2030 Emissions Reduction Target: Heating

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 5th September 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

The noble Baroness makes a valid point. Heat networks are probably more appropriate for most flats—for instance, you could have one heat pump in the basement that would heat all the flats—but for some cases she is right.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, what is the Government’s estimate of the cost of meeting this target and who will pay for it?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

That depends on what target the noble Lord is referring to. There are a number of different targets but a substantial amount of government funding is going into this—some £450 million for the boiler upgrade scheme and £6.6 billion to decarbonise heating generally.

Electricity and Gas (Energy Company Obligation) Order 2023

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 26th June 2023 Lords Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Energy Security and Net Zero (Lord Callanan)]

My Lords, I beg to move the Motion standing in my name on the Order Paper.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, can I ask the Minister briefly about this order? As I understand it, the order is about requiring the providers of energy services to take measures to reduce people’s energy bills, which is very welcome at a time when there is a cost of living crisis. Can the Minister confirm whether the reports in today’s Daily Telegraph that the Government are planning to reintroduce the green levy on people’s electricity bills are correct? If so, is it wise to do so at this time?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

My Lords, my noble friend is being slightly mischievous on this. The question he asks is not in any way related to the statutory instrument debated last week, but I would be happy to have a separate conversation with him about it.

SMEs: Net-zero Targets

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 7th June 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

Of course it will vary depending on the type of business. Many businesses are already working in green areas. A lot of them are involved in retrofitting. On the other hand, some of them are very energy intensive. There are different solutions for different businesses.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, given that their competitors in Germany and elsewhere are extending the deadline for ending the production of motor cars with internal combustion engines, are we not in danger of making our large car manufacturers into small and medium-sized enterprises as they are being forced to reduce production, with great consequences for employment and competitiveness?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I normally agree with my noble friend, but I do not on this solitary occasion: I think he is wrong. Other major economies, including the EU, are essentially doing a similar job—they have made a couple of small exceptions to the ban with things such as novel fuels. Providing certainty for industry and business is the direction they need to go in. Supporting them in the appropriate areas, ensuring that the right gigafactories are completed in the UK, is the way to go, in my view.

Climate Change: Net Zero Strategy

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 3rd May 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

Of course, we will continue to keep these matters under review. I am not going to predict what might happen to the Bill in the House of Commons, but we will certainly reflect on what the House voted for.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, will my noble friend resist the blandishments from the Green Party about planning and organisation, given the shambles it has created in Scotland for the coalition there on the bottle return scheme?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

Of course, I accept my noble friend’s advice about Green policies. I pointed out the example of Germany. The Green Party’s opposition to an electric railway line—HS2—is another example of a hypocritical policy, but there are many others that we could choose from.

Heat and Buildings Strategy: Gas Boilers

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 28th February 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

The noble Baroness will be aware that these are matters for the Chancellor. As a Minister, I have long observed not getting into predicting taxation policy. I will certainly pass her suggestions on to the Chancellor.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, further to the questions from the right reverend Prelate and my noble friend Lord Naseby, I was involved in raising funds to refurbish our rectory. The church insisted on putting in a heat pump; because of the nature of the property, it cost nearly £40,000 just to insulate it in order to make the heat pump work efficiently. Heat pumps are not suitable for all buildings, which is why it is essential that we look for an alternative.

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I partly agree with my noble friend. It is a good thing that the rectory was insulated anyway, whatever kind of heating was installed in it. Heat pumps obviously work best in well-insulated properties, but you can now get high-temperature heat pumps that work in all scenarios. I agree with my noble friend that, as I said earlier, there is a multiplicity of property types and different technologies will work in different properties.

Horizon Europe: UK Participation

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 31st January 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I always stand ready to receive advice from the noble Lord about how we can meaningfully enter into negotiations with someone who does not want to meaningfully enter into negotiations with us. Obviously, the Labour Opposition know better than we do on this.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, does my noble friend not think that the Government might be more successful in delivering what everyone wants if the Opposition do not keep taking the side of the EU, which is responsible for this?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

My noble friend gets the Opposition riled more than I do sometimes. Criticism of the EU is almost blasphemy in some parts of this House, but the reality is this is the fault of the EU. We stand ready to continue the negotiations and to associate as soon as the EU is prepared to talk to us about it.

Electric Vehicle Battery Production

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 23rd January 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I think we acted appropriately. We agreed a grants award with this company, and we very much hoped that that project could be taken forward. It was a substantial amount of grant aid, but appropriate due diligence was done. The company produced a business plan and we set out an agreed series of milestones that it needed to meet, including securing the necessary private investment, before the public funds could be released. Unfortunately, it did not manage to achieve that. As I said in response to the noble Lord, Lord Lennie, noble Lords would have criticised me if we had released the funds and the company had then gone into administration.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

Jaguar Land Rover and Mini are iconic examples of British culture and manufacturing. How can the Minister be satisfied with new Jaguar Land Rovers only being supplied with one key because the company does not have chips, and with electric Minis being made in China? Surely this cannot be right, and the Government need to get a grip on this.

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I know that my noble friend has personal experience of problems with his keys, and I hope they are resolved. That is not intended as an obscure comment—his is a genuine complaint, and I know it will be resolved. Of course, it is always regrettable if manufacturing is outsourced overseas, but the UK car industry has been successful in the past, and we have one of the biggest car industries in Europe. A massive programme of transformation is required in the industry as we move towards more electric vehicles, but I am sure that the industry will rise to the challenge.

Renewable Energy: Generation Licences

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 13th December 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I thank the noble Baroness for that, which is totally unrelated to the Question she tabled. There have been almost 1,000 generation licences issued. It is a demand-driven process. All generators below 50 megawatts are exempt from having a licence in the first place.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, could my noble friend the Minister indicate what has happened in recent days, as temperatures have fallen so low and there being no wind, to the cost of electricity as a result?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

My noble friend makes an important point. I suspect that he knows the answer to his own question: because it has been relatively still, there have been relatively small amounts of wind in the power sector, so the other sources of power—nuclear, imports, gas, et cetera—have moved in to fill the gap. That is how a diverse system should work.

Employment Policies

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 6th December 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I thank the noble Lord for his question. It is slightly unrelated to the point under discussion, but I would be happy to get back to him in writing.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, could my noble friend tell me whether it is consistent with the International Labour Organization’s declaration on fundamental principles and rights of work to have Ministers in this House one-third of whom are unpaid?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

The ingenuity of my noble friend in seeking to ask his questions knows no bounds. As far as I am aware, Ministers do not have employment contracts. We serve at the behest of the Prime Minister and sovereign, and I am sure that most Ministers are happy to continue doing so.

Newport Wafer Fab

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 22nd November 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

As was printed in it, the final order was based on the technology and know-how that could result from a potential reintroduction of compound semiconductor activities at the Newport site. The noble Lord has read the final order. As I said in a previous answer, this has no implication for any other policies. Every one of these transactions is looked at on national security grounds in the context of the legislation that was passed giving quasi-judicial power to the Secretary of State. It has no implication for any other sectors of the economy. Every transaction is looked at on an individual basis.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, I bought a new Land Rover in July, and I am still waiting for a second key because of the shortage of chips. Given the Chinese aggression towards Taiwan, and given its dependency, surely this decision is to be welcomed. We should aim for a degree of self-sufficiency, as far as is possible, in the production of chips, given our determination to be a country which is secure against totalitarian states and their aggression.

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I am sorry to hear about my noble friend’s Land Rover key; I hope it is restored to him as quickly as possible. We have a very active semi- conductor manufacturing and research and development facility in this country. We have over 100 companies actively working with compound semiconductor devices. Around 5,000 UK companies, 90% of which are SMEs, are designing and making electronics components devices, systems and products. The Chancellor announced an increase in funding in this area. The south Wales cluster is particularly important. We are spending hundreds of millions of pounds promoting it. We are very proud of it. This has no implications beyond that specific transaction, which was considered on national security grounds under the legislation, as the Secretary of State is required to do.

Prepayment Meters: Pricing

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 11th October 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I refer the noble Baroness to the Answer I gave earlier: using a prepayment meter is not the most expensive way, and many customers choose to do it for their convenience. The licensing conditions for Ofgem reflect the cost of serving different groups of customers. Of course, we keep these matters under review, but if we equalised it, then those paying by direct debit—often those who are fuel poor as well; there is a higher percentage of customers on that level —would end up paying more. There are no easy answers to this.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, does my noble friend not accept that it is all very well talking about those people paying on direct debit, but we are talking about people who, if they have a bank account, are probably overdrawn and are certainly not in a position to do so? I pay by direct debit, but I do not understand why my standing charges, which are a major part of the costs, are going up as well as the energy costs. At a time when the Government are giving huge support to consumers and therefore to the utilities themselves, which would otherwise be facing severe financial difficulty, do we not have a bit of leverage and can we not speak up for those people struggling to pay those bills?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

We are helping those struggling to pay bills; I refer the noble Lord to the massive programme of support that we have put in place. These charges are set by Ofgem. I am aware that the standing charge is a controversial subject, but that reflects the network costs and other costs that every customer has to bear in addition to the unit costs of gas and electricity.

Economy: The Growth Plan 2022

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 10th October 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I will certainly look at doing that but, as I said, we are preparing for the legislation. There is furious drafting going on at the moment. It will be in the House shortly. I think noble Lords will find that it addresses some of the points they are raising, but I would be happy to look at holding a seminar as well if they would find that helpful.

Once again I can only agree, as I normally do, with my noble friend Lord Forsyth’s words; what a great Budget Statement it was. He rightly noted, for instance, that investment comes from retained profits after tax. The noble Lord, Lord Bilimoria, for his part, agreed that it is absolutely right to target growth. My noble friend Lord Lamont said that going for growth is a laudable objective. My noble friend Lord Lilley said simply that growth is crucial. All were correct. I cannot agree with everything that the noble Baroness, Lady Wheatcroft, said—I do not normally agree with her very much—but she was right to say that, on growth, the problem has been about delivering.

My noble friend Lord Frost observed that the Government’s opponents think that the right way forward is more of the same, while our belief is that we have to do things differently. The measures in the growth plan represent an ambitious first step towards getting to the 2.5% target through removing barriers to the flow of private capital, supporting skilled employment, accelerating infrastructure construction, getting the housing market moving and cutting red tape for businesses. Historical experience suggests that 2.5% GDP growth is ambitious but achievable given the growth that the UK has observed in the past.

Independent economic forecasters have estimated that the energy package could reduce the headline rate of inflation by around 5% by freezing energy bills. As always, the Chancellor is of course working closely with the Governor of the Bank of England to tackle inflation and closely co-ordinate support for the economy. While more government borrowing is required in the short term to tackle high energy prices, the Chancellor is committed to seeing government debt fall over the medium term. The independence of the Bank of England is sacrosanct and the Government have reconfirmed their commitment to the monetary policy remit. The Government have full confidence in the Bank of England to take action to get inflation back to target.

