ISIS Members Returning to the UK

Gavin Newlands Excerpts

Monday 18th March 2019 Westminster Hall

[Gavin Newlands (Paisley and Renfrewshire North) (SNP)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Howarth. I thank the hon. Member for Thornbury and Yate (Luke Hall)—something I have not said before—for setting out the petition so well. It can be quite difficult to do that in a balanced way on such a sensitive issue, but he handled it very well. He spoke of the declared area offence, which is intended to make it easier to convict those who travel to conflict areas. We tried to put appropriate safeguards in place, and we welcome the measure, provided that those safeguards are in place. I join him in sending our condolences to those involved in the atrocities in Utrecht and Christchurch—an urgent question is being asked about that in the Chamber. It is important to remember the victims of extremists and terrorists.

The hon. Member for Barrow and Furness (John Woodcock) mentioned the clash between this debate and the urgent question in the Chamber. I am curious about why we are often quick to label far-right violence and extremism as that, rather than as terrorism. We are quick to describe members of Daesh and al-Qaeda as terrorists, but we seem to talk about the far right in stages; we call it extremism and violence, and only after a certain amount of time do we call it terrorism. I am a little uncomfortable with that, to be honest.

I jokingly said before the debate that I do not think the hon. Member for Barrow and Furness and I have ever knowingly agreed on anything since my election in May 2015. However, halfway through his speech I found myself agreeing with almost everything he was saying—I even said, “Hear, hear” at one point. That was a shock to both of us. We did diverge at one point, where we have subtle differences of opinion, but I welcome much of what he said. He made a good point about the impact on international relations in an incredibly sensitive area if we were to disallow the return of Daesh terrorists to the UK. His point about social media companies is incredibly important. I think we would all accept that there has been an improvement in those companies’ reactions with regard to taking down content and so on, but too often their reaction is still far too slow. There is still a long way to go with regard to social media platforms doing their bit.

There is no doubting the gravity and importance of this issue and of the petition. We must all recognise that there is a deep sense of anger in the country. That is evidenced by the nearly 600,000 signatures on the petition, 582 of which came from my constituency. Regardless of our opinions on the petition or anything else, we are all deeply concerned about the threat from Daesh, al-Qaeda and other terrorist organisations and ideologies. I very much feel the anger—I hear it in surgeries, and I get emails the same as everybody else—of those who signed the petition. However, I do not agree with the solution they call for.

The petition asserts that removing citizenship from Daesh members would keep the UK safe from terrorism, but that is fundamentally flawed and, as we heard, flies in the face of international law. The UK must meet its international obligations, allow the return of its citizens and ensure that they face the full consequences of their actions. If we do not take responsibility for that, on whose shoulders should it fall? Stripping extremists and terrorists of their citizenship would leave a line of angry, radicalised and violent people in post-conflict regions and give them, through their extremist lens, further reason to wish violence upon the people of our countries.

Alex Younger, the chief of MI6, insisted that although he is “very concerned”—as we all are—about the individuals making their way back from Syria and elsewhere in the region, British nationals have a right to come to the UK. The Times also reported that MI5 sees individuals who have joined Daesh as potentially valuable intelligence assets in continuing the fight against Daesh and its murderous ideology at home and in the region.

However, no one who has fought for or assisted a terrorist group will ever face a warm welcome on their return to the UK. Many of these fighters have committed unimaginable acts of terror and violence against innocent people in the name of a fascist ideology; of that there can be no doubt. It is vital that we recognise that if a UK citizen becomes isolated from society and susceptible to radicalisation, it is we—our society and our Government —who failed to prevent that. As has been said already, if the UK allows radicalisation to happen, it is our responsibility to make amends and bring the UK national in question to justice.

Having been the SNP’s Front-Bench spokesman on the Counter-Terrorism and Border Security Bill—I am sure that I took interventions from the hon. Member for Barrow and Furness—I very much look forward to the review of the Prevent strategy that the Opposition secured during the Bill’s passage. We will seek to ensure that the review is independent and that its scope is wide enough for it to be truly effective. The point was made earlier that that is not about watering down our approach to Prevent; I say in response that it is about ensuring that it is effective, which I think we all want.

Between 2014 and 2017 there was a dramatic rise in the number of UK citizens who lost their citizenship, so will the Minister carry out a full review of the powers available to the Home Office to strip an individual of their citizenship? Statistics show that citizenship deprivation was used only a handful of times a year, but its use rocketed from 14 times as recently as 2016 to 104 times in 2017. Under the Immigration Act 2014, the UK Government are required to carry out a review of the Home Secretary’s power to revoke citizenship. The first such review was conducted in 2016 by the eminent QC David Anderson—he is now Lord Anderson—in his capacity as the independent reviewer of terrorism legislation, but no subsequent review has been published, and the position of independent reviewer is currently vacant. The next review would need to cover the period from July 2015 to July 2018.

On that note, it is worth considering these comments by Duncan Lewis Solicitors:

“The power to deprive UK citizens of their citizenship can only be used against the children of immigrant parents—meaning that the application of the policy is inherently discriminatory. It cannot be used on a white English person with white English parents.”

That aspect of the current powers must surely be dealt with in the next review to address fully the obvious concerns about the policy.

The Home Secretary also has powers to ensure that foreign fighters can return to the UK to face justice, and powers that would enable him to manage the return of foreign fighters. Provided he reasonably suspected that an individual had been involved in “terrorism-related activity” and posed a threat to security in the UK, he could impose a temporary exclusion order, which have been mentioned, under the Counter-Terrorism and Security Act 2015. That would permit return only on strict licence conditions. If an individual was still considered a threat to national security, further restrictions could be imposed on his or her liberty through a terrorism prevention and investigation measure, or TPIM. It may be possible to prosecute under the Terrorism Act 2000, which includes offences of being a member of, or aiding and abetting, a proscribed terrorist organisation.

I shudder to think what state we would find our world in if all countries abdicated responsibility for the terrorists born in their country. The UK has been described as being in the “vanguard of citizenship deprivation”, with an approach that contrasts starkly with that of other European countries, such as France and the Netherlands, which have returned their citizens from Iraq and Syria to face justice at home. In a recent similar case, Ireland most likely will not revoke the citizenship of a Daesh fighter returning there. Even Donald Trump tweeted that the UK should “take back” Daesh fighters captured in Syria and “put them on trial.” Surely that shows just how out of step with the rest of the world we have become.

I have not mentioned her by name thus far, although she has been brought up, but the reason this issue has gained so much attention of late is of course the case of Shamima Begum, who had her citizenship revoked by the Government—a move I wholeheartedly disagree with. Surely she must come to the UK to face justice. What has not gained the same attention is the death of her son, Jarrah, an innocent newborn baby and a British citizen who died in a refugee camp in Syria—a child who, if he had returned, may eventually have gone on to live a normal life in the UK. I hope that the Government reflect on their actions, or lack thereof, in that case.

Our position is clear: the UK bears responsibility for all its citizens, and the actions of the Home Secretary are to be condemned. It is time for Daesh members to come back to the UK and face justice.