Lower Thames Crossing: Development Consent

Lord Davies of Brixton Excerpts

Monday 29th April 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Davies of Gower (Con)]

I recall answering this question from the noble and right reverend Lord some time ago. I cannot remember the date, but I will certainly look it up and write to him.

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab)]

My Lords, for the avoidance of doubt, I am not currently answering Questions from the Front Bench, although I hope that it is simply a matter of time.

[A noble Lord]

The annunciator is wrong.

Industrial Action on the Railways

Lord Davies of Brixton Excerpts

Monday 20th June 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

The noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, asked: what next? The most important thing, to my mind, is for the unions to come back to the table—to sit down with the train operating companies and Network Rail to reach a resolution.

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab)]

My Lords, I the interesting part of the Statement was, as someone said, its tone, which I think was accurately reflected in the Minister’s delivery to the House. There is clearly no intention from this Government to achieve a settlement. They have convinced themselves that it is in their interest to wind up the issue, reflected in the ministerial Statement in the use of terms such as “union barons”. This strike was because of the frustration among the membership of the unions involved; a massive majority of the entire unionised workforce was in favour of taking action. This is not down to the leadership; it is down to the members and their dissatisfaction. When the Minister comes and reads us a Statement that is more like a Daily Mail op-ed on a bad day, it demonstrates the Government’s total lack of interest in achieving any settlement.

[Viscount Younger of Leckie (Con)]

Sorry to interrupt the House again, but I urge Peers to keep their questions succinct to allow more Back-Bench questions to be asked.

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab)]

Does the Minister understand that part of the reason for this discontent is the Government’s intention to wind back on the pension schemes that cover the railway staff? The Government make policies to make people’s pensions worse; that is part of the problem. Does she understand that?

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

A review by the independent regulator for pensions recognised the pension scheme is underfunded. There clearly has to be some sort of remedy to address that. In most train-operating companies, workers can retire at 62—several years earlier than most people are able to retire—and, for those who worked for Network Rail after 2012, at 65. There is lots of work to do on pensions, but the noble Lord spoke about the tone and it is quite interesting to see how this has developed. I do not know if the noble Lord was able to watch Mr Lynch on the television this afternoon and take note of his tone.

Travel Disruption at UK Airports and Ferry Ports

Lord Davies of Brixton Excerpts

Thursday 9th June 2022 Lords Chamber

Asked by

[Lord Davies of Brixton]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what steps they intend to take to alleviate the problems, including queues, cancellations and delays, being experienced by travellers at airports and ferry ports in the United Kingdom.

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab)]

My Lords, clearly, this is a topical issue that is causing much concern to many people. I am sure that all noble Lords will have read reports in the press, heard interviews on the radio and seen scenes of chaos at airports on the television. For example, yesterday’s Daily Mail reported:

“No end in sight to holiday nightmare. Airlines ‘resign themselves to summer of chaos’ and Heathrow boss warns of 18 MONTHS”—


its emphasis—

“of misery as passengers face more mayhem today with huge queues and bag collection in ‘disarray’”.

Today’s Daily Mail reported:

“The airline chaos causing travel misery for Britons plumbed new depths today as a video showed baggage falling off an overloaded conveyor belt and left strewn across the floor in Manchester Airport’s arrivals hall.”


However, we must remember that this is about individuals and families, not generalities. We should not lose sight of how this has impacted on people who were just hoping for a holiday. Tuesday’s Mirror quoted Ali Haynes, who arrived at Luton Airport with her partner and five month-old baby three hours before their easyJet flight to Palermo was due to depart, only to learn that the plane had been grounded. She said:

“We’re now stuck in Luton departures with no information on what next. Holiday ruined.”


The Financial Times reported on Michael Norman, who tried to fly back to Manchester from Faro, Portugal, on Sunday. He said that easyJet did not tell passengers that their flight was cancelled until they were at the departure gate. He said:

“We have no idea, it is as if they abandon you … they should not be flying people out on holiday if they cannot fly you back”.


The Daily Mail again:

“Furious mother posts picture of her exhausted six-year-old daughter while stuck in Cyprus after Tui cancelled family’s flights TWICE”—


again, its emphasis—

“as experts warn travel chaos is set to get even worse.”

Now, there are many horrendous things going on in this world. For example, there is the suffering of people in Ukraine, Yemen, Afghanistan and elsewhere overseas and, at home, there is the increase in poverty with families being forced to choose between food and heating. However, I make no apology for raising the issue with the Minister. In the context of what everyone has gone through during the Covid pandemic, we can all sympathise with those who are thwarted in their simple and understandable wish to take a break, typically somewhere warmer and sunnier than they might expect at home. While most of the coverage has focused on those on holiday, it is entirely possible that there has also been an adverse effect on business travellers, who increasingly use budget airlines.

