Ukraine, Syria and Iran

Debate between Lord Wallace of Saltaire and Lord Bishop of Wakefield

Monday 24th February 2014 Lords Chamber

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, I have seen the base of the Russian Black Sea fleet in Sevastopol with the Ukrainian Black Sea fleet, such as it is, not far away. I recall that someone for whom I used to work, Admiral Sir James Eberle, was invited in the early 1990s to advise the Russians and the Ukrainians on how the Black Sea fleet should be divided between the two. His recommendation was that the best thing was to scrap the entire fleet. Unfortunately, the advice was not taken.

[The Lord Bishop of Wakefield]

My Lords, perhaps I may focus my question on Ukraine. It seems to me that there are some senses—not exactly repetitions—in which we are seeing replayed some of the things that were not resolved in the early 1990s with the collapse of the Soviet Union. I remember that at that time I was working at Lambeth as the archbishop’s foreign secretary, as it were, and on one occasion the telephone was brought to me in the bath. There was a call from the gatekeeper telling me that Mr Gorbachev was in captivity in the Crimea and he thought that I ought to know so that I could do something about it. Some very good and quite low-key, and low-cost, initiatives were taken by Her Majesty’s Government at that time to support the development of democracy in the various republics that resulted from the collapse of the Soviet Union, including Ukraine. Can we be reassured that, once things become a little more stable, those sorts of initiatives might be looked at again? I am suggesting not carbon copies but that sort of thing.

My other point is that only the churches never recognised the division of Europe. The Conference of European Churches always worked across Europe. There are very serious divisions in the churches in the Ukraine, often reflecting some of the fragmentations that exist in the country as a whole. Again, that is another area where Her Majesty’s Government might work with others to see how one moves towards a more democratic situation.

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, I continue to learn how close church links can be across national boundaries. I was in Armenia some months ago and was met by a very chatty archbishop, who seemed to know almost every bishop I had ever met in this country. However, we all know that the Orthodox Church in and across the former Soviet Union is a very complex and divided entity, and not all its branches are committed to anything that we would recognise as a liberal approach to organised religion. Sadly, the different branches of the church in Ukraine represent that rather well.

Electoral Fraud

Debate between Lord Wallace of Saltaire and Lord Bishop of Wakefield

Thursday 6th February 2014 Lords Chamber

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, I am well aware of that. Indeed, the Electoral Commission looked at the Northern Ireland scheme in particular and has estimated that if we were to extend it to Great Britain, with likely take-up, based on the Northern Ireland model, of 10%—mostly young voters—it would cost some £28 million.

[The Lord Bishop of Wakefield]

My Lords, following the question of the noble Lord, Lord Campbell-Savours, about areas of high risk, in our diocese of Wakefield the local authority of Kirklees has been pinpointed as just one such area for the sort of reasons that the noble Lord mentioned. The local authority is working hard with a number of agencies to ensure the probity of the next elections. Will the Minister say what sort of support will be given to councils to enable them to fulfil this important duty?

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, I was discussing that exact question with the electoral registration officer of Kirklees the summer before last, including the authority’s co-operation with the police. We all know that there are pockets of problems within Kirklees. It is a matter for local co-operation with the police, who are well aware of this. We are also well aware that there is a certain tendency in some local elections for candidates to use allegations of electoral fraud against each other as part of the local campaign. That is one of the reasons why the police are occasionally a little sceptical about allegations being thrown around during the campaign.

Electoral Registration

Debate between Lord Wallace of Saltaire and Lord Bishop of Wakefield

Wednesday 5th February 2014 Lords Chamber

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

As the noble Lord knows from our previous discussions on this on many occasions, the Government are not in favour of extending ring-fencing. Having met a number of electoral registration officers, I have great confidence that they can look after themselves and ensure that the money is not siphoned off to other sources.

[The Lord Bishop of Wakefield]

My Lords, noble Lords will know that churches and the ancillary buildings connected with them are often the places where hustings take place, and indeed are used as polling stations. This is a key way of engaging local people in the democratic process. With the recent passing of the transparency of lobbying Act, will the Minister reassure us that churches and such places will continue to be used and will not be affected by the passing of that Act?

