Academies Bill [HL]

Baroness Thornton Excerpts

Wednesday 23rd June 2010 Lords Chamber

[Lord Phillips of Sudbury]

Amendment 64 is in my name and that of my noble friend Lady Walmsley. With this amendment, I have had the temerity completely to redraft Clause 1(7) because, with the best will in the world, it is extraordinarily lumpy and unclear. However, I have made a wonderful boo-boo in the redraft, in that I have said that academy arrangements “may” prohibit, when of course it should be “must” prohibit, so I beg noble Lords’ indulgence and ask that “must” be read in place of “may”. However, my point is that in the existing subsection (7) the difference between attendance at a school and education provided at a school is wholly unclear to me. It says that,

“no charge is made in respect of … admission … attendance … or … education provided at the school”.

I suppose that this is really a probing amendment so that the Minister can tell the Committee what is missing from my comprehension.

[Baroness Thornton]

I promise that I shall say only a few words but I want to add to what my noble friend Lady Royall said in opening this debate. The very helpful Library notes that we received in the briefing pack repeat what is in the Explanatory Notes, so it is very important that this matter is clarified.

[Lord Hill of Oareford]

My Lords, I hope that I am able to provide the clarification for noble Lords opposite, including the noble Lord, Lord Rix, and for my noble friends. I start by reassuring noble Lords that academies are prohibited from charging for admission. No pupils on the roll of an academy will have to pay for their education.

On the specific point made by the noble Baroness, Lady Royall, as I said, Clause 1(7)(a) prohibits charging but the Bill as drafted allows for the prospect that an academy may need to charge in certain circumstances. I shall explain the kind of circumstances that I have in mind; I think that we touched on this earlier. For example, an academy may wish to charge for providing evening classes to people not on the school roll. We had earlier debates about wanting a school to be part of a community. Providing evening classes would seem to be a good example of that and the Bill would enable the school to do it. Alternatively, an academy may want another organisation to be able to provide evening classes or other activities that can be accessed by the wider community. Therefore, as we want academies to take part in, and be part of, the local community, that is what the Bill provides for. However, any fees charged would be put back into the academy in accordance with the charitable objects of the academy trust.

So far as concerns charging for nursery or SEN provision in Amendments 67 and 75, I reassure the Committee that academies will not be permitted to charge for education provided during the usual timetabled school hours, including the entitlement to nursery education; nor will they be permitted to charge for special needs provision.

I hope that that provides some reassurance and that the noble Baroness will be able to withdraw her amendment.

--- Later in debate ---

[The Earl of Listowel]

I hesitate to prolong the debate at this late hour and I think that my concern is probably a little far-fetched, but this is such an important area to get right that I hope your Lordships will bear with me for a moment. Before I begin, perhaps I may thank the Minister for the pains he took to organise a meeting to discuss this issue, for his helpful correspondence and for the personal note he sent to me, which I much appreciated.

Recently, I was talking with a friend who worked for some time with a number of children with learning difficulties and disabilities, including two children with Down’s syndrome. They were a girl and a boy aged 13 and 14. The 13 year-old was a real terror in a way. They would be having a picnic in the park and she would run away from the group. It was very annoying and difficult to manage for the teacher. She was a wonderful girl, full of life and really charming, but when getting back on to the minibus after the day out—the excursion—the teacher began teasing her about her boyfriend, the young man. My friend sensed that the teacher was so angry because his authority had been flouted that he was using this devious way of getting back at her.

The point of the story is that we need excellent teachers working in this area. The noble Baroness, Lady Garden, raised the issue of the status of SENCOs and said that they should be qualified teachers. It may be far-fetched because I suspect that many of the teachers working in this area have a particular vocation and will not think of leaving it. I imagine that when academy status is introduced, most of the schools that will go into it will be secondary schools and there may not be an issue. However, I remain concerned. I am grateful for the Minister’s reply on this and for the comments of the noble Lord, Lord Baker, but if the uptake of academy status is a great success and academies cream off the best teachers into their purlieu, it will be worth considering whether teachers who might have considered going into special educational needs will choose to go to these schools. The Minister said that he is not expecting a revolution; that this is a small-scale change. However, I am not sufficiently reassured by what he has said so far. The noble Lord, Lord Baker, said that the same thing was said about city technology colleges—that they would be the end of the world—but in fact they proved a welcome addition.

I approve of giving schools more autonomy but we need to think through what the general impact may be on the workforce. I refer particularly to the previous Government’s record on health visitors. In 1998, health visitors were hailed as the champions, the pioneers of the Government’s plans for early intervention. Ten years later, where are we? We have an ageing workforce, most of whom are about to retire, with great shortages and too heavy a case load. I was talking to a health visitor—a nurse with the responsibility of funding several London boroughs in this area—and she said, “I have to choose between funding the Sure Start centre, funding the Family Nurse Partnership and funding the health visitors”. It was all done with the best intention, but it is between these stools that these matters fall. I encourage the Minister to recognise the point and reflect further on what the impact might be if his plans are successful.

[Baroness Thornton]

My Lords, I agree with the remarks of the noble Baroness, Lady Garden, about SENCOs; she made a very important point.

I had not intended to intervene but in briefing sent to me by TreeHouse, the charity that runs a school for children with autism, there is a question that has not yet been raised in the debate. It relates, particularly, to children with autism but I think it applies to children with SEN. Indeed, TreeHouse has worked with the special educational consortium on the Bill and agrees with all the briefings that it has sent to different Members of the House. In regard to the application of the SEN legal framework, TreeHouse states:

“Currently the Academies Bill provides that Academies are bound by the SEN Code of Practice, which is statutory guidance”.

In its view,

“This provides only a small part of the legal protection that children with autism and their families currently have in maintained schools, where their rights are more strongly protected by legislation through the Education Act 1996 and the School Standards and Framework Act 1988 in addition to the SEN Code of Practice”,

which other Members have mentioned. It continues:

“Schools that become Academies will therefore have weaker responsibilities for children with SEN, who, in turn, will have weaker legal protection”.

It is a legitimate question for TreeHouse to raise and I hope that the Minister will be able to answer it.