Postal Services Bill
Debate between Jack Dromey and Baroness Burt of Solihull
Lorely Burt
I welcome the Lords amendments that we are considering today. They are an indication of the way in which the Government and the Opposition can work together, because the Government have obviously listened to the constructive suggestions made by Members on both sides of the House. There is a great deal of consensus; I believe that the amendments went through the other place without a Division. That goes to show just how well things can work when everyone is minded to make that happen.
On the subject of shares going to employees, when I wrongly tried to intervene on the hon. Member for Llanelli (Nia Griffith), I was going to point out that it is not 100% of the company that is being sold off to private interests: it is actually 90%, and 10% will go to the employees. The benefits to those employees will be huge. The Bill recognises the importance of the work of the conscientious postman or woman who keeps the post coming through the letterbox six days a week, come rain or shine, and the importance of the work force to the success of the company. The proposals will offer real benefits to the employees.
I greatly welcome the fact that the pension plan members will be protected and that the subsuming of the pension plan is being brought forward. That will give tremendous reassurance to prospective pensioners in Royal Mail. Perhaps most importantly, and despite the disagreement of the Opposition, we are securing the future of the company. The worst thing would be for the Government to do nothing, which would allow Royal Mail to decline and fall. It is an unfortunate fact that, under the previous Government, 65,000 Royal Mail employees lost their jobs and 7,000 post offices were closed. The future of the post office network is now secure. I also greatly welcome the proposal for a vote before mutualisation. That will put in place important protections.
I should like to ask my hon. Friend the Minister a few questions. Does he think that I have understated the benefits for employees? Can he think of any others? Can he give me an assurance that the universal service obligation will be properly protected? Has he had any discussions with representatives of the Communication Workers Union, and, if so, what do they think about the proposals?
Jack Dromey (Birmingham, Erdington) (Lab)
It is important that, when we come to the House, we should reflect the feelings of our constituents. I should therefore like to tell two stories. First, just before Christmas, I visited the local postal sorting office at Sutton New road. I spoke to each of the excellent men and women there. They told me how they had worked there for 10, 15 or 20 years. Some had worked there for 25 years. They work in all weathers to provide an outstanding service to the people of north Birmingham. They felt bitter about what they regard as a betrayal of their loyal service to the country.
Secondly, I want to tell a story not so much about a local post office as about a local entrepreneur who wants to reopen a post office. We have in Perry Common a community well served by the Witton Lodge community association. That community has backed an individual who now runs the local grocery shop—it used to be a sub-post office—and he wants to reopen that post office. Through me, he has approached both the Post Office and the Government for support, only to have it declined. If I may, I will return to that matter at the conclusion of my remarks.
Jack Dromey
To develop our post office network, it is necessary to be imaginative and creative. Sadly, we are moving in the opposite direction.
The Government’s stance could not be clearer. They have rejected a number of opportunities to make the commitment firm in this important legislation. They have declined to accept a statutory commitment, as exists in countries such as Germany and the Netherlands, to a figure of 11,500. They have rejected the embedding in the Bill of the access criteria on how near people’s local post office will be. Post offices locally cannot live on warm words alone; good intentions and high hopes mean naught if we cannot have guarantees for the future.
Lorely Burt
Will the hon. Gentleman refresh my memory on how many new post offices were created under the Labour Government? Was there not a net decline, or managed decline, of the Post Office amounting to 7,000 post offices. Why does he decry the fact that this coalition Government are doing all they can to preserve and enhance the post office service that we have inherited?
Department for Business, Innovation and Skills (Performance)
Debate between Jack Dromey and Baroness Burt of Solihull(13 years, 9 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Jack Dromey
I believe in the real world of work and in listening to the voice of the business community. There has been widespread concern and criticism from across the business community in the midlands about the abolition of Advantage West Midlands. Indeed, Business Voice WM, on behalf of the business community in the midlands, has put forward a proposal that stresses the importance of maintaining a regional strategic structure if the success of that motor manufacturing cluster is to continue.
Lorely Burt
The hon. Gentleman’s experience of the business community in the west midlands is not mine. I have found that the business community has been excited about the prospect of taking its destiny in its own hands, together with elected representatives from the local authority, and creating a forward-thinking local enterprise partnership.
Jack Dromey
Again, with the greatest respect, I am not sure which business community the hon. Lady is talking about. All five of the organisations that represent the business community in the midlands have told me that they are determined to try to make the best of a bad job, following the abolition of Advantage West Midlands, and make the LEPs work, but they are dealing with confused and competing voices. The LEPs have no statutory basis and no funding at a time of major local government cuts. Those organisations are increasingly despairing, because they have lost what worked in favour of something that, at the moment, looks like it will not work.
