Immigration (Guidance on Detention of Vulnerable Persons) Regulations 2024

Lord Hanson of Flint Excerpts

Monday 14th October 2024 Grand Committee

In summary, we welcome the regulations and urge noble Lords to support the Government. These regulations continue the work of the past Conservative Government on stopping illegal channel crossings. These regulations will make the United Kingdom safer and our borders more secure, so I ask only that the Minister answer my questions about their position on the detention of pregnant women and on the principle of second medical opinions. Aside from that, I commend the Government for their efforts.

[The Minister of State, Home Office (Lord Hanson of Flint) (Lab)]

I am grateful to my noble friend Lady Lister for bringing this debate before the Committee and for not just her contribution but those of the noble Baroness, Lady Hamwee, the right reverend Prelates the Bishops of Sheffield and Manchester, my noble friend Lord Davies of Brixton, the noble Baronesses, Lady Mobarik and Lady Lawlor, and, on the Front Benches, the noble Lords, Lord German and Lord Sharpe. I will try to refer to the points that they made.

If I may, I shall start with a straightforward statement: there is a similarity with the previous Government’s objectives, but there are very stark differences too. In general terms, this Government, which I am proud to represent, want to secure our borders and provide a new border command to ensure that we deal with the issues of illegal migration, but also to ensure that we fulfil our responsibilities on asylum, speed up asylum claims, take action on criminal gangs and ensure speedy decisions across the board to limit the amount of detention that takes place.

These regulations were initiated by the noble Lord, Lord Sharpe, and his Government when the Home Office was under his jurisdiction. When I assumed this position on 9 July, one of the first requests I had for a meeting was from my noble friend Lady Lister. I met her on 22 July—before I had even been sworn in as a Member of this House—to understand her concerns and reflect on them accordingly. She put some very strong points to me then and was not sufficiently reassured not to call for this debate, but I will repeat to the Committee what I said so that it is aware of the direction of travel in the broad context of the Government’s overall position on migration issues.

Noble Lords have mentioned a number of points, which I will try to cover in turn. First, on the review, I have indicated to my noble friend that, along with my colleague Dame Angela Eagle, the Minister for Migration, I will look at the issues at Brook House, the principles of detention and the issues of second opinion, retraumatising behaviour and managed migration, which the noble Lord, Lord German, mentioned. The logical place to start is, therefore, the review.

When we met on 22 July, one of the points I made to my noble friend Lady Lister was the simple fact that I, along with my honourable friend Dame Angela Eagle, had inherited the immigration guidance regulations, which had been tabled and were coming into effect. I had discussions with officials about the impact of those regulations and whether, given the representations made by my noble friend Lady Lister in the first week of July, we could reflect on those changes—our first week of ownership of the responsibilities of the Home Office. I was clear, as I hope I fed back honestly and openly to my noble friend, that we wished to maintain the regulations in place as the guidance had been issued, but that I would commit to a review of the regulations and the wider policy of detention at an appropriate time to examine the concerns which were put to me at that private meeting and had been the subject of correspondence with others outside the House.

So, what does the review mean? We have agreed to undertake a review of the adults at risk policy. It is currently ongoing and we are looking to complete the policy review by spring 2025. The scope of the review includes not just the Detention Centre Rules generally but rules 34 and 35, which have recently been expanded to include the SI laid in April 2024, following the concerns raised by my noble friend Lady Lister. I and my colleague in the House of Commons are taking a thorough approach to ensure that the review looks at improving the effectiveness of the regulations and safeguards and includes a period of engagement—I know that my noble friend is very keen on this, and I share her wish—to get the views of external stakeholders, including NGOs, on how the regulations are operating currently and what changes, if any—I say “if any” to keep the review open—should be made following its completion. I hope that reassures my noble friend and others who raised the circumstances of the review. We will look at those issues in detail and come to some conclusions, based on an assessment by Ministers and officials and taking into account the views of NGOs, on how this will work in future.