In raising the question I am not really interested in conducting a post-mortem on who has been to blame for this situation. I am not even that interested in hearing about what action the Government have already taken to address the problems. What I would like to hear from the Minister is some empathy with travellers and an indication of what further action the Government might take to help alleviate the distress that is still arising daily—particularly when we are told by none other than John Holland-Kaye, CEO of Heathrow Airport, that, as things stand,

“it will take 12 to 18 months for the aviation sector to fully recover capacity”.

Is there really no end in sight? With my flights booked for later in the summer, I really should declare an interest.

We therefore need to be clear about the Government’s analysis of the reasons for the problems that travellers face, and then what more should be done about them. I think it is reasonably clear that an inadequate response to the recovery of foreign holidays is at the heart of the problems. We know about the impact of the pandemic on the global aviation industry. The Government did the right thing in supporting aviation, but it was not enough: tens of thousands of jobs were cut. In the first lockdown in particular, the industry made significant cutbacks in its workforce. The problem then was the uncertainty about any recovery in travel; no one knew how long the pandemic would last or how it would turn out, so it was unclear until relatively recently when things would get better for the travel industry.

It has been suggested that the airlines should have predicted that there would be surge in demand when the world opened up again. But there were various false starts, and it is not surprising that the industry acted, as it has turned out, with caution. Now, however, it is clear that, with vaccination, fewer border restrictions and no sign of a more dangerous variant, things are returning to something like normal. Flights are returning to levels not seen since 2019 and, as a result, the understaffed airlines and airports are struggling to cope with the increased demand.

It appears that the biggest problem is the recruitment that is needed to fill the gaps in staffing required to meet current demands. Airlines and airports need countless different jobs to operate, from security guards to cabin crew, but there are widespread staff shortages across much of the economy following the pandemic. Many people who previously worked in the industry have also found better jobs elsewhere, without the pressure of shift work and relatively poor pay. It has also to be said that there is no doubt whatever that the problem in recruitment in the UK has been exacerbated by Brexit. I am not trying to reopen the issue of Brexit, at least in the context of this debate, but as a result, there are simply fewer people available to work in the industry. To the extent that it is possible for EU citizens to work here, the terms of employment that they now face because of the additional restrictions make the work far less attractive.

I hope that the Minister will not strain our credulity by claiming, like one of her colleagues, that Brexit has improved the staffing situation. I hope that she will admit the problems and, accepting that Brexit is done, look at what scope there is within the agreements that have been reached to adjust the rules on employment to alleviate the staffing problems. We know that there are also problems with the rate at which new employees can be recruited. Some of the jobs are sensitive, requiring lengthy background checks and training.

My question today is: what more will the Government do to alleviate this situation, or are they effectively saying that everything that could be done has been done and that it is really up to the airports, the airlines, the ferry ports and the ferry companies to solve the problem?

P&O Ferries

Lord Davies of Brixton Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd March 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

I do not have any information on the employment status of workers in freeports but, if I can find out any information, I will certainly write to the noble Baroness.

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab)]

My Lords, I want to pursue the issue of pensions, which was raised by the noble Lord, Lord Fox, and highlight the question to the Minister: to what extent are the pension arrangements that apply to these workers under threat? Is the company doing this because it is encountering commercial difficulties? Is the covenant to which most company pension schemes rely therefore under any sort of threat? The fact that the pension arrangements are continuing is not sufficient comfort.

It is also important to understand that two pension arrangements are involved here: the P&O scheme and whatever other arrangements that provide pensions for the unfortunate workers who have lost their jobs, and the Merchant Navy Ratings Pension Fund, which is a separate arrangement in which I assume many of those who have been fired have deferred benefits. Because of the way that scheme has operated in the past, P&O potentially owes it a lot of money. There was an implication that pensions are not a problem but the issue bears further investigation and reassurance, both to the House and to the workers involved.

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

I would be pleased to take that issue away and ensure that we have looked into it in great detail. My understanding is that the employees’ pensions are protected. We are aware of the pension deficit in the Merchant Navy Ratings Pension Fund; P&O Ferries will need to pay what it owes.

Integrated Rail Plan: Northern Powerhouse Area

Lord Davies of Brixton Excerpts

Thursday 16th December 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank my noble friend Lord Berkeley for introducing this important debate and thank the Minister for the useful and informative session this morning exploring the plan. I have it here with me, and my eyes are drawn irresistibly to page 15, where it states:

“Bringing local transport systems outside London to the standards of the capital is a critical part of levelling up, driving growth and prosperity.”


