Daylight Saving Bill (Money)

Angus Brendan MacNeil Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd November 2011 Commons Chamber

[Miss Anne McIntosh (Thirsk and Malton) (Con)]

I rise to oppose the money resolution and I welcome this opportunity to state why I believe the Daylight Saving Bill is a complete misnomer. There is no daylight saving. All that is proposed in the Bill is that the hours of darkness be moved further into the morning. I am responding, Madam Deputy Speaker, to the arguments that have been put by the Minister and my hon. Friend the Member for Castle Point (Rebecca Harris).

[Mr Angus Brendan MacNeil (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP)]

The hon. Lady makes the salient point that there will be no more daylight. What is actually happening is that people are being moved into the darkness. Clocks started off measuring time and ended up governing people’s lives, and people are going to find—as they found 30 or 40 years ago—that they will be living their lives in the early part of the day in darkness. When push came to shove at that time, the vote in this House was 366 votes to 81. That was not just Scottish Members but Members from all over the UK. Once they had experienced it, they would not have it again.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Order. Perhaps it would be timely for me to remind the House that we are not debating the Bill itself or the merits of the Bill. We are debating a money resolution to commission a study that will look at the evidence. I will rule Members out of order if they try to re-debate the Bill. That is not the purpose of this money resolution.

--- Later in debate ---

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

I shall keep my remarks brief as a number of Members on both sides of the House wish to speak.

I am open-minded about what we do ultimately, but I have some questions on the money resolution that I hope the Minister can address. As my colleague, the Chair of the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee said, the Committee will shortly be taking evidence on the merits and demerits of switching the start of the day. Do the Government propose to wait until the Committee has had a chance to consider the evidence before embarking on a significant spend of money?

I see that the Under-Secretary of State, Scotland Office, and the Minister of State, Northern Ireland Office, are present to hear the debate—but I will not dwell on why there is an Under-Secretary of State for Scotland and a Minister of State for Northern Ireland. Do the Government expect the Wales Office, the Scotland Office or the Northern Ireland Office to incur expenditure as part of the consultation? Will the Minister also confirm whether any of the devolved Administrations—the Scottish Parliament or the Welsh and Northern Ireland Assemblies —would be expected to incur costs as part of the consultation that would be ongoing?

[Mr MacNeil]

If indeed there were any costs, surely if this measure originated in Westminster, those costs should be met at Westminster.

[Thomas Docherty]

The hon. Gentleman teases me down an avenue which if I were to pursue and consider why the Scottish Parliament would seek even more money from this place when it is more than amply recompensed for the jobs that it is asked to do, you, Madam Deputy Speaker, would robustly close me down.

I hope that the Minister can give some clarity. I hope that he has also heard today that this is not a Scotland versus England issue, but an argument across all four nations of the United Kingdom.

[Mr MacNeil]

rose—

[Thomas Docherty]

The hon. Gentleman was slightly late, but I appreciate that he was on different time.

[Mr MacNeil]

I checked the clock; I was two minutes late. But the substantial point is that the hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. This is not a north versus south or an England versus Scotland issue. Indeed, I feel quite an English nationalist in the midst of this debate, having to represent many of the good people of England who lived through the experiment of the late ’60s and early ’70s , and who write to me with their concerns looking for a voice. The hon. Gentleman is absolutely correct when he says that this is not a north versus south or a Scotland versus England issue.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)]

Very interesting. The hon. Gentleman should face the Chair when he speaks so that I can hear him. However, I heard what he said and now that he has made his point I would like Mr Docherty to return to the money resolution.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Hollobone]

That is absolutely right, and my hon. Friend makes an extremely perceptive intervention. In fact, the Government have used a whole year of this two-year Session to delay the Bill, thereby denying the House the scrutiny it needs to improve legislation. I cannot understand why the Government are so frightened of scrutiny, because the better that Back Benchers do their job, the better the legislation, and the better the reputation of the Government of the day.

[Mr MacNeil]

Is the hon. Gentleman saying essentially that we should not be here tonight talking about the Bill, because it should have been dead and buried in the past year?

[Mr Hollobone]

That could have been an outcome, absolutely. We should not be here tonight, because we should have been here almost exactly a year ago. That is when the Government should have tabled this money resolution; then, the Bill would have proceeded into Committee; and on one of the subsequent private Members’ Fridays the hon. Gentleman and I could have debated its merits and demerits. The law would have been either passed or not by this stage, but Her Majesty’s Government have effectively taken a whole year out of the process, meaning that the legislation is right up against the wire.

There is a private Members’ Friday this coming Friday, but then there is only one other such Friday, 20 January 2011. The passage of the money resolution tonight means that there will not be time for the Bill Committee to sit before this Friday, so if the Bill is to go through Committee the only remaining Friday on which it can return to the House is 20 January. On that day, it will need to complete its Report and Third Reading if it is to make any progress, meaning that its subsequent passage through the House of Lords will be squeezed between the end of January and the beginning of April. That is going to be a rushed process if the Bill is to succeed.

My simple contention is this: whether someone is for or against the Bill, if the time and scope for the scrutiny of any legislation is reduced, it will probably not be as good as it otherwise might have been. There is absolutely no need for this process to have taken so long. I simply do not understand why it has taken Her Majesty’s Government almost 12 months to make up their mind—indeed, to change their mind—on the merits of this Bill.

[Mr MacNeil]

Is the hon. Gentleman saying that the Bill of the hon. Member for Castle Point (Rebecca Harris) has, in effect, been destroyed because of the time that has been taken away from the consideration of it and the fact people will not have the opportunity to consider it? Is he also saying that there is a great danger the Bill will not become law and, as a result of the Government’s actions, the Bill has been utterly destroyed?

[Mr Hollobone]

I do not think the Bill has been destroyed because it still has a chance of passing through both Houses. The point I am trying to make is that if it does succeed in becoming an Act, it will only be by the skin of its teeth because there effectively is only one more sitting Friday for private Members’ Bills in this place.

[Mr MacNeil]

Therefore, if it is not utterly legally destroyed, it is morally destroyed.

[Mr Hollobone]

It has certainly not been the best use of parliamentary time in making sure that, as a piece of legislation, the Bill is as good as it could be. I am very worried that the Government are setting a precedent to abuse the private Members’ process because, as my hon. Friend the Member for Wellingborough (Mr Bone) said, another Bill has passed its Second Reading in this place. The Local Government Ombudsman (Amendment) Bill was passed on a private Members’ sitting Friday on 10 June. The will of this House was that that Bill should have its Second Reading, but here we are five months later and the Government have not yet moved a money resolution for that Bill.