Net Zero: 2050 Target

Debate between Caroline Lucas and Kwasi Kwarteng

Tuesday 6th June 2023 Westminster Hall

[Kwasi Kwarteng (Spelthorne) (Con)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered Government policy on reaching Net Zero by 2050.

It is always good to see you in the Chair, Sir Christopher. This is the second time in about seven years that I have been able to introduce a Back-Bench debate, so I am very grateful for the opportunity.

I am pleased to be able to say that the net zero agenda—the energy transition—enjoys wider support across the House than practically any other area of policy. Yes, there are sceptics on both sides of the House, but it is extraordinary how widely shared the ambitions for net zero and decarbonisation are. I am grateful to organisations in my constituency and to my constituents. I thank Talking Tree, whose climate emergency centre has promoted decarbonisation in my constituency, and my constituent Hettie Quirke, who has raised these issues with me in constituency surgeries and provided me with my inspiration, or certainly my motivation, for requesting the debate.

This is a matter of great interest to me personally. I was fortunate to be appointed Energy Minister, the post that my right hon. Friend the Minister now ably fills, in July 2019, only a few weeks after we as a Government had passed the net zero Bill and enshrined the 2050 net zero target in law. That target was not simply plucked out of thin air. It is based on a scientific assessment of what we need to do as a global community to keep average temperature increases on this planet below 1.5° compared with 1990.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

Does the right hon. Gentleman recognise that at the time when the net zero by 2050 target was agreed, so was the principle of common but differentiated responsibilities? That means that countries such as the UK that can go further and faster must do that, so we should be looking at something much closer to real zero as soon as possible after 2030, not net zero by 2050.

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

As the hon. Lady well knows, she and I have very different views on this. I think that the Government have to carry the population with them, and it was interesting to hear what the unions were saying about oil and gas earlier this week. I would like to be able to press a button and say that we can get to absolute zero by 2030, but I do not think that is possible given the technological constraints and the financial and fiscal pressures. I do not think it is attainable, which is why I am happy to push the target of net zero by 2050.

I want to talk about our ability to reach that target. The hon. Lady is right that we could and should always try to do more, but we are constrained not only by technology but by fiscal necessities and, I might add, by what is going on in the rest of the world. The UK represents only 1% of global GDP, but we are an example and a leader, and we have to be able persuade partners across the G7 and the G20 and particularly in the developing world. As she will appreciate, that is not always easy.

The Growth Plan

Debate between Caroline Lucas and Kwasi Kwarteng

Friday 23rd September 2022 Commons Chamber

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

The freeports are certainly continuing and I would be very happy to speak to my hon. Friend about how we can, as he puts it, unblock the process to accelerate the Humber freeport bid.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

This Budget amounts to an environment wrecker’s charter and it is a statement of missed opportunities. For example, a report just this week shows that a major programme of insulating homes in Britain and installing heat pumps could benefit the economy by £7 billion a year, create 140,000 jobs by 2030, get our fuel bills down and get climate emissions down too. Tucked away on page 14 of the growth report is a tiny reference to some investment in energy efficiency. It is nowhere near enough. Why is the Chancellor setting his face against the kind of retrofit revolution that offers the only viable way out of the current crisis, as well as reducing our dependence on fossil fuels? Is it because, for him, dogma and deregulation trump evidence and common sense every time?

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

It is not about dogma and deregulation. In fact, I campaigned for the eco and energy efficiency measures when I was Business Secretary and ensured that there was reference in the growth plan to the eco plan. We may well expand that at a future date.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Caroline Lucas and Kwasi Kwarteng

Tuesday 7th June 2022 Commons Chamber

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

One of the fastest and most effective ways to protect people from the impact of rising energy costs would be an ambitious retrofit and insulation programme, which should have been at the heart of the Government’s approach but has been conspicuous by its absence. The Government support pledged so far for energy efficiency falls £1.4 billion short of their manifesto commitment, so will the Secretary of State tell us what more he plans to do on the issue? In particular, will he tell us with absolute certainty that legislation for ECO4—the energy company obligation—which was due in April, will not face any further delays and will definitely be laid before Parliament before the summer recess?

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

It is not my job to say when legislation will be coming into this House—[Interruption.] What I will say—[Interruption.] What I will say specifically in relation to decarbonisation is that we have a clear heat and buildings strategy. The manifesto commitment covered 10 years, so it was not over the term of the Parliament. There was a clear manifesto commitment over 10 years and more money clearly needs to be spent to honour that commitment over a 10-year spending period.

Energy Security Strategy

Debate between Caroline Lucas and Kwasi Kwarteng

Tuesday 19th April 2022 Commons Chamber

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

I would be very interested to hear my right hon. Friend’s views on solar. I think solar is crucial. I am delighted that we have so many former Energy Ministers in the Chamber today; my right hon. Friend was a very distinguished holder of the post, and I am very pleased to engage with him on this important subject.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

The triple test of the strategy is whether it helps to cut dependence on Russian gas, whether it brings down bills and whether it secures a safe climate. It manages to fail on all those fronts. It also has a massive hole where energy saving should be.

It has been reported today that the Government are considering scrapping green levies, which support renewables and address fuel poverty, as the Secretary of State knows, and which therefore help to get fuel bills down. Can he reassure me that that rumour is false and that any changes made will simply be about moving those levies to general taxation—or will this be another policy led by a handful of Tory Back Benchers?

