LGBT People: Diplomatic Service

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Thursday 18th January 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I agree with the noble Lord, and I assure him that, certainly in my time at the Foreign Office as a joint Minister and at the FCDO, we have made great strides forward. I recognise the importance of the recent announcement we have made, both to facilitate and to demonstrate directly that this is a modern department, dealing with complex issues in the world but, equally, we are proud of all our diplomatic staff.

[Lord Cashman (Lab)]

My Lords, I welcome this Question, which deals with an issue that some of us in this House have been working on for decades. Indeed, I was privileged to work with the noble Baroness, Lady Goldie, on widening this issue into the Armed Forces. It is always good to see the Minister at the Dispatch Box on this issue. May I suggest that he encourage the noble and learned Lord, Lord Etherton, to look at his report to see how it could be widened to deal with the diplomatic and intelligence services? Perhaps he could look at the Canadian model: the Canadian Government have considered equality of treatment for those in service to the Government, and I believe that serves as an excellent model.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I begin by paying tribute to the noble Lord for his work in this area, and to that of my noble friend Lord Lexden, too, for what has been done in this place. I also acknowledge the noble Lord, Lord Collins, on the Opposition Front Bench, because we have worked closely on this issue. Of course I will take the suggestion forward in working with other key partners. I have gone through the recommendations of the report, and I know that the MoD has already implemented just about half of them. I think the MoD is looking very much at, and is seized on, recommending the important financial reward element, which has been acknowledged as a principle. Of course, in the two departments we will want to see what can be learnt from that. There are different ways of working, and I am sure there are crossovers, which are being looked at actively as I speak.

Qatar: FIFA World Cup

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Thursday 24th November 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, first and foremost it is for every individual to make whatever support they wish to indicate any community and any suppression of human rights. What is more effective in our advocacy—I am giving an answer and, while the noble Lord, Lord Scriven, may not wish to hear it, other noble Lords do. That is not the way of the House; it is appropriate to listen and hear. At the same time, I take on board what the noble Lord, Lord Addington, said. It is right that we make these issues very clear. Whatever issue of human rights is raised, we will raise it directly with the authorities, and we are working very constructively in this respect.

[Lord Cashman (Lab)]

My Lords, teams have been banned from wearing the rainbow armbands. As we have heard, the Qatari authorities have banned fans from wearing rainbow T-shirts and rainbow hats. Does the Minister agree that such overreactions help no one, certainly not FIFA and certainly not Qatar, and they do not suppress the human rights abuses that are being carried on within Qatar and the other Gulf states?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, on the noble Lord’s second point, we have a debate later today and I know we will discuss all elements of human rights. On his earlier point, I agree, as I have said. I am thankful to him and the noble Lord, Lord Collins. There were issues that arose in advance of the World Cup that were highlighted to me concerning particular demonstrations that took place, and I hope the noble Lord, Lord Cashman, feels that we handled that sensitively and effectively and resolved matters. That is the constructive way I am engaging on this issue.

Civil Society and Human Rights Defenders

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Wednesday 23rd November 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I am not sure of the date of commencement, but I will write to the noble Baroness. We work very closely on this agenda with Mexico. I know, for example, on issues of LGBT rights, on the Equal Rights Coalition we handed over in September the co-chairmanship among other countries to Mexico, so we have a comprehensive human rights dialogue with it. As I said, I will write to the noble Baroness about the date.

[Lord Cashman (Lab)]

My Lords, as we have seen from the tragic events in an LGBT club in Colorado and the staggering rise in trans hate crime in this country —there were 2,630 such crimes in 2021—hate speech, from wherever it comes, has devastating consequences. I would therefore like to ask the Minister this: what specific action are the Government taking to work with LGBT human rights defenders in countries where LGBT people are criminalised and where the death penalty exists for LGBT people, such as the United Arab Emirates, Iran, Nigeria, Saudi Arabia and Qatar?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, the noble Lord is right to raise these issues, and I pay tribute to his work on this important agenda. I assure him that, through our network of more than 280 missions around the world, we deliver direct diplomatic engagement and raise LGBT rights directly, even in those parts of the world. Again, there are noble Lords with whom I confer privately sometimes because of the sensitivity of the issue. I do not hold back; we hold those discussions quite candidly to ensure the rights of all citizens, whatever their faith, belief or sexuality, as we enjoy them here in the UK—notwithstanding the domestic challenges that the noble Lord highlighted. We continue to remain focused. Human rights should be universal for everyone everywhere.

Evacuations from Afghanistan

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Thursday 26th May 2022 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, again, the noble Lord speaks with great insight and knowledge of the situation. Yes, there was a decision that had been taken by the United States in relation to the NATO engagement in Afghanistan, and we were of course part of that engagement. It was very clear that, once the United States had made that decision to withdraw and the timetable had been set, we had to work to those parameters. The challenges that we saw were immense. I turn to the point on the speed, even on the day, at which the Taliban took over Kabul. There are now some incredible women leaders right here in London; they were sitting on planes ready to leave and do their daily business—no one expected the fall of Kabul as quickly as it happened. Equally, it is important that, when partners work together, they share intelligence so that, in extremely challenging and unprecedented situations, decisions can be made to deliver the best possible outcomes.

