Northern Ireland (Executive Formation etc) Bill

Debate between Geoffrey Cox and Steve Baker

Committee stage
Tuesday 29th November 2022 Commons Chamber

[Sir Geoffrey Cox (Torridge and West Devon) (Con)]

I had the great privilege a little while ago of being the Advocate General for Northern Ireland, and I recall in the same situation the Chief Justice of Northern Ireland saying to me that there was a serious problem in the appointment of Northern Ireland barristers to the rank of King’s counsel. Can my hon. Friend give me the assurance that he and my right hon. Friend will be in close touch with the Chief Justice of Northern Ireland and that there will be no impediment to the appointment of King’s counsel in the province? It is very important from the point of view of judicial appointments generally that that first rung on the ladder is not obstructed or delayed.

[Mr Baker]

The Secretary of State is well aware of the issue that my right hon. and learned Friend raises. I am grateful to him for putting it on the record, and we will certainly take up the point that he makes.

We do not think we can anticipate all the decisions that civil servants will need to take, so this House should not try to start prioritising some decisions over others. We are clear, however, that we want to restore the Executive with locally accountable politicians taking those political decisions. Amendment 13 concerns reporting on decisions taken. In my intervention on my friend the hon. Member for Belfast East (Gavin Robinson), we reached a conclusion on what we will do through the guidance in paragraph 15, and I look forward to amending the guidance when it is published in its final form.

On amendment 7 and new clause 3 and having “due regard” to the views of the First Minister designate and the Deputy First Minister designate, the essential issue is that the Belfast/Good Friday agreement does not recognise any position of First Minister designate or deputy First Minister designate, nor a joint office of First Ministers designate, so it would not be appropriate to refer to those positions, which do not exist in this expedited legislation. There is also no reference in the Belfast/Good Friday agreement to leaders of groupings.

Clause 3 as drafted already requires the Secretary of State to have regard to representations made by any MLA, and that will allow views from across the political spectrum to be put forward, including but not limited to the leaders of the largest parties in the two largest designations within the Assembly. On other occasions, Members have conceded that the Secretary of State and I have been engaging widely with Members, and we will be glad to continue doing so.

Amendment 8 and new clause 1 are about publishing representations of MLAs and providing a report to the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee. I can assure the hon. Members for Foyle (Colum Eastwood) and for Belfast South (Claire Hanna) that the Secretary of State will treat the duty with all the seriousness it deserves as we provide guidance to senior officers on the exercise of departmental functions in relation to clause 3(1). We do not think that publishing representations from MLAs themselves is a proportionate or necessary step. I would also make the same point about the hon. Members’ new clause 1, which would require a specific report to the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee on decisions taken. As we discussed earlier, reports will be made available through the Secretary of State to MLAs, Members of Parliament and through Libraries, as we discussed earlier.

We have already had a fairly wide-ranging discussion of MLA pay, but what I would say to my hon. Friend the Member for North Dorset (Simon Hoare), the Chair of the Select Committee is that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State has a real zeal for this issue. He will need to make a determination, and I know that he will consider the current evidence base, but also I am confident that he will instruct officials to look for further evidence on the level of remuneration that MLAs should receive while they are not sitting and carrying out their full duties. We have heard some reasonable arguments about what that will mean for people who are less well off, and I know that my right hon. Friend will bear all of that in mind when he makes his determination. However, I should like to reassure my hon. Friend the Chairman of the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee about all of his amendments and say that his zeal is matched at least by that of my right hon. Friend.

My hon. Friend the Member for North Dorset mentioned pension entitlements. Although it is perfectly reasonable to raise that, and we have considered the issue, the amendment would have a number of unintended consequences, which we do not have the powers to mitigate. We have therefore legislated to avoid those consequences.

I am extremely grateful for a wide-ranging and constructive debate. We have addressed a wide range of amendments to this short Bill, and they are all constructive. I am grateful to hon. Members above all for their forbearance on the compressed timescale that has been necessary for these measures.

Question put and agreed to.

Clause 1 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clauses 2 to 15 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

The Deputy Speaker resumed the Chair.

Bill reported, without amendment.

King’s Consent signified.

Bill read the Third time and passed.

Legal Advice: Prorogation

Debate between Geoffrey Cox and Steve Baker

Wednesday 25th September 2019 Commons Chamber

[The Attorney General]

Yes.

