Online Safety Bill

Debate between Ian Paisley and Damian Collins

Report stage
Monday 5th December 2022 Commons Chamber

[Damian Collins]

I thank the right hon. Lady for that information.

Let me move on to the debate about encryption, which my right hon. Friend the Member for Haltemprice and Howden has mentioned. I think it is important that Ofcom and law enforcement agencies be able to access information from companies that could be useful in prosecuting cases related to terrorism and child sexual exploitation. No one is suggesting that encrypted messaging services such as WhatsApp should be de-encrypted, and there is no requirement in the Bill for encryption to end, but we might ask how Meta makes money out of WhatsApp when it appears to be free. One way in which it makes money is by gathering huge amounts of data and information about the people who use it, about the names of WhatsApp groups and about the websites people visit before and after sending messages. It gathers a lot of background metadata about people’s activity around using the app and service.

If someone has visited a website on which severe illegal activity is taking place and has then used a messaging service, and the person to whom they sent the message has done the same, it should be grounds for investigation. It should be easy for law enforcement to get hold of the relevant information without the companies resisting. It should be possible for Ofcom to ask questions about how readily the companies make that information available. That is what the Government seek to do through their amendments on encryption. They are not about creating a back door for encryption, which could create other dangers, and not just on freedom of expression grounds: once a back door to a system is created, even if it is only for the company itself or for law enforcement, other people tend to find their way in.

[Ian Paisley (North Antrim) (DUP)]

I thank the hon. Member for jointly sponsoring my private Member’s Bill, the Digital Devices (Access for Next of Kin) Bill. Does he agree that the best way to make progress is to ensure open access for the next of kin to devices that a deceased person leaves behind?

[Damian Collins]

The hon. Member makes an important point. Baroness Kidron’s amendment has been referred to; I anticipate that future amendments in the House of Lords will also seek to address the issue, which our Joint Committee looked at carefully in our pre-legislative scrutiny.

It should be much easier than it has been for the Russell family and the coroner to gain access to such important information. However, depending on the nature of the case, there may well be times when it would be wrong for families to have access. I think there has to be an expedited and official process through which the information can be sought, rather than a general provision, because some cases are complicated. There should not be a general right in law, but it needs to be a lot easier than it is. Companies should make the information available much more readily than they have done. The Molly Russell inquest had to be delayed for four months because of the late release of thousands of pages of information from Meta to the coroner. That is clearly not acceptable either.

My right hon. and learned Friend the Member for Kenilworth and Southam (Sir Jeremy Wright) has tabled an amendment relating to small and risky platforms. The categorisation of platforms on the basis of size was linked to duties under the “legal but harmful” provisions, which we expect now to change. The priority illegal harms apply to platforms of all sizes. Surely when illegal activity is taking place on any platform of any size—I hope that the Minister will clarify this later—Ofcom must have the right to intervene and start asking questions. I think that, in practice, that is how we should expect the system to work.

Like other Members who served on the Joint Committee —I am thinking particularly of my hon. Friends the Members for Watford (Dean Russell) and for Stourbridge (Suzanne Webb), both of whom spoke so passionately about this subject, and the hon. Member for Ochil and South Perthshire (John Nicolson) raised it as well—I was delighted to see that the Government had tabled amendments to cover Zach’s law. The fact that someone can deliberately seek out a person with epilepsy and target that person with flashing images with the intention of causing a seizure is a terrible example of the way in which systems can be abused. It is wrong for the platforms to be neutral and have no obligation to identify and stop that action, but the action is wrong in practice as well, and it demonstrates the need for us to ensure that the law keeps pace with the nature of new offences. I was very proud to meet Zach and his mother in October. I said to them then that their work had changed the law, and I am glad that the Government have tabled those amendments.

