Export Licences: High Court Judgment

Debate between Hilary Benn and Liam Fox

Thursday 20th June 2019 Commons Chamber

[Dr Fox]

I agree with my right hon. Friend about the humanitarian costs involved in the conflict, and I also agree that there can be no military solution to this particular conflict. There can only be a negotiated and political solution. However, we do monitor allegations of IHL breaches, and we do take that into account when making decisions. Of course, the predictive nature of this process means that we have to look at the past pattern of behaviour, the information we have available, and what mitigations may have been put in place to ensure that any incidents are not repeated. We are unable to make absolute definitions about whether there has been a breach when we are not party to the full information, but we make those decisions based on the predictive element of criterion 2c and on the evidence that is available from both public and protected sources.

[Hilary Benn (Leeds Central) (Lab)]

The Government’s position is, frankly, inexplicable, because the Secretary of State referred to all the careful analysis that has been done, but anyone else undertaking an assessment of future risk—this goes to the heart of the point that the right hon. Member for Sutton Coldfield (Mr Mitchell) just raised—would look at the past behaviour of those using the weapons that we have sold to Saudi Arabia. As the Secretary of State well knows, others have done so, and the UN panel of experts found over three years ago that

“the coalition had conducted airstrikes targeting civilians and civilian objects, in violation of international humanitarian law”.

The Government cannot continue to say, “We’re sorry. We haven’t been able to make an assessment, but we are not sure that there is a risk about the future.” I will ask a direct question of the Secretary of State: is it the Government’s view that Saudi Arabia has engaged in activities that have breached international humanitarian law?

[Dr Fox]

I disagree with the premise of the question itself. The right hon. Gentleman says that the Government’s position is inexplicable, but it is not. We are following the EU and national criteria set out for arms exports, and we are following the EU common position. We look at all reports of potential breaches of international humanitarian law, but we must also take into account, by the nature of the predictive elements in criterion 2c, what we think the future risk will be based on, for example, any mitigations.

EU Trade Agreements: Replication

Debate between Hilary Benn and Liam Fox

Wednesday 13th February 2019 Commons Chamber

[Hilary Benn (Leeds Central) (Lab)]

The past two and a half years have been a very painful process, as the wild and optimistic promises about what could be achieved from the Brexit process have collided with reality. That includes what the Secretary of State said to the Conservative party conference in the autumn of 2017. The question I wish to put to him is simply this: why does he think that it has proved so difficult to roll over all these deals, when he told that conference that it would be a very easy thing to do and he was confident of achieving it?

[Dr Fox]

If we get an agreement via the withdrawal agreement with our European Union partners, that is exactly what will happen: those agreements will roll over. Let me explain to the House why: the United Kingdom will be deemed by the European Union to continue to be party to those agreements. We will get continuity, but we will not get the same continuity if we do not get an agreement with the EU. Those who continue, by their actions, to make no deal more likely will have to be responsible for the consequences.

Trade Bill

Debate between Hilary Benn and Liam Fox

Tuesday 9th January 2018 Commons Chamber

[Dr Fox]

I confirm that we have had very positive discussions with the Canadian Government, and I also confirm it is our intention, as we have said, to ratify CETA before we leave the European Union. Once we have left the European Union, CETA will form a good basis for any future agreement with Canada, while taking advantage of the increased trading freedoms the United Kingdom might have, unrestricted by elements such as the data localisation restrictions that are currently placed on us by the EU’s negotiating position.

[Hilary Benn (Leeds Central) (Lab)]

This Bill is a consequence of the Government’s decision to leave the customs union. Will the Secretary of State explain why, as we learned from his colleague the Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union, the decision was taken without any economic assessment of the consequences of leaving the customs union? Will he now set out why he thinks the gains will outweigh any potential losses?

[Dr Fox]

I hate to correct the right hon. Gentleman, but this Bill is a consequence of the British public’s vote to leave the European Union. Leaving the European Union means that we are leaving our current trading agreements. If we want stability to continue for our businesses, we have to put the legislative framework in place for it to do so. That is exactly what we are doing.