National Insurance Contributions (Secondary Class 1 Contributions) Bill

Debate between Viscount Goschen and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Committee stage
Wednesday 29th January 2025 Grand Committee

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I support my noble friend’s amendment and will speak briefly.

The Minister in the other place said that the Department for Education made an assessment of the impact of the rise in NICs on special educational needs. Bearing in mind the debate that we have already had on the lack of impact assessments, if an assessment has been made, it should be shared. We have already seen the disproportionate impact of VAT on independent schools and the impact that it is having on children with special educational needs. Again, this is tantamount to a double whammy. These children are among the most vulnerable in society.

I reflect on my time as a councillor in my local authority many years ago: the vital link and lifeline that these drivers provide, as my noble friend Lady Monckton has articulated so passionately and poignantly, are essential. I also reflect on the statement made by the Chief Secretary in the other place, which said that, when we are pursuing economic growth, these changes must permeate every element of society—I paraphrase—and every part of our country. How can impacting the most vulnerable contribute to any kind of sensible understanding of growth?

I was a Minister for a long time; perhaps that is why I am not counted alongside the dynamic duo, on my side of the Committee, of my noble friends Lady Neville-Rolfe and Lady Noakes. I say this to the Minister: one thing that Ministers in your Lordships’ House do is listen—the Minister is doing that—but that listening also turns into action. Many vulnerable groups, including those highlighted by my noble friend, are being impacted. As a minimum, surely we need engagement at this stage. After all, that is what we are all about: scrutiny, listening, reviewing and ensuring that, when it leaves the House, legislation is in a better state than when it got here. I appeal to the Minister, as a minimum, to engage and listen to some of these groups that my noble friend highlighted. Perhaps, through his intervention, the Government will think again.

[Viscount Goschen (Con)]

My Lords, the Committee is very much in the debt of my noble friend Lady Monckton for her having raised this important issue this afternoon, because it presents a microcosm of all the arguments around the Bill. It is a narrowly focused amendment that draws the Committee’s attention to one narrow measure—one small, but very important, part of our national life. It is therefore incumbent on the Minister to give a substantive answer, not just “We don’t do further impact assessments”, because I am not sure that there is widespread belief in the country about the impact assessment that the Treasury notes has been made. I do not believe that that gives sufficient confidence. It is a short, high-level note and, at the bottom of the electronic page, it asks, “Did you find this page helpful: yes or no?” I think that most Members of the Committee would reply in the negative.

It is important for the Minister to listen to an illustration of the effect that this Bill will have, as we have heard in previous groups of amendments, on the wider growth of our economy as well as on extremely vulnerable people, as was illustrated by my noble friend’s amendments. I very much look forward to the Minister’s detailed and substantive answer.

Southern Rail

Debate between Viscount Goschen and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Monday 12th December 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

As the noble Baroness knows, I have acknowledged the fact that the company’s communications have been ineffective and that it has to take responsibility. I have never stood at the Dispatch Box and said that this problem comes from the unions alone. It is a challenge; there are challenges between the company and Network Rail. In that regard, as the noble Baroness will know, my right honourable friend the Secretary of State has appointed Chris Gibb to look specifically at the continuing issues: not at strike days—which, as she rightly highlighted, arise—but at ensuring that the issues on the line can be resolved. A new alliance board has also been established, which includes passenger representatives, and its report will be with the Secretary of State by the end of this month.

[Viscount Goschen (Con)]

My Lords, I declare an interest as a resident of Sussex who attempts occasionally to use this line. I thank the noble Lord for his role in supporting Peers who are interested in this subject. How much worse will this transport crisis have to get in the south-east of England before the Government intervene directly to take control of the situation?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

As my noble friend knows, the Government have been taking serious regard of all the concerns that have been raised. My honourable friend the Rail Minister meets with GTR weekly. My right honourable friend the Secretary of State has appointed Chris Gibb to look at the issues which arise between Network Rail and GTR, and his report will come through at the end of this year—at the end of this month. As I said, my right honourable friend the Secretary of State has now written directly to both RMT and ASLEF, asking them to meet with Southern at ACAS, where we hope this issue can be resolved. I agree with my noble friend and with all noble Lords; many in this House and beyond have rightly raised this issue because they are exasperated. That is probably a reflection of the sentiment the Government feel. We are taking major steps to resolve this issue, and I implore all parties, particularly those involved with the dispute, to come forward so that we can tackle the dispute and then the long-standing issues which impact negatively on this line and on many people in the south-east of England.

Southern Rail Services

Debate between Viscount Goschen and Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon

Monday 5th December 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

The noble Baroness raises some important points. On the fares increase, the Government have recently announced a substantial compensation package, which reflects the priority that the Secretary of State is giving this issue. The compensation will reflect the challenges—the delays and cancellations—that have impacted on the people using the service.

I have taken back to the department the noble Baroness’s point about the apps. We are looking at what measures can be put in place to ensure that claims for compensation are dealt with effectively and efficiently.

On the question of prioritising this issue, the Secretary of State and my honourable friend the Rail Minister, whose Statement I have repeated, are both dealing directly with this matter. The noble Baroness will be aware that the Rail Minister meets Network Rail and GTR weekly and that I recently held a briefing session for all Peers on this important issue. During that meeting I gave an assurance that the Rail Minister and I will continue to have formal quarterly updates to ensure that the challenges facing commuters, including Members of your Lordships’ House, are prioritised appropriately and that the relevant issues are brought to bear on the railway operator.

[Viscount Goschen (Con)]

My Lords, I declare my interest as someone who has attempted to use this service. I thank my noble friend for arranging that extremely helpful briefing meeting with his colleague, the Rail Minister.

Do my noble friend and the Government have confidence in Southern’s ability to deliver an effective rail service? When does he think that this appalling and unacceptable situation, in which a very large area of the country is no longer served by a predictable rail service, will be resolved? Has not the time come for stronger action by the Government? Perhaps my noble friend can also help me and other people who use the railway to understand why the RMT is still on strike when the majority of the conductors have agreed to the new contract.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I assure my noble friend that the Government are looking for this long-standing dispute to be resolved as quickly as possible and have repeatedly called on all sides to come back to the negotiating table. I acknowledge that there are three elements to this issue, as set out in the Statement. First, there is the industrial action, which needs to be resolved. Secondly, why the strike persists when the substantial majority of those impacted—230 out of 232—have signed new contracts is a question for the unions to answer. The third element in the equation is, of course, the issue with Network Rail, which is responsible for the infrastructure. In that regard, the appointment of Chris Gibb to work specifically with both the franchise operator and Network Rail will ensure that we can identify the issues and, more importantly, address them as quickly and efficiently as possible. His report is due with the Secretary of State at the end of this year.