on animal welfare, I would like to thank all organisations involved in the Cut the Chase coalition. Greyhound Rescue Wales, Hope Rescue, RSPCA, Dogs Trust and Blue Cross have worked tirelessly to engage with Members and put forward the case for an outright ban on this cruel and unnecessary sport, sometimes in the face of aggressive opposition.</p>

<p>I&nbsp;thank Jane Dodds for that intervention because this has been critically important indeed in supporting this amendment, making sure that we are listened to and acknowledge that crucial role of those organisations who are at the front line. And so, just in recent days, we've written not only to all regional safeguarding boards, but we've written to all our third sector partners, the NSPCC and all those at the front line supporting victims and survivors, and asked them to, again, tell us concerns and give us any concerns that are being raised with them, and also to emphasise the importance of their work. Of course, the funding of these organisations is critically important, and the role and the respect that they must have in multi-agency safeguarding as well. So, I'm really grateful for the cross-party group work that you've mentioned, Jane, for children and young people, and I also recognise that we've actually got a really important forthcoming report and debate on the cross-party's&nbsp;Children, Young People and Education Committee's inquiry into children on the margins. I think that debate will be a follow through from our debate today.&nbsp;</p>
<p>Just in terms of the third sector and those on the front line with children's organisations, I met with Action for Children last week, with Dawn Bowden, the&nbsp;Minister for Children and Social Care, and they also now have Alun Michael as their ambassador. We discussed the work we're taking forward on child criminal exploitation.&nbsp;</p>
<p>There are many other points that I would like to respond to, but I think you will find that we've already published the response from the Government to that report. But you'll find, I hope, the response will provide many of the responses to the points that have been raised today, and I think, particularly, Sioned Williams's points on the importance of specialist teams and the role that Barnardo's plays across Wales, and the very excellent work, for example, in the safeguarding adolescents from exploitation teams and authorities. Natasha also made a really important point about modern slavery, and human trafficking from Joyce Watson, and the fact that we have developed online learning on modern slavery. And regional safeguarding boards and social care workforce teams are commissioning and developing multi-agency training.</p>
<p>So, I hope that the work I've outlined to deliver on the existing inquiry recommendations and the new independent audit being led by Baroness Casey represents a comprehensive response to this issue. Continuing with this approach rather than duplicating or distracting from it is the best way to maximise delivery and action at pace so we can better safeguard children from harm. Across all of this activity, I repeat: we're determined to hear the voices of victims and survivors, but not just to listen, as Sioned Williams says, but to take action. I do believe the amendment captures this goal and the objectives that we're committed to and I've set out.</p>
<p>In closing, I would say the continued work being undertaken by Welsh Government, UK Government, our policing partners, children's organisations, our local authorities to ensure there's comprehensive understanding of the issues in this debate—no stone is being left unturned. Our focus will always be on listening to victims and survivors of abuse. And on behalf of the Welsh Government I say again: we will do everything we can as a Government to ensure young people in Wales are safe from the horrific crimes of exploitation and sexual abuse.</p>

<p>Okay. I'm going to interrupt you, because we are short of time. We'll come to Mick Antoniw&nbsp;in a minute, but Jane Dodds just wanted to pick on—</p>

<p>Okay. Fine. Jane Dodds.</p>

<p>Bore da. Welcome to this morning's meeting of the Reform Bill Committee. Can I just go through a few of the housekeeping rules? If you've got phones or other electronic equipment, please make sure they're silent or switched off so that they don't interfere with the broadcasting. The Senedd, as you know, operates bilingually, and if you require simultaneous translation from Welsh to English, that's available on channel 1. If you require amplification, that's going to be available on channel 2 on the headsets. There is no scheduled fire alarm today, so if one does take place, please follow the directions of the ushers to a safe location. We have received apologies from Jane Dodds today, and there is no substitute because technically Jane is not a member of the committee, but she's always been a part of this committee and undertaken the work.</p>