This was raised in a separate debate last week, since when we have moved from the absurdity of a three-month financial deal for TfL to the farce of a one-week deal.

The Minister will have us believe that the situation is all the fault of the mayor. However, the truth is that it is solely the result of the Conservative Government’s political animus towards London. I know it; Londoners, from business leaders to poverty campaigners, know it; the whole world knows it. I suspect even the Minister knows it.

The failure to adequately finance TfL is directly relevant to the Integrated Rail Plan and connectivity in the northern powerhouse, for two reasons. First, the Government have set London as the standard to which other cities should be levelled up. Poorer services in London will mean poorer provision in cities in the north and the Midlands. Secondly, and crucially, this is not a zero-sum game. Growth and prosperity in London are as important to people in the north and the Midlands as they are to Londoners.

Extraordinary Funding and Financing Agreement for Transport for London

Lord Davies of Brixton Excerpts

Thursday 9th December 2021 Lords Chamber

Asked by

[Lord Davies of Brixton]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government when they will announce the details of any further Extraordinary Funding and Financing Agreement for Transport for London for the period after 11 December.

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab)]

My Lords, I should perhaps mention, in the interests of full disclosure, that I live in London and am the proud holder of a Freedom pass.

My Question is of course highly topical; the deadline is tomorrow for the Government and TfL to reach an agreement on the future funding of transport in London. That is not just the Underground and the buses; it is the roads and the whole transport system for London.

My intention in raising the matter is not so much to discuss the details of a possible agreement as to ask about the process and timing by which such agreements are reached. In short, what my Question is really asking is whether the Minister agrees that there must be a better way of doing this and, if so, what the Government propose to do to bring it about. Perhaps there has been some news since I last checked, by my Question still stands. Even if an agreement is reached tomorrow, we still need the Government to tell us what steps they will take to improve the system by which such agreements are reached.

By way of background, in addition to the excellent brief produced by the Library, it is worth emphasising that this will be the fourth in this series of deals for relatively short periods since we were struck by the pandemic. There was May to October 2020; there was October 2020 to March 2021, subsequently extended to May 2021; and, most recently, there was May to December 2021, which expires on Saturday. Obviously, part of the reason for this pattern has been the unknown and unknowable progress of the pandemic, emphasised most recently by the Government announcing yesterday that everyone should, where possible, work from home. We simply do not know how people will react and how this will affect ridership.

I therefore welcome the Statement made to the Evening Standard by Paul Scully MP, the Minister for London, that the Government remain committed to make up TfL’s loss of fare revenue from Covid. It would be good and appropriate if the Minister could make a more formal commitment to that policy from the Dispatch Box.

The problem, however, is that short-term fixes to cover lost fare revenue simply do not work for Londoners. Those who travel on TfL services deserve something more certain in the longer term in terms of both revenue and capital. It is important to understand that TfL’s budget does not just cover day-to-day running of services; it must cover the capital needed to maintain and, where necessary, update services to deal with the changing needs of both Londoners and the visitors whom we welcome to our great city. For example, some of the rolling stock is near or at the end of its working life and its replacement simply cannot be deferred.

The practical difficulty is that TfL is, in effect, a local authority and is bound by the rules that govern local authority finance. What this means in practice is that it cannot budget for a deficit and is legally required to plan for the worst-case scenario. Consequently, unless and until a formal agreement is reached on additional funding and signed on the dotted line, TfL has to plan for substantial cuts in expenditure, both in services and capital, in case a deal fails to materialise.

Perhaps other noble Lords will mention the sorts of cuts that TfL has had to consider; I want to make just one specific point about any possible deal. It would be totally wrong to make TfL’s staff, who have served us so well during the pandemic, facing real danger in their day-to-day work, pay for the problems that have arisen. They should not have to pay now through real- terms cuts in their pay and conditions or cuts in their future pensions—there is always a pensions angle.

It is a shame that speakers in this debate are so London-centric, as one important point I want to emphasise is that this is not just an issue for London—I look forward to the remarks of the noble Lord, Lord Shipley. The Government’s own statements make this clear. In their Integrated Rail Plan for the North and Midlands, they refer explicitly to London’s transport system and state:

“Bringing local transport systems outside London to the standards of the capital is a critical part of levelling up, driving growth and prosperity.”


Two things flow from this statement which are relevant to London. First, London and TfL set the standard to be achieved, and cutting back on services in London has no part in the Government’s trumpeted policy of levelling up. Will the Minister confirm that that is the case?

