All-Party Parliamentary Groups

Debate between Lord Laming and Lord Naseby

Wednesday 11th November 2015 Lords Chamber

[The Chairman of Committees]

My Lords, the position, as I understand it, is simply being quite clear about the accountability that goes with these groups. A number of concerns have been raised about them. Although it may seem that this House is in some way disadvantaged, that is not the intention. The intention is to make absolutely clear where the accountability rests for the compliance that is necessary to make sure that these groups operate well within the rules of Parliament and do not bring either House into disrepute. I understand that at present there is no appetite in any way to undermine that accountability.

[Lord Naseby (Con)]

Is my noble friend aware that when I founded the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Sri Lanka in 1975, it was the convention that the chairman should always be in the Commons? However, the disappointment for those of us who take an interest in these different groups—I confess I take an interest in a number—is that there was no consultation with your Lordships’ House when this review was undertaken. It was suddenly announced out of the blue. Can one hope that the noble Lord the Chairman of Committees will ensure that, in future, there is proper consultation through the normal channels and that the rest of us can be part of that conversation?

[The Chairman of Committees]

My Lords, there have been a number of reviews. The earlier review was set up jointly by the Speaker of the House of Commons and the Lord Speaker, with Members of this House on the review. The most recent review, to which I have referred, was set up in response to some very serious and real concerns. We ought not to minimise the reality of those concerns, but let us be sure that the two Houses continue to work together as much as we can.

Procedure of the House

Debate between Lord Laming and Lord Naseby

Wednesday 9th January 2013 Lords Chamber

[Lord Laming]

The answer that I gave the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, which I shall repeat, is that the committee considered a number of possibilities and decided that each one of them had considerable flaws and was time-consuming. The committee therefore went ahead and produced a thoughtful document, which is now before your Lordships. The reason—

[Lord Naseby]

The point that the noble Lord does not seem to have taken on board is: what consultation was there with Back-Benchers? Questions are put down by Back-Benchers. The vast majority of members of the Procedure Committee are not Back-Benchers and they do not put down Questions. On the whole, I question whether they really know what the procedure is and what really happens.

[Lord Laming]

The committee considered the representations that had been made to them by Back-Benchers and those representations fell into three clear and unambiguous categories as far as the committee was concerned. One is to simplify the procedure; the second is to recognise that not all Members are free to form a queue at two o’clock and not all Members find it a dignified process; and the third and most important point is whether it is possible to arrive at a recommendation that enables a wider range of Members to table Oral Questions.

The committee made these recommendations in the belief that it had addressed the objectives set for it. The committee not only made the recommendations on that basis but recognised that any change has its advantages and disadvantages, many of which have been aired today, and those were considered by the committee. It therefore decided that, if there is going to be a change, which is clearly a matter for the House, why not introduce it on an experimental basis, as set out in the report, so that we can all learn from experience? In the light of that experience, we can either modify what has been recommended or it can be scrapped and we can go back to what is presently in operation.

This House has demonstrated its willingness to look at its procedures. It has demonstrated through the Leader’s Group and other means that it is willing to consider changes in its procedures if it seems that they can be in keeping with the current pressures on the House. As I am sure all noble Lords will agree, it is not a dramatic change to introduce a ballot for matters of this kind. However, I urge the House to consider that, if we accept the amendment of the noble Lord, Lord Lea, we will end up with three different procedures to determine four Questions. I have to say that that is not a system that would appeal to me; nor do I believe that it would simplify the matter.