I listened with amazement to the arguments which in effect said that the Government should get out of the economy and industry. Anyone who has ever had anything to do with the real world of work, here in Britain and in France or Germany, knows the simple truth that the role of good government is key to a successful economy. Time and again over the years I have worked with the private sector and engaged with the Government to try to get them to do the right thing—such as the scrappage scheme and the stimulus scheme that kept our house building industry from collapse.
In the next stages, I hope that Ministers will recognise the value of partnership and industrial activism, and will make the right decisions. Jaguar Land Rover is making applications, under the regional growth fund, on both the lightweight platform and the small engine. Investment in those will create tens of thousands of jobs in Britain. Warwick university’s proposal to become a technology and innovation centre would make it the global hub for automotive research and development worldwide and is strongly supported by Jaguar. Investment in that would greatly strengthen the motor manufacturing cluster in the midlands.
Let us not repeat the mistakes of history. It was a tragic error of judgment not to agree the Forgemasters application. If we are to see a renaissance of the nuclear industry in Britain, with British manufacturing benefiting as a consequence, we should back Forgemasters.
Postal Services Bill
Debate between Jack Dromey and Baroness Burt of Solihull
Lorely Burt
I cannot take any more interventions. I am sorry.
The point is that 90% of Royal Mail will become a private company. That necessitates close scrutiny to ensure that Royal Mail employees and customers and the taxpayer are protected.
Consumer Focus wants changes that protect consumers to be added to the Bill. It believes that Ofcom “must” impose a consumer protection condition on every postal operator—rather than “may”, which is the term currently used in the Bill. Please can we have “must” instead of “may”? Can we also add the requirement that Ofcom must impose the essential condition that every postal operator must guarantee the confidentiality, safety and security of mail?
I know that Opposition Members are concerned that the Bill’s provisions may be detrimental to customers in rural areas. Can we therefore insert into the Bill a definition of the minimum number of access points to the mail system—post offices and post boxes—and the criteria for geographic distribution, together with criteria under which exceptions could be sought? Can we also add a requirement on Ofcom to consult representatives of residential and small and medium-sized enterprise customers, and other particularly vulnerable customers, when conducting any review of the universal postal services order? SMEs often get left off the list, but it is important that they are consulted as well.
Customers need proper protections when things go wrong. Can we build into the Bill a requirement for postal operators to be members of an approved redress scheme to ensure complaints-handling standards can be monitored and independently investigated? Finally on the consumer front, can we build in a requirement that postal operators continue to provide appropriate information to the regulator and an appropriate consumer watchdog in order to enable independent monitoring of performance, quality of service, complaint handling and services provided to vulnerable consumers?
I want to make a few comments about the separation of Royal Mail and the Post Office. Key provisions in the Bill allow for the privatisation of Royal Mail and the formal separation of Royal Mail and the Post Office. Formal separation offers considerable advantages for the Post Office. For example, it would be managed by a board that could be more closely aligned to its own strategic objectives, and would no longer be a junior partner in group decision making. However, the Government have announced that they will seek a refreshed inter-business agreement between Royal Mail and the Post Office. Will subsequent contracts be subjected to a competitive tender process given that, as Opposition Members have pointed out, there would be no guarantees that the Post Office would retain its mail contract thereafter? I fully accept that there may be arguments against seeking to maintain the contractual relationship between the Post Office and Royal Mail in perpetuity as we cannot reasonably assume that consumer need will necessitate upholding the current access arrangements indefinitely. I also understand why, in light of future uncertainties, the Bill must not be too prescriptive, but might it include provision for the Secretary of State to seek a review of the access criteria at a future date, subject to parliamentary approval?
On the division of assets between the Post Office and Royal Mail, the Bill allows for the transfer of property or other assets between parts of Royal Mail Holdings plc. These provisions allow property transfers to be made directly by the Secretary of State or the holdings company. My worry is that the Post Office has frequently taken a minor role compared to Royal Mail, so when negotiating the property transfers, we need to ensure that the greater weight of Royal Mail is not used unfairly. Therefore, can the Government take steps now, in advance of measures contained in the Bill and the separation of the holdings company taking effect, to maintain the Post Office’s current assets?
Finally, there is speculation about who might buy Royal Mail. All the protections I have mentioned must be in place, but I would like whoever the purchaser might be to be given the best possible chance to make Royal Mail a world-beating postal service.
Lorely Burt
No, sorry.
Royal Mail is currently hamstrung by regulations that make it uncompetitive against outside competitors, so can we examine those seriously? We want to make Royal Mail a much more attractive proposition for a prospective purchaser and ensure that the staff and new management, together, can make it the full and profitable service that it deserves to be.