<p>Can I thank Jane Dodds for her question? As I’ve already said, it was a very, very difficult decision for Transport for Wales to make, but they did consult with user groups and passengers. And whilst the 05:07 Machynlleth to Barmouth service was removed and the 06:45 Barmouth to Machynlleth service, they did retain the 08:52 Machynlleth to Pwllheli service and the 11:37 Pwllheli to Machynlleth service. So, they were listening and they did act on what they heard.</p>
<p>New trains are going to be introduced this year. They’ll be more comfortable, they’ll be more reliable, and, from May of this year, a year-round 16:30 service will be introduced between Aberystwyth and Shrewsbury. TfW are aiming to introduce an hourly service on this route during the summer months from May of next year.</p>

<p>Finally, question 8, Jane Dodds.</p>

<p>Diolch yn fawr, Jane Dodds. It sounds like a fantastic independent cancer charity, the Bracken Trust, obviously providing vital cancer services around the year. It is independent. I'm not aware—I haven't been able to find—that there is present Welsh Government funding for that. I don't think they have funded it in the past; it must've been funded, presumably, by the local authority, health board, trusts and fundraising donations. But I will take this back to the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care&nbsp;so that we can look&nbsp;at this in terms of their current situation. Of course, this is a situation where they may also be able to get support via the voluntary sector, third sector routes and infrastructure routes as well. So, I will liaise on those questions.</p>

<p>Motion NDM8798 Jane Hutt, Paul Davies, Jane Dodds, Heledd Fychan</p>
<p>To propose that the Senedd:</p>
<p>1. Notes the progress in delivering the Welsh Government’s violence against women, domestic abuse and sexual violence strategy 2022-2026.</p>
<p>2. Supports a call to action for all to accelerate action to eliminate gender-based violence and the need for a whole system approach.</p>

<p>Diolch yn fawr, Dirprwy Lywydd, and thank you so much to everyone who's contributed in this really powerful debate this afternoon on this vitally important topic. I do thank all Members for their contributions today. The commitment was so clear across this Chamber, a commitment coming through from our male allies—commitments from all those—and the women who I know for years have worked hard to campaign for Wales to be the safe place we want it to be. But I do recognise that there's so much more to be done as we head towards the tenth-year anniversary of our groundbreaking Act. That's why I wanted this debate to happen, so that, again, we can learn more from our debate today, and thank the work of the Equality and Social Justice Committee as well, because that has also raised the awareness profile of our strategy and what we are seeking to achieve.</p>
<p>So, can I start by thanking—diolch yn fawr—Sioned Williams? Thank you for co-tabling this debate. It was important that we got that co-tabling across the Chamber. Actually, Mark, you reminded us of all that cross-party work that we did leading up to the bringing forward of the violence against women, domestic abuse and sexual violence Act. But it is about us working together. Yes, scrutiny and challenge are crucial. The issues about the funding in the amendments from Plaid Cymru—I've already commented, in my opening remarks, about the increase to the VAWDASV budget: £250,000 for this financial year and then an increase of over £2 million to our overall funding for VAWDASV for 2025-26. I won't go over that again, but I do recognise that we need to put this on a long-term sustainable footing. That's why I do accept&nbsp; amendment 3, and I think your amendment, actually, does sum up what we are trying to do in terms of that long-term sustainable funding model.</p>
<p>Jane Dodds also commented on this as well in terms of support for those organisations particularly supporting children and young people. But the sustainability of the funding is really important in terms of the code of practice for third sector funding that we are looking at, for longer term funding to be made possible, to ensure that we can have a long-term funding model for a VAWDASV specialist sector that supports that sustainable delivery of services. So, yes, in support of amendment 3; I think that also shows the recognition of us moving and listening and learning. Can I please—[<em>Interruption</em>.]</p>

