House of Lords: Sittings

Lord Foulkes of Cumnock Excerpts

Wednesday 9th January 2019 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock]

That the House should adjourn at close of business on 14 February to return on 25 February, and similarly adjourn at close of business on 4 April to return on 23 April.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, I beg to move the Motion in my name on the Order Paper. A number of Members have asked me why I have put down these particular dates. I have put them down because they are the dates for the February Recess and the Easter Recess already announced for the House of Commons. I thought it was strange that the House of Commons, the primary House, in this Parliament is able to announce its recess dates and we are not. It just seems crazy. In both Houses there is a qualification: it is always subject to the progress of legislation. That is understood. It is accepted that things can change, but at least it gives us some degree of potential certainty.

I do not always agree with my noble friend Lord Grocott on everything, but on this I agree with him wholly. When he was Chief Whip, he ensured that both Houses of this Parliament met and went into recess at the same time, so that it was Parliament that was sitting, not just one House or the other. Unless we take a decision, there is uncertainty not just for Members—a lot of whom have already gone into their whips’ offices asking when the recesses will be—but for the staff. We have to have some concern for the staff of this House and for the uncertainty that it creates for them.

I have been looking back over the last 15 years, and the February and Easter Recess dates are normally announced in October or, at the very latest, November of the previous year to give us some degree of certainty. I know that at the moment there is a particular uncertainty about the legislation—I do not need to go into that; everyone knows it—but of course it works both ways, and it works for both Houses.

The Government Chief Whip could have pre-empted my moving this Motion today by making an announcement in the normal way. As he has not done so, I am minded to let the House decide on its own recesses. That would be self-regulation at its best.

[Lord Taylor of Holbeach (Con)]

My Lords, this is really not how we agree on or give notification of our recess dates. Although I fully understand the concerns of the noble Lord, Lord Foulkes, and others, I cannot support the Motion before the House and ask others not to do so either. As the House has heard, most recently during Question Time on Monday, there will be a significant amount of legislation before the House before the end of March, and I do not think it sensible to confirm recess dates before then.

I have been up front with other members of the usual channels. As I indicated to them at the end of December, all our recess dates are subject to the progress of business. I intend, if possible, to provide for a long weekend during February, but I anticipate that the House will need to sit on days when the Commons is not sitting. The House has an important part to play in scrutinising critical legislation and we all know that we will need to do that during February and March. I hope to be able to confirm our plans for Easter soon, and I hope that that will be a fortnight’s recess, but, again, I cannot guarantee that the dates will match those of the Commons.

I am grateful to everyone for their patience and understanding but, at this critical point for all of us, we need to put the important scrutiny work of the House first, even where it causes personal inconvenience. I do not think that I have to point out to noble Lords how it would appear to members of the public if the House were to vote to give itself a holiday at this juncture.

I give an undertaking to come back to the House at the earliest opportunity to make an announcement in the usual way. On that basis, I ask the noble Lord to withdraw his Motion. If he does not feel able to do so, I ask noble Lords to think very carefully before supporting him in the Lobby today.

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Taylor of Holbeach]

My Lords, that is my intention: that we should create the time to do our business properly.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock]

My Lords, I know that the Government Chief Whip has a life outside this place: I see him from time to time on the plane to Bergerac. But I assure him that I am not moving this because of any personal inconvenience to individual or collective Members of Parliament. All the points he made apply equally to the House of Commons—all of them. They can be recalled, as can we, if urgently needed; indeed my noble friend Lord Adonis suggested late last year that we could be recalled if necessary. I have known my good noble friend Lord McAvoy since we were very young councillors together: he in Glasgow, me in Edinburgh, and we still got on. I do not want to upset him, but a number of people have said to me that too many decisions in this House are made by the usual channels, without consulting individual Members or considering what they think. I suggest that this is an opportunity for individual Members to make a decision. We have been told we may get a weekend, but we have not even been told which weekend. I would like to give Members the opportunity of a free vote on this, and I hope it will be a free vote.

Motion disagreed.