Covid-19 Update

Debate between Lord Sikka and Lord Bethell

Tuesday 18th May 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bethell (Con)]

My Lords, I pay tribute to the vice-chancellors and to the universities and colleges of Britain for the way in which they have embraced campus testing. It has been a salutary lesson in what can be done, and it has helped to keep infection rates down on campuses where there has been a small number of returning students to date. That is done mainly through LFD testing. Positive tests then have a complementary PCR test, and the PCR test is automatically sequenced if it is positive. The combination of LFD, PCR and sequencing is the right one for keeping infection rates down, but we tweak the formula as and when best advice comes in.

[Lord Sikka (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the pandemic has hit the low-paid and the poor the hardest. The Government need to commit to a road map to a better post-Covid society so I invite them to make two pledges. First, at the very least, they need to reduce the NHS waiting lists in England from the present 4.95 million to 2.5 million, which was the case in 2010. Will the Minister pledge to do exactly that by the end of this Parliament or even sooner? If not, why not? Secondly, the poorest 10% of households pay 47.6% of their income in direct and indirect taxes, compared with 33.5% for the richest 10% of households. This condemns millions of people to poor food, housing and health, which is a key reason for deaths during this pandemic. Will the Government pledge to eliminate that injustice by the end of this Parliament?

[Lord Bethell (Con)]

My Lords, I recognise some of the noble Lord’s insights. It is undoubtedly true that the low-paid and the poor have been hardest hit by Covid, both by the infection rates themselves and by the lockdown. That is a frustrating truth that is completely recognised and acknowledged by the Government. It is also true that the low-paid and the poor have health inequalities that have themselves made people more vulnerable to sickness, both from Covid and from the non-Covid diseases that have been exacerbated by limited access to some parts of the NHS. We are absolutely committed to reducing NHS waiting lists—that is an incredibly important part of the “build back better” mantra—but we need to do more to bring a degree of levelling up to all parts of society in order to address the symptoms that the noble Lord rightly describes.

Covid-19: Update

Debate between Lord Sikka and Lord Bethell

Tuesday 20th April 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bethell (Con)]

The right reverend Prelate hits the nail on the head. It is extremely sad, frustrating and hard to acknowledge the fact that those who live in deprivation are often those who are hardest hit by this awful disease. We have worked extremely hard to get the vaccine, and testing and tracing, into those communities and to support them with whatever education and community support we can. But the fact remains that this country has an unequal health outcome for too many families, and it is part of our levelling-up agenda that we try to address that. The obesity strategy is one way in which that we can do that, but there are a great many others that we need to look at.

[Lord Sikka (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, 4.7 million people in England are waiting for routine operations and procedures. Some 388,000 have been on waiting lists for more than a year. Even with the extra £7 billion a year, it is estimated that it will take five years to clear the backlog. Can I urge the Government to declare an NHS emergency, equivalent to that of Covid-19, provide additional resources to the NHS, and inform the House of the targets they will set for reducing the waiting list?

[Lord Bethell (Con)]

The noble Lord is right that the backlog is a grave issue, and we are fighting as hard as we can to address it. The big guns of the NHS are moving from Covid to addressing the backlog, but we should not overstate its threat either. Large parts of the NHS remained open all the way through Covid, and I pay tribute to those in the NHS who worked extremely hard to ensure that many elective procedures and much diagnosis continued. We do them and their reputations no favours if we imply that the NHS was in any way doing less than it should have done to work through Covid. But the noble Lord is right; this is a grave issue, and we take it extremely seriously.

NHS: Pay

Debate between Lord Sikka and Lord Bethell

Tuesday 9th March 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bethell (Con)]

My Lords, I am at a slight disadvantage because I am not quite sure that I can substantiate the noble Baroness’s view that pay has lagged behind inflation. Her economics lesson is extremely interesting but not one that the Chancellor is necessarily persuaded by. Where she is entirely right is that pay is an important aspect of any recruitment campaign by the NHS, and that is why we have put recruitment at the heart of our commitment to it. That is why we are recruiting 50,000 nurses and making a very large number of GP appointments. We are seeing huge gains in achieving those targets, which reflects the fact that there is not a massive or structural misalignment in our pay arrangements.

[Lord Sikka (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the Government paid consultants up to £7,000 a day for advice on test and trace but nurses risking their lives are offered less than £1 a day. Does the Minister agree that this contempt for nurses is disgraceful because a higher award can easily be funded? For example, taxing capital gains in the same way as earned income can generate additional tax revenues of £14 billion a year.

[Lord Bethell (Con)]

I am grateful for the economics lesson from the noble Lord. I will take those recommendations and pass them on to colleagues at the Treasury.

Covid-19 Update

Debate between Lord Sikka and Lord Bethell

Thursday 4th March 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bethell (Con)]

My Lords, the noble Baroness makes her point extremely well. It is an area that we have looked at extremely carefully. The proportion of people who are not registered is remarkably small, but the phenomenon does exist. For this particular vaccination round, we have put in procedures so that those who turn up at a GP or vaccination centre who are not registered can be registered on the spot, and I thank colleagues at NHS D, who have put the necessary arrangements into the NIMS programme to make that possible. There are also others who do not know their NHS number—well, an enormous number of them now do know it. That is one of the blessings of this vaccination programme. We are also working extremely hard to reach out to the people the noble Baroness alludes to—the homeless, the Roma community and those who are recent arrivals in the UK—to make sure that the vaccination is offered to absolutely everyone in the UK, whatever their immigration status, whatever their living arrangements and whatever their medical history.

[Lord Sikka (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, last month the High Court concluded that the Secretary of State acted unlawfully by failing to comply with the transparency policy. When did the Prime Minister become aware that the Government were failing to meet their policy, and will the Minister now provide this House with minutes of each Cabinet meeting at which the government failure was discussed?

Covid-19: Contracts and Mass Testing Programme

Debate between Lord Sikka and Lord Bethell

Wednesday 4th November 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bethell (Con)]

We have published 80% of the contracts to date and are working on publishing the rest. I hope that that will meet noble Lords’ expectations.

[Lord Sikka (Lab) [V]]

KPMG, PricewaterhouseCoopers, Deloitte and Ernst & Young have been fined for audit failures and have regularly been chastised by the regulator, even though they have been doing audits for over a century. They have no experience of test and trace or of dealing with viruses but have received multimillion-pound Covid contracts. What due diligence checks were carried out by the Government and how? Will the Government inform Parliament and allow a public audit of all their checks on these firms?

[Lord Bethell (Con)]

My Lords, the circumstances of the pandemic were exceptional, and I am not sure that any large company had any experience of putting together a national test and trace programme. The firms to which the noble Lord refers have considerable consulting experience and the capacity to support the national rollout of a large organisation such as NHS Test and Trace. They have provided invaluable support to the country at a time of need. All our contracts are scrutinised extremely closely by the finance function in the DHSC, and we are supported in that by the government legal service and finance staff from the MoD and the Cabinet Office, for which we are enormously grateful.