[Lord Cashman (Lab)]

My Lords, I wish to recognise the incredible work done by the Minister on this issue, particularly since the fall. I want to raise the issue of vulnerable groups. A large number of LGBT people who were hoping to get out of the country are now in hiding. Are the Minister’s Government still in regular contact with Amnesty International, Stonewall, Rainbow Migration and the other organisations that are working very hard and on the ground on this issue?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I assure the noble Lord that we continue to work with key groups that have links with NGOs on the ground. I referred earlier to some of the incredible, courageous women leaders; they are also very much part of my formal engagement, and are informing our decisions today and our medium and long-term policy when it comes to Afghanistan. On LGBT people and other minorities, the situation is dire—the noble Lord knows the Taliban’s approach to this issue. However, that does not mean that we should be deterred from our focus on and support for these communities in Afghanistan.

International Human Rights Day

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Thursday 10th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My noble friend makes a very important point and I share her view that human rights defenders go across all pillars of human rights priorities. Earlier this week I had a very constructive meeting with Amnesty International on this very issue. I assure my noble friend that I am looking to our key partners in that sphere to see how we can strengthen the various human rights pillars, be it media freedom, freedom of religion, addressing gender- based violence or LGBT rights. There are so many areas where human rights defenders play a brave role in the field, and it is right that we defend them.

[Lord Cashman (Non-Afl) [V]]

My Lords, today is International Human Rights Day, but not for trans people. In the United Kingdom, trans women and trans men face unrelenting organised attacks, defamation and blatant misrepresentation, which has created a climate of fear, sadly whipped up by some Members of your Lordships’ House. The attack is now on trans teenagers and their parents. Will the Minister discuss with other ministerial colleagues across government what legal protections can be afforded to trans people in the United Kingdom to allow them to live their lives without fear or harm and enjoy their human rights?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

The noble Lord highlights a very disturbing issue. It is right that, when we go out and defend human rights—particularly the rights of the LGBT community—we stand up for rights at home. I will certainly take those concerns forward. If he is aware of particular issues or cases, I ask him to write to both me and my right honourable friend the Minister of State for the Home Office. I assure him that, as a co-chair of the Equal Rights Coalition alongside Argentina, we are sharing best practice and promoting LGBT rights equality globally. Even in countries such as Pakistan, we have seen transgender legislation being brought forward, which is encouraging for a country that is substantially challenged on a whole range of human rights.

British Citizens Abroad

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Tuesday 24th March 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Cashman (Non-Afl)]

My Lords, many people are trapped overseas. As the Minister says, some routes are still open. However, people are being financially crippled because of the extortionate rise in some ticket prices. I declare an interest, with a cousin trapped in Brisbane. The hike in Emirates air tickets is quite rightly described as extortionate. Will the Minister, along with other Foreign Ministers, therefore put pressure on the airline carriers?

And, although this is not in the Minister’s remit—it has been raised with me by airline personnel—is he aware that social distancing rules are not being thoroughly followed in some UK airports?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

On the latter point, I am aware of it. I have family members involved in the airline industry in the UK, and that is a concern being addressed directly by colleagues.

In response to the noble Lord’s first question, I agree with him and we are working with airlines to ensure that any prices charged reflect the true nature of the emergency.

Freedom of Religion or Belief

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Monday 10th December 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I assure the noble Lord that I do not share that sentiment. This is important to me. I am proud of Britain remaining a bastion of human rights historically, currently and in the future, ensuring that we, along with our partners and friends, raise issues where there are human rights abuses. Sometimes that is done discreetly and effectively; sometimes we call them out publicly. That continues to be the case.

[Lord Cashman (Lab)]

My Lords, does the Minister agree that the defence of religious belief is paramount but, equally, that we should not go down the route of imposing religious belief and thereby using it to deny people their human rights in various parts of the world, not least in the 36 Commonwealth countries where religion is used as an excuse to deny lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people their rights?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

First, I agree with the noble Lord on the issue of forcing anyone to believe anything. My role is not just that of freedom of religion envoy; I am the envoy for freedom of religion or belief. “Or belief” is an important part of my role, ensuring that discrimination against anyone, including the LGBT community, is kept at the forefront of the agenda. Indeed, as part of our celebrations of 70 years since the charter, we announced that we will co-chair the ERC with Argentina from June 2019.

British Overseas Territories: Same-Sex Marriage

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Monday 23rd July 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

My Lords, first, I do not think that there is a double standard. The noble Baroness may recall my vociferous defence, as the Minister for the Overseas Territories, of the autonomy of the overseas territories, believing that it was right that they should continue to take forward the issue of the registers, as they were doing quite progressively. However, the will of the other place was such that the will of Parliament was upheld by the Government. We would rather not have been in that position. On this issue, we continue to respect the autonomy. However, at the same time, I assure the noble Baroness that we work very progressively. We have seen in recent developments in places such as Bermuda how the courts domestically are reacting to the importance of progressing this issue.

