Sale and Display of Human Body Parts
Debate between Lord Boateng and Baroness Twycross
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Culture, Media and Sport (Baroness Twycross) (Lab)
My Lords, I thank my noble friend Lord Boateng for securing this debate on this sensitive and hugely important topic.
I begin by echoing the Deputy Prime Minister who, speaking in the other place last year, declared the sale of human body parts, regardless of their age and origin, to be abhorrent. I am personally appalled by any disrespectful treatment of human remains and agree wholeheartedly with the Deputy Prime Minister’s view. As my noble friend said, this issue is about basic human decency. Like the noble Baroness, Lady Black of Strome, I genuinely cannot see how we have more stringent law around the sale of ivory—the briefing I got mentioned birds’ nests and birds’ eggs—than around human remains. It feels completely out of step with where we should be as a society.
I know the Museums Minister met with Bell Ribeiro-Addy MP this morning to talk about this topic. The Secretary of State and I have also spoken, and I have read with interest the report Laying Ancestors to Rest, published by the APPG for Afrikan Reparations yesterday. Its recommendations will inform the Government’s consideration of the issues raised today and is very timely. It is clear that the practices that prompted this debate impact many people, with the potential to cause significant distress and offence to communities across the globe. As a result, this topic should be given the respect and attention it deserves.
In response to the point made by the noble Baroness, Lady Bennett of Manor Castle, about the number of speakers in this debate, I point out that the time allowed for speakers as a result of the number of speakers means that noble Lords have had more time, which feels more appropriate than a more rushed debate. I was in the youth debate immediately before and people had three minutes each; this feels much more appropriate so that we can go into a bit more depth on this important issue. However, I agree with the noble Baroness, Lady Bennett, that this is about the type of society we want to be.
On the issues in my noble friend’s Question, I will discuss the treatment of human remains, first in museums and secondly at public auction, before turning to what I hope are some helpful next steps we will take as a Government in the coming weeks. I apologise that some of this reflects the current position we are in and not necessarily where people might wish us to be.
Although I acknowledge that museums are operationally independent of the Government and that decisions relating to their collections are for their trustees to make, I expect them to be respectful in the way they care for and display human remains. I agree with my noble friend Lord Boateng that this country should lead in relation to best practice—a point also made by the noble Baroness, Lady Black. Arts Council England clearly requires museums to abide by the long-established code of ethics, overseen by the Museums Association, as a prerequisite for museum accreditation. All museums in England are able to remove human remains from their collections. National museums in England, which otherwise have legal restrictions on the disposal of items in their collections, were permitted by the Human Tissue Act 2004 to remove human remains from collections, provided that they are reasonably believed to be the remains of a person who died fewer than 1,000 years ago.
My noble friend Lord Boateng and the noble Earl, Lord Effingham, referenced the Pitt Rivers Museum, which has, for example, taken steps to remove all human remains from public display and is working to contact descendant communities to agree ways forward. As noble Lords will be aware, DCMS issued guidance for the care of human remains in museums in 2005. This encourages museums to establish an advisory framework to assist in determining repatriation claims and provides a set of criteria that need to be taken into account in assessing claims. I read this guidance this morning, and it is clearly 20 years old; the world has changed substantially, as yesterday’s APPG report makes clear. It is also clear that, sometimes, incomplete collections and databases make it really difficult to know what and where human remains are held—which, in this age of digitalisation, seemed surprising to me, although I am not an expert.
My noble friend Lord Boateng referenced the British Museum and the issue of the tattooed Māori heads. DCMS Ministers regularly meet with the British Museum’s chair and directors, and I will ensure that this is raised with them, as well as other issues raised during the debate.
As I mentioned earlier, the majority of museums in England would be able to return mummies and mummified remains. However, the cut-off date in legislation is currently a thousand years from the date the relevant sections came into force. Although many museums do undertake extensive and detailed work while looking at the return of human remains, documentation establishing the provenance of some human remains is often incomplete, lacking detail or incorrect. As a result, the research and identification process is a challenging and resource-intensive task. I am not underplaying the importance of that task; it is a vital piece of work to ensure that the human remains are treated with appropriate respect.
Since the introduction of the Human Tissue Act 2004, a number of successful repatriations of human remains have been made. For example, the Natural History Museum has returned the remains of just under 600 individual people to a number of countries, including to communities in Australia, New Zealand and Hawaii. They are continuing with detailed provenance investigations to inform potential future returns.
I understand that museums often hold repatriation ceremonies when returning ancestral remains, to try to ensure that the communities involved feel that they have an opportunity for healing and to honour their ancestors. We are in regular contact with relevant museums and we support them in their work to return human remains. This includes recent meetings to discuss the concerns raised, the communities impacted and recommendations for further action.