The right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Durham and the noble Baroness, Lady Brinton, used the phrase “trickle-down economics” as if it is somehow official government policy. I am afraid that, as my noble friend Lord Hannan said, this phrase is a fantasy of extremely fertile left-wing imagination. We have no such policy, as my noble friend Lord Bethell said. No Minister has ever used that phrase. I cannot be clearer: it is fantasy.

The noble Baronesses, Lady Smith of Basildon, Lady Bowles of Berkhamsted and Lady Fox of Buckley, discussed the perceived market reaction to the Government’s decisions. Of course I cannot get into commenting on specific financial market movements. They are determined by a wide range of international and domestic factors. We recognise that there has been some market volatility, which is to be expected as financial markets adjust to policy decisions. The Government do not have a preferred price or yield for assets in financial markets; the price is set by that market. I note, however, my noble friend Lord Lilley’s astute observation that sterling has recovered against the US dollar.

On corporation tax—again, this was mentioned by the noble Baroness, Lady Smith of Basildon—the Government have prioritised cancelling the corporation tax rise and announcing the permanent level of the annual investment allowance to support businesses and increase the productive capacity of the economy. Importantly, the decision on corporation tax is not a cut: it is not proceeding with a previously announced increase.

Meanwhile, the income tax rate cut is being brought forward to April 2023 instead of 2024. This is the first cut to the basic rate in 15 years, supporting over 30 million taxpayers to keep more of their own income. Taxpayers in England, Wales and Northern Ireland will all gain around £170 on average.

The noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, made the point that freezing the personal allowance is bad for low-income households.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

I apologise for interrupting my noble friend the Minister at this late hour. Can he explain why, as a result of the cut in the basic rate of income tax, it is necessary to send money to Scotland to compensate them for English taxpayers paying less?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

My noble friend is tempting me down a difficult road with the Barnett formula. I am sure that he will allow his point to stand, but I will not get into an argument about it at this late stage.

The Government equalised the primary threshold and the lower profits limit, the point at which employees and the self-employed respectively start paying class 1 and class 4 NICs, with the personal allowance at £12,570 from July 2022. This was the largest ever increase to a personal tax starting threshold, with an almost 30% increase. About 2.2 million working people have been taken out of paying NICs altogether, on top of the 6.1 million who already do not pay NICs.

The right reverend Prelates the Bishop of Durham and the Bishop of Derby both spoke on the importance of benefits, and I know that the House had a discussion on this earlier today. The next annual review of government-provided benefits is due to commence this autumn, and the Government will announce their outcome following this review.

Achieving economic growth is about a good deal more than just cutting tax, crucial though that is. The Government have announced a series of complementary steps to support that growth. As my noble friend Lord Wolfson of Aspley Guise rightly noted, supply-side reforms are key, and the Chancellor made a series of announcements to achieve those reforms.

The noble Lord, Lord Davies of Brixton, asked about IR35. The Government recognise that administering the reforms places a high burden on businesses that engage contractors. The Government’s overarching priority is growth, so now is the right time to simplify the tax system and reduce those burdens, so that businesses can focus once again on core profit-making activities.

The noble Lord, Lord Hendy, questioned the Government’s plans on strike legislation, which were also mentioned by my noble friend Lord Northbrook. On this, I agree with my noble friend Lord Dobbs that the Government should be on the side of the workers trying to get to work. I confirm that the Government will indeed legislate to implement our manifesto commitment on minimum service levels. Our plans will also ensure that staff in organisations that are in active industrial disputes always have the opportunity to resolve disputes when fair and meaningful pay offers are made from employers. The measure will make it simpler to end industrial disputes over pay and ensure that trade union leaders do not have undue influence in causing disruptive strike action through rejecting fair pay offers without the consent of their members.

The noble Lord, Lord Patel, noted the importance of capital investment, particularly in research, science and innovation. The Government are committed to their target to increase R&D investment to 2.4% of GDP across the economy, which I know that the noble Lord will welcome. At the 2021 spending review, the Government committed to £20 billion by the end of the SR period, £5 billion more than in 2021-22 and the largest ever sustained uplift in public research and development spending.

The noble Lord, Lord Inglewood, asked about the business rates offer in investment zones. Investment zones could benefit from a range of time-limited tax incentives over the next 10 years, such as reliefs on business rates, stamp duty, land tax and employer national insurance contributions. Businesses in designated areas and investment zones will benefit from 100% business rates relief on newly occupied and expanded premises.

Crucially, the Government understand that growth and sustainable finances go hand in hand and that maintaining fiscal discipline will provide the confidence and stability to underpin long-term growth. As the Chancellor said last week, there is no path to higher sustainable growth without fiscal responsibility.

The noble Lord, Lord Liddle, said that he did not believe that the numbers could be made to add up. The point of the medium-term fiscal plan, three weeks from now, is to do exactly that. My noble friend Lord Lamont rightly said that fiscal responsibility is not the enemy of growth and furthermore noted that the Chancellor has the resolve and determination to face these challenges.

Given the exceptional circumstances, we moved quickly to provide significant support for households and businesses in the first days and we are acting swiftly to set out a growth plan. The Chancellor has brought forward the medium-term fiscal plan and OBR forecast date to 31 October, alongside the publication of the medium-term fiscal plan. This reflects the Chancellor’s desire to provide clarity and certainty, by setting out a plan to get debt falling and by publishing a full economic and fiscal forecast.

The core economic mission of this Government is growth. We have a plan to achieve it. The Prime Minister promised that this would be a tax-cutting Government and we are keeping that promise. Most importantly, we promised to release the enormous potential of our great country, and that is what the growth plan does and what this Government are determined to deliver.

Low-Income Families: Energy Cost Support

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 6th September 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

The noble Lord is commenting on proposals that he has not yet seen. The House will not have long to wait, and a lot of options have been worked on over the summer. As well as putting preparations in place for the Energy Bills Support Scheme, which I remind the House will be rolled out from 1 October in a series of monthly payments, other options have been prepared. The energy price rise is unprecedented, and we all know the reasons for that. The noble Lord will have to be patient and wait and see what we announce.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, does my noble friend not agree that the reason why 46% do not pay income tax is that this Government have raised their thresholds? If it was right to pay an extra £20 in universal credit during lockdown, when circumstances were bad—they are considerably worse now—should we not look to increase universal credit payments on a temporary basis?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

My noble friend makes powerful points on both the issues that he raises. Of course, we should be proud of our record in taking the lowest paid out of income tax altogether, but I am sure that the new PM will want to bear my noble friend’s words in mind.

Winter Heating Initiatives

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Thursday 7th July 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I am slightly confused by the noble Baroness’s question. Yes, of course, we are rolling out the energy bills support scheme, which is a £400 payment that will be delivered through energy bills directly to all consumers. There is a considerable package of support. I could list all the other measures if the noble Baroness had time but there is a £37 billion package of cost of living support across the economy.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, could my noble friend help me? Surely the easiest way to help people faced with large energy bills is to remove the tax from them and cut the 5% rate of VAT?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

Of course, the rate of VAT has already been reduced on some energy-efficiency measures, but my noble friend makes a good point and I will be sure to convey it to the Treasury.

Post Office: Horizon Compensation

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Thursday 30th June 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

Officials and, I am sure, Ministers are keen to learn the lessons, but the inquiry is the best place to fully go into all these matters, which took place over decades, as I said. It will get to the bottom of this and the appropriate individuals will be held responsible.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, I congratulate my noble friend on the brilliant job he has done on this, but can he help me on the question of Fujitsu? We do not need a public inquiry to tell us that the software was deficient; we have reports of whistleblowers saying that they knew it was. So why is the taxpayer having to pick up the bill for this, and why is Fujitsu not being forced to pay up? If it is not prepared to do so, why on earth are we allowing it to do any work for any Government or anyone else with whom we have influence?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

As my noble friend knows, I have considerable sympathy with his points, which, on the face of it, seem obvious. But we need to wait for the inquiry to positively establish the facts and lay them out in stark detail before considering what further steps to take.

Carers: Unpaid Leave

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 14th June 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

The noble Lord is absolutely right. Certainly, that is a good suggestion, and I shall take it back for the department to have a closer look at. It would seem like a good idea. I remind the House that we have a substantial programme of support in place—as we saw only recently in the crisis—for carers and others. Low-income households benefit from a means-tested benefit cost of living payment of £650. Those living in the same household as a disabled person for whom they care get £150. Families with a pensioner in the household benefit from a pensioner cost of living payment of £300—and that is just in the latest package of support offered by the Chancellor. So of course there are always other things that we can look at, but we are fulfilling our responsibilities to the caring community.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, if we can spend a whole day on 5 July discussing our sitting hours, could we not spend that day bringing forward a Bill that could complete all its stages instead?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

The business managers would point out that it probably takes a lot more than a day to deliver important legislation such as this, which includes going through the proper and appropriate scrutiny and procedures. My noble friend has been critical of me in the past when we have brought forward emergency legislation without the appropriate scrutiny.

Queen’s Speech

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 16th May 2022 Lords Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy (Lord Callanan) (Con)]

My Lords, as always, it has been a great pleasure to hear so many varied and valuable contributions over the last five hours and I thank everyone who has contributed to this important debate.

First, it was, of course, a great pleasure for the whole House to be able to welcome the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of St Edmundsbury and Ipswich to this House, and I congratulate him on his excellent maiden speech. The House will know that I am a great football fan, so on maiden speeches I always try to look at the football affiliations of the Member joining. Of course, Ipswich Town is where the right reverend Prelate comes from—or, rather, represents in his bishopric —but when I saw that the nickname of Ipswich Town is the Tractor Boys, I thought, maybe we will not go there on this occasion. He joins this House with much valuable experience, gained domestically and internationally, and I am glad that he is now recovered enough to speak today on the challenges that we face on the climate. To that end, I hope that his horticultural pursuits, with which he entertained the House, continue to flourish, and I agree with him that planting trees is a symbol of hope and faith in the future. We will all look forward to his contributions when the energy security Bill is brought before this House later in the Session.

Many of us have years—perhaps more years than we care to remember—of experience under our belts. We have seen many crises come and go, but these past couple of years have of course been particularly testing. The war in Ukraine has shocked us all, but, beyond the horrors it has wreaked on the poor people there, it has increased the cost of energy and food across the entire world. Many in this country have moved from worrying about living through a pandemic to worrying about the cost of simply living. But, as my noble friend set out, and to answer the question of the noble Lord, Lord McNicol, the Government’s legislative agenda for the coming year will aim to meet many of these challenges head-on.

The Government of course know that the rising cost of living is making life harder for people. We know that people are worried, and we do not seek to minimise that worry, but we do seek to alleviate as much as we can. The noble Baroness, Lady Jones, raised a number of points when she spoke on behalf of the Opposition at the beginning of this debate and I hope that, over the course of this speech, I can respond to many of those points. I start by reassuring her and other noble Lords, including my noble friend Lady Noakes, the noble Baroness, Lady Drake, and my noble friends Lord Bridges and Lord Horam, who all rightly talked about the challenges we face on the cost of living, that we stand ready to help shoulder the burden and we have already provided support worth more than £22 billion in 2022-23. We are boosting the incomes of the lowest paid and helping families with their energy costs.

