Capita

Debate between Drew Hendry and Oliver Dowden

Tuesday 24th April 2018 Commons Chamber

[Oliver Dowden]

My children are aged six and eight, and on the off chance that they happen to tune into this later, I will make sure that I do not repeat that word, because I would not want to hear it around our breakfast table.

I know about the commitment of my right hon. Friend the Member for Rayleigh and Wickford (Mr Francois) to this issue; he is absolutely right to raise it. We all know that there have been problems with Capita, but I can update him and the House by saying that the MOD and Capita have agreed an improvement plan under their contract. I understand that Capita is looking to deliver on that plan, so I am confident that it is making steps in the right direction, although I do not deny that there have been problems in the past.

[Drew Hendry (Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey) (SNP)]

A £701 million rights issue after a £530 million loss, with a scramble to recover reputation after damaging contract bungles, is indeed indicative of a business with no strategy. Given the wide range of public services involved, is the Minister at all worried by the situation? If so, what precautions has he put in place to protect people’s jobs? Does he agree that this highlights a role for the public sector in providing vital public services? Given that he is wedded to the PFI model, will he take the time to look closely at the Scottish Government’s Scottish Futures Trust model, which has saved the Scottish Government £1 billion?

[Oliver Dowden]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his questions. As I have said, Opposition Members keep trying to characterise this as ideological, but the fact is that Governments of all colours have used outsourcing. Why? Because they know that that can deliver savings. It is just the same as when private companies use outsourcing so that they can focus on their core businesses.

The hon. Gentleman asks whether I take a close interest in this—yes, I take a close interest in all our strategic suppliers. On a weekly basis, I receive updates on the position and on the plans that we have, if necessary, in relation to all our strategic suppliers. However, I restate to the House that Capita’s position is not the same as Carillion’s—nor, indeed, are any of the other strategic suppliers in that position.

Capita

Debate between Drew Hendry and Oliver Dowden

Thursday 1st February 2018 Commons Chamber

[Oliver Dowden]

Of course there are lessons to be learned from this. Indeed, that is exactly what bodies such as the Select Committee on Public Administration and Constitutional Affairs are looking into. However, there is a distinction between a private company and a public body. I do not think it would be appropriate to extend the full FOI provisions to all private companies.

[Drew Hendry (Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey) (SNP)]

If the Minister is serious about getting the best value for the public, will he commit to learning from the Scottish Government? The Scottish Futures Trust’s latest independently audited benefits statement shows more than £1 billion in savings since it was established.

[Oliver Dowden]

I welcome the hon. Gentleman’s question. Of course we will learn those lessons, but it is worth noting that the Scottish Government gave a contract to Capita in 2015. Capita was appointed by the Scottish Public Pensions Agency to deliver its integrated pensions IT software solutions, which is another example of Governments choosing to use the expertise of the private sector.

Welfare Reform and Work Bill

Debate between Drew Hendry and Oliver Dowden

Monday 20th July 2015 Commons Chamber

[Oliver Dowden]

I am afraid that I cannot, because I am subject to the time limit.

We concluded that it should not be possible to earn more on welfare than a person who had gone out and worked every single day could earn after tax. We also concluded that it should not be possible to leave school and immediately start claiming benefits. I think that those are fair principles, and I think that principles are better than mere salami slicing.

All this has given rise to a need to change the measure of child poverty. It was absurd when Gordon Brown spent huge amounts of time and money showing people one side or the other of an arbitrary line. We are looking at more fundamental principles and measures of what drives poverty. Living in a workless household is one of the biggest drivers of poverty, and I think it right to take account of the massive reduction in workless households that has taken place under our Government. Lack of educational attainment is another huge driver of poverty. I know that such opportunity-based measures are dismissed by Opposition Members—including, as was clear from his speech,. the right hon. Member for East Ham (Stephen Timms)—but I think that they are vital if we are to establish whether we are merely putting a sticking plaster over poverty, or addressing the fundamental causes.

[Drew Hendry (Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey) (SNP)]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Oliver Dowden]

I have some time left, so I will.

[Drew Hendry]

That is very gracious of the hon. Gentleman.

In my constituency, 3,900 working families will have lower incomes as a result of the Government’s changes, and 7,100 children will be pushed into poverty. Can the hon. Gentleman tell me how that encourages people to think that working is a good idea?

[Oliver Dowden]

First and foremost, we are introducing a national living wage, which will deal with the current problem and give people a massive pay rise. Ultimately, however, there is a wider point to be made. Opposition Members are decrying every single measure in the Bill, but if they oppose our welfare reform measures, they must be able to tell the House and their constituents what measures they themselves plan to introduce. Which other welfare costs do they intend to cut, and which other taxes do they intend to increase—or do they intend to continue to borrow, thus forcing our level of national debt ever higher?

That is the contrast between Labour and the Conservatives, who are willing to make difficult decisions. None of us enjoys making those decisions, but we make them in a principled fashion that sets the economy and the country on the right track.