Covid-19

Debate between Dominic Raab and David Lammy

Tuesday 17th March 2020 Commons Chamber

[Dominic Raab]

My right hon. Friend makes a good point. For those in South America more generally, there has been a range of concerns in different countries. Fundamentally, we want to encourage, as I have explained, commercial operators to keep running because that is the way of easily repatriating people at scale. But of course we will look and liaise with the airline operators—the Transport Secretary is already doing that—to make sure that, where there are gaps, we can always provide as much support as possible for vulnerable or stranded constituents.

[Mr David Lammy (Tottenham) (Lab)]

My constituent Sarah Goodman is stuck in Morocco. She travelled with friends just on Saturday and is now subject to a ban. I have also heard from students on years abroad who are stranded. Can the Secretary of State work on his website to update British nationals who find themselves stranded abroad? Can there be a global strategy because there must be people from abroad stuck in our own country who would like to return home?

Grenfell Tower

Debate between Dominic Raab and David Lammy

Monday 5th February 2018 Commons Chamber

[Dominic Raab]

As I have said, the building regulations review is under way and we have had the interim report. We have accepted all its recommendations and, when the final report is published, we will look at it carefully and consider how to take it forward.

[Mr David Lammy (Tottenham) (Lab)]

The Minister says that he is “in conversation” with a number of councils. After Grenfell, the Secretary of State said that he would leave no stone unturned and take every precaution in relation to anyone living in a building with similar cladding. On 22 June, the Prime Minister said that every resource would be made available. Why is the Minister still “in conversation”? Why is he not providing the funds? Why is it possible that there could be another Grenfell in this country tonight?

[Dominic Raab]

I have to say to the right hon. Gentleman that using that kind of language on an issue that we are all trying to grapple with is quite irresponsible. We have offered the financial flexibility—[Interruption.] He can point his finger in a jabbing manner all he likes, but we are taking this forward as effectively as we can. Some of the technical issues cannot be addressed overnight. We need to get this right and not act in haste. We have made sure that the interim arrangements are in place so that no one sleeping in their home at night is unsafe. The wider renovations will take time to get right because this is a complex technical undertaking.

Police Federation Reform (Normington Report)

Debate between Dominic Raab and David Lammy

Thursday 13th February 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

The hon. Gentleman makes his point strongly. That point comes across crystal clear in the report. I was going on to say that many of us have watched in this country as cases involving minorities have often been overlooked. The truth is that there are many cases, some of which emanate from my own constituency, where there have been concerns about the Police Federation and a closed shop, particularly in relation to getting at the truth. However, what is so startling is that what may have been a minority concern has broken into the mainstream. When three officers so blatantly tell mistruths and so blatantly refuse to apologise over an event involving a Cabinet Minister in a country such as this, it must tell us something about a culture of impunity that has become endemic in the system. It must also say something about the necessary reform that must now come. I am pleased, therefore, that the Police Federation has accepted the report’s recommendations. The tipping point must surely have been reached if it has come to pass in this way.

As we have this debate in 2014, it is clear that a number of our institutions need to reform and to look closely at these closed practices. We as Members of Parliament are premier among them. We have had debates about closed practices in the NHS and the need for a stronger whistleblowing culture. In the Leveson report, we saw real concerns about parts of the journalism profession. Now, as we come to the police, we must see an end to those closed practices and to the refusal to get to the truth.

We have such discussions not to attack but out of sadness. The practices under discussion have chronic effects on ordinary people’s lives and they put tremendous pressure on families. It is the nature of any state that it leaves the individuals caught up in this feeling desperately powerless. That is why we juxtapose the situation in which the right hon. Member for Sutton Coldfield (Mr Mitchell) has found himself with so many others.

[Mr Raab]

The right hon. Gentleman is making a powerful speech. Does he agree that the way in which the Police Federation uses its funds in litigation is critical to the balanced approach that he is discussing? It is one thing for it to defend its own members from litigation—to use the fund as a shield—but another thing to use those funds as a sword to pursue other people, especially victims or other members of the public?

[Mr Lammy]

Absolutely. The point is that some of those funds involve taxpayers’ money, which must demand close scrutiny. I am pleased that the Chair of the Home Affairs Committee suggested that scrutiny should be No. 1 on the agenda. It is also the case that the federation has seen fit to go after leading members of our society who are looking at police reform issues. Why is it that it thinks that it can get away with challenging a senior Cabinet Minister? Is it because parliamentarians, MPs and Ministers at this point in the cycle just happen to be a minority group that is up for attack and the federation thinks it can get away with it? There is a connection with the way it might deal with certain types of criminals. There is a connection with the way it might deal with some parts of the Irish community in this country, who would say that they have experienced some sharp practices from parts of the Police Federation. I am talking about the notion that, “It is a minority, the public don’t care that much and we can get away with this.” We must challenge that, because the honour of a great profession is at stake. Some £8 million is spent annually in relation to litigation. These are important budgets. We must ensure that they are being used for the right purposes.

I have been concerned, especially in the Duggan case, that officers have been advised by the Police Federation not to give interviews. Attempts to suspend officers facing serious allegations are always fought, whatever the circumstances. If any of us were caught up in a situation that involved the death of another individual, we would not be able to refuse to give an interview. Why would we accord that power to people who are in uniform? This is a very important issue.

One of the fundamentals of our system is the fantastic idea that we have policing by consent. That is at the heart of our police service. Here in London, there are only 32,000 police officers, and a population heading towards 10 million. In reality, it is the 10 million people who work alongside the police who give us that feeling that we are safe almost anywhere in London. The idea is that we police by consent, not by fear as is the case in America or in parts of continental Europe where police officers carry guns. It is an idea that we must treasure and protect. It is grossly undermined when a minority of police officers misbehave, they are not challenged sufficiently, there is not sufficient scrutiny, and there is the sense of a closed shop where even those who are blatantly lying are protected. That is why this report is so important, why the House must look closely at implementing it and why we must revisit these issues not just in Backbench debates over the coming months and years but in debates in Government time where we are absolutely rigorous about protecting this important fundamental of our democracy.