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, I cannot see any way in which the use of churches as polling stations, and indeed the role of the clergy in encouraging people to do their community and civic duty, will be adversely affected. I very much hope that the church will continue to encourage all those who are part of its community to take a full part in civic, social and political life.

Georgia

Debate between Lord Wallace of Saltaire and Lord Bishop of Wakefield

Monday 27th January 2014 Lords Chamber

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, some years ago I said to one of my friends in Moscow that the Russian attitude to the Georgians reminds me very strongly of the English attitude to the Irish in about 1850. There is a certain refusal to accept that Georgia is an independent country, capable of governing itself. The new Government have tried to open a dialogue with the Russians. So far, the Kremlin has not been very open to responding to that dialogue.

[The Lord Bishop of Wakefield]

My Lords, I begin by declaring an interest as the Church of England’s lead bishop on Georgian affairs. Last year, I had the good fortune to meet the outgoing President Saakashvili and, independently, some of his associates. I then met a number of members of the present Government. The antagonism could be felt in both directions and was seriously affecting stability and development. The previous Government had done some good work on corruption, tax collection and so on. If the economy is to prosper, the next thing that needs to happen is a building up of the infrastructure. Can Her Majesty’s Government assure noble Lords that the new Government will do that?

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, on my last visit to Tbilisi I had lunch with MPs from both the governing party and the opposition party. That would not have been possible in Armenia or Azerbaijan. One has to put these things in perspective. Yes, of course we are assisting with developing the infrastructure in Georgia. The European neighbourhood partnership is putting a lot of money into Georgia and, of course, BP and other foreign investors are also assisting with the development of the country.

Georgia

Debate between Lord Wallace of Saltaire and Lord Bishop of Wakefield

Wednesday 3rd July 2013 Lords Chamber

[The Lord Bishop of Wakefield]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what steps they are taking to encourage greater economic and political co-operation between Georgia and the European Union.

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, the UK fully supports greater economic and political co-operation between Georgia and the European Union, particularly through regular and intensive high-level contact. Three senior Georgian Ministers have visited London in recent months and three UK Ministers and several senior officials have visited Tbilisi. We are pleased that Euro-Atlantic integration has remained a priority for the new Georgian Government, and, through involvement in the Eastern Partnership, Georgia is finalising an association agreement and a deep and comprehensive free trade area with the EU.

[The Lord Bishop of Wakefield]

My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for his response and for setting out the range of co-operation between Georgia and the EU. I remain concerned that, for most Georgians, this assistance remains invisible. Do the Government accept that to avoid similar mistakes to those made with the Ukraine, the EU should take steps to explain to the wider Georgian public the benefits of the association agreement and other such co-operation measures with the EU, rather than after they have been negotiated?

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

I was briefly in Tbilisi eight weeks ago and saw that the EU is quite visible there. The EU monitoring mission is the largest external monitoring mission in Georgia, monitoring the borders with the disputed territories of Abkhazia and South Ossetia. The EU heads of mission meet regularly, and comment regularly and openly, on developments in Georgian politics. The Council of Europe and the OSCE are also active in assisting with judicial training in Georgia and elsewhere. So we are quite visible and extremely active.

Georgia

Debate between Lord Wallace of Saltaire and Lord Bishop of Wakefield

Tuesday 11th December 2012 Lords Chamber

[The Lord Bishop of Wakefield]

My Lords, perhaps I may move the focus to Russo-Georgian relations. Prime Minister Ivanishvili made most of his millions in Russia and it is reported that he either has been, or is about to be meeting President Putin. Will the Minister comment on the Government’s informed understanding of how Russo-Georgian relations may alter or whether they will remain as they are?

[Lord Wallace of Saltaire]

My Lords, we would welcome an improvement in relations between Russia and Georgia. The new Government have indeed attempted to open a new dialogue with the Russians, but so far, as far as I am informed, the Russians have not responded very favourably. The problems of Abkhazia and South Ossetia remain; Russia still does not accept the territorial integrity of Georgia. There is a long way to go, but in the context of the multinational Geneva talks in which Britain also plays a part, we would very much like a more positive dialogue between Russia and Georgia to take place.