Citizens Advice Bureaux

Lord Boateng Excerpts

Thursday 8th December 2011 Lords Chamber

Tabled By

[Lord Boateng]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what plans they have to secure the future of Citizens Advice Bureaux in the Big Society, in the light of the reductions in funding.

[Lord Boateng]

My Lords, I welcome the opportunity to initiate this short debate on the question of how Her Majesty’s Government plan to secure the future of the citizens advice bureaux in the big society, in the light of reductions in funding.

The quality and breadth of interest across parties in this subject, represented so late on a Thursday afternoon in this House, is indicative of the breadth of support and appreciation that the CAB movement has engendered through its activities across the country.

The Prime Minister has described CABs as “fantastic”. When asked, at the very outset of his introduction of the concept of the big society, how he would best exemplify it, the example he gave was of the citizens advice bureau movement. I believe that was an apposite example.

Let me declare my interest at the outset. I had my first job as a qualified solicitor working as a citizens advice bureau lawyer. I will in due course, no doubt, be in receipt of a modest pension from the Greater London citizens advice bureau movement, so I should declare that at the outset. What I learnt from my time as a CAB lawyer, and subsequently when seeking to serve my constituents in the other place, is that the CAB movement makes a real contribution to community cohesion, and access to rights and benefits. Importantly, it brings together voluntary activity in local communities, rural and urban, in ways that enhance the whole community through access to justice, knowledge and information. Importantly, it also saves the state a very great deal of money. That is why this debate, and the question raised with the Government, are of significance: because of the current crisis in funding that is affecting the CAB movement.

The scale of that crisis was indicated by the chief executive of Citizens Advice, Gillian Guy, to the Public Accounts Committee, when she gave evidence in the course of its inquiry. She said that it was not just an issue of local government funding, important though that was, because without local government funding there is not the core funding that allows CABs to do what they do in the local community. The cuts in local government funding, she revealed, generally average about 10 per cent. That, by itself, would be bad enough, except that those figures mask the considerable range in the impact of those cuts. Some bureaux will lose between 60 per cent to 100 per cent of their entire local government funding.

As Gillian Guy pointed out, other bureaux, where the local authority has recognised the very real contribution that local CABs make to the delivery of their services and have left their funding intact, will face a crisis because 25 per cent of some of their funding comes from the legal aid fund. As noble Lords well know, legislation currently going through this House and through the other place will effectively bring an end to that funding, so that bureaux will lose an additional £20 million of funding as a result.

Why am I, a former Chief Secretary to the Treasury, urging more public expenditure in this area? It reminds me of the pieces that appear from time to time in a certain sort of newspaper in which an alcoholic recommends temperance. I have not suddenly undergone a conversion to the joys of public spending, but the figures reveal the startling savings to the public purse that come from expenditure on advice. For example, every pound spent on housing advice potentially saves £2.34; every pound spent on debt advice could save £2.98; every pound spent on benefits advice potentially saves £8.80; and every pound spent on employment advice can save the state £7.13. CABs offer real value for money. That is why we should view the current crisis in the funding of the CAB movement as a matter that requires urgent attention from the Government.

One recognises that the Government have taken some steps, which are welcome, to bridge the funding gap. However, we should be clear about what the steps are. They all represent transitional funding. There is no offer of sustainable funding beyond the period covered by the transitional funding. I fear that the result will be a degree of uncertainty affecting the CAB movement that will make it impossible to plan for the future. People who provide real, important and significant services to local communities are now faced with redundancy. The Government have announced a review of government funding of advice, led by the Cabinet Office, and that is welcome. Of course, the CAB movement will contribute to that review, but the concern is that it should be a comprehensive piece of work that will look right across government for input. There is also concern that all those with an interest in advice provision should be engaged in the review; that we should look not for top-down models of funding advice centres—because all experience shows that they tend not to work—but for a means of funding that will allow local communities to set priorities, with funding mechanisms that are able to meet those priorities; and that any conclusions of the review should be fully funded. If they are not, I fear that the future of CABs will be bleak indeed.