<p>Diolch, Llywydd. Can I just start by responding to those last points from Jane Dodds and welcome her comments, and repeat the assurance I just gave to Mabon ap Gwynfor? Eliminating profit remains a very high priority for this Government, and we want to achieve that goal as quickly as we can. We would not be here today, discussing these amendments, if we hadn't prioritised this legislation, and I think that clearly shows our commitment that we've made to eliminating profit from the care of children and young people. Can I assure you that we will continue to listen to all of those stakeholders that have an interest in taking this agenda forward, and at the heart of that will be the voice of children and young people, who have been the drivers behind this legislation from day one? I would be happy to maintain the conversations with young people throughout this process, as I have done, and I would want to continue those discussions with other stakeholders, of course, in the third sector, local authorities and beyond, and, of course, with Members in this Chamber. And thank you very much, Jane, for your support.</p>
<p>Going back to the amendments, then. Regarding amendment 46, I recognise that both Members and the sector want to be kept informed of the progress through the transition period regarding the move towards not-for-profit provision, and that's why I did accept recommendation 9 in the Health and Social Care Committee Stage 1 report, and agreed to arrange the publication of the six-monthly progress report, with the intended publication of that first report by 22 April 2025. Given this published commitment, I really don't see the need to duplicate a similar commitment within legislation, as the amendment proposes.</p>
<p>Moving to amendment 47, I do recognise the wish to ensure that local authorities are sufficiently funded to fulfil their vital duties related to the accommodation of looked-after children following enactment of the Bill's provisions, but I can't support this amendment because it requires Welsh Ministers to determine the funding needs of local authorities arising after the end of the transition period before the transitional period has even begun. Now, the end of the transition period could potentially be some years away, as determined by judgments about sufficiency of provision within local authorities, therefore, it's not realistic to estimate the precise level of funding for each local authority so far in advance of the transitional period having ended.&nbsp;</p>
<p>Finally, moving to amendment 48, I do recognise the wish to ensure that legacy providers are clear on the support that they will receive before the transition period begins, and how Welsh Government will communicate with them through that period. Similar to amendment 46, this was an area recognised within the Health and Social Care Committee Stage 1 report, specifically recommendation 4. I accepted that recommendation in part, committing to continue to work with stakeholders to consider what guidance and support could be made available to private and independent providers wishing to re-establish their business under a not-for-profit model, and to develop targeted communications to support different parts of the sector. Given these commitments, I consider duplicating a similar requirement within primary legislation to be unnecessary, and therefore I don't support the amendment.</p>

<p>—in terms of the budget. But can I just say very quickly that I think our curriculum is making a huge difference? Julie made reference to Sound; that's having a real impact, a real culture change, a huge success rate, with 97 per cent of men and boys in the target age range across Wales having seen the Sound campaign. All four police force areas now want to use the campaign in their violence reduction work. As Joyce and others have said, it starts with men, and this is where it's important that we look at that effective campaign, because it is—. We didn't know we'd need a Sound campaign.</p>
<p>It's important, Mark, that we have got a work stream on perpetrators, and that work is being undertaken very effectively in terms of the group involved in that. But also, just to respond to the point that Jane Dodds has made—and Julie—about children and young people, we have a work stream on children and young people. I certainly respect the fact that the Equality and Social Justice Committee request urgent action to ensure that we fast track specific and specialised therapeutic services, and we are addressing that as well, and I look forward to visiting the walk-in hub of Platfform in Cardiff.</p>
<p>I think, Mabon, you make important points as well in terms of the ways in which we need to look at all the statistics, our sexual assault referral centres, access to them. You gave a very powerful report—debate—here in the Chamber most recently, where we took on board some of those issues.</p>
<p>Last week, Siân Gwenllian, we had a very powerful conference in north Wales sponsored by Unison and Wrexham University on tackling workplace sexual harassment, and the issues about housing, of course, are crucial. I'll always remember campaigning for the Housing (Homeless Persons) Act 1977 back in those early days of us tackling domestic violence here in Wales, and recognising the vulnerability of women in terms of their housing needs. And I know that Jayne Bryant is very clearly supportive of that.&nbsp;</p>
<p>So, I think, Dirprwy Lywydd, I will finish on these important points. I think it's a very emotional point for me to respond to this debate, because, back in 1975, the select committee in Westminster reported on their inquiry into violence against women in marriage, and they recommended one family place per 10,000 of the population to meet the needs of what were described as 'battered wives'—do you remember—in those days. And, in 1975, we opened the first women's refuge in Cardiff, by a group of volunteers. Fifty years later, we have the legislation, we have the strategy, we have the commitment of all partners in the public sector. But, clearly, we do have so much more to do to unite in this Chamber to actually deliver on my motion to support a call to action for all to accelerate action to eliminate gender-based violence and the need for a whole-system approach.</p>
<p>Please, don't let us have those headlines: 'Man told ex "I killed her, but don't say a word", court hears', 'Ex-footballer...kicked wife in the head in row...court hears', 'Man admits to murder of three women', 'Only 4% of alleged domestic abusers in police dismissed', 'stalker who tried to get their victim arrested'. Those are quotes from this last week here in Wales. Let's move this motion forward.</p>