I am conscious that a number of noble Lords today have perceived the amendments to the statutory guidance as weakening the protections. To be clear, we are committed to safeguarding vulnerable people in detention and the existing safeguarding mechanisms continue to operate, including a dedicated team that is constantly reviewing how those rules operate in practice.

That leads me to the question of the Brook House inquiry because, again, that indicated—this was a reflection by the authors of that inquiry—how the rules were operating in certain establishments. I hope we can reassure the House that, as Ministers, we continue to reflect on the recommendations of that inquiry. That was mentioned by the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Sheffield, the noble Baroness, Lady Hamwee, my noble friend Lord Davies of Brixton and by the noble Lord, Lord German, from the Liberal Democrat Front Bench. I want to assure colleagues that the amendments made to the adults at risk policy through this SI are separate from that ongoing wholesale review of the policy, and that the recommendations will be considered as part of the general review that I will be undertaking.

I say to the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Manchester that I cannot envisage any circumstances in which Ministers in this Home Office will be painting over murals undertaken by children in detention centres as a whole, and I hope that gives him some reassurance. In fact, I believe that even the Minister who ordered the painting over those murals is now somewhat backtracking on his ability to remove a mural from a wall. But perhaps he can answer for himself in due course on that issue.

The question of a second opinion was raised by a number of noble Lords. I agree that seeking a second opinion could lead to delays in detention decision-making, and that could have an impact on the length of time a detention occurs. However, I think that I have made it very clear, as have officials, that casework guidance is clear that the second-opinion process does not constitute a pause in the consideration of a case more generally, and we wish to seek to limit the amount of detention that an individual undertakes. I also understand—this point was raised by a number of colleagues—that there is the potential for retraumatisation of individuals because of that long period. But, again, I want to put vulnerable people at the heart of any policy and any review, and to look at how we can manage that system downstream in due course.

On the adults at risk policy itself, the amendments made to the statutory guidance did not change the requirements placed on the Home Office to identify potentially vulnerable people or indeed to assess the appropriateness of detention. Again, to reach out to the noble Lord, Lord Sharpe, I think there was an intention on the part of the previous Government to limit the amount of detention that was in place, but this House has to accept that, in some cases, detention will be a necessity. We have to try to ensure that, when that detention occurs, there is open, transparent and clear guidance for members of staff, constant medical monitoring of individuals who are potentially vulnerable, and that we ensure that that detention is done for a purpose. In addition, allied to the other points I have mentioned to my noble friend Lady Lister, we must look at how we can speed up the asylum claim issue to ensure that we reach conclusions speedily, fairly and openly. It is in nobody’s interests to have the long levels of backlog or indeed, therefore, the long levels of detention for some individuals because of an assessment process on the grounds of asylum claims.

We want to—and certainly have to—expand the detention estate to bolster our capacity to ensure that we have swift, firm and fair returns. However, we also need to do that in a way where we understand that we will never be at the point of detaining no vulnerable people, and we must be mindful that all those subject to immigration control who are liable to removal could indeed become vulnerable once in detention.

I am acutely conscious that the regime that we have, based on the legislation and the SI before this Committee today that was tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Sharpe, previously, needs to be reviewed. That review will take place, it will be part of the wider review of the policy as a whole and I will report back to this Committee and face scrutiny, as ever, by the terrier—as I think the noble Baroness, Lady Hamwee, called my noble friend Lady Lister. Having been a terrier on occasion myself, I know that terriers are a good thing to chew Ministers’ legs and keep them focused on issues. From my experience both as opposition spokesman, as I have been, and as Minister, as I have been before this post, I know that terriers are a useful asset to parliamentary democracy. I hope that I can also reassure my noble friend Lady Lister that we are examining these issues in what I hope will be a productive way.

The wholesale review of this policy is under way, with a view to reforming it. Officials have been advised to progress this work at pace, given the paramount importance of this safeguard. Indeed, we now have officials monitoring the performance of the existing regulation to ensure that we feed into that review in a proper and effective way.

The issue that was raised about pregnant women remains the same under the latest regulations—unchanged—and we will not get a second opinion either, ensuring that they are excluded from this process; I hope that that reassures the noble Lord, Lord Sharpe.