As the noble Lord, Lord Wood, pointed out—I do not know whether he is in his place; I cannot see him—inflation adds another layer of concern, particularly for families. As noble Lords will know, monetary policy is of course the responsibility of the MPC of the Bank of England, but my noble friends Lord Tugendhat and Lord Forsyth spoke about the make-up of this committee and the efficacy of the 2% inflation target. I hope noble Lords will understand that separation of fiscal and monetary policy is a key feature of our economic framework, but, on the first point, appointments are made on merit following fair and open competition, and, on the second, the Chancellor has reconfirmed the 2% inflation target. The Chancellor is also taking practical action that will help households ride out this extremely stormy period. He has increased the national insurance primary threshold and the lower profits limit to £12,570. The Government have cut fuel duty and the universal credit taper rate. We have increased work allowances by £500 a year and, of course, increased the national living wage to £9.50 an hour.

The noble Lord, Lord Bilimoria, speaks with authority when he tells us about the current attitude of business and the current tax rates. However, I reassure him and my noble friend Lady Noakes that the tax plan announced at the spring Statement will allow further tax cuts in the future—conditional, of course, on fiscal sustainability and robust levels of headroom.

Equally, my noble friend Lord Bridges asked for more help for the most vulnerable in our society. I can tell him that our modelling shows that the poorest 60 % of households receive more in public spending than they contribute in tax and that households in the lowest income decile will, on average, receive more than £4 in public spending for every £1 that they pay in tax.

My noble friend Lord Altrincham asked, rightly, about bank closures. I of course recognise the importance of appropriate access to banking. However, the way that consumers interact with their banking is changing. Decisions on opening and closing branches are a commercial issue for those banks and building societies. Clearly, banks need to carefully consider the impact of planned closures on customers and ensure that those customers are treated fairly. I hope noble Lords will also agree when I say that by growing the economy and investing in the long term, and through levelling up the United Kingdom, we can help to mitigate the worst effects of the cost of living crisis.

As the noble Lord, Lord Londesborough, noted, productivity has long been a puzzle that remains unsolved. The Government recognise that vacancies are at a record high of 57% above the pre-pandemic level. However, unlike the puzzles given as Christmas gifts, this is one that we are determined to complete. That is why the Government launched the Way to Work campaign to get 500,000 jobseekers into work by the end of June 2022. We are quadrupling the scale of employer-led skills bootcamps to provide more retraining opportunities for adults in high-growth sectors. It is also why, as noted by the noble Lord, Lord Monks, we must ensure that employers play their part in improving conditions and pay to attract workers. I am of course delighted to remind the noble Lord—I know he does not like hearing this—that the UK has one of the best employment rights records in the world. It is well known that in many areas the UK goes much further than the EU on worker protections.

My noble friends Lord Colgrain and Lord Shinkwin spoke about making a more favourable environment for part-time workers, retirees and disabled people. I share their views that we cannot and will not neglect these important groups.

The noble Lords, Lord Haskel, Lord Monks, Lord Hendy and Lord Woodley, my noble friend Lord Colgrain and the noble Baroness, Lady Donaghy, all asked why there is no employment Bill. I reassure them all that as we rebuild our country after the hardships of the pandemic, the Government are committed to building a high-skilled, high-productivity and high-wage economy worthy of the people who worked so hard to get us through that pandemic. I reassure noble Lords that the Government remain committed to bringing forward legislation to deliver on their manifesto commitments on employment as soon as parliamentary time allows.

As we look towards how we grow the economy, I agree with my noble friend Lord Hunt on the importance of competitiveness within the financial services market. The sector plays a critical role in ensuring that this country remains an attractive place to do business; indeed, it helps to attract investment. I am sure that my colleagues in the Treasury will welcome his scrutiny of the Bill, and that of my friend Lady Noakes, when it eventually comes to this House.

Let us remember that this is still a country that other nations want to do business with and one which, with its spirit of enterprise and openness, still delights in attracting global investors. The noble Lord, Lord Razzall, said that Brexit has not worked. I would respond that we are still very much a country to be reckoned with and that between 2019 and 2027, the UK is forecast to see the third highest growth in the G7, behind only Canada and the United States. Our fintech community is thriving and, as my noble friend Lord Holmes noted, can continue to play its part in growing our economy. The Government have confirmed that they will provide £5 million of seed funding for the creation of new industry-led centres for finance, innovation and technology to help tackle the barriers to growth and accelerate the UK fintech sector.

The noble Lords, Lord Davies and Lord Sikka, asked about audit and corporate governance reform. The audit, reporting and governance authority—ARGA —will protect and promote the interests of investors, other users of corporate reporting and the wider public interest. The noble Lord was right to say that regulation should be proportionate, and I welcome his further engagement as we refine the legislation. I particularly enjoyed the trenchant criticism from the noble Lord, Lord Sikka, of a Bill that he has not actually seen yet. Perhaps the noble Lord should wait, as we will shortly publish the Government’s response to the White Paper consultation in which we will demonstrate our approach to many of the issues that he raised.

Let me respond in this section of my speech to the noble Lord, Lord Fox, who also asked about the economic crime Bill. I cannot give him a precise date for its introduction yet, but I assure him that work is proceeding at speedily as possible: lots of draftsmen are beavering away furiously on the Bill as we speak. On the implementation of the first Act, we are also proceeding speedily with that, and I will be contacting the noble Lord shortly, he will be delighted to know, to invite him to a meeting to discuss the 12 statutory instruments that we will shortly be introducing to implement the provisions—[Interruption.] He asked the question and I am responding to it. Other noble Lords also took an interest in that, so, as I promised during the passage of the Bill, I will want to involve them in the discussion, because we want the register of overseas entities, in particular, to be implemented as quickly as possible.

On the subject of energy, we can all be proud of the way that this country has stepped up to support our friends in Ukraine: from sending packages of military aid for generators for hospitals to opening homes up for refugees, we the British people have shown that we will not abandon our allies during their darkest hours. Like many in this House, I am sure, it makes me so proud to see those brave Ukrainian soldiers saying “God save the Queen” as they launch more UK-supplied missiles at Russian tanks.

My noble friends Lord Howell and Lady McIntosh spoke about the impact of the crisis in Ukraine on oil and gas supply, and we continue to divest ourselves of Russian oil and gas. The Government are clear that we will not be the financial backers of Putin’s war crimes. Indeed, this crisis has highlighted the need for a secure British energy supply, one that is not disrupted by war or influenced by rocketing global prices. Ultimately, we want lower energy prices so that hard-working people do not worry about the basic right of a warm home. A bold drive to create energy for the UK in the UK was outlined in our recent British Energy Security Strategy. I am glad that the noble Lord, Lord Haworth, with his long-standing interest in this area, supports it. We will supercharge our renewables, knowing that the hostile actors I referred to cannot control the offshore winds of the North Sea or stop the sun from shining occasionally in Kent and Wiltshire, where some of our biggest solar farms have been built.

Following on from that, the noble Lord, Lord Haworth, and my noble friends Lord Bourne, Lord Moynihan and Lord Wakeham also rightly spoke about nuclear. As we decarbonise and look for a steady load of clean electricity to complement our renewables mix, the size and importance of the nuclear sector will continue to grow. We have an aim of delivering up to 24 gigawatts of nuclear power by 2050, approximately three times the level we have today. That requires reversing decades of underinvestment in this sector. The new energy security Bill strengthens and complements that strategy, and it will secure our energy needs and build a more affordable system that is fit for the future. The Bill will complement the action we are taking right now through our £9 billion package of financial support to protect consumers from the full impact of rising prices. It will also provide high-skilled jobs and help to rejuvenate our industrial heartlands up and down the country.

I turn to the amendment in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady Bennett. Of course, she will know that, although I disagree with many of the points she raised, I respect her passion and commitment to the green agenda. She will know that the Government are already taking a joined-up approach to delivering world-leading climate commitments through our net-zero strategy, the Environment Act and the environment improvement plan. Further, our 10-point plan, together with the net-zero strategy and the energy security strategy, is driving an unprecedented £100 billion-worth of private sector investment by 2030 into new British industries, including offshore wind, and supporting about 480,000 clean green jobs by the end of the decade.

Having said that, our oil and gas sector is still important to the UK and continues to keep us warm and strengthen our security of supply. Maximising economic recovery and oil and gas need not be in conflict with the transition to net zero: they can and should be fully integrated. The North Sea Transition Authority has therefore integrated expressly into its strategy where industry can assist the Government in meeting our net-zero target.

The noble Baroness, Lady Bennett, also spoke about the rights of way Act, which I must say we have no plans to change. Easy access to the beauty and restorative nature of the countryside is so important for people’s health and well-being. That is why we have created and restored some 360,000 football fields-worth of habitat since 2010.

Many noble Lords, including the noble Baroness, Lady Kramer, the noble Lords, Lord Wood and Lord Low, and my noble friends Lord Howell and Lord Bourne, raised the topical subject of a windfall tax on oil and gas companies. The noble Lord, Lord McNicol, also raised it, as he should do as an Opposition Front-Bencher. I understand, as we see these energy companies report record profits just as ordinary people start to dread opening their latest bills, that the call is getting louder. However, noble Lords will know that the Government already place additional taxes on those companies which extract from the continental shelf. Indeed, their tax rates are double those paid by other businesses.

In response to the question posed by my noble friend Lord Forsyth, according to HMRC tax receipts and national insurance contributions for the UK statistical table, net offshore tax receipts from oil and gas production were approximately £1.4 billion in 2021-22. However, as always, the Chancellor and Government keep all taxes under review and the Business Secretary has made it clear that these companies must reinvest in the UK and in renewables.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

I hesitate to interrupt my noble friend, but I asked my noble friend Lady Penn how much the Government were getting in additional receipts as a result of the increase in the cost of oil, petrol and so on. Some £1.4 billion is a small fraction of that; it ought to release resources which were otherwise not there and could be used, for example, to deal with universal credit.

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

Of course there will be other increases in the likes of VAT and other taxes, which are estimated by the OBR. I will certainly speak to the Treasury and ask whether we can give my noble friend a more complete number. However, as I said, the Government keep all these taxes under review. We made it clear that companies must reinvest in the UK. In fact, Shell and BP are already investing hundreds of millions into our economy, including carbon capture infrastructure in the Humber and on Teesside.

But it is not just about energy production. Many noble Lords, including the noble Baronesses, Lady Jones, Lady Parminter and Lady Hayman, the noble Lords, Lord Teverson and Lord Birt, and my noble friends Lord Bourne and Lord Moynihan, talked about the important subject of energy efficiency. Huge progress is already being made in the energy efficiency of UK homes. In 2008, 9% had an energy performance certificate, or EPC, of C or above; today, the figure is 46%. We are already investing more than £6.6 billion over this Parliament to improve energy efficiency, much of it targeted at the poorest in our society. This includes a £1.1 billion home upgrade grant and the energy company obligation scheme, which has been extended from 2022 to 2026, boosting its value from £640 million to £1 billion per year.