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

I engage with Front-Bench and Back-Bench colleagues all the time and they have lots of brilliant ideas. I do not recognise the hon. Lady’s characterisation of the strategy; I think it does deliver on security, it does deliver on longer-term affordability and it does deliver on the sustainable net zero targets that many in this House agree with.

Russian Oil Import Ban

Debate between Caroline Lucas and Kwasi Kwarteng

Wednesday 9th March 2022 Commons Chamber

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

The Government are right to get off Russian oil and gas—I welcome that—but wrong to propose replacing it with new domestic production. Our dependence on fossil fuels is what got us into this energy crisis in the first place, and that is why many of us, including the International Energy Agency, are calling for no new licences. The real insanity is trying to get out of one crisis by plunging ourselves into another. More extraction from the North sea will keep our bills high and drive us past safe climate limits, and fracking will not help. Will the Secretary of State use this moment to launch an emergency green revolution? Will he get serious at last about energy efficiency, and will he wean the UK off not just Russian oil and gas, but all oil and gas now?

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

On this question, I have to confess that the hon. Lady and I have completely different views. We are diametrically opposed. I agree with her on the net zero commitment, but this idea that we can simply switch the lights off, so to speak, on oil and gas is absurd. [Interruption.] It is completely absurd and we need to have investment in the North sea.

[Caroline Lucas]

“No new licences” is what I said.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Caroline Lucas and Kwasi Kwarteng

Tuesday 22nd February 2022 Commons Chamber

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

There has been a critical issue with very high wholesale prices, which as I speak are about 200p a therm, whereas at the beginning of last year they were 50p a therm or lower; there has been a quadrupling of the price. The energy price cap has protected consumers, but we are talking to Ofgem all the time about how we can refine the cap to make it more sensitive to wholesale prices in the market.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

Today marks the start of International Energy Week, formerly International Petroleum Week. The Secretary of State was billed to open the event, and he will know that, despite the rebrand, the lead sponsors include fossil fuel giant BP, which is investing just 2.3% of annual capital expenditure into the jobs-rich green energy sector. When will the Government end their cosy relationship with the fossil fuel dinosaurs and replace the outdated duty to maximise economic recovery with a duty to minimise the extraction of North sea oil and gas and to maximise clean, green jobs instead?

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

The hon. Lady will know that we have committed to the “Net Zero Strategy”, which was lauded across the world as a world-beating document. She also knows that, as I have said repeatedly and my right hon. Friend the Minister for Energy, Clean Growth and Climate Change has also said, we are committed to a transition, not extinction. We have to work with fossil fuel companies and the industry to transition to a net zero future, and that is exactly what we are prepared to do.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Caroline Lucas and Kwasi Kwarteng

Tuesday 21st September 2021 Commons Chamber

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

That is absolutely right. I fully recognise, as my hon. Friend appreciates, that we have had huge success in decarbonising our power sector, but we need to accelerate the decarbonisation of our homes and buildings. As I pointed out to the right hon. Member for Doncaster North (Edward Miliband), we have had some success in decarbonising public sector buildings—particularly through Salix—but we now need to focus on decarbonising our dwellings and other buildings.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

The Minister can play accounting games over the Cambo oilfield, arguing that it was licensed 20 years ago, but essentially its emissions will still drive climate change. New research shows that 60% of existing oil and gas reserves must stay in the ground if we are to stay within 1.5° C, and the International Energy Agency has said that there must be no new oil and gas development of any kind. With COP26 in just six weeks, with the Secretary of State trying to have international diplomacy, what message does he think is given out by the Government going ahead with more oil and gas?

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

With regard to Cambo, the hon. Member will appreciate that the decision has been scrutinised in the normal regulatory way. As an energy Minister I helped to negotiate a North sea transition deal, and key to that was the word transition. We need to transition our existing oil and gas sector to a decarbonised platform. What she and others like her want to see is a complete eclipse and shutting down of oil and gas, with 250,000 jobs vanishing overnight. That would be completely irresponsible.

UK Gas Market

Debate between Caroline Lucas and Kwasi Kwarteng

Monday 20th September 2021 Commons Chamber

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

We have rehearsed the shale gas issue many times on the Floor of the House. As Energy Minister, I was confronted with a situation in which the experiments with shale gas induced a reading of 2.9 on the Richter scale and people’s plates were falling off their walls. They wrote to me to say, “We’ve got to stop this,” and there was a moratorium. There is a moratorium, and I have said very explicitly that when the evidence changes we will look at it, but for now there is a moratorium on shale. However, my hon. Friend knows that I understand and fully appreciate the effect of supply and demand as well—perhaps not as well as he does, but better than the Opposition.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

I am very glad to hear the Secretary of State say that protecting consumers is now his Government’s primary focus; it is just a great shame that it has not been in the past. He continues to expose people to high energy prices by refusing to look at the demand side. I do not think that the words “energy efficiency” or “home insulation” have passed his lips once this afternoon. When will he properly learn the lessons of the failed green homes grant, the green deal and the scrapping of zero-carbon homes? When will he put in place the comprehensive street-by-street local authority-led insulation scheme that we know will get emissions down, fuel prices down and jobs up right across the country?

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

The hon. Lady knows that we have discussed the heat and building strategy, and I have discussed it personally, on a number of occasions. We have said that it will be published very soon, and I look forward to her response when it is.