Education in Prisons

Debate between Lord Brooke of Alverthorpe and Lord Timpson

Tuesday 21st October 2025 Lords Chamber

[Lord Timpson (Lab)]

I was clear when I started in this role that it is going to take time to fix what is a complex and troublesome system. Therefore, I cannot say exactly what I can achieve in the next six months. However, I am very clear that we need stability, and staff who are trained to deliver a safe and secure environment. From a position of education, it is important that staff have enough prisoners in their classrooms to teach. All too often, due to regime issues, security issues and so on, we have too many examples—as I saw on my prison visit to Hindley on Thursday—where people are locked up 22 hours a day. That is part of our inheritance but something I am having to deal with. I am addressing it in exactly the same way I addressed how I ran my business: focus, delivery and making sure I get accountability from the teams that are passionately engaged in what we are trying to do.

[Lord Brooke of Alverthorpe (Lab)]

My Lords, one of the omissions from the report from the group of the noble Lord, Lord Foster, is that there is no mention of AI. AI provides us with an opportunity for low-cost training, education and rehabilitation. Could the Minister say that, within the next six months, action will be taken to advance AI in prisons? You can engage prisoners more with AI than with traditional means. Maybe we could try to get some of the tech companies that are not paying tax to come in, working on a joint basis, and do some work in prisons to achieve the kind of objectives the Minister is seeking.

[Lord Timpson (Lab)]

I thank my noble friend for the question. In over 70% of the meetings I have, AI is mentioned. Often, it is mentioned as a way that will solve problems much further down the line, but it is about how we can embrace it now to get the advantage of it. Digital learning is important in prisons and something that we need to push further on. There is a product called Launchpad, which is in people’s cells. It is basically an iPad-type device that they can learn, read and educate themselves on. There is a business called Coracle Inside that supplies lots of iPads and laptops to prisons. I recently was part of a “Dragons’ Den”, where a number of tech companies came to present some really interesting ideas, and a number of them mentioned AI in their presentation.

Prisoners: Reoffending

Debate between Lord Brooke of Alverthorpe and Lord Timpson

Tuesday 14th October 2025 Lords Chamber

[Lord Timpson (Lab)]

I believe that everybody who leaves prison should have the opportunity for a full life after they have served their punishment. We need to run prisons well, and it is difficult to run them well when they are 99.9% full. That is why our focus in the Sentencing Bill is on a sustainable justice system, so that prisons and probation can work hand in hand with the courts, the DWP and housing teams to make sure that, when people leave, they leave with confidence. We do not want people, in the lead-up to being released, to be concerned about having nowhere to live and all the other anxieties about coming out. That is one of the reasons why recall rates are still far too high.

[Lord Brooke of Alverthorpe (Lab)]

I know the Minister is interested in particular in those prisoners with drink and drug problems. Is he aware that many of the recovery centres that operate around the country state that funding to try to keep prisoners in recovery from drink and drug problems is drying up? This is principally coming from the health service side, but the Minister has an equal interest in this. Could he explore it and try to find some assistance around these continuing problems with funding?

[Lord Timpson (Lab)]

My noble friend is right; this is absolutely vital for a number of people who leave prison. Some 49% of people go into prison with drug and alcohol problems. I have set up a drug and alcohol advisory panel with Dame Carol Black and others. I have also taken it one step further: I have been to an AA meeting to see how it works, and in the next two weeks I am going to my first NA meeting. I believe that the more of those types of meetings we have in prisons, the more opportunity people will have to overcome their addictions.