<p>Diolch yn fawr, Jane Dodds. The draft budget for next year, 2025-26, includes an indicative allocation to raise the childcare offer hourly rate by 20 per cent, from £5 per hour to £6 from April 2025. This is really important for the recruitment and retention of staff. It also includes uplifts to Flying Start childcare and nursery education. Also, that hourly rate is going to be reviewed annually. That was part of the package. But also, importantly, I think, for the sector, it includes making the 100 per cent small business rate relief permanent, giving more certainty to childcare providers and to enable them to address the financial challenges that you have raised.</p>

<p>First Minister, I’ve spoken to many, many farmers since the autumn and, despite all of the huge challenges that have come to bear on them from this place, they are overshadowed by this major issue. The inheritance tax decision has cut right into the heart of the farming industry as it threatens the future of family farms. It threatens the future of our future farmers, those young people who don’t even know what this is all about—people that we should hold precious in this place. It threatens the very fabric of our rural communities—the things that make rural Wales what it is. In the longer term, ironically, it threatens our food security and what the Government is trying to do to achieve its own plans for a sustainable farming system, one that is focused on the long term and on future generations—something that requires investment and certainty. First Minister, the Treasury can make figures say what they want, but this isn’t just about money; it’s about something more valuable than that, something deeply precious to our country. So, First Minister, I’ll repeat the question that Jane Dodds raised: will you stand up for the farming industry in Wales and make the case against this? A 'yes' or a 'no', as Jane said, will suffice.</p>

<p>Diolch, Llwydd. Well, you won't be surprised to hear that I cannot support James Evans's amendment 42, which opens up the 'types' condition to a wider definition to accommodate models that are 'any reasonable profit entity', as set out in amendment 43.</p>
<p>I've been very clear all along that the policy intention behind this legislation is the removal of all profit. It is not about tackling excessive profit or profiteering only. The concept of 'reasonable profit' therefore conflicts with the fundamental objective of the proposals that seek to ultimately remove the ability to extract any level of profit from children’s care, for exactly the reasons that were set out by Jane Dodds. I cannot therefore identify how 'any reasonable profit entity' could be considered compatible with the objectives of this legislation. It would also represent a departure from the concept of having very clearly defined models on the face of the Bill to give providers the absolute clarity that they have asked for on what type of undertaking is within the scope of this legislation.</p>

