Brexit: European Council and Commission

Lord Callanan Excerpts

Tuesday 27th March 2018 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Department for Exiting the European Union (Lord Callanan) (Con)]

My Lords, the European Union published a draft withdrawal agreement text as part of our ongoing negotiations under Article 50. We have made significant progress towards concluding much of the withdrawal agreement by agreeing the chapters on financial settlement and citizens’ rights, in line with the joint report, as well as the terms of a time-limited implementation period. We will carry this momentum forward and aim to reach agreement on the entire withdrawal agreement by October.

[Lord Dykes (CB)]

I thank the Minister for that Answer. How long will the Government need to renegotiate the existing trade agreements with non-members who have trade agreements with the European Union as a whole? Will the 21 months of the transition period be enough?

[Lord Callanan]

We are pursuing many of these multilateral agreements in a whole range of areas, including trade agreements, and we are confident that we have enough time to complete those negotiations.

[Lord Bridges of Headley (Con)]

Perhaps my noble friend could clarify a point from the Statement yesterday. In the Statement, the Prime Minister said that,

“we remain committed to the agreement we reached in December in its entirety”.

A little later, she said, on the Northern Ireland border:

“I have explained that the specific European Commission proposals for that backstop were unacceptable”.—[Official Report, Commons, 26/3/18; col. 524.]


Which is it: do we accept the agreement in its entirety or do we not?

[Lord Callanan]

I thank my noble friend for his question. The Government are committed to the avoidance of a hard border, including any physical infrastructure or related checks and controls. The UK’s intention is to achieve these objectives through the overall EU-UK relationship. Should this not be possible, the UK would propose specific solutions to address the unique circumstances of the island of Ireland.

[Lord Anderson of Swansea (Lab)]

Do we confidently expect to get a better deal on our own with, for example, South Korea, than the EU will get?

[Lord Callanan]

It will be a matter for the negotiations, but we hope to achieve an agreement at least as good as the existing trade agreement with South Korea, yes.

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

My Lords, is not the truth that, despite barbs often directed at Brussels, EU institutions have proved far more transparent, accessible and accountable—and, I might add, more honest—than Ministers and departments in Whitehall? There is no way that we would have this annotated withdrawal agreement if it had been left to the UK Government. Does not the Brexit process show how much our democracy and governance need modernising?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Callanan]

I am afraid I just do not agree with the premise of the noble Baroness’s question. We are extremely transparent and very accountable. We published a draft legal text on the implementation period. The EU publishes many documents; we publish many documents. We appear at numerous Select Committees and debates in this House to account for the Government’s strategy. We are committed to being as transparent as possible but, obviously, as is the case with the EU, we do not want to do anything to prejudice our negotiating position.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab)]

My Lords—

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Tebbit]

My Lords, could my noble friend perhaps arrange some sort of education process for those people on the other side of the House who do not believe that the British people are capable of running a democratic process? We had been doing it for quite a long time before most of those on the continent got round to the idea of having a democratic process.

[Lord Callanan]

I see that my noble friend is as provocative as ever. We believe in democracy; part of the referendum was about taking back control. I am sure that this House, and the other place, are quite capable of organising our own affairs in the future.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock]

Was that not a waste of a question? You would have thought the noble Lord would have learned by now. Would the Minister now care to try to answer the question posed by the noble Lord, Lord Bridges, without reading from a pre-arranged brief? Which statement is correct: the first, that everything is agreed; or the second, that we have not agreed in relation to Northern Ireland? Which is correct?

[Lord Callanan]

We have a number of things to discuss with the EU about Northern Ireland. As I said to the noble Lord, it is one of the areas that has not been bottomed out into a legal agreement yet. We are committed to taking those discussions forward with the Commission and the Irish Government, but our red line of having no hard border between Northern Ireland and the Irish Republic remains, and of course, the indivisibility of the United Kingdom also remains a red line.

[Lord Hannay of Chiswick (CB)]

Has the Minister studied the part of the guidelines which says that the European Union would reconsider its approach to trade issues if the British Government were to change their mind? Will the Government show any of that flexibility that the Prime Minister is calling for?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Callanan]

We have been flexible throughout the negotiations. We want to reach a good flexible agreement with the European Union. We have given some ground, and the EU has given some ground. That is in the nature of European negotiations. I am sure that will continue into the future but, of course, we have our red lines, which will not be crossed.

[Baroness Symons of Vernham Dean (Lab)]

My Lords, my noble friend Lord Foulkes was right: the statements read out by the noble Lord, Lord Bridges, are not compatible with each other. Will the noble Lord, Lord Callanan, undertake to clarify the position and to come back to the House with a clearer and more satisfactory answer than he has been able to give?

[Lord Callanan]

As in all these negotiations, when we reach an agreement with the European Union and the Irish Government on the precise details of the border, we will be sure to report to the House on that matter.