Secondly, the growth and prosperity of London depends as much on having a good transport system as it does in the north and the Midlands. The point that is too often missed from debates about levelling up is that this is not a zero-sum game; growth and prosperity in the north and Midlands depend to a significant extent on growth and prosperity in London. It is worth noting that London currently has the highest unemployment rate of any UK region. This is bad news for everyone—not just for Londoners but for the whole country and our economic prospects. The Government must recognise that London has a critical role to play in the nation’s economic recovery. I am sure that the Minister knows all this but, for whatever reason, we have ended up in this absurd situation where there is no certainty about TfL’s funding in two days’ time.

To return to my original question, does the Minister accept that the Government have a responsibility to avoid this sort of brinkmanship in these negotiations? She may well blame the mayor, but does she accept any responsibility? In any event, what constructive steps will the Government take in future to achieve the necessary longer-term agreement that should be put in place?

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

I will come on to longer-term funding, if the noble Lord will give me time—although I might now run out of time. I will skip on a weeny bit.

We have required the mayor to make much-needed efficiencies and savings in the TfL cost base. It is funny, when you turn the spotlight on, how much money you can find in there: £720 million in ongoing savings. That is quite a lot of money—I am not sure we would have found that had we not gone through the pandemic. Obviously, work continues. We are reviewing the TfL capital programme to draw out the efficiencies and we have asked the mayor to look at new income sources to raise between £0.5 billion and £1 billion and to report regularly on the financial position.

The noble Lord, Lord Adonis, will know, if he looks back through the deal letters, that it is the case that the Government have committed to a review of the future funding of TfL, and that work is ongoing. We will not suddenly have a long-term deal for the next five years from Saturday. I think all noble Lords recognise that, in the midst of a pandemic, that would not be wise. We have also required TfL to initiate other necessary reforms, such as to the TfL pension scheme, so that it can transform into a modern and efficient transport operator, fit for the future of London.

I turn specifically to the pensions issue. As the noble Lord, Lord Davies, said, there is always a pensions issue. TfL’s own independent panel recognised that TfL’s pension scheme was outdated and in need of reform. It is not the Government saying that but its own independent panel. So we agreed with the mayor in the funding settlement that a process would be put in place in order to modernise and reform the pensions, and we will have a report from Sir Brendan Barber by 31 March next year.

On capital, the Government are contributing capital as well as income. There has been the £1 billion of capital a year, which I have mentioned. On top of that we have had to provide further funding for Crossrail—and I am very excited that it is opening soon. There has been funding for Hammersmith Bridge. However, TfL has made an announcement via its financial committee—and this is where we start getting into the PR and spin of TfL, or the “mayor’s world”. This level of funding means that TfL now has to implement something called its “managed decline scenario” for capital investment. Let me be absolutely clear that that rather unambitious phrase comes from the Mayor of London playbook. It is not what we want or expect to see for London, and we will continue to work with TfL to fully understand the detail of the future capital programme.

On new income, noble Lords may be asking: what is holding up the current deal? The plan is. Before the pandemic, 70% of TfL’s revenue came from fares. TfL’s finances need to be more resilient, and again this was noted again by TfL’s own independent panel. Work therefore had to commence to find new income sources, some of which had been identified by the independent panel, so a fair amount of work had been done. The mayor was given a deadline of mid-November, so that we would have the plan in good time before the deal ends. He failed to deliver the requisite document. He was then given an extension until 8 December—yesterday. We finally received a submission from the mayor yesterday at 8 pm. We are urgently considering what he sent us late last night, but we are very clear that it is for the mayor to decide new income approaches.

We know that omicron may provide an additional level of uncertainty. We know that TfL had started to recover and that things were looking better for London, but we are not sure where things will go over the coming days and weeks. The Government remain on-risk for revenue under the current funding settlement and use the top-up mechanism to protect TfL from exposure to unexpected changes in passenger demand.

On the point about Nexus made by the noble Lord, Lord Shipley, all that I will say is that I met Nexus earlier this week—so everything he said, I already knew, and I have heard its pleas.

In conclusion, the Government will continue to support TfL in a way that is fair to the UK taxpayer and ensures continued services on London’s transport system. In return, the Mayor of London must step up and lead from the front by making potentially difficult decisions in difficult times. At the moment, we are seeing a PR blitz of overexaggerated claims of doom, which he blames on others. We as central government have not been able to swerve difficult decisions, and neither should he. We look forward to working with the mayor in the coming hours, days, weeks and months to ensure that the capital has the modern, efficient and sustainable transport system that it needs and deserves.