<p>Altaf, I'm just going to bring in Jane Dodds and I'll come back to you.</p>

<p>Okay, very lastly, Jane Dodds. A quick question.</p>

<p>Jane Dodds wanted to come in.</p>

<p>Diolch yn fawr, Jane Dodds. Very early on, when the changes came about in the summer, about eligibility for the winter fuel payment, I met with the older people's commissioner to talk about—. If you recall, the previous older people's commissioner had had a big pension credit take-up. Not everyone who's entitled to pension credit in Wales had been applying for that benefit. So, we are working with the older people's commissioner—the past one and the present—to say that we needed to ensure that we reach out to older people, recognising it was the winter fuel payment that is so important to older people in terms of take-up of pension credit.&nbsp;It is something where all of the ways in which we can support older people. That does include access to the discretionary assistance fund.&nbsp;</p>
<p>It is very important that we ensure that older people feel that they are eligible and they are entitled to the discretionary assistance fund, because it is a source of emergency support for people—anyone over the age of 16. We do have 800 registered DAF partner organisations who can make applications on behalf of the people that they represent and support, and that does include Age Cymru as well as local authorities, Citizens Advice and those who are working particularly with older people. And I very much look forward to my next meeting with the older people's commissioner to discuss these issues and how we can make older people more aware of DAF.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p>
<p>I think it's very interesting, you know, there's been a lot of awareness raised about pension credit, I have to say. Just interestingly, I recall at one of my surgeries just encouraging people to apply for pension credit and I remember one particular surgery where someone said, 'Not only have I applied but I've gone round and told everybody in the street to apply if they are in that age group'. I think a lot of awareness was raised about pension credit, but we do need to ensure that other sources of funding, benefits that older people might be entitled to, would be available. And I think this is where we are doing other things in terms of our support for the Fuel Bank Foundation—that we invest in our fuel voucher scheme, with the Fuel Bank Foundation particularly supporting those who, perhaps, are off-grid. The discretionary assistance fund also supports people who are off-grid. And we've revised the way we make those payments based on feedback from some of our partners who are at the forefront of tackling poverty—the Bevan Foundation, Citizens Advice as well.</p>

<p>Thank you. Can I move over to&nbsp;Jane Dodds now?</p>

<p>I was pleased to co-submit this motion from Mabon ap Gwynfor here today, with Jane Dodds, as a debate, and I'm grateful to the Business Committee for selecting this. As Members have already outlined, NRW is often debated and discussed in this Chamber, and I think it's right there is a particular focus today on the 'Case for Change' report. I'm also grateful, Cabinet Secretary, for the time you've spent with me, as chair of the cross-party group on outdoor activities, and for your response to a letter that the cross-party group sent you on this particular matter.</p>
<p>As has already been outlined by others here today, there are concerns about the knock-on effects in particular of the closure of these sites on the economy—local economy in particular—of those areas, and jobs. We must remember that the sector that it's most likely to impact is the outdoor activity sector, and it's really significant. It contributes around £1.6 billion a year to the economy here in Wales, supporting around 31,000 jobs.</p>
<p>By no means are those three centres completely responsible for all of that, but it certainly sends a message to the sector as to the value with which it's held here in Wales. And we know—and you know this, Deputy First Minister—that the value of the outdoors to all of our lives, and our health in particular—mental health value in particular—is significantly important. Indeed, I was just reading a recent report that showed that, if there was a 10 per cent increase in people accessing these types of spaces, it would save the NHS £200 million a year alone on physical and mental health needs. So, it is really significant.</p>
<p>Jenny Rathbone pointed out the impact to the tourism industry and to visitors here in Wales, but there's a very real impact to local people in those communities around those areas who like to access those spaces, and we need to make sure that they are properly supported. So, as chair of the Senedd's cross-party group on outdoor activity, I do regularly hear about the great work that the sector provides in Wales, and the sector wants to be the best in the world. Let's make no bones about it. Outdoor activity in Wales is highly sought after and must remain such, and the centres that are going to be closed are an important part of outdoor activity attractions here in Wales.</p>
<p>I'll be grateful to hear from the Deputy First Minister on the points that colleagues have already raised around the transition of these assets to those local community groups, so we don't see that closure of them for that period of time. Mabon rightly outlined the broader issue of asset transfer, and that is something we do need to continue debating and pursuing, but there's a very immediate issue here. We'd all want to see a seamless, smooth, quick transfer of those assets to those interested parties, removing unnecessary bureaucracy that is holding up any sort of transfer, so that those centres can be used very quickly once again.</p>
<p>And the other point I just want to raise in terms of the case for change is the proposed removal of the education team within NRW. They do provide a unique resource and training for teachers and school staff, equipping them with skills to pass on to the children that they support. They also have a role in helping schools in our outdoor trips and expeditions. The removal of that team to me does not align with the warm words I heard from Ministers when I was pursuing my outdoor education Bill here in the Senedd. There were lots of words about the importance of outdoor education. This to me smacks in the face, the complete opposite, of those warm words, and I feel that there's a piece of work that needs to be done to ensure that expertise is not permanently lost from the education team in NRW.</p>
<p>So, I want to align myself with the comments of colleagues in this Chamber so far. We do need to see the quick transition of those assets, and Cabinet Secretary, I’d be grateful to hear your views on how the expertise from the education team will not be permanently lost either. Diolch yn fawr iawn.</p>

