Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Lord Clarke of Nottingham and Lord Beamish

Tuesday 13th March 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Kevan Jones (North Durham) (Lab)]

22. What discussions he has had with the Lord Chief Justice on the potential effect of his planned changes to legal aid on the number of litigants in person.

[The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice (Mr Kenneth Clarke)]

I thought that I had already answered this question, which was grouped with Question 10. I said that a substantial number of cases already—

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Clarke]

The courts already deal with litigants in person, and they are very used to dealing with that situation. We accept that the legal aid changes currently before the House of Lords will increase the number of litigants in person, but the evidence on the issue is very mixed, indicating that some cases are dealt with more quickly and others take longer. In fact, many such cases do not require legal representation at all.

[Mr Jones]

The Justice Secretary is clear that the number of litigants representing themselves will increase. In drawing up his cuts in legal aid, did his Department make any assessment of increased costs, given that the Lord Chief Justice is concerned that courts could be swamped and that the cost to the taxpayer could be higher as a result of those cuts?

[Mr Clarke]

We see no evidence at all that this would give rise to increased costs. It is extremely difficult to anticipate precisely the effect of there being more litigants in person because the evidence is so mixed. We are concentrating, particularly in the family division, on dealing with more cases by way of mediation. Adversarial litigation is not always the best way of resolving problems; there are many better alternative ways of resolving disputes in suitable cases. We are putting more money into mediation and less into taxpayers paying for lawyers.