(2 days, 21 hours ago)
Commons Chamber
Ian Sollom (St Neots and Mid Cambridgeshire) (LD)
I am grateful to the Opposition for this debate. In the recent Westminster Hall debate on this topic, we heard powerful testimony about the reality that graduates face in making repayments every month and watching their balance grow, with their plans deferred and lives constrained. I am sure we will hear more of that today, and those stories deserve to be heard and to receive a clear response, not a political runaround.
Parts of the motion are not wrong. The plan 2 threshold should be unfrozen, and while we may disagree on the specific change proposed, the interest structure does need reform, as the Liberal Democrats have said clearly. The motion also calls for more apprenticeships for 18 to 21-year-olds, and we welcome such investment in principle. We would go further by doubling degree apprenticeships in priority sectors and introducing skills co-operatives specifically to help small businesses to pool resources to take on apprentices they could not otherwise afford.
However, the question is whether the motion as a whole represents a serious plan, and I am afraid that it does not. Specifically, it calls for
“controlling the number of places on university courses where the benefits are significantly outweighed by the cost to graduates and taxpayers.”
Let us be clear about what
“controlling the number of places”
means. It means cutting. The courses they have in mind are arts, humanities and creative subjects.
The argument rests on a definition that sounds objective but is not: which courses have benefits that are significantly outweighed by their costs? The proxy appears effectively to be graduate salaries. Graduate salaries are a poor measure of what society gains from a degree. Nursing, teaching, social work and creative arts all underperform on salary data while delivering enormous public value, so what logic are the Conservatives applying? Even on salary terms, cutting arts places would damage science, technology, engineering and maths, not protect it, as one Labour Member mentioned. Arts courses are relatively cheap to deliver and cross-subsidise expensive laboratory provision. The Institute for Fiscal Studies explicitly found that reducing arts funding may, perversely, reduce funding for STEM.
Alex McIntyre (Gloucester) (Lab)
The hon. Gentleman is making a very important point. The Conservatives talk about cutting public funding for courses such as creative arts, but that will not stop the wealthiest students from accessing those courses. Does he agree with me that all that will happen is that people from more deprived parts of our country will not be able to access them, and that there will be one rule for them and another rule for everyone else?