Scotland: Independence

Lord Touhig Excerpts

Thursday 1st March 2012 Lords Chamber

Asked by

[Lord Touhig]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what discussions they have had with the First Minister of Wales on the issue of a referendum on Scottish independence.

[The Advocate-General for Scotland (Lord Wallace of Tankerness)]

My Lords, first, I am sure that noble Lords from other parts of the United Kingdom will wish to join me in extending to Welsh noble Lords our warmest greetings and best wishes on St David’s Day.

The Government have had no formal discussions with the Welsh Government on the issue of a referendum on Scottish independence.

[Lord Touhig]

My Lords, I thank the Minister for his St David’s Day greeting; it is most welcome to those of us who spend much of our working lives as missionaries in England.

The future of the United Kingdom is not a matter that can be left to negotiations between Her Majesty’s Government and the Scottish Government alone. Any change in the status of any of the nations of our union must affect us all. The people of Wales—and, indeed, the people of Northern Ireland—are not mere spectators in all this. Wales’s First Minister has proposed holding a constitutional convention so that we can redefine what a modern United Kingdom should look like. What do the Government think about that idea? If such a convention is held, should it not be held before the Scots hold their referendum?

[Lord Wallace of Tankerness]

My Lords, we are faced with the position where the Scottish Government have said that they wish to proceed with a referendum. We have serious doubts as to the legality of that; that is why we have proposed in our consultation document that we should engage with the Scottish Government to see whether we can get an appropriate order to allow such a referendum to take place on a legitimate basis.

However, it has been accepted by successive Administrations that no part of the United Kingdom should be forced to stay within the United Kingdom against its wishes. That is why, first and foremost, the Government wish to ensure that we succeed in winning the referendum for Scotland to remain part of the United Kingdom; but I wholly accept that any other arrangements for how powers may be distributed within our United Kingdom have implications for all parts of it. Therefore, the more we can discuss it among different parts of the United Kingdom, the better.