Furthermore, the noble Lord, Lord Teverson, and my noble friend Lord Bourne rightly spoke about the importance of reducing energy demand. We are scaling up our consumer advice and information service to help households understand how to reduce their energy demand effectively and what longer-term actions they may need to take as part of the transition to net zero. Noble Lords also asked me about protecting those 4 million consumers on pre-payment meters. Not only were special measures put in place in March 2020 but customers are also protected by the price cap.

To move from the local to the global, my noble friend Lord Howell called on the country to stand up to OPEC. He will be pleased to know that we are in fact working with partners across the G7, the IEA, OPEC+ and other oil-producing countries to press for measures to stabilise oil prices, and with the IEA and our allies on strategic oil reserve releases. However, the current—

Newport Wafer Fab

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Thursday 7th April 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I can confirm that the review is taking place.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, what does my noble friend make of the remarks by the adviser to the Board of Trade, Tony Abbott, that the sale of Newport Wafer Fab would not go ahead were it happening in Australia? What discussions have been had with him, and with our allies in the Five Eyes network?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

What would happen in Australia is a matter for the Australian Government. Tony Abbott is a member of the Board of Trade, and of course we value his insight and opinions, but this is a quasi-judicial decision that will be taken in the interests of the United Kingdom by the Business Secretary.

Employment Bill

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 6th April 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

The BEIS Secretary of State has formally commissioned the Insolvency Service to urgently undertake a thorough inquiry into the circumstances surrounding the recent redundancies made by P&O Ferries that the noble Lord referred to. We will not hesitate to take further action if we find evidence of wrongdoing. He will know that the Secretary of State for Transport has also committed to applying the national minimum wage to seafarers.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, has my noble friend noticed the catastrophic reduction in the number of self-employed people in this country following the implementation of IR35? What has happened to out manifesto commitment that we would implement the recommendations of the Taylor report, which would have provided an opportunity for us to have an employment situation that would encourage the kind of high-tech investment and growth that the Government say they want?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I certainly know the problems that my noble friend is identifying with IR35 and will communicate them to HMRC and the Treasury.

Behaviour Change for Net Zero

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Thursday 31st March 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I thank the most reverend Primate for his question, and it is a pleasure to see so many of his colleagues in the gallery with us this morning. Achieving our net-zero targets will be a shared endeavour, requiring action from everyone in society. I very much welcome the 2030 net-zero target set by the Church, and I am following the Church’s consultation on its net-zero road map with interest. It mirrors our net-zero strategy, which delivers a comprehensive set of measures to support and capitalise on the UK’s transition to net zero by 2050. I would be very happy to meet with the most reverend Primate to discuss how we can build on that excellent work and how we can work together to enable our green future.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, does the Minister accept that everything has changed as a result of the war in Ukraine and the huge increase in the cost of fossil fuels? Given our dependence on fossil fuels as we move away from them in the longer term, are not the Government to be congratulated on allowing further development of North Sea interests in order to enable security of supply and, most importantly of all, to protect the poorest people in this country so that they are actually able to meet their bills?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

My noble friend makes a very important point. The Ukraine crisis has changed everything. What the crisis in the use of fossil fuels demonstrates is the need—ultimately, in the longer term—to use less of them and to move towards more renewable power, which I know my noble friend supports. However, in the meantime, for the transition, we will still need oil and gas, and my contention is that it is much better to achieve those supplies from our own domestic production, which is secure, pays UK taxes and employs UK workers.

Russian Oil and Gas Imports

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 7th March 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what plans they have (1) to impose sanctions on the import of gas and oil from Russia, and (2) to encourage (a) coal-fired power generation, and (b) investment in (i) shale gas fracking, and (ii) offshore energy sources.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy (Lord Callanan) (Con)]

My Lords, we have imposed the most severe package of sanctions that Russia has ever seen. Although there is currently no ban on Russian oil and gas imports, this is under urgent review. However, the UK is in no way dependent on Russian gas. In 2021, it made up less than 4% of our supply. Most of our gas came from domestic production and reliable suppliers such as Norway. To boost energy security, we need to generate more domestic renewable power.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, although we all want a cleaner, greener future, surely we have a duty to put the maximum pressure on President Putin when the situation in Ukraine is beyond grim. Should we not therefore develop our own resources—in the North Sea, through fracking and through nuclear power—to guarantee security of supply, which surely must be the first duty of any Government?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I agree with a number of the points my noble friend made. Of course we should put the maximum pressure on Putin because of his appalling actions, and continue to invest in the North Sea for our domestic production. We should also continue to invest in nuclear power and renewables. One point I differ with him on slightly is fracking, which I am afraid does not offer the silver bullet many people think it does.

Economic Crime: Planned Government Bill

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 31st January 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I am afraid that it is necessary for primary legislation to enact the reforms of Companies House. This is an area for which I am responsible, and I work closely with Companies House on it. I get a steady flow of complaints from noble Lords and from Members of Parliament about abuses of the Companies House register. There is a certain amount that we can do with the funding that I announced in terms of reforms, but the primary reforms require primary legislation.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, will this Bill perhaps offer a remedy to ensure that when political parties have had donations from criminals who are fugitives from justice—such as Mr Michael Brown, who made a substantial donation to the Liberal Party—that money will be returned?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I thank my noble friend for that question. As he was straying on to the issue of party-political donations, I noticed groans from the Liberal Democrat Benches. I think that is evidence that they can dish it out but are not so keen on taking it.

National Living Wage

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 17th January 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I know the noble Baroness feels passionately about this and, as I said in response to earlier questions, I think the whole House is united in wanting to see increases in the minimum wage and the living wage as much as possible. However, it benefits nobody if it drives people into unemployment and further poverty. We want to see increases in the national minimum wage, but we want to see them on a sustainable basis.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, listening to these questions, is my noble friend satisfied that the Bank of England is correct in assuming that inflation is going to be a transient phenomenon? Was it not a mistake that it continued with its programme of QE even when the economy was growing rapidly? If people push for wage increases, that is how inflation takes off, and it will be very difficult for the Bank of England to control it.

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

My noble friend also makes an important point. Inflation has a pernicious impact on the economy and, of course, it impacts most on the lowest paid. I am sure the Bank of England wants to take all these factors into account. I will not stand here and give it advice on this matter, but it is important that we take account of inflation in calculating the minimum wage, and that is exactly what the Low Pay Commission does.

Post Office Update

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 24th May 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con) [V]]

My Lords, I congratulate the Government on extending the remit of the inquiry, but I am afraid my sympathies are with my noble friend Lord Arbuthnot. I do not understand why all those affected cannot be compensated, nor why we are not asking Fujitsu to stump up. Has my noble friend seen the report in Computer Weekly of 19 February, in which a developer said that

“senior managers at Fujitsu were aware that an important element of the Horizon system did not function correctly and could not be fixed”

and that, when this product was launched,

“no design documents, no test documents, no peer reviews, no code reviews, no coding standards”

were issued?

Surely these people are victims of gross incompetence, both on the part of the Post Office and by a corporate organisation which is still working for the Government. Why it it not being properly held to account and stumping up, instead of relying on the taxpayer?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

We are actively discussing the next steps with the Post Office, including the best process for ensuring that fair and swift compensation is provided. As I said, it will be for the Post Office to determine the next steps but, as I have said repeatedly, we want this to be done as quickly as possible. Regarding Fujitsu, I have considerable sympathy for the points the noble Lord made, but compensation from Fujitsu is a contractual matter between the Post Office and Fujitsu. I hope all options are being examined. It is for the Post Office to lead on the compensation process, but I assure my noble friend that Ministers are closely following this process.

Post Office Court of Appeal Judgment

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 28th April 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

As I said in previous answers, we are keen to see that all postmasters whose convictions are overturned are fairly compensated as quickly as possible, and we will work with the Post Office towards this goal. On the noble Lord’s comments about the inquiry, the problem with a full statutory inquiry is that it could take many years to report. The current inquiry is going well; everyone is co-operating and we should be able to get a report in the summer. I think it is better for all concerned that we have the report, so that we learn the lessons that have to be learned as quickly as possible, rather than waiting years—but, as I say, we are not ruling anything out. If there is any lack of co-operation that we need to address, we will not hesitate to go further.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con) [V]]

My Lords, given that people have lost their livelihoods, liberty and even lives as a result of the incompetence and bureaucratic bullying, does my noble friend really think it is enough, after 20 years of injustice, for the Post Office to apologise for historical failings and recruit two NEDs, and for the Government to compliment the victims on their tenacity and offer the cliché that lessons will be learned? Why has no one been held to account and why, as the noble Lord, Lord Harris, just asked, is Fujitsu, the producer of the dodgy Horizon software, not paying for the damage it caused and repeatedly denied? Will my noble friend return to the question asked by my noble friend Lord Arbuthnot, who has done so much in this area, about why the 550 people are not to be included? As for the argument that there was an agreement signed—it was an agreement signed before people knew of the scandal of the way the Post Office was behaving.

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I totally agree with the noble Lord that, of course, words are never enough, and we are keen to see that those whose convictions were overturned are fairly compensated. I cannot make any commitments on funding at this stage; it is for the Post Office to engage with the appellants in the first instance as to how compensation can be paid as quickly as possible. The inquiry is doing its work, we will see the report in the summer when it is produced and we will learn all the appropriate lessons.

Industrial Strategy: Local Growth

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 26th April 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

The noble Lord makes a good point. The £62 million social housing decarbonisation fund demonstrator is currently delivering 19 projects across England and Scotland. In the autumn 2020 spending review we committed a further £60 million towards funding the main elements of the social housing decarbonisation fund to ensure some early progress and, of course, we are still committed to the manifesto commitment of £3.8 billion for the funding total.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con) [V]]

My Lords, the report by the Industrial Strategy Council, which was appointed by the Government and consists of a number of distinguished businesspeople, points out that, whether it is called an industrial strategy or a plan for growth, the basic premise is the same: a programme of supply-side policies to drive prosperity in and across the economy. Does my noble friend agree, and, if so, what are those supply-side policies?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

In the new plan for growth that the noble Lord refers to, we have decided that the Industrial Strategy Council in its current form will no longer be needed to monitor and evaluate the impact of the industrial strategy. The Prime Minister and the Chancellor have convened a build back better business council to act as a sounding board and to provide help, advice and support on the way forward.

Global Navigation Satellite System

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 10th March 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I thank the noble Lord for his question. We have always been clear that the possible provision of PNT services was not the rationale for our investment in OneWeb. The programme is analysing a number of ideas for concepts in low earth orbit, and OneWeb is of course one of the many companies that are contributing to that.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con) [V]]

My Lords, could my noble friend help me and explain why an independent space-based positioning, navigation and timing system is necessary, whether it is affordable and whether the investment in OneWeb is a practical and cost-effective means of delivering it?