Fishing Discards and Quotas

Debate between Ian Paisley and Damian Collins

Wednesday 18th March 2015 Commons Chamber

[Damian Collins (Folkestone and Hythe) (Con)]

Today, we have debated the Budget, focusing on much of the positive news for the economy and businesses right around the UK. I was pleased to be able to speak earlier on those matters. In the Adjournment debate, I want to raise the plight of a particular industry. Businesses operating in it are experiencing real difficulties and concerns. I am speaking particularly about the inshore fisheries industry in my constituency, but I know the subject is of interest to many other hon. Members with constituencies right around the UK’s coastal waters.

Many fisheries businesses are suffering acutely: they are landing fewer fish; they have a reduced quota and reduced incomes; and the operating costs, business costs and indeed the costs of living for the fishermen’s families are not going down. There is an urgent need, I believe, for additional quota for the under-10 metre fleet and the inshore fisheries in particular. I believe this is necessary to alleviate the considerable hardship being experienced, and if the proposed discards ban is going to be workable, the extra quota will be needed.

The inshore fishing fleet and the inshore fisheries businesses are an important part of the local economies that they serve—not just for the crews and their families and the vessels they maintain, but for the communities where the fish are landed. In my constituency, from Dungeness and Hythe to Folkestone, fishing businesses are linked to the trawlermen’s businesses. There are businesses such as the Dungeness Fish Hut and Richardson’s, also in Dungeness; Griggs of Hythe; and the Folkestone Trawlers association. These are popular fishing businesses. They sell fish into the restaurant trades, they are part of the important local food tourism offer and they support local food, fish festivals and so forth. They are an important part of a living coastal community—its heritage, its traditions and its economic life—and many other businesses rely on their sustainability.

The urgent matter of quota has been raised with me by my local fishermen. My hon. Friend the Member for Hastings and Rye (Amber Rudd) also met the Minister to raise with him concerns brought to her attention by fishermen in Hastings, who particularly highlighted the reduction in quota of 28% for sole and no increase in their quota for skate and rays. In my constituency, the Folkestone trawlers brought to my attention the fact that one of them had recently caught his entire month’s quota for plaice in an hour and half while fishing in Hythe bay—such is the level of abundance, yet the fishermen have the acute frustration that they do not have the quota to land more of the fish because they are already at their limits.

The Folkestone trawlers supplied me with some data based on the quota for this month. It is based on the quota for the North sea and English channel areas from which the Hythe-based fishermen fish, and it looks at levels of cod, plaice, skate and sole. The total catch value for the fishermen, minus their expenses, would bring in a total of £8,635, divided between four crews, but they tell me that they are unlikely to catch much sole. At the moment, sole would bring in over half of the value, so the real potential income from the quota of fish landed could be as little as £3,285 divided between the crews. The Folkestone trawlermen tell me that when that is broken down to the hourly rate for which the fishermen are working, it means that they could be working for as little as just over £5 an hour.

[Ian Paisley (North Antrim) (DUP)]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for raising this important issue. Are we not seeing the pernicious evil of Europe once again, as it sticks its nose into our affairs and prevents our fishermen from earning a livelihood?

[Damian Collins]

I agree that there is widespread concern about the operation of the common fisheries policy and the deal that it gives our fishermen, and I think that we would all like to see more local management of our waters. That is part of the agenda that the Government have pursued during their negotiations in Europe, which I think we would all support, and which the sector would certainly support.

There is also the question of the allocation of quota. The inshore fishing fleet has about 4% of the United Kingdom’s quota, although it supplies about 75% of the manpower for the UK fishing industry. Will the Minister consider making additional quota available for the inshore fleet? The fishermen tell me they need a substantial increase, and that they need it soon. The provision of additional quota in a year or two may come too late for a number of fishermen who are currently in great difficulty.

The question of conservation levels has been raised in the House recently, and, indeed, arose last week during questions to the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs. It is especially relevant to sea bass stocks. Because sea bass is outside the quota, inshore fishermen in particular are going for whatever fish are available to supplement their catch, and sea bass is a good species to go for. It is possible that any concern about fish that are not on the quota will be exacerbated by the lack of quota for the inshore fleet.