I end by suggesting that we look at the communities we know best. My local CAB in Brent is faced with the reality of these cuts. What sort of clients will find themselves most affected? Brent CAB gave the example of a disabled mother who as a result of the advice that she was given on the warm home discount scheme is now able to obtain a £120 discount on her electricity Bill; and of a disabled elderly client who needed to replace her worn-out boiler and restore some warmth to her home. She was not aware of her rights or of how Carillion had failed her. As a result of the CAB she became aware of her rights and this winter she will live in a warm home.

CABs are about enabling communities. They are about enhancing lives. They do so in cost-effective ways. They involve highly skilled and qualified volunteers who require organisation and training, which costs £1,600 but produces a benefit to the community that is so much greater than that. All that requires core funding and access not just for generalist but for specialist advice, and it has to be funded.

I ask that the Government produce a joined-up approach to this, that the review be comprehensive and that we go to the Treasury to seek that that review’s outcomes are fully funded. Then we really will have a contribution made by CABs to a big society that is more than just a form of words.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Wilcox]

I will try to answer the questions as I go along, because, first, that means noble Lords do not have to wait for me to write the answer, and secondly I can try to fit them into what I am saying so that it has some kind of flow. But more than likely I will not get it right and will wish I had not started this way. I will try to continue. The noble Lord will get his advice.

The noble Lord, Lord Shipley, spoke about the policy to protect the vulnerable. The advice sector review is seeking the input of a wide range of advice sector stakeholders, including national and local advice organisations, representative bodies, funders and other organisations that have an influential role in this sector. Continual provision of services to vulnerable consumers will be at the centre of this review, and I hope that this reassures the noble Lord, Lord Shipley, that we are looking at it.

I am pleased that my department continues to support the national umbrella bodies that support the local bureaux, but the same cannot be said of local authorities. In a number of areas, the delivery of services by local bureaux has been seriously affected by local authority spending cuts, despite clear guidance from central government that voluntary organisations should not be seen as a soft target by them.

The current financial climate is such that all avenues must be explored in finding efficiencies and unlocking savings, and because of their experience, creativity and closeness to communities, voluntary groups can frequently deliver them.

[Lord Boateng]

Given the failure of many local authorities to take the advice and guidance from government, I wonder if the Minister would reflect, and perhaps come back to us, on the desirability of her department encouraging consideration within government of whether to impose a duty on local authorities to make provision for advice in their areas. Surely experience shows us that when local authorities do not take guidance from central government there is a requirement at least to consider imposing a statutory duty on them to do so.

[Baroness Wilcox]

As a result of the debate that the noble Lord called, I can take back what he suggested. I cannot respond at the moment, but a debate such as this allows things like that to be said, on which I will go back and reflect—as I will on everything that was said, including the question of the noble Lord, Lord Phillips, to which the answer is, “We will write to Lord Phillips”. So I cannot give him the answer now, for which I apologise.

The current financial climate is such that all avenues must be explored to find efficiencies and unlock savings. Because of their creativity and experience close to communities, voluntary groups can frequently do this. Local authorities should look to strengthen, not weaken, their ties with the voluntary sector. I am pleased that councils such as Reading, Hackney, Thurrock and Wolverhampton have recognised this. Certainly I will take back the comments that the noble Lord, Lord Boateng, has just made.

I felt that this debate was almost a forerunner for the Committee stage of the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Bill. I also felt that I could not tell noble Lords very much more than what we are doing at the moment, which is almost all that I have done. It simply remains for me to recognise the excellent work carried out by Citizens Advice nationwide. In future, our goal is for Citizens Advice to be at the heart of providing consumer information, advice, education and advocacy. In the mean time, I am glad that my department's financial support for the central operations of the Citizens Advice network helps bureaux to go on being the mainstays of community life.

As I said, I will take away the speeches that emphasised the urgency of need, and in particular the speech of the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Newcastle, who spoke so movingly of the need in rural areas. It is easy to forget when we spend so much time in central London that the area I come from—Cornwall—and the area he reflected on are large areas with small populations where it is very difficult to get advice.

I will take back the reflections of my noble friend Lady Gardner on the fact that language is sometimes a barrier, not an access, and that we must be careful to make sure that everything does not happen online. I hope that the results of the review that I reflected on will enable the Government better to reflect what we have heard tonight.