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

I answered the point about OneWeb in the previous answer. That is not the rationale for our purchase of OneWeb. PNT services from space underpin all 13 critical national infrastructure sectors, including national security, defence and transport. They are an important component of future technologies such as autonomous vehicles, smart cities and so on, so it is essential that we have our own autonomous capability.

Covid-19: Business Interruption Loans

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 22nd April 2020 Lords Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy (Lord Callanan) (Con)]

My Lords, we are constantly reviewing the Coronavirus Business Interruption Loan Scheme to make sure that businesses can access loans quickly and easily. This includes looking at what other countries are doing in order to inform our own scheme’s design. Changes that we have made to eligibility tests mean that even more UK businesses are able to apply to the CBILS and we are working with the British Business Bank and lenders to ensure that we are doing what we can to speed up lending. As of 15 April, 6,020 loans, worth a total of £1.1 billion, have been given out to SMEs. We expect to see this increase substantially when weekly figures are published tomorrow.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, I draw attention to my interests in the register. Given that there are more than 5 million SMEs in this country and fewer than 1% have formal applications being considered or approved under the Coronavirus Business Interruption Loan Scheme, amounting to just over £2 billion, how many businesses do the Government expect to fail as a result of the lockdown? Given the Chancellor’s promise to “do whatever it takes” to see the UK through this crisis, why is he rejecting the advice from the Governor of the Bank of England, the Bank’s chief economist, three former Chancellors, a former Bank governor and experienced bankers to re-engineer the CBILS to provide a 100% guarantee to ensure the speedy and efficient transfer of cash to desperate businesses?

[Lord Callanan]

I thank my noble friend for his question. Of course, the issue of 100% guarantees has been raised by a number of other contributors. It is something that we are keeping under review. However, we think that the structure of the scheme at the moment is appropriate to its function. We do not believe that it is right to put all the cost of these loans directly on to taxpayers. Banks should have some involvement in those loans. As I say, we are keeping the scheme under review.

Climate Change: COP 26 Arrangements

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Thursday 12th March 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

I think it demonstrates the importance with which we see the subject that a number of different Ministers are responsible and are involved in working towards policy to this end. The noble Lord can be reassured that my right honourable friend the Secretary of State is fully committed to making COP a success. We do not underestimate the challenge that this involves; it is going to be a huge gathering, requiring immense amounts of logistical and operational planning. We are committed to doing that. My right honourable friend the Secretary of State is working hard to deliver that, and we are talking to the Scottish Government about it.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, could my noble friend ensure that one of the things on the agenda for this climate change conference in Glasgow, which is so important, is whether it is sustainable to have an independent Scotland based on an economy which relies on an oil price of $100 a barrel?

[Lord Callanan]

What I like about my noble friend is that he is always tenacious in getting his subjects on to the agenda. Perhaps in this instance it would be best if I did not comment directly on the substance of his question.

Brexit: Preparations

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 8th October 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, I congratulate the civil servants and officials responsible for this document. Listening to the speeches from the Opposition Front Benches, it is perfectly obvious that they have not read it. It is very helpful indeed. The only criticism I make of the Government is that they did not give us very long to read it, but I have read it. On page 46, for example, it makes it absolutely clear that pet owners will still be able to travel to Europe with their pets after Brexit. They may need to take additional steps to prepare but it explains what these are. The opposition parties are scaremongering and making the same speeches. They have demanded to know what would happen if we left, but when a document is produced all we get are the same tired old arguments that we have heard over and again. I congratulate my noble friend and his officials on the fantastic piece of work that has been done in this document.

[Lord Callanan]

I thank my noble friend for his comments and join him in congratulating all the officials across government who are working on no-deal preparations. We have some excellent civil servants who are putting in a great deal of work to make sure that the country is prepared to honour the democratic decision the British people took to leave the European Union.

Brexit: Divergence from EU Standards

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Thursday 3rd October 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

There are already checks, of course, because Ireland is a single epidemiological unit. Therefore, there are already checks in the Irish Sea on live animal exports, et cetera. If these proposals are accepted—we will see how the negotiations go—there will need to be a small increase in the number of checks done.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

Does not my noble friend think that, had we been able to make our own regulations in respect of emissions standards, we might have avoided the appalling scandal related to diesel engines and the great distress that it has caused to many of our citizens who have diesel cars?

[Lord Callanan]

My noble friend makes a good point. It is a matter of national self-confidence: we should be able to determine these things for ourselves. I really do not see why that is such a difficult concept for the Opposition to grasp.

Brexit: Parliamentary Processes

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Thursday 3rd October 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

The great thing about this proposal is that it has attracted support from across the sector, including, I am delighted to say, from a number of Labour MPs who take quite a constructive approach to wanting to deliver on the referendum result. It looks as though we have a majority assembled for this provision, but we still have a lot of hard negotiating to do. We will endeavour to bring back a proposal that will enjoy widespread support across all communities and all parties.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

Does the Minister agree that there is an irony in this Question, which calls on the Prime Minister to comply with the provisions of the European Union (Withdrawal) (No.2) Act? Section 1(4) of that Act says that we should apply for an extension,

“in order to debate and pass a Bill to implement the agreement between the United Kingdom and the European Union under Article 50(2)”,

requiring the Prime Minister to give an undertaking that he can pass an agreement which has been consistently rejected by the House of Commons because of Labour going through particular Division Lobbies.

[Lord Callanan]

My noble friend makes a sensible point. It appears to many of us that this Bill was designed to try to undermine the UK’s negotiating position. It was interesting that we had six hours of debate on EU withdrawal yesterday and nobody—either from the Labour Front Bench, where we had two speakers, or the numerous speakers from the Labour Back Bench—but nobody had anything to say on Labour’s position on this, because, of course, its position is ridiculous. Its position is that it wants to go to the European Union, negotiate a new deal, come back and then vote against it. What a shabby Opposition they have become.

European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018 (Exit Day) (Amendment) Regulations 2019

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 27th March 2019 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Department for Exiting the European Union (Lord Callanan) (Con)]

My Lords, first, I express my gratitude to the House for agreeing to suspend Standing Order 72 so that we can debate this statutory instrument today. I am also thankful to the Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee for its report, produced yesterday. In addition, I express special thanks to the other excellent committee, the JCSI, which met only this afternoon but has very helpfully released its view on the instrument and has not found any reason to draw it to the special attention of the House.

There was an important discussion yesterday about why the Government had asked the House to agree to take the debate without having a guaranteed report from the JCSI. Taking that decision was, in my view, the right thing to do and we should all be grateful to the JCSI for being prepared to do its work so quickly and thoroughly. I am sure that that has been of great assistance to the House.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

I am most grateful to my noble friend but, given that this has happened, surely it was not necessary to suspend our Standing Order.

[Lord Callanan]

Maybe not, but we did not know when the committee would be considering the report. It made special arrangements to sit—but I take my noble friend’s point.

Although the Motion approved by the other place on 14 March to seek an extension is not legally binding, the Government made it clear in that debate that we would seek an extension if that was what the House voted for. The other place then voted to approve a Motion to seek to extend the Article 50 period. An extension has therefore been agreed with the EU and the Government are now committed to implementing that extension in domestic law.

This is a vitally important instrument with a simple but crucial purpose. It will make sure that our domestic statute book reflects the extension of Article 50 that was agreed with the EU on Friday 22 March. As the House will be aware, the decision adopted by the European Council and agreed to by the UK provides for two possible durations. Should the other place approve the negotiated withdrawal agreement this week, the extension will last until 22 May. If it does not approve the withdrawal agreement this week, the extension will last until 12 April.

These regulations, laid under the European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018, therefore cater for an extension in either scenario by redefining exit day to ensure that the day and time specified in that definition is 11 pm on 22 May or 11 pm on 12 April, depending on whether the other place approves the withdrawal agreement.

I note of course that the noble Baroness, Lady Hayter, has tabled an amendment to today’s Motion which I am sure she will speak to in a moment. As ever, my noble and learned friend Lord Keen stands ready to respond to that in his closing speech.

I take this opportunity to respond directly to a question put yesterday to my noble friend the Leader of the House by the noble Lord, Lord Pannick. I assure the House that the Government have considered carefully the vires under Section 20(4) of the 2018 Act and are satisfied that they have the power to make these regulations under that section. Section 20(4) provides that regulations may be made to,

“amend the definition of ‘exit day’ … to ensure that the day and time specified in the definition are the day and time that the Treaties are to cease to apply to the United Kingdom”.

That power applies only where the day and time specified in the definition of exit day differ from that when the treaties will cease to apply.

Following agreement with the European Council last Friday, the day and time that the treaties cease to apply do now differ from that contained in the definition of exit day. However, the European Council decision identified two possible dates when the EU treaties will cease to apply. Consequently, the amendment to exit day reflects those two dates, applying the same condition, and, in doing so, ensures that the day and time specified in the definition are the day and time that the treaties cease to apply to the United Kingdom. Only one day and time will apply at any given time.

It would be contrary to a natural reading of the words in subsection (4) to suggest that the power may not be exercised in this way to reflect the conditionality in the extension agreed with the EU. I would also draw attention to paragraph 21 of Schedule 7 to the Act, which puts beyond doubt that the powers in the Act may be used to deal with supplementary matters.

The effects of the instrument will apply across the domestic statute book, so it is important that I set out the details of what it will do and why. Currently, major changes to the domestic statute book reflecting our exit from the EU are due to take effect on exit day, which is defined in the European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018 as 11 pm on 29 March 2019, despite the extension terms that have now been agreed at the international level. These changes apply across a huge number of policy areas, from emissions trading to Europol. All the changes are designed so that our statute book works when we leave the EU. However, because in many cases they amend EU regulations they are inconsistent with the situation in which we remain a member of the EU for a couple more weeks or months.

Brexit: Negotiations

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Thursday 24th January 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

Let me say to the noble Baroness that of course I can give her a reassurance that we are negotiating hard alongside Gibraltar. Gibraltar will leave the EU at the same time as the UK does. However, asking me to rule out no deal, as the Labour Party continues to do, is an impossible job. There are essentially three solutions to our current predicament: we can have a deal; we can have no deal; or we can have various forms of remain. The Labour Party tells us that it is against this deal, that it is against no deal and yet it says that it wants to respect the result of the referendum. The party really needs to decide what it is actually in favour of rather than what it is against.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, did my noble friend see the “Question Time” from Derby last Thursday and the reaction of the audience to the suggestion that we might defer Article 50? Is it not plain as a pikestaff that the entire country want an end to this, are fed up with the manoeuvring and parliamentary activity undermining our constitution and wish us to get on with doing what they voted for, which is to leave the European Union and become an independent country?