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab)]

I am afraid that my actual Question in the way I phrased it in my introduction was not answered. Effectively, reading between the lines, the Minister is saying that it is totally the mayor’s fault and the Government are not prepared to do anything to avoid this situation arising in future.

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

I am over time, but I will respond. I am saying that there is definitely fault on the mayor’s side, but I am saying that we have had to be very flexible in this process all the way through. I have been deeply involved in it for the past 18 months or whatever. We have always had to be very flexible, because things change. That has always been our goal. However, at the core of all that is the direction of travel of making TfL financially sustainable and understanding what it would look like by April 2023 and, thereafter, what a longer-term future for TfL looks like. That is our prize and what we have our eyes on. We would like the mayor to join us on that journey. He is not quite there yet, but I am forever hopeful.

Insulate Britain

Lord Davies of Brixton Excerpts

Tuesday 26th October 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

I cannot agree more with my noble friend.

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab)]

My Lords, there is no doubt that the activities of the Insulate Britain campaign have caused problems and disruption for many people. I guess that was the point. Does the Minister agree that these problems will come to be seen as trivial when compared to the disruption we shall all face to our lives if we fail to address climate change?

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

This Government have one of the strongest records in the world in tackling climate change, and I fear that using the word “trivial” in relation to this disruption is a poor choice of word. Insulate Britain has said that days of disruption are necessary to force the Government to act. This is just a small, rag-tag group of people who will not force the Government to do anything.

North of England: Rapid Mass Transport System

Lord Davies of Brixton Excerpts

Monday 28th June 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

I am sure all noble Lords will agree that, just because something is old, that does not mean it is useless. We must look at all technologies, and that is precisely what we do. My noble friend makes an important point in saying that systems around the world use this, but just one operational high-speed system does so at the moment: the Shanghai City maglev. There are many others operating at lower speeds—that is, less than 100 mph—and obviously, there is one in construction in Japan, but it is coming up against some cost pressures.

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab)]

Will the Minister give a clear commitment on behalf of the Government to Northern Powerhouse Rail as part of the integrated rail plan?

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

I can reassure the noble Lord that the Government are considering all options as part of the integrated rail plan and of course, Northern Powerhouse Rail is a very important part of that. Once the IRP is published, Transport for the North will submit a business case consistent with policy and the funding framework.

Transport for London: Financial Settlement

Lord Davies of Brixton Excerpts

Tuesday 2nd March 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

My noble friend raises a very interesting period of time that unfortunately I do not remember, but it is the case that the Mayor of London has some very interesting ideas as to how he wants vehicle excise duty to be spent. It is one of the proposals in the financial sustainability plan he has prepared, which I have to say does seem to have been drafted with a money-no-object mindset. Noble Lords will know that vehicle excise duty is used for the strategic roads network, which is the motorways and the major A roads, so unless we are going to stop Londoners from using our motorways and buying products that have been brought into London by HGVs travelling on them, I see absolutely no rationale for devolving VED.

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I read in the Financial Times today that the ONS says that as an average Londoner I receive about £4,000 less in public spending than I pay in tax. As a proponent of progressive taxation, I am happy to pay, but the fable of the goose that lays the golden egg comes to mind. Will the Minister agree that the economic prosperity of the whole country depends on a prosperous London, and that that requires, among other things, a well-connected London with excellent public transport? Is it not remarkable that London is the only major city in the world where there is no contribution from general taxation, from which the whole country would benefit?

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

The noble Lord is right that London will play a very important part in the economic future of our nation; in 2018 it made 23% of UK GDP. But while much of the funding for Transport for London comes from passenger revenues, there are other routes by which it gets money; for example, business rates retention, which is a retention which would otherwise have gone to Her Majesty’s Government. So one might assume that there is a broad breadth of sources of funding for TfL, but I agree—the Government want to support London’s recovery and we want to keep the capital moving.

HS2: Phase 2B

Lord Davies of Brixton Excerpts

Monday 8th February 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

My Lords, this Government completely agree with the noble Lord, and that is why transport infrastructure and building back better is our priority for Britain over the coming years.

[Lord Davies of Brixton (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I join the general trend of support and welcome for the Government’s continued commitment to the entire HS2 project. Could the Minister take the opportunity to reinforce the point that this is not a zero-sum game, with one part of the country gaining at the expense of another? We all gain from the introduction of the project, not least those of us who live in London; we gain because the north gains. Would the Minister confirm that?

[Baroness Vere of Norbiton (Con)]

The noble Lord is completely right—this project is about connectivity and capacity, and the connectivity strand is about connectivity throughout the country. HS2 provides a wonderful opportunity to create a high-speed rail spine down the centre of the country which will benefit both the cities it connects and the local communities beyond them.