Localism in Planning

Debate between Lord Herbert of South Downs and Crispin Blunt

Wednesday 17th July 2013 Westminster Hall

[Nick Herbert (Arundel and South Downs) (Con)]

Good morning, Mr Hollobone. I will try to keep my remarks reasonably brief, to allow my hon. Friends the opportunity to participate in this debate, but the number who wish to do so is evidence of the growing concern in our constituencies about planning matters and the need to ensure that we strike the right balance between providing housing and ensuring that the countryside can be protected and that we keep the promises that we made to local people. I am therefore grateful for securing this debate.

[Mr Crispin Blunt (Reigate) (Con)]

I apologise to my right hon. Friend for intervening so early, but I am also serving on a Joint Committee, to which I need to return. I just want to say how much I welcome his securing this debate and the fact that so many colleagues wish to take part. I have made it clear to the Prime Minister on the Floor of the House that the national policy planning framework is not working to protect the green belt. There is greenfield development in the green belt designated for my constituency at the behest of a planning inspector, rather than local people, which is evidence that our system is not working. I am delighted that my right hon. Friend is raising these issues today.

[Mr Philip Hollobone (in the Chair)]

Order. Eleven Members have indicated that they wish to speak, and I am absolutely determined to do my best to ensure that those 11 people speak. It would greatly help the chances of those who want to speak if they do not intervene beforehand; otherwise we simply will not be able to get everybody in.

Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Bill

Debate between Lord Herbert of South Downs and Crispin Blunt

Tuesday 5th February 2013 Commons Chamber

[Nick Herbert (Arundel and South Downs) (Con)]

Marriage is one of the most important institutions in our society. It concerns many of us that it is in decline, yet while many move away from marriage, one group turns towards it. Gay couples are now asking to be admitted. Here we have a section of society who are saying that they want to declare commitment and that they value stability, in the sight of the public and perhaps of God. We defenders of marriage should be gratefully opening the doors, yet the reaction of some has been to slam them shut.

It is said that gay people should accept civil partnerships—and no more—which confer most of the legal rights of a marriage. Thousands of people such as me have cause to be grateful for the courage of hon. Members who voted for that change. Entering a civil partnership was the most important thing I have done in my life. At that time, civil partnerships were opposed by the Churches, a significant proportion of the public and many hon. Members. Just eight years later, only a small minority of the public oppose civil partnerships and many hon. Members who voted against the change now say they support it. People choose marriage for a reason: they know that it means something special. Indeed, it is because marriage is different that many are opposing the change, so we cannot say that civil partnerships are the same or dismiss the debate as being about a name. How many married couples would like to be told that they were barred from matrimony and able only to take out a civil partnership?

The Church of England and the Catholic Church object to gay marriage. I disagree with them, but their religious freedom is surely among the greatest prizes in our democracy. I would not vote for this Bill unless I believed that it protected religious freedom. No faith group should be compelled by law to conduct a gay marriage against its will, and none will be, but religious freedom cuts both ways. Why should the law prevent liberal Jews, Quakers or Unitarian Churches from conducting gay marriages, as they wish to? With the proper safeguards for faith groups and individuals to exercise their consciences and to disagree, I do not believe that there are sufficient grounds to oppose a measure that allows gay marriages for others. No one has to enter a gay marriage. No one’s Church has to conduct a gay marriage. We simply have to agree that someone else can enter a gay marriage.

Are the marriages of millions of straight people about to be threatened because a few thousand gay people are permitted to join? What will they say? “Darling, our marriage is over: Sir Elton John has just got engaged to David Furnish”? I appreciate the sincerity with which many people oppose equal marriage and the serious points made. Ensuring that religious freedom is protected is a proper concern, but some of the objections do not bear scrutiny. We are told that because there will not be a legal definition of “consummation”, there is some terrible flaw in the Bill, but many loving heterosexual marriages exist without consummation. Are they invalid? For some, the objection is to homosexual conduct itself. Today that is a minority view—one thankfully in decline.

[Mr Crispin Blunt (Reigate) (Con)]

My right hon. Friend says that that attitude is in decline, but does he agree that although achieving legal equality is critical, it is—and only ever will be—part of the battle for acceptance?

[Nick Herbert]

I strongly agree with my hon. Friend.

I believe that many who do not share that view nevertheless have a principled concern that gay marriage would mean redefining the institution for everyone, yet Parliament has repeatedly done that. If marriage had not been redefined in 1836, there would be no civil marriages. If it had not been redefined in 1949, under-16-year-olds would still be able to get married. If it had not been redefined in 1969, we would not have today’s divorce laws. All those changes were opposed.

Growth and Infrastructure Bill

Debate between Lord Herbert of South Downs and Crispin Blunt

Monday 17th December 2012 Commons Chamber

[Nick Herbert]

That raises the question of the process whereby councils are now assessing need, and the potential confusion between need and demand. I think that communities will feel cheated if, having been promised the abolition of the top-down housing target that was set by the last Government—effectively by means of the regional spatial strategies—they see it returning through the back door in the shape of a planning inspector, and if local authorities find that they have no choice but to provide a level of housing that they consider to be unsustainable.

[Mr Blunt]

Let me make it clear to my right hon. Friend, and to the Minister, that that is precisely what is happening to Reigate and Banstead borough council. Its draft plan has been kicked back by the inspector to “show again”, because it simply does not meet what he believes to be the required development objectives in the green belt. The council is being invited to review the green belt in its area, which is meant to be sacrosanct. It is not just in the case of ordinary developments that localism is being overturned.

[Nick Herbert]

My hon. Friend makes his point powerfully. The principle of localism is enshrined in the very name of the legislation recently mentioned and was set out in the coalition agreement. Under that principle, local communities should now have the power—on an objective assessment, I agree—to gauge the level of need. They are best placed to determine whether there is sufficient local infrastructure and what the environmental damage would be, and balance that against the economic needs of their area. They are best placed to determine the right level of housing in their area.