The topic of the sale of human remains via auction houses, online or by any other means was spoken to at length by the noble Baroness, Lady Black of Strome. As she made clear, while the Human Tissue Authority created by the Human Tissue Act in 2004 regulates the public display of human remains, it does not cover sales or purchases, as the Act does not regulate the sale of human remains that were not intended for transplantation.
Over the course of the week since I started preparing for this debate, I have been appalled by the type of objects that are readily available online. In my view, it is appalling and unacceptable. UK auction houses have to set their own standards and best practice in this area, taking into account the consent and licensing provisions of the Act as it stands. As DCMS officials have already relayed to the sector’s representative bodies, the Government expect all organisations and individuals to act appropriately and respectfully in relation to these sales.
I turn briefly to the UK art market—this is not art, in my opinion. However, we have one of the largest art markets in the world and play host to some of the most renowned institutions for the study and practice of art. This Government are committed to maintaining this reputation and want us to be a global centre of expertise, both in arts and in culture.
Although the sale of human remains is rejected by representatives of the UK art market, recent events, including, as mentioned by my noble friend Lord Boateng and the noble Earl, Lord Effingham, in Oxfordshire, have demonstrated that some auction houses are involved in the sale of body parts. This is hugely concerning. This Government call on all auction houses to scrutinise their activities rigorously and for anyone trading in human remains to consider very carefully the ethical implications of this deeply disturbing activity for those communities impacted.
As a Government, we must also consider how we can work together to address these issues, which cut across multiple departments. The Health Secretary met with Bell Riberio-Addy, MP for Clapham and Brixton Hill, in December, following concerns she raised in the other House on the topic of the sale of human remains online and via auction. In the last year, and again over the past few days, DCMS officials have raised the sale of human remains with the British Art Market Federation, the Society of Fine Art Auctioneers and Valuers and the Human Tissue Authority, as well as discussing the display and care of human remains from indigenous and other peoples in public collections with representatives from the museums sector.
We are now in a position to set up a cross-Whitehall meeting of relevant Ministers and policy officials to discuss a range of options, including legislative change, to prohibit the abhorrent sale of human remains and to further protect the dignity of those remains belonging to indigenous peoples.
I once again thank my noble friend Lord Boateng for bringing this topic to my attention and the attention of my department and the Government.
Lord Boateng (Lab)
Before the Minister sits down—she has given a very encouraging response to the Question—will she address the question of a possible meeting between indigenous communities, when they visit the United Kingdom in June and October, and her and other Ministers, because that would be hugely encouraging to this conversation? It must be said that when in the past they have met representatives of the British Museum trustees, they have not returned with an answer that was acceptable to those indigenous communities, and it would help them to meet with Ministers.
Baroness Twycross (Lab)
I was just coming to the point that I would be very happy to invite my noble friend to meet me, or another Minister from DCMS, to continue this conversation. I would be very happy to facilitate a meeting of the type he has requested. I am happy to commit to a meeting myself. I will pass on the request to other Ministers, as is appropriate in my view, rather than committing my colleagues to specific meetings, but I am very keen to work with him to discuss pathways forward to address some of the hugely disturbing and distressing practices discussed today, which should be for the past, not the present day.
Schools: World War II Anniversary
Debate between Lord Boateng and Baroness Twycross
Baroness Twycross (Lab)
I agree wholeheartedly with the noble Lord that the 100-year commemoration of the First World War was indeed powerful. Whether through activities in schools, conversations in the home with older relatives or the work of some of our fabulous museums, such as the Imperial War Museum, I wholeheartedly agree with him that living history is a hugely powerful way for children to gain an understanding of the past. Sadly, we will soon be at the point where we will not have the voices of people who experienced the Second World War, whether as veterans or as children. I am very clear that that should be incorporated into how schools, and we more broadly, mark these important 80th anniversaries of VE Day and VJ Day.
Lord Boateng (Lab)
My Lords, I declare my interest as chair of the Memorial Gates foundation. Over 600,000 African service men and women served alongside the British forces in World War II. Some are still living, including Warrant Officer Joseph Hammond, who served in the “Forgotten” Fourteenth Army in Burma. Will she meet with the foundation, the legion and others concerned to see how we can best facilitate the witnesses who are still living to make their contribution to the education of young people during the 80th anniversary?
Baroness Twycross (Lab)
We are keen at DCMS and across government to make sure that all voices are heard. I would be very happy to meet the organisations my noble friend has raised. We are clear that there were a huge number of troops and people deployed and that their voices and stories should be part of the commemoration of these important events.