Environmental Permitting (England and Wales) (Amendment) Regulations 2011

Baroness Smith of Basildon Excerpts

Tuesday 12th July 2011 Grand Committee

[Lord Teverson]

I was hoping that one of the noble and right reverend Prelate’s colleagues who has a degree in history and physics might be here. We have already dealt with chemistry and we have some very interesting substances listed here such as cosmic nuclides or whatever. In my electoral division in Cornwall, I have a NORM depot for the china clay industry, operated by Imerys, which is about to be replaced. I got involved in some of the issues concerning the oil industry and other areas where there is a small radioactive residue that comes from processing these minerals. I am delighted to say that I have received no lobbying from the Cornish china clay industry on the regulations, and therefore assume that they are a good improvement. Therefore, I congratulate the Minister on this change.

I have never seen an Explanatory Memorandum that has been more complicated and of which I have understood less. However, I am sure that the Department of Energy and Climate Change has our interests at heart.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon]

My Lords, I am very grateful for the Minister's explanation. I am still thinking about the banana reference, which I did not quite get. If he would elucidate further on that, it would be an enormous help. He made clear the reasons behind the regulations. They are intended to be simpler and more user-friendly, while maintaining standards for the regulation of low-level radioactive substances and complying with EU directives.

As he knows, the regulations were first consulted on by the Labour Government in 2009. As a result of the consultation, a fair number of changes were made. Normally, I would raise concerns about an order coming into force so quickly following its discussion—I understand that it will be the day after it has been signed. However, in this case there should be widespread knowledge and understanding among those groups that are affected by the regulations. For the reassurance of the Committee, it would be helpful if the Minister would state whether he is entirely satisfied that all those who need to know about the regulations do so, and, if there are any gaps, what efforts are being made to ensure that we pick up those who may have missed some part of the consultation process since 2009.

These are very technical regulations. I, too, regret that the noble and right reverend Prelate is no longer with us, because he would be helpful. Few noble Lords will understand Part 3 of the regulations. Table 2, headed “Concentration of radionuclides”, lists various concentrations in becquerels per gram. I confess that I have no understanding of what that means and so in many ways feel inadequate to the task of effective scrutiny. I therefore seek reassurance from the Minister. Can he say whether any concerns were raised through the consultation that the regulations would in any way compromise public safety? I gave notice that I would ask that question. If those concerns were raised, how were they addressed? Those who were consulted would have greater knowledge than I or other Members of your Lordships’ House would have.

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[Lord Marland]

This is hopefully the last statutory instrument before we break—oh no, there is another one. I am always happy to hear the tales of Cornwall from the noble Lord, Lord Teverson, and all about English china clay. It is fantastic. The noble Baroness asked some very good questions, some of which she has given me notice of.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon]

All of them.

[Lord Marland]

The noble Baroness did not give me notice of the banana—I had to slip that in.

[Baroness Smith of Basildon]

I did not expect the noble Lord to mention bananas in today’s debate, so I think that I can be forgiven for that.

[Lord Marland]

The point of the banana was to illustrate that everything is radioactive. We need to consider that as we embark on anything to do with radioactivity.

There has been extensive shareholder consultation and engagement on this, as you would expect. Naturally, it is fundamental that public safety concerns on anything to do with nuclear radioactivity are given priority. I think the general public believe that, which is why reaction to events in Fukushima has been relatively benign. We are not being complacent but I think that the public understand that we put public safety first. The Health Protection Agency has been consulted and is happy with it. A lot of it is based on International Commission of Radiological Protection recommendations, which underpin the EU basic safety standards directive. Of course, any concerns that are raised in these discussions are taken most seriously and responded to. It is fundamental to our nuclear endeavour that we do so.

Finally, I am in regular touch with Mr Jamie Reid, as I am a regular visitor to Sellafield. I hope that the noble Baroness will join me there at some point. West Cumbria is a fantastic place and we will put in the Library a copy of the response to his very detailed and extensive questions and naturally will furnish the noble Baroness with a copy as well. I commend these regulations to the Committee.