[Mr Steve Baker (Wycombe) (Con)]

Is it not the case that, contrary to the shouted opinions from the Opposition Front Bench, the Supreme Court has invented a new constitutional rule, just as Lord Sumption told us on the “Today” programme this morning? Lord Sumption also said that this was a revolution—he described the decision as revolutionary. Is it not the case that—[Interruption.] The hon. Member shouts “shocking”, but it was Lord Sumption who said it. Is it not the case that, prior to this revolutionary decision by the Supreme Court, it is quite likely—indeed probable—that my right hon. and learned Friend’s advice was correct, but the Supreme Court changed the law?

[The Attorney General]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for the question. I cannot disclose what advice I gave. The hon. and learned Member for Edinburgh South West, who first asked this urgent question, had that answer, and I am afraid I am going to have to keep giving it today. However, what I would say is that the Supreme Court did indeed, as it overtly and explicitly said, develop the law. It took what was a political convention—hitherto, in all the constitutional textbooks, described as unenforceable by a court—and decided that it would set a test and convert it into a legal principle and legal test. It was perfectly entitled to do that, just as this House will, in the coming months and years, have to reflect on the implications and on whether it is content to leave that position untouched. However, for the moment, that is the law, and the law must be obeyed.

Withdrawal Agreement: Legal Opinion

Debate between Geoffrey Cox and Steve Baker

1st reading: House of Commons
Tuesday 12th March 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mr Steve Baker (Wycombe) (Con)]

Paragraph 23 of the political declaration makes it clear that we would

“build and improve on the single customs territory provided for in the Withdrawal Agreement”.

We know what the EU understands that to mean. In good faith and with best endeavours, it understands it to mean a customs union, as Dan Hannan MEP reminded us earlier. So is it not the case that if we negotiate under this agreement, we will either find ourselves trapped indefinitely in the backstop, because the EU is acting “in good faith”, or have to agree a customs union, contrary to our manifesto?

[The Attorney General]

I simply say to my hon. Friend that I really do not believe so. Why not? Because the commitments now cemented on alternative arrangements, which require a separate negotiating track, with a timetable to negotiate them, are now built in so that, as I have said in my written opinion, it would be extraordinary if the EU declined to adopt any such measures. It would be extraordinary, so I do not accept that the backstop is the base for any future arrangement. Let me give another reason why it is not. Built into the political declaration is an independent free trade policy, and we cannot have an independent free trade policy and have a customs union. Also built into it is no free movement. Does the Labour party support free movement now? It speaks with all sorts of voices. But the political declaration says there is none, and we cannot belong to the single market without free movement. So I say to my hon. Friend that I understand where these fears come from, but we must be bold and courageous, and we must move forward, for the sake of our country.

Withdrawal Agreement: Legal Position

Debate between Geoffrey Cox and Steve Baker

Monday 3rd December 2018 Commons Chamber

[The Attorney General]

I can only tell the right hon. Gentleman that I have not massaged the advice. I have given it absolutely as I see it—absolutely starkly. I will give that same advice if anybody asks to come and see me, but I cannot breach the fundamental constitutional principle that I believe it would be contrary to the public interest to break. I can only invite the right hon. Gentleman to accept that I have given this advice as candidly as I possibly can; I cannot say any more if he does not accept that.

[Mr Steve Baker (Wycombe) (Con)]

An amendment was tabled to the Humble Address motion that was highly sympathetic to my right hon. and learned Friend’s position. It was not selected and not passed, but the motion, unamended, was passed. Therefore, whatever he has just argued at the Dispatch Box, the position is as my hon. Friend the Member for North East Somerset (Mr Rees-Mogg) set out—he is under an instruction. If he wishes to change the position in the House of Commons, will he move a motion in this House to support the position that he has just set out?

European Union (Withdrawal) Bill

Debate between Geoffrey Cox and Steve Baker

Committee: 6th sitting: House of Commons
Tuesday 12th December 2017 Commons Chamber

[Mr Baker]

I am grateful to my right hon. and learned Friend for that intervention.

[Mr Cox]

I wonder whether my hon. Friend might be attracted by this idea. At the moment, as drafted, the clause gives an inclusive, non-exhaustive list of examples, but I wonder whether the principle of ejusdem generis might not assist us if it were slightly redrafted. One could draft it so that any extensions beyond the inclusive list had to be of the same kind or species as those that were listed. That might give some comfort, if they have to be of a similar character to those enumerated in the Bill.

[Mr Baker]

I am extremely grateful to my hon. and learned Friend, and I would be happy to meet him, our legal team and my right hon. and learned Friend the Member for Beaconsfield to take their suggestions on board. I am keen to address this, and I know that the Secretary of State is keen to do so, but I am not in a position today to have tabled or accepted an amendment. I ask them to bear with me and have further meetings with us and our legal teams to try to find a way through.