Draft Onshore Hydraulic Fracturing (Protected Areas) Regulations 2015

Callum McCaig Excerpts

Tuesday 27th October 2015 General Committees

[Callum McCaig (Aberdeen South) (SNP)]

I will be brief to allow others to speak. First, I will touch on what the Minister said about the call for this debate to happen in the Chamber, as opposed to in Committee. At business questions on Thursday, I made that request to the Leader of the House, and it was rejected. That was unfortunate. This debate would benefit from all Members being given the opportunity to engage in it, because the implications of getting this issue wrong are so large.

Ostensibly, this is an England and Wales only matter. The point that my hon. Friend the Member for Edinburgh East made on the changes to Standing Orders raises the issue of why the Scottish National party is here and why we will be voting. There are two clear issues. First, there is the cross-border issue with water contamination. Frankly, poisoned water knows no national boundaries, or sub-national boundaries, if that is what people wish to call them. Beyond that, the SNP made it clear in the run-up to the election that we would engage in progressive politics with folks from elsewhere in the United Kingdom. Frankly, it saddens me that defining whether we should have safe drinking water should count as progressive politics in this day and age. It is beyond the pale.

[Andrea Leadsom]

Does the hon. Gentleman not think it is rather ridiculous, shall we say, that he should stand there as an SNP Energy spokesman suggesting that somehow the Government of the day would deliberately poison people’s drinking water? Does he not think that is a completely outrageous accusation? Did he not listen to my remarks?

[Callum McCaig]

At no stage did I say that there would be deliberate poisoning of water. If the Minister took some more time to listen and reflect, it might be more helpful. What we are dealing with here is the potential for drilled wells—fracked wells—under protected groundwater source areas.

[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

Far from talking about scaremongering, the Government would do well to look at the impact assessment by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs on rural economy impacts. Of course, the Government tried to prevent it being in the public domain, but it states:

“There is a risk that even if contaminated surface water does not directly impact drinking water supplies, it can affect human health indirectly through consumption of contaminated wildlife, livestock or agricultural products.”

That is from the document that the Government tried to hide. We now have it in the public domain, and what the hon. Gentleman is saying is far from scaremongering.

[Callum McCaig]

I thank the hon. Lady for that. To dwell for a second on the terminology here, we are talking about protected groundwater source areas. Why are we talking about that? The agencies have suggested that the areas are in need of protection. Someone drilling a well is going through the aquifers to pump chemicals down into the ground to cause a chemical reaction that causes mini-fractures. That is the process. If people think that what happens 1,200 metres below the ground has no relevance to what happens at the surface, they are deluding themselves. Even were it not for the large hole that is required to get the chemicals down there in the first place, there is the chance of seepage to the surface and the aquifers, causing damage.

I understand that the Government have a different approach to fracking than my party’s Government in Holyrood, and I am entirely thankful that the matter is devolved to the Scottish Parliament. I have great sympathy for Members whose constituencies may be adversely affected by the regulations. If the Government are to proceed with fracking, would it not be sensible to demonstrate its safety before they consider allowing it in protected groundwater source areas? To me, that seems a logical way of dealing with the race for gas.

[Graham Jones]

The hon. Gentleman tempts me to ask two quick questions. First, has there not been some form of fracking under the North sea, in and around Scottish shores, for a long period? What experience and knowledge does he have of that?

[Callum McCaig]

First, the majority of fracking in the North sea uses water, so there is not the use of chemicals that is required for onshore gas fracking. Secondly and frankly, the North sea is considerably further away, so I do not think that the implications for our drinking water are the same: I do not think that it is possible to drink sea water.

[Graham Jones]

I am grateful for that answer. The hon. Gentleman said that scientific evidence is needed. So I presume that he is in favour of some limited testing of fracking: he is not absolutely opposed to fracking if he wants some scientific base for it.

[Callum McCaig]

The science can be done in a number of ways and there are many lessons that can be learned from fracking elsewhere in the world: we would benefit from pausing and learning the lessons of elsewhere. I am very pleased that the Government north of the border have proceeded with a moratorium to allow a proper evidence-based approach to this issue.

[Graham Jones]

So the hon. Gentleman is saying that fracking is okay in other countries, to find out the scientific evidence base, but there is a moratorium in Scotland. Is that not a duplicitous position for the SNP to take?

[Callum McCaig]

I have no jurisdiction over what happens in the United States of America, for example. [Interruption.] Excuse me?

[The Chair]

Order.

[Callum McCaig]

I will cut my comments short—I have taken up longer than I had intended to—and say that it is completely and utterly unfathomable to push ahead with this proposal at this time. It is deeply regrettable that this debate is not happening in the Chamber and I wholeheartedly support the comments of the hon. Member for Southampton, Test about taking these regulations away and coming back with something that protects the environment, and above all protects water sources.

[Several hon. Members rose—]