[Lord Callanan]

The noble Lord makes a powerful point, as always. I think most members of the public do want to see us just get on with it. An extension to Article 50 is not a solution; it is just deferring the date on which a decision has to be made. So, yes, we do want to get on with it and we want to leave on 29 March.

Air Pollution

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 9th January 2019 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

I know that the noble Baroness takes a close interest in this important matter. I agree that air pollution is very important. However, the answer to her question is that we are. After we have left the European Union, the same air pollution rules as before will continue to apply in the UK; that was legislated for in the European Union (Withdrawal) Act. The office for environmental protection, which we aim to set up by the end of the implementation period, will be able to enforce those same rules.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, will my noble friend confirm that one of the reasons we have a problem with air pollution is because of diesel engines, which were promoted as a result of the EU regulations, which were in turn promoted by German manufacturers, such as Volkswagen and others, which then went on to fiddle the rules for emissions standards?

Brexit: Withdrawal Agreement and Political Declaration

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 9th January 2019 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Department for Exiting the European Union (Lord Callanan) (Con)]

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Foulkes, is paying attention. Today marks the start of three days of debate examining two documents: the withdrawal agreement and the political declaration, which together form the agreed deal with the European Union. These were, of course, the subject of two days of debate before Christmas in this House, as well as three days in the other place.

In both Houses we heard many diverse views on the deal, with much positive commentary—and of course some negative commentary—on what has been agreed after two years of difficult negotiations. While the task of closing the next three days of debate falls to my noble and learned friend Lord Keen, I thought it would be appropriate, with the leave of the House, to take time in my opening remarks to address many of the points made by noble Lords before Christmas, since they did not get to benefit from a closing speech at the time.

Noble Lords examined every aspect of the deal, demonstrating the breadth and depth of their experience and expertise. While the vote on the final agreement is rightly one for the elected House, it is clear that contributions from this House will be of great value to those making their choice in the other place. One subject in particular was raised by my noble and learned friend Lord Mackay, the noble Lords, Lord McCrea and Lord Empey, and the noble and learned Lord, Lord Goldsmith, among others, and that was of course the Irish border and the backstop. At the time, I was especially struck by the powerful intervention from the noble Lord, Lord Bew. Given the concern about the backstop across both Houses, it was right that the Government took the opportunity to raise these concerns with our negotiating counterparts in the EU.

Following the December European Council, the EU published conclusions which gave the reassurance that the EU,

“stands ready to embark on preparations immediately after signature of the Withdrawal Agreement to ensure that negotiations can start as soon as possible after the UK’s withdrawal”.

As has been made clear in private meetings with the Prime Minister, this confirms that the EU, like this Government, does not want to use the backstop. I recognise that, despite all this, significant concerns remain in this House, which is why the Prime Minister set out that we would be seeking further assurances on top of those provided in the December European Council conclusions.

Over the Christmas period, the PM has been in contact with a number of her European counterparts about the further assurances that Parliament needs on the backstop. The PM has been in touch with the Taoiseach, and British and Irish government officials have also been in contact over the past week. Securing those additional reassurances that Parliament needs remains our priority, and leaders remain in contact. Leaving the EU with the deal that has been agreed is in the interests of both sides.

We recognise the concerns raised around the backstop and the unique challenges presented by Northern Ireland in our exit from the EU. That is why we have today published a paper setting out a series of commitments to Northern Ireland, in particular in any backstop scenario. These recognise the unique circumstances of Northern Ireland and the unique nature of the impact of the backstop in Northern Ireland. This seeks to address some of those concerns and reaffirm Northern Ireland’s integral place as part of the United Kingdom.

In that paper, we set out that we will ensure a strong role for the Northern Ireland Assembly ahead of any decision to bring the backstop into effect. We will provide a Stormont lock over any new areas of law being added to the backstop, giving a guarantee in law that no new areas of law can apply to Northern Ireland under the backstop without seeking the consent of the Northern Ireland Assembly. We will guarantee the unfettered access of Northern Ireland businesses to the whole of the United Kingdom market. Again, we will set that out in legislation. We will give an unequivocal commitment that that there will be no divergence in rules between the scope of the backstop between Great Britain and Northern Ireland, were it ever to come into effect.

We will set out a legal guarantee that nothing will change areas of north/south co-operation without the explicit agreement of the Executive, in line with the arrangements under strand 2 of the Belfast Agreement. We will provide a clear role for the Northern Ireland Executive in discussions between the UK and the EU under the withdrawal agreement structures that specifically affect Northern Ireland, and we will ensure a strong role for the Northern Ireland Executive and the other devolved Administrations as we move into the next phase of negotiations.

I am aware of the Motion tabled by the noble Baroness, Lady Smith of Basildon, to which I am sure she will speak in more detail shortly. My noble and learned friend Lord Keen will respond to that in closing the debate.

Over the course of this debate, we will examine two documents that represent months of complex negotiations and deliver on the result of the referendum. As noble Lords, including my noble friend Lord Tugendhat and the noble Baroness, Lady Falkner, noted before Christmas, the deal may not be perfect. It is well known that negotiations require compromise, especially when dealing with 27 other countries. As the Prime Minister has said, we must not risk making the perfect the enemy of the good.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My noble friend has made an interesting statement about Northern Ireland and the paper that has been published. Why was it not possible for the Government to publish it in advance of this debate so that we had a chance to read it and understand what was involved?

[Lord Callanan]

My noble friend makes a good point, but important negotiations have been going on on these matters and we continue to discuss these matters with our EU partners. We hope to bring further clarifications before the vote.

The withdrawal agreement and political declaration demonstrate our joint commitment to a future partnership that reflects the depth of our shared history and values. It is right, as the most reverend Primate the Archbishop of Canterbury, among others, reminded us in the first debate, that this future partnership should work in the best interests of the country and for all generations in it. This deal delivers on the result of the referendum by restoring sovereign control over our borders, laws and money. It protects jobs and the vital security co-operation with our European neighbours, and it delivers certainty for businesses and citizens. This is a deal which, if passed in the other place, will ensure that our exit is smooth and orderly, and delivers in the national interest.

This deal delivers in securing the rights of EU citizens living and working in the United Kingdom, who make such a valuable contribution to our society, economy and public services. That contribution was highlighted by noble Lords, including the noble Baronesses, Lady Miller of Chilthorne Domer and Lady Kennedy of The Shaws, and the noble Lord, Lord Cashman. This deal delivers on that commitment and secures the rights of 3.5 million EU citizens living and working in the UK and those nearly 800,000 UK nationals living and working in the EU, so that they can continue living their lives broadly as they do now.

The noble Baroness, Lady O’Neill, rightly raised the important question of Irish citizens’ rights in the UK, particularly those who may be without a passport. The Government will ensure that these rights will continue to be protected when we leave the EU, no matter what the terms of our departure.

The noble Earl, Lord Clancarty, and the noble Baroness, Lady Thornton, spoke passionately about immigration and freedom of movement. We shall introduce a skills-based immigration system, built around the talents and skills that a person has to offer, not solely on where they come from.

This deal ensures there will be an end to the billions of pounds we send to Brussels every year, allowing us to invest in our domestic priorities. It means that we will leave the common agricultural policy and the common fisheries policy. We will once again be in control of our immigration policy.

Let me turn now to the political declaration, which sets out the terms of our future relationship. The noble Lords, Lord Mendelsohn and Lord Livermore, and my noble friend Lord Howard of Rising spoke about the impact of leaving the EU on the economy.

Brexit: Negotiations

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 20th November 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

There are mechanisms to bring the backstop to an end but my noble friend is right that they would need to be mutually agreed. A joint committee has been set up and independent arbitration is foreseen within that, to which we can apply the solutions. They are set out in the agreement. I would be happy to write to my noble friend with further details but I understand the point he is making.

The Brexit discussions have been about acting in the national interest and that has necessarily involved making what we believe to be the right choices, not the easy ones. By resolving this issue, we are now able to move on to finalising the details of an ambitious future partnership. The outline political declaration we have agreed sets out the basis for these negotiations, and we will negotiate intensively ahead of the European Council this weekend to turn this into a full future framework.

Under the future relationship we will see an end to free movement. As the Prime Minister stated yesterday at the CBI conference, we will have our own new skills-based immigration system, based not on the country people come from but on what they can contribute to our United Kingdom. We have worked hard to deliver for the economy—to deliver a deal that puts jobs, livelihoods, prosperity and opportunity first. This is what Brexit should be about: getting a good deal that unlocks the opportunity of a brighter future for this country and all our people.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

I am most grateful to my noble friend. Just going back to the point about the position of Northern Ireland, given that the backstop in the agreement provides for a different regulatory regime in Northern Ireland, why is this not creating a border down the Irish Sea?

[Lord Callanan]

This is only within the backstop itself. As I said, we hope that the backstop will not be required and that we will be able to put in place future arrangements that will render the backstop unnecessary. There are some regulatory differences now between Great Britain and Northern Ireland. But it is true that under the backstop, if it comes into operation, Northern Ireland will align with many parts of the single market acquis that are necessary for the creation of a borderless Ireland.

The declaration reached common ground on services and investment, including financial services. It also ensures that we will be leaving the common agricultural policy and the common fisheries policy. The UK will become an independent coastal state once again.

We have been able to agree on key elements which will help keep our people safe. These include effective extradition arrangements, as well as mechanisms for data exchange on passenger name records, DNA, fingerprints and vehicle registration data. We have also agreed a close and flexible partnership on foreign, security and defence policy.

UK-EU Future Relationship: Young Voters

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 10th September 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

I remind the noble Lord that we have had a people’s vote already. I do not know what he thinks, but I thought that the people voted in the first referendum. David Cameron said, in 2015, that it would be the final decision: a once-in-a generation choice. To use a more personal example, I was not old enough to vote in the 1975 referendum, in which he no doubt participated. I cannot remember much about what happened then, but I might well have voted no, and I have had to live for 40 years with the decision that his generation took. That is in the nature of binary referendums: those old enough and eligible at the time participate.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, does my noble friend not think it absurd that the noble Lord should be arguing for a second referendum on our decision to leave the European Union while at the same time arguing against a second referendum on Scottish independence?

[Lord Callanan]

None of the positions that the noble Lord takes strikes me as particularly more absurd than any of his other positions.

Brexit: Preparations and Negotiations

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 23rd July 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

My right honourable friend the Secretary of State will be making an Oral Statement in another place tomorrow. I do not know whether we have an exact time for that yet.

Leaving the EU offers us an opportunity to forge a new role for ourselves in the world, to negotiate our own trade agreements and to be a positive and powerful force for free trade. Central to our proposal is a free trade area for goods, supported by a common rulebook for those rules necessary to provide frictionless trade at the border and a new facilitated customs arrangement. This will help to secure the complex supply chains and just-in-time manufacturing processes that we have developed with the EU over the past 40 years. This will give businesses certainty and clarity and preserve those jobs that rely on frictionless trade at the border.

