Judicial Pensions (Amendment) Regulations 2024

Debate between Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames and Lord Wolfson of Tredegar

Monday 11th November 2024 Grand Committee

[Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames (LD)]

My Lords, first, I congratulate the noble Lord on his concise and detailed opening on a complicated set of regulations. I note that the regulations were introduced by the last Government and have hardly undergone any significant change since their introduction, so it is unsurprising that they are likely to be relatively uncontroversial. There will certainly be no opposition from the Liberal Democrats to these proposals.

The most significant of what are largely tidying-up amendments are those that bring into line with other fee-paid judges a number of tribunal judges and chairs. That is completely in line with the view that we all take—that tribunal judges and chairs are a very important part of the working judiciary and that the tribunal system does the whole work extremely well. It is right that the pension arrangements for paid judges should be aligned.

The other significant point is that the pension arrangements for part-time service in the light of the O’Brien judgment are now going to be tidied up so that some of the anomalies that arose from that judgment have been eliminated, so far as they can be, although it is a difficult area—and I appreciate that the regulations have to reflect that difficulty.

I noted from the Explanatory Memorandum and the Minister’s opening that there was a consultation, which attracted no fewer than six responses, none of them critical—and, I take it, all of them raising questions that have been satisfactorily answered. In view of that, I have no further questions for the Minister on this SI.

[Lord Wolfson of Tredegar (Con)]

I am not sure whether I need to declare a formal interest, as my wife sits as a fee-paid tribunal judge but, for the avoidance of any doubt, I do. I suspect that the impact of this regulation on her will be de minimis and no doubt happen in many years’ time.

That said, I can be brief because the Minister has been so comprehensive. As we heard from the noble Lord, Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames, these regulations emanate from the previous Government; this is not an area where, historically, there has been political controversy. Indeed, as the Minister said, we debated similar regulations when our roles were reversed. I echo his comment to me that this is probably not the last time we will come back to debate and discuss these pension regulations, because they are complex. Part of the reason for that is the history and the litigation that has arisen, but the one thing we share around the Committee is the importance of having an attractive pension scheme so that we attract the finest candidates to our judiciary—and retain them. Indeed, one of the things we did in the previous Government was to increase the retirement age to 75. The Minister referred to our outstanding and independent judiciary, and we absolutely endorse those two adjectives; it is outstanding, and it is totally independent.

I also endorse the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames: the fact that we are widening some of these pension schemes to include more tribunal judges is testament to the fact that so much of the important work of our judiciary is done by tribunal judges, both full-time and part-time—I think fee-paid is the proper term. Day in, day out, tribunals up and down the country deal with really important issues for people on the ground, so to speak. They are often unsung, and far from the legal journals and law reports, but they deal with important legal issues on a daily basis.

I have only one question for the Minister, which I ask as a matter of interest rather than in any controversial way. I note that, by these regulations, we are extending the time to enable judges to make choices between the pre-1995 and post-1995 schemes. I am interested in why we are extending time for that and why this particular period of extension has been chosen.

Other than that, I am tempted—as I think they are still debating the Budget in the Chamber—to point out that, although it is important to have attractive and gold-plated pensions in the public sector, that does not mean that we should raid private pensions in the private sector. If I say any more on that I will take this debate to places where it ought not to go, so I will stop there and make it unequivocally clear that we on these Benches are also firmly in favour of these regulations. I thank the Minister for introducing and explaining them so clearly.