Police: Joe Anderson

Debate between Lord Sharpe of Epsom and Lord Dobbs

Monday 15th April 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

Again, I would prefer not to pass judgment on the quality of the investigation that the Merseyside police have done, as the noble Baroness is asking me to do. I really do not know what the complexity of this case is. I do not know why it has taken so long to resolve. I would assume that there are very strong operational reasons, given the obviously high-profile nature of the people involved.

[Lord Dobbs (Con)]

May I ask my noble friend about a case on which he can comment? It is that of a public figure: Ted Heath. I can sense—although I cannot see—him gritting his teeth even as I raise that name. The only reason Ted Heath was accused, with the most vicious accusations, is that he was a public figure, and a vulnerable public figure. He died years ago. Surely, this is a matter of public service that we should be doing in this House, and my noble friend would become a local hero in this House if he simply went away and told the Home Office that this would be settled once and for all and that, at last, Ted Heath’s name could be cleared.

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

Well, I hear what my noble friend has to say. He has heard what I have had to say on this subject on at least 20 occasions and, no doubt, I will be called back to the Dispatch Box to say it all again. As I said last time, I have gone back to the Home Office and we are looking into ways of perhaps answering the noble Lord’s question.

Shamima Begum

Debate between Lord Sharpe of Epsom and Lord Dobbs

Tuesday 27th February 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

The noble Lord is right. The Home Secretary has the power to deprive any British national of citizenship status on conducive to the public good grounds, providing that such action does not leave the individual stateless. In this case, the Court of Appeal found for the Government on all grounds.

[Lord Dobbs (Con)]

My Lords, there is a strong impression that citizenship has now become a matter of judicial ping-pong, which is clearly unsatisfactory. My noble friend mentioned the British Nationality Act 1981; that is nearly 50 years old, and a lot has changed in this world since. Should we not have a fresh look at the meaning, rights and responsibilities of citizenship in this country, and is not this Chamber the best place for that debate?

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

My noble friend raises some very good points, which I am happy to take back to the Home Office. I reiterate that this power is used very sparingly and only in conducive to the public good circumstances.

Hate Crime

Debate between Lord Sharpe of Epsom and Lord Dobbs

Monday 24th April 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

I am afraid I am not sure when the Bill will be introduced. I am aware that the Government support that Bill, which was introduced by Greg Clark. I do not have the answer as to how the crimes will be recorded, but I will find out.

[Lord Dobbs (Con)]

My Lords, Saturday was the occasion of Stephen Lawrence Day. I pay tribute to the noble Baroness, Lady Lawrence, who is in her place, for all the dedicated work she has done to build on the memory of her son. What a pity that it should have coincided with the outbursts of Diane Abbott, which left me cold in our modern world. We have hate legislation. Does my noble friend really think that that legislation is effective? Is it really reducing the amount of hate in society, or is it encouraging us to concentrate on the wicked things that are going on rather than allowing us the opportunity to celebrate and build on all the many good things that are going on in terms of race relations in this country, of which the Stephen Lawrence Day Foundation is one?

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

I associate myself with my noble friend’s remarks about the noble Baroness, Lady Lawrence, and the work she has done in that area. As regards whether hate crime legislation increases, improves or takes away from the current situation, there are plenty of reasons why hate is present in society—you can start with Twitter and move on. I am not sure that the legislation makes an enormous difference to that, but it is something that will remain front and centre of public debate for many years.

Police and Crime Commissioners

Debate between Lord Sharpe of Epsom and Lord Dobbs

Monday 20th March 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

My Lords, I am sorry that my noble friend finds it unsatisfactory. I think it would be unsatisfactory for me to stand here and make a comment that might prejudice a judicial inquiry. I am not going to do that.

[Lord Dobbs (Con)]

My Lords, I pay tribute to the noble Lord, Lord Lexden, and his persistence in trying to learn the lessons from this hugely unfortunate episode. Law and order go to the very heart of what a civilised society stands for. I understand that the noble Baroness, Lady Casey, will tomorrow deliver a report on the Metropolitan Police that will give the police force yet another good kicking. Does the Minister not agree that it is not enough to leave all these things up to police and crime commissioners, let alone the Mayor of London? The Government have to take a central role in dealing with what is an ongoing and deeply serious problem.

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

My Lords, I agree up to a point. The Government are taking a central role, not least through the review into the dismissal process that I have talked about before. I have little doubt that that will become a topical subject within the next 24 hours. That will look into the composition of misconduct panels, including the impact of the role of legally qualified chairs; more broadly, it will look at things such as the appeals mechanism and the effectiveness of the performance system, including for officers who have failed vetting. That review was launched on 17 January and was said to take about four months to conclude. We are getting towards the end of that process, so there will be more to be said.

Police and Crime Commissioners and Panels

Debate between Lord Sharpe of Epsom and Lord Dobbs

Monday 31st October 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

I am obviously aware of the noble Lord’s long engagement with this subject, but I do not agree; there are lots of reasons why things have happened.

[Lord Dobbs (Con)]

My Lords, I will be perhaps a little unhelpful to my noble friend and say that I quite agree with the noble Lord, Lord Bach. Trust in the police has measurably declined in recent years. My noble friend’s predecessors have stood at that Dispatch Box and talked about the former chief constable of Wiltshire and commissioners of police in the London Met, and we have had endless examples of where the system is going wrong. Whatever system we have set up for this, is it not ultimately the Government’s responsibility to sort this out and restore trust in the police? Without that, we cannot trust in justice.

Qatar: Football World Cup 2022

Debate between Lord Sharpe of Epsom and Lord Dobbs

Tuesday 30th November 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

The UK is committed to the principle of non-discrimination on any grounds, including on the basis of sexual orientation and/or gender identity. We are committed to promoting and protecting the rights of LGBT people. They are not asking for special rights, merely to be accorded the same dignity, respect and rights as all other citizens. Qatari authorities have committed that everybody is welcome to the tournament, including LGBT visitors. We will continue to engage on this between now and next year’s tournament, so that anyone of any background can go and enjoy themselves. We will continue to encourage the equal treatment and respect of individual rights and identify what action Qatar is taking to match those words.

[Lord Dobbs (Con)]

My Lords, from this side of the House, I also welcome my noble friend to his new responsibilities; I wish him well. Do not all the very valid points that have been made during the course of this Question surely emphasise the need for ongoing and constructive engagement in conversations with countries such as Qatar? Can we also be brutally realistic and realise that nobody is going to rush to listen to our sermons on democratic values and human rights in the Middle East when our policies for the last 20 years in Iraq, Libya, Syria and Afghanistan have pointed in entirely the wrong direction?

[Lord Sharpe of Epsom (Con)]

My noble friend is right to raise the importance of constructive engagement. The UK has a strong history of promoting our values globally. We believe that the best approach is to engage with Governments and work with international partners and civil society organisations to promote and defend those universal freedoms. The relationship between the UK and countries of the Gulf Cooperation Council and the wider MENA region is historic and enduring. But we should also recognise that this is a region with distinct cultures and differing political systems.