Violent Disorder

Lord Caine Excerpts

Tuesday 3rd September 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)]

Again, I am grateful to the noble Lord for bringing his significant expertise in this area to the Statement and to the long-term debate on this issue. First and foremost, I join him in paying tribute to the brave officers who held that line in the face of violent attacks that could have caused—and did cause—considerable harm to injured officers. That is a depleting factor on police forces in a particular area.

It is important to note that on Saturday 10 August, 6,675 officers were deployed in a single day to hold back criminal riotous behaviour. Those 6,675 officers put themselves on the front line, but in doing so they were also not doing other duties. That is one of the reasons why, immediately after the riots began, the Prime Minister said he would set up a national programme to look at deployment of resources, capability and how this was dealt with. I hope the noble Lord will welcome this.

The extremely important point was made that intelligence-led policing is absolutely vital to ensure that we get ahead of what is happening. That means using important—but difficult and challenging—tactics which involve looking at social media posts, tracking and looking at the capability of potential offenders and advising forces on how to deal with them in potential hotspots. I have no problem whatever in using the tools available to protect the public, because nobody forces anybody to organise a riot or to attack buildings and mosques and nobody says “Let’s burn this down” unless they are—or are potentially—going to commit criminal offences.

If we can nip those in the bud through the better organisation of policing or by the recognition of techniques that will bring convictions through the independent forces of the law, the police, the CPS and the courts, good on that, because that will protect the type of people that the noble Baroness from the Liberal Front Bench and the noble Lord, Lord Sharpe, indicated need protecting.

[Lord Caine (Con)]

My Lords, I was born in Harehills in Leeds, as I believe was the noble Baroness, Lady Blake of Leeds. It is a terribly deprived community and I still live about three miles from there. Will the Minister, whom I welcome to his post, join me in condemning those who immediately sought to exploit the appalling violence that took place in Harehills for their own political ends, using language that was designed only to stoke division and tension within that community, and did so from the luxury of Milwaukee? I refer, of course, to the leader of Reform UK.

[Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)]

I am grateful for the noble Lord’s welcome to me coming to this position. The Member for Clacton, if that was the Member he was referring to, is responsible for his own comments, in his own way and in his own time. He should be held to account by people in Clacton and by the wider community for any comments he makes. It is not for me to comment on that; it is for him to make those comments. What I will say is that, whenever things happen—as they do—we need to look at, and take action on, that criminal behaviour and close it down. Sometimes, it happens with summer activity, with people having too much to drink over long nights; sometimes, it is fuelled by right-wing violence and, other times, it is fuelled by other activity. If, underneath that, there are long-term trends of Islamophobia, anti-Semitism, right-wing ideology or, indeed, extreme left-wing ideology, we need to look, in a cold, calm way, at what has caused that, how we deal with it, how—following the noble Lord, Lord Hogan-Howe—we intelligently police it and, ultimately, how we bring people to court if they have committed criminal offences. What Ministers can do is put the architecture together for that. The Prime Minister has been trying to look at the lessons learned from the initial response, which surprised many of us in that week after Southport, to see how we can improve that response and listen to what the police say about their own lessons. If that involves action by the Home Office in support of policing, that is what we will do.

Law Enforcement: Brexit Impacts

Lord Caine Excerpts

Wednesday 6th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My Lords, timely access and cross-border co-operation benefits not only the UK but the EU. The noble Lord talks about serious and organised crime, which knows no borders and is global. It is incumbent on all of us to work together to stem its flow.

[Lord Caine (Con)]

My Lords, as my noble friend is aware, the closest co-operation between the Police Service of Northern Ireland and An Garda Síochána is absolutely crucial in the fight against both terrorism and organised crime. In this context, the European arrest warrant has aided the smooth extradition of suspects between our two jurisdictions. Could my noble friend assure the House that arrangements are in place to ensure that this continues and that there is no going back to the extradition problems that beset us in the past, which so soured UK-Irish relations?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My noble friend is absolutely right to point that out, and I think it will have been foremost in the minds of negotiators, both here and in Ireland. We do not want to go back to those days, and it is very important that arrangements are in place that allow for criminals and terrorists to be dealt with swiftly and efficiently.

Reading Terrorist Attack

Lord Caine Excerpts

Tuesday 23rd June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Caine (Con) [V]]

My Lords, in the aftermath of every terrorist incident there is inevitably speculation about whether more could have been done to prevent it. Does my noble friend agree that, by its very nature, intelligence is not an exact science, but rather requires many—often very difficult—assessments? Will she reiterate this Government’s fullest possible support for the police and the intelligence agencies? Overall, they do such a fantastic job in seeking to keep us safe from the ongoing terrorist threat.

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I wholeheartedly agree with my noble friend. He is right: intelligence is not an easy science at all. If we think about the 25 terrorist attacks thwarted, we can imagine what things would be like if the intelligence services had got it wrong. That is a staggering figure—25 terrorist attacks thwarted in just three years. As my noble friend and the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, say, our police and intelligence services are the best in the world.

Public Order

Lord Caine Excerpts

Tuesday 9th June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, I should say to the noble Baroness, who is also my noble friend, that if democracy failed in Bristol, democracy is failing in Bristol and it is up to the people of Bristol to vote in a more effective democracy. I do not think that there is one single answer to some of the systemic issues in what we have seen. We have to work across government and all the strata of society in order to make that cultural change.

[Lord Caine (Con) [V]]

My Lords, while I completely understand, not least because of my own experience in Northern Ireland, that the police often have to make very difficult judgments in public order situations, does my noble friend agree that it is none the less vital to public confidence that the law is still enforced? Is not one of the lessons we learned from what we saw in the summer of 2011 that this is more effective when it is done quickly?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I agree absolutely with my noble friend. It is not only best that it is done quickly, but it is what the public expects.

Covid-19: UK Border Health Measures

Lord Caine Excerpts

Thursday 4th June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, it is important to make clear at this stage that we are led by the science. SAGE, the Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies, advises the Government, and it is for the Government to make policy decisions.

[Lord Caine (Con)]

I refer to my entries in the register of interests. My noble friend will be aware that, within British sport, rugby league is unique in that three overseas teams compete in two of our domestic leagues—Catalans Dragons and Toronto Wolfpack in the Super League and Toulouse in the Championship. Each team plays home and away fixtures. A 14-day quarantine period that encompasses players and staff risks making any fixtures involving these overseas clubs extremely difficult, if not impossible, when the rugby league season finally resumes. Will my noble friend take this issue back to the Home Secretary? In considering possible sporting exemptions, will she ensure that rugby league, which has great experience in managing teams in and out of the UK, is fully involved in these discussions?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

These are cross-government decisions where Ministers engage with each other. I understand the huge strength of feeling in rugby, football and the many other sports which people would love to have back and engage with. As I have said previously, the Government will regularly review its decisions and the rules that are in place every three weeks. We are committed to getting this country up and free and running—or playing rugby—as soon as we possibly can.