A key component of the free trade area will be our proposal for a facilitated customs arrangement, or FCA. This is a business-friendly model that removes the need for any new routine customs checks and controls between the UK and the EU while enabling the UK to control its own tariffs and boost trade with the rest of the world. Under this arrangement, the UK would apply the EU’s tariffs to goods intended for the EU and its own tariffs and policy to goods intended for consumption here in the UK.

In contrast to the earlier proposal for a new customs partnership, the FCA will be an up-front system. This means that most businesses would pay the right tariff to begin with, rather than receiving a rebate at the point of final consumption. Other businesses could claim a tariff repayment as soon as possible in the supply chain. We will agree the circumstances in which repayments can be granted with the EU and, as the White Paper makes clear, we will negotiate a reciprocal tariff revenue formula, taking account of goods destined for the UK entering via the EU and goods destined for the EU entering via the UK. This model has the specific advantage of protecting UK-EU supply and value chains and the businesses that rely on them. For example, Airbus manufactures wings for all its civil aircraft in north Wales. These are then transported to the continent for final assembly. In Dagenham, Ford manufactures diesel power trains for export to the EU. As well as supporting businesses, this approach would meet our shared commitment to Northern Ireland and Ireland in a way that respects the EU’s autonomy without harming the UK’s constitutional and economic integrity.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

On the reciprocal nature of the FCA, is it realistic to expect 27 other countries to put in place the bureaucracy and systems necessary to execute this in order to accommodate our wish for this compromise?

[Lord Callanan]

It probably would be unrealistic, which is why we are not asking them to do that. We will agree a reciprocal tariff formula, but we will not ask our EU partners to put in place specific arrangements at their borders.

Alongside these close arrangements for goods, we will negotiate a wide-ranging deal on services and digital.

Brexit: Negotiations

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 6th June 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

As I also said, we hope there will be a deal. We are working towards a deal and negotiating in good faith, as we believe our European partners are. However, as a responsible Government, it is important that we plan for all eventualities.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, will my noble friend confirm that if indeed we are in the unfortunate position of leaving without a deal, we will not be paying the £40 billion to the EU?

[Lord Callanan]

If there is no deal then there will be no withdrawal agreement, and that bill would be included in the withdrawal agreement so the noble Lord is correct.

Brexit: British Citizens

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Thursday 29th March 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

When we have a deal, which I am confident we will get, we will come back to this House, we will put the option to both Houses and we will report back to the public, including young people.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

Should we not congratulate my noble friend on the brilliant job that he has done during Committee on the Bill, such that the opposition spokesman on foreign affairs, Mrs Emily Thornberry, said that the Opposition will probably vote for the deal when it is put before the Commons?

[Lord Callanan]

I thank my noble friend for his comments, but let us see how Report goes before we get the congratulations in too early. Yes, Emily Thornberry’s comments yesterday were interesting, as were Keir Starmer’s at the weekend when he said:

“I don’t think there is any realistic prospect of”,


Article 50 “being revoked”. On the referendum, he said:

“Having asked the electorate for a view by way of the referendum, we have to respect the result”.


I never thought I would hear myself say it, but on this occasion I agree with the Labour Party.

European Union (Withdrawal) Bill

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 19th March 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

We want a deal with the European Union. We have said that we will negotiate for the best possible deal and then we will put that to the House in a Motion. If Parliament approves it then we will bring legislation forward to implement the deal. That is what has been said many times in the other place as well.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

Does my noble friend recall that both David Cameron and the leader of the Opposition wanted to implement Article 50 within days of the referendum result? All this argument suggesting that we have somehow precipitately moved into Article 50, and that the referendum did not give a clear instruction to both the government and opposition parties, is therefore simply froth.

[Lord Callanan]

I am not sure that I would use the word “froth”, but we have had a good debate about this and I am sure we will continue to do so.

Parliament authorised our notification of withdrawal in the Article 50 Bill with a clear majority. That position was supported in the general election when we and the Labour Party both said that we would implement the results of the referendum and, in the process, obtained over 80% of the vote. The Liberal Democrats, of course, said that they would not and got 7% of the vote.

European Union (Withdrawal) Bill

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 14th March 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

I do not think I said that. The terms of Amendment 7 are fairly clear. That has been written into Clause 9 by another place, and we will respect that.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

Perhaps I was not paying enough attention, but can I ask my noble friend: if we are going to end up with primary legislation to implement the agreement, why is it necessary to have Clause 9 at all? He gave some examples of particular regulations, but I could not see the link that justified having Clause 9 itself.

[Lord Callanan]

There are some technical provisions that we may want to use Clause 9 to implement, subject to the provisions of Amendment 7. There is also the political imperative that the House of Commons considered this matter closely and decided to keep Clause 9 in the Bill, albeit modified. We want to respect the will of the House of Commons.

European Union (Withdrawal) Bill

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Committee: 6th sitting (Hansard): House of Lords
Monday 12th March 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

I take on board the sincere nature of the noble Lord’s assurances on this matter.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

Might my noble friend point out to the noble Lord that, if it is about taxation, that burden would not be placed on this Chamber anyway?

European Free Trade Association

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 27th February 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

I was not totally clear what the noble Lord was asking me there, but of course not all of the EFTA countries are in the EEA: Switzerland is not. We will clearly want to continue our relationship with the EFTA countries afterwards, as they are close friends and neighbours. After the end of the implementation period, we will of course want to continue our association with them.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, could my noble friend confirm that Donald Tusk’s words—

“Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed”—

also apply as far as we are concerned, in particular to the contribution of money to the EU?

European Union (Withdrawal) Bill

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Committee: 1st sitting (Hansard - continued): House of Lords
Wednesday 21st February 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

I do not have information about how many official meetings have taken place. I understand that officials are meeting extensively. They are in regular contact. I am told by my officials that contact with officials in the Scottish and Welsh Governments and discussions are extremely positive. That is not the same as getting political agreement, but we are endeavouring to do that. Proposals have been tabled, after extensive discussion, for the meeting tomorrow. We hope there will be agreement. I obviously cannot guarantee that, but we hope there will be. We remain committed to obtaining legislative consent Motions if possible, and we will continue that dialogue in an effort to do that. That is the responsible way to proceed, but I totally understand the frustration expressed from all parts of the Committee that we do not yet have that agreement. We want to get that agreement. We are endeavouring to get that agreement. We will do our best to get it, but we will table amendments for this Committee to consider before we get to Clause 11.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

Given the difficulties, which are understood, of getting agreement to one legislative consent Motion, can the Minister give us an assurance that whatever amendments he tables will not require us to have legislative consent to even more Motions?

[Lord Callanan]

I am not quite sure I understand that point. I do not think we can give that assurance at the moment. I will have to have a separate discussion with my noble friend on that point.

European Union (Withdrawal) Bill

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Committee: 1st sitting (Hansard): House of Lords
Wednesday 21st February 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

I am happy to clarify for the noble Lord that we remain completely committed to the Good Friday agreement.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My noble friend has been accused of not being very experienced. I point out to those Members opposite that we are in Committee but we have had three and a half hours of Second Reading speeches, not speeches on the amendments.

Brexit: EU Customs Union

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Wednesday 7th February 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

Was there a question there? I am sure that, if Mr Robbins gives any kind of update, being the good, efficient civil servant that he is, he will want to reflect government policy.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, will my noble friend confirm that when we leave the customs union we will be able to end the scandalous discrimination against developing countries and others where there are very high tariffs on food, clothing, textiles and other goods? Can he give an example of some of the high tariffs that we will be able to avoid, thus reducing the costs to British consumers?

[Lord Callanan]

I thank my noble friend for his question. He is, of course, right. Leaving the EU offers us the opportunity to have our own independent trade policy not contracted out to the European Commission. There are many opportunities that will present themselves, and eliminating some of the extremely high tariffs on agricultural products is one of them.

Brexit: Negotiations

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Tuesday 30th January 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Callanan]

I do not think that there is any discontent within DExEU. When the department was established, a number of officials were seconded from other government departments, and a number of them have returned to their original departments. But the noble Lord is right—these negotiations are complex and impact on a whole range of policy areas. Most departments in Whitehall are involved in one way or another, so of course it is important to co-ordinate that work, which is done both in DExEU and in the Cabinet Office.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, how helpful does my noble friend think it is to the British national interest to have people sniping from behind the scenes at our negotiators at this crucial time?

[Lord Callanan]

Well, the noble Lord knows that I admire greatly his contributions on these subjects, but perhaps on this occasion he is not quite correct. The normal process of parliamentary scrutiny is appropriate. We, of course, as Ministers welcome the opportunity to account to your Lordships’ House; we will be doing that extensively over the next few months and have done over the last few months. Of course, it would be nice to see a bit more support of our position sometimes. Nevertheless, most people take a responsible attitude and want to question and probe us on the process, which is absolutely correct.

Brexit: Data Transfer

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Thursday 16th November 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, does my noble friend not agree that it is high time that the Members on the Liberal Democrat Benches and others accepted the decision of the British people and joined Team UK and started arguing for the interests of our country rather than against them?

[Lord Callanan]

As usual, the noble Lord is correct. It would be nice to think that Members opposite would be in favour of getting a good deal on behalf of the UK. I assume that they are all democrats and would therefore want to respect the result of the referendum.

Queen’s Speech

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Monday 26th June 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

That an humble Address be presented to Her Majesty as follows:

“Most Gracious Sovereign—We, Your Majesty’s most dutiful and loyal subjects, the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in Parliament assembled, beg leave to thank Your Majesty for the most gracious Speech which Your Majesty has addressed to both Houses of Parliament”.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Transport (Lord Callanan) (Con)]

My Lords, it is a privilege and pleasure to open the second day of debate on Her Majesty’s most gracious Speech. I am honoured to be standing before noble Lords just three weeks after taking up my role in the new Government as a Transport Minister. This is always one of the most interesting and wide-ranging debates in the Lords calendar, so I very much look forward to the valuable and informed contributions that I know that many noble Lords will make. On behalf of the whole Chamber, I particularly extend a warm welcome to the noble Lords, Lord Colgrain and Lord Mountevans, who will be giving their maiden speeches today. I also thank my noble friend Lord Prior, who will be winding up the session this evening.

This Queen’s Speech was all about building a stronger, more successful and more resilient Britain: a country with its sights firmly set on the future and on what we can achieve as we build closer links with friends and trading partners around the world; as we deliver a Brexit deal that works for all parts of the United Kingdom; and as we grow and rebalance our economy, working to meet the aspirations of the whole nation. These themes will crop up regularly in our Queen’s Speech debate today, as we debate the Government’s agenda on economic affairs, transport, business, energy, the environment and agriculture.

Let me start with the economy. The fundamentals of the economy are strong. We have a record number of people—almost 32 million—in employment. We have reduced the deficit by almost three-quarters since 2010. After our economy grew 1.8% last year—the second highest in the G7—the Office for Budget Responsibility expects it to grow a further 2% this year.

