Citizens’ Assemblies and Local Democracy

Debate between Jim Shannon and Debbie Abrahams

Tuesday 16th April 2024 Westminster Hall

[Debbie Abrahams (Oldham East and Saddleworth) (Lab)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered citizens’ assemblies and local democracy.

It is lovely to see you in the Chair, Ms Vaz. I am absolutely delighted to lead this Westminster Hall debate on how citizens’ assemblies can be used to enhance public engagement in political decision making, bringing benefits to our democracy and society as a whole.

As hon. Members may know, last month I introduced the Standards in Public Life (Codes of Conduct) Bill to Parliament. Many people across our great country and nation states feel that the UK Parliament—including MPs and Ministers who sit in this place—is disconnected from them and their lives. It is not just the poor behaviour of a few bad apples affecting how people feel; there is a much deeper malaise.

People have a growing lack of trust and confidence in politics and politicians. Last year, a King’s College London study of 24 countries found that the UK fares poorly in people’s confidence in the Government, political parties and even Parliament. Added to that, there is a marked difference by generation. Young people have experienced some of the biggest shifts in attitude: confidence in the Government among millennials in Britain has halved since 2005, falling to its lowest level on record, and generation Z has very low confidence in a wide range of other institutions, too.

In the Hansard Society’s audit of political engagement series, which was carried out between 2004 and 2019, people reported an increasing sense of powerlessness and disengagement over time. Similarly, polling by the think-tank Compassion in Politics showed that four out of five people have no respect for politicians, and that 40% of parents would be concerned if their child expressed a desire to become a politician, which is worrying if we want our democracy not just to survive but to thrive.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I congratulate the hon. Lady on bringing forward this debate. I always do research on these matters. Northern Ireland is fortunate to have its own citizens’ assembly with 75 members, which passed three high-level resolutions that made recommendations on the core themes of social care, change and strong leadership. Is the hon. Lady aware of Northern Ireland’s citizens’ assembly? Does she believe that it can foster better communication between people and their elected representatives? If so, would she add her support to it?

[Debbie Abrahams]

I was not specifically aware of the citizens’ assembly in Northern Ireland, although I am aware of many across our nation states and in other countries. They are seen as a mechanism by which elected representatives can maintain contact with their constituents on various policy issues throughout a political cycle.

Polling from the Institute for Government recently showed that two thirds of constituents do not think that the current Government behave to high ethical standards. Likewise, polling from the UK Anti-Corruption Coalition found that two thirds of voters believe that UK politics is becoming more corrupt. We know that when socio- economic inequalities are narrow, trust between different communities and groups increases, and the reverse is true when the inequalities widen. Of course, that is the situation we find ourselves in at the moment.

There are other good reasons for greater public engagement and deliberative policymaking, including through citizens’ assemblies. Before I was elected to this place, I served as a public health consultant and academic. My work was focused on tackling health inequalities and their main determinants—inequalities in income, wealth and power. It may surprise hon. Members to hear that there is an independent and universal effect on our health and wellbeing that relates to our status in a hierarchy. The process of engaging people in decision making and sharing that power has a positive impact on their health and wellbeing, in addition to leading to the development of better politics based on lived experience and consensus.

Errol Graham: DWP and Safeguarding Adults Board Inquiry

Debate between Jim Shannon and Debbie Abrahams

Tuesday 6th June 2023 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I commend the hon. Lady for bringing forward this debate. She has compassion and a heart for people who are in trouble, and we commend her for that. She often brings forward things that we all add our support to. Each day in our offices we witness people who have fallen foul of the DWP: those with extreme health difficulties, people who are desperate, people at their lowest—that is just the way they have had it. Does she feel that the DWP needs to be aware of those who need help, and that DWP staff need to be trained accordingly so that they can spot those who are in trouble? It is sometimes a knack, but I believe that is important.

[Debbie Abrahams]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. In fact, he was in the Chamber back in February 2020 when we had the previous debate and described some of these events. Three years on, nothing has changed. He is absolutely right: not only would it be nice, but it is a requirement. The DWP has a safeguarding requirement and a responsibility to ensure that the claimants who come to its attention are adequately protected.

Human Rights Day

Debate between Jim Shannon and Debbie Abrahams

Tuesday 14th December 2021 Commons Chamber

[Debbie Abrahams (Oldham East and Saddleworth) (Lab)]

Last Friday marked the UN’s Human Rights Day and the final day of the 16 days of activism against gender-based violence. I am delighted to formally mark the day in the Chamber tonight.

As many hon. Members will know, Human Rights Day is observed annually on 10 December—the day when in 1948 the United Nations General Assembly adopted the universal declaration of human rights. The declaration is a milestone document that proclaims the inalienable rights to which every one of us, as a human being, is entitled regardless of

“race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status.”

Its central tenet, set out in article 1—

“All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights”—

is as important today as when it was adopted just over 73 years ago.

I have a copy of the declaration in my office. I believe that its significance to humanity, having been adopted so shortly after world war two, must not be underestimated: it is the hope that we can be better than the horrors that we witnessed. However, although the declaration is