[Lord Cashman (Lab)]

My Lords, I know that the Minister is both personally and politically committed to human rights and equality. Therefore, can he help me out? According to the most recent White Paper on the overseas territories, published in 2012, the UK Government assume an obligation in relation to good governance of the territories, which includes the obligation,

“to ensure … just treatment and … protection against abuses”,

for the peoples of the territories. Therefore, can the Minister confirm that the peoples of the territories include LGBTI people? Notwithstanding his intention on behalf of the Government to engage, what concrete measures are they considering to ensure that LGBTI people can embrace and enjoy equality and human rights in conformity with the United Kingdom’s international legal obligations?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

First, on the latter point, I assure the noble Lord that we work very constructively with our British Overseas Territories to ensure that they comply with international obligations. Indeed, the progress we have seen in Bermuda is reflective of the fact that equality for all citizens, including members of the LGBT community, is safeguarded and that they will continue to be able to play a full and active role in the future. On the specific issue of equal marriage, as I said, we are engaging constructively and it remains the British Government’s position. The noble Lord mentioned the 2012 paper. The basis of that was to encourage and continue to support the overseas territories to make progress on this important issue directly themselves.

Commonwealth: Discriminatory Legislation

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Monday 21st May 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Cashman (Lab)]

My Lords, I welcome the £5.6 million fund and the commitment of the Prime Minister to address the discrimination faced within the Commonwealth. Does the Minister agree that, vital though it is to work with Stonewall, the Kaleidoscope Trust and others, it is imperative that we work with NGOs and individuals in those countries so that there is no suggestion of neocolonialism or imposition from outside?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I have a short answer for the noble Lord: yes.

Bermuda: Same-sex Marriage

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Thursday 8th February 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Cashman (Lab)]

My Lords, it gives me no pleasure to engage on this question. I refer your Lordships to my interests set out in the register, particularly as an officer of the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Global LGBT Rights. I know the Minister is personally committed—and, for all I know, the Secretary of State is also committed—but in the end it is government action that matters, and it has failed. The Government could have taken action because the Bermudan law is in breach of the Bermudan constitution. On those grounds alone, action could have been taken to prevent assent. Is the Minister aware that the Government’s credibility on the international stage on human rights and LBGT rights is now seriously damaged? This is deeply worrying, particularly in the run-up to the Commonwealth Heads of Government Meeting in April. Is the Minister also aware of the feeling of utter betrayal not only in Bermuda but in the wider international human rights and LGBT rights community?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I thank the noble Lord. We have talked about issues of LGBT rights in direct meetings and when I last met the APPG. I reiterate that we will continue to raise the rights of all LBGT people wherever in the world. In the context of the points he made on the Bermudan law, time will tell how that is tested. As I said earlier in the context of the ECHR, the test is that same-sex couples have legal recognition, which this new Act provides. On our future on the global stage, we have consistently raised human rights records across the piece, including LGBT rights. I assure the noble Lord as a Human Rights Minister that LGBT rights will continue to figure as a key priority whether in the Human Rights Council or elsewhere and we will continue to challenge discrimination in this regard.

Turkey: Human Rights

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Monday 29th January 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Cashman (Lab)]

My Lords, there have been worrying developments in Turkey recently, and the EU has been very vocal and effective. I refer specifically to the president’s denouncement of the established and renowned Boğaziçi University in Istanbul and the banning of any lesbian, gay, bisexual or trans exhibitions and cultural events in Ankara. Will the Minister join with others in reinforcing that such a ban, supposedly due to security concerns, should not be used to diminish the human rights and civil liberties of all citizens in Turkey, particularly those who are lesbian, gay, bisexual and trans?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

As the noble Lord will know, the United Kingdom did at that time make its position on this issue absolutely clear to the Turkish authorities and continues to do so. We will continue to raise it in international fora. Indeed, it continues to be raised in all our bilateral meetings and dealings with our Turkish counterparts.

Orlando Terrorist Attack

Debate between Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon and Lord Cashman

Monday 13th June 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

First, I say to my noble friend that our reports say no British citizens were impacted, and I am pleased to hear that all are safe. That said, he is right. I agree with his sentiment that we as Britain deal with these issues head on, and that means bringing people and communities together. The best response to any extremist or terrorist threat is to unite against such threats. By doing so, as we have done previously and are doing again today, we will show extremists of any guise that we will defeat their voices of evil.

[Lord Cashman (Lab)]

My Lords, as a member of the lesbian and gay community, I recognise that this attack on our community is an attack on us all, but does the Minister agree that we must not match hatred with hatred? We must inform and educate, and, above all, we must ensure that this extremism is not represented as coming from any one religion, theology or community. We must show that we have the quiet determination to resist it and ensure that such actions never happen again.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

I totally agree with the noble Lord’s sentiments, and of course agree that no religion endorses such acts of evil and hate. Recently we have seen sectarian issues arise here in the UK and indeed my own Muslim community was impacted in that way recently by the incident in Glasgow. Actually, my Ahmadiyya Muslim community puts forward a great slogan: “Love for all, hatred for none”.