Our economic success over the past few years has been widely documented, but what perhaps is less well appreciated is how it is benefiting the whole of our country. As the Chancellor made clear in his Mansion House speech last week, inequality is at its lowest in 30 years. The poorest households here have seen their incomes rise by more since 2010 than any other G7 country. That is partly thanks to the introduction of the national living wage, adding £1,400 to the annual income of those in full-time work on minimum salary. It will continue as we increase the national living wage, so that people on the lowest pay see their wages rise as the economy strengthens.

We have been clear that we want to keep taxes as low as possible for ordinary working people. Although we live in changing times, one thing will never change: this Government will always put economic stability first. That is why we are investing £23 billion through the national productivity investment fund in key growth areas, such as research and development and housing. It is why we are helping young people to get the training and development they need to do the high-skilled, high-paid jobs of the future. It is why we are determined to get the best possible Brexit deal for households and for UK companies.

As we leave the EU and adjust to our new position in the world, the resilience, flexibility and dynamism of our economy will be key. New Bills in the Queen’s Speech on trade and customs will help to give us an independent trade policy and a world-leading customs service. As Her Majesty’s most gracious Speech made clear, we will help British businesses sell their products and services abroad and boost exports.

Achieving our economic objectives depends on co-ordinated action across government, and I am proud that transport is playing a much bigger role today in stimulating growth. Transport used to be among the first departments to suffer whenever Governments of the day had to tighten their fiscal belts. While our competitors invested in major infrastructure projects, here in the UK, transport upgrades often fell victim to short-term political concerns. Because we have failed to invest in the long-term fabric of our nation, we have watched as our roads have grown more congested and our railways more overcrowded. But that is changing. No more is Britain seen as short-termist or infrastructure-averse. Since 2010, we have overhauled transport policy, and today we are delivering the capacity and links that we need to grow as we leave the European Union—connecting British companies with fast-growing global markets, creating the highly skilled jobs we need to modernise transport in this country and making the necessary investments to improve journeys for all working people.

Her Majesty’s most gracious Speech also showed how we are taking full advantage of the unique opportunities that new technologies provide. For example, the automated and electric vehicles Bill will help make Britain a global leader in developing and owning self-driving and electric cars. Self-driving vehicles might sound like science fiction, but they are already science fact and will revolutionise the way we travel. They will make roads safer by cutting the risk of human error and reducing insurance premiums. They will change the lives of disabled people with reduced mobility and reduce congestion by making better use of scarce road space. That is why, through this Bill, we are positioning ourselves as one of the first countries to benefit from the development and growth of self-driving vehicles.

It will also help us retain our leadership in electric vehicles. We are already one of the biggest markets for plug-in cars in Europe. So far this year, sales of pure electric cars are up by 36%, with a total of more than 100,000 ultra-low-emission vehicles now on our roads in this country. That is a ringing endorsement of the Government’s funding commitments of more than £2 billion since 2011 to increase ultra-low-emission vehicle uptake and support greener transport.

Our charging infrastructure is one of the most comprehensive in Europe, with more than 11,000 publicly accessible charging points, now including 900 rapid chargers. As the market evolves, however, this number will need to increase. The new Bill will give drivers confidence that there will be somewhere to charge their cars at motorway service areas and large fuel stations right across the country. Common standards will make them easy to use, and ensure that drivers have a wide choice of charging points. One of the main reasons the sales of electric cars are increasing is that buyers can see the charging infrastructure taking shape around them. This Bill will speed up the development of that network.

There is also a revolution happening on the railway. We are making excellent progress with HS2, Britain’s new high-speed rail network. HS2 will be the backbone of the national rail system, connecting our major cities, transforming capacity across the railway, and freeing up space for new commuter services on existing lines. HS2 is not just a new railway; it is an investment in our economic prosperity for the next half century and more. It will be a powerful catalyst for rebalancing our economy, spreading growth that for far too long has been concentrated in London and the south-east.

The new Bill announced last week will give us the powers to build and operate the next stage of the line from the West Midlands to Crewe. It is a crucial section of the project. Not only will it reduce journey times from London to Manchester and Crewe, it will speed up journeys to places such as Liverpool, Preston and Glasgow. With cross-party support and a programme that remains on time and on budget, construction of phase 1 will begin soon. We expect to deposit the new Bill covering the West Midlands to Crewe route in Parliament by the end of this year.

High-speed rail may be the biggest transport scheme of this generation. However, an even bigger revolution is taking place above us—in space. In the new economic space race, Britain is a strong competitor. The space industry Bill announced by Her Majesty last week has a clear purpose: to make Britain the most attractive place in Europe for commercial spaceflight; to put British business, engineering and science at the forefront of space technology; and to offer our world-leading, small satellite companies low-cost, reliable access to space. It will also generate opportunities for tourism.

While I am sure that most noble Lords would probably prefer two weeks on a cruise ship to floating in sub-orbital weightlessness for half an hour, there is in fact lots of demand for space tourism. The UK space industry is already worth £13.7 billion to our economy, and employs more than 38,000 people. This Bill will help us to achieve our goal to grow our share of the global space market to 10% by 2030. We want to be the first country to establish commercial spaceport operations in Europe. However, we need to move quickly to achieve our objectives. That is why this Bill is so important and we expect its First Reading to take place shortly. It will help provide the legislation required for launches and flights from UK spaceports, giving us new powers to license a wide range of commercial craft, including vertically launched rockets, space planes and satellites. Any site that meets the regulatory requirements will be able to apply to become a spaceport. We have already had strong interest from regions across Britain wanting to benefit from this exciting new market.

Finally, my department will also deliver a Bill to improve protection for holidaymakers. This will update the ATOL scheme so that it can keep pace with changes in the online travel market and UK-established companies can sell more easily across EU borders.

Her Majesty’s most gracious Speech also featured a number of important Bills and measures that the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy will be taking forward. The nuclear safeguards Bill will enable us to implement a domestic safeguards regime when we leave the EU Euratom treaty. This will allow us to meet our international obligations. We are bringing forward proposals to ensure that critical national infrastructure remains protected, so that foreign infrastructure ownership does not undermine our security or essential services.

We will strike the right balance between protecting national security and remaining a global champion of free trade. The Government also want to ensure fairer markets for consumers, so we will publish a Green Paper that will closely examine markets that are not working in the interests of consumers.

Let me be clear: we are firm believers in the market economy. It is the private sector, operating through a competitive market economy, that has delivered much of the growth that we have seen since 2010, but it is our job to make sure the system is working for the benefit of consumers. In particular, while progress has been made in recent years to improve competition in the energy retail market, it is clear that industry needs to do more. We expect energy suppliers to treat their customers in the same way as other competitive service sectors, so we will act where necessary. This will include bringing forward measures to help tackle unfair practices in the energy market so that energy bills can come down. A smart meters Bill will also help us complete the rollout of smart meters, protecting consumers and leading to £5.7 billion of net benefits to Britain. Smart meters will not just put consumers in control of their energy use, helping them to avoid wasting energy and money, they will end estimated billing and help customers to use smart pre-payment.

As I mentioned, the Queen’s Speech also confirmed the Government’s commitment to increasing the national living wage—specifically, increasing it to 60% of median earnings by 2020, then maintaining it in line with median earnings until the end of this Parliament. The Queen’s Speech also set out the Government’s intention to enhance rights and protections in the modern workplace, informed by Matthew Taylor’s review of modern employment practices.

I turn to the environment and agriculture. Agriculture contributes £8.6 billion to our economy and employs 1.5% of the workforce, so it is important that we support the industry and provide a strong foundation for future growth. The EU’s common agricultural policy, under which we have been operating for the past 44 years, has been an expensive failure. It is a system that provides financial support to millions of farmers across Europe to boost productivity, which accounts for around 40% of the total EU budget at €58 billion a year, and has been widely criticised for creating artificially high food prices throughout the European Union. Leaving the EU presents us with a great opportunity to renew our agriculture policy so that it supports farmers in a targeted and more effective way, while also achieving better value for money for hard-working taxpayers. Our vision is for a productive and competitive UK agriculture sector, supplying products of the highest standard to the domestic market and increasing exports abroad. At the same time, we will improve our environment, so that we can leave a better environment to the next generation than the one we inherited. The agriculture Bill will provide stability and certainty for the farming industry. It will enable the Government to support farmers to produce and sell more great British food, and in a more sustainable way. It will also help us deliver the same cash total fund for farm support until the end of the Parliament.

A fisheries Bill will be introduced to allow us to regain control of the UK’s exclusive economic zone and set UK fishing quotas once we have left the EU. This will provide a basis for us to secure a fairer share of the market, and greater economic benefit from our fish stocks. It will help a new generation of fishermen, as well as preserving and increasing our stocks, and it will support our coastal communities while securing the best possible deal for the UK fishing industry. We will no longer be bound by the common fisheries policy and will become an independent coastal state. But we will, of course, still meet our international obligations and co-operate with other coastal states in the management of our waters.

The gracious Speech sets out a clear direction for the future of Britain: a fairer, more prosperous and self-determining future as we leave the European Union, but also a more global future—one in which we build new relationships and trade agreements around the world, and where the talents and innovation of our own people and businesses can shine. I have set out how our legislative programme will help us meet those ambitions, and now I look forward to hearing contributions from all around your Lordships’ House.

European Union (Notification of Withdrawal) Bill

Debate between Lord Forsyth of Drumlean and Lord Callanan

Report stage (Hansard - continued): House of Lords
Tuesday 7th March 2017 Lords Chamber

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

The noble and learned Lord is normally very careful and precise. At the beginning of my speech I read out the words that David Jones used in the other House. He said: “We expect and intend” that that will happen before the European Parliament debates. This says that such approval “shall be required” before the European Parliament debates. There is a big difference between “expect and intend” and “shall be required”.

[Lord Callanan (Con)]

Does the noble Lord agree that the vote in the European Parliament will be about whether the deal that is negotiated will be acceptable, not about whether the UK actually leaves the EU or not?

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean]

My noble friend is absolutely right on that point. Subsection (3) of the proposed new clause states that:

“The prior approval of both Houses of Parliament shall … be required in relation to an agreement on the future relationship of the United Kingdom with the European Union”.


I put that point to the noble Lord, Lord Pannick, in my intervention. This effectively gives this House, and the House of Commons, a veto on Brexit. It gives it the ability to prevent us from leaving the European Union, despite the fact that we have had the biggest vote in our history from people requiring that. It would be immensely destructive to the reputation of Parliament and of this House.

Subsection (4) states that:

“The prior approval of both Houses of Parliament shall also be required in relation to any decision by the Prime Minister that the United Kingdom shall leave the European Union without an agreement as to the applicable terms”.


That means that Ministers are unable to walk away. This was the mistake that David Cameron made. If he had walked away he might have been able to get a proper deal—who knows? He did not walk away and they knew he was not going to. That is why he got such a useless deal. This ensures that Ministers cannot walk away. For the noble Lord, Lord Pannick, to suggest that the amendment is simply implementing the Prime Minister’s promise is a complete misrepresentation.