<p>On that question—Jane Dodds asked the question earlier of whether you would rather see the NI increase scrapped. I didn't hear a 'yes' or 'no' answer, but you might want to address that as well. While I'm sure you hope the full cost of Welsh local authorities will be covered, my colleagues in local government are less optimistic. Last month the finance Cabinet Secretary noted that national insurance reimbursements for the public sector will be distributed through the Barnett formula. He warned this would be fundamentally unfair, with Welsh local authorities receiving a lower percentage of reimbursement than their English counterparts. The nature of each council, as you just explained to us, when it comes to in-house services and those contracted out, is different. A promise had been made that the national insurance contributions for public sector workers would be fully funded by the Treasury. So, how are you going to allocate the Barnett consequentials when they eventually get here? Are you confident that you will have enough funds in the Welsh budget to make up the difference between the reality and the formula allocation, when it comes to fully funding the consequences of the Chancellor's decision?</p>

<p>Motion NDM8756 Mabon ap Gwynfor, Sam Rowlands, Jane Dodds</p>
<p>To propose that the Senedd:</p>
<p>1. Notes:</p>
<p>a) Natural Resources Wales’s 'Case for Change' agenda;</p>
<p>b) that 120 staff members are directly impacted by the changes proposed under ‘Case for Change’; and</p>
<p>c) that services provided by NRW will be reduced.</p>
<p>2. Regrets:</p>
<p>a) Natural Resources Wales’s decision to approve the ‘Case for Change’ proposals; and</p>
<p>b) the decision to close catering and retail operations at Coed y Brenin, Nant yr Arian and Ynyslas.</p>
<p>3. Believes that these closures will have a detrimental impact on the mid-Wales economy.</p>
<p>4. Calls on Natural Resources Wales to proactively engage with communities and organisations to expedite the process in order to avoid temporary closure of the centres.</p>

<p>Diolch yn fawr, Jane Dodds. I'm sure you will have volunteers to go on that journey on that wonderful Heart of Wales line. There are issues in terms of timetable changes for mainline services that are taking place, with more consistency for passengers, but of course we've heard already this afternoon and we've been reminded of the £800 million investment in our brand-new fleet of modern trains. I think what's important is that passengers on the Heart of Wales line will benefit from the conversion of the class 153 active travel units, which will provide additional seating and cycle capacity. It is important that, overall in 2024, Transport for Wales services were the most punctual and reliable of all train operators in Wales, but there is still more to do, quite clearly—huge improvements as a direct result of public ownership and investment. But it is important that you've drawn attention today to the Heart of Wales line route capacity and the service itself. This is something where I'm sure colleagues, in terms of our Cabinet Secretary, will be interested in the question, but also see that this is a partnership with Powys County Council as well, in terms of integrated public transport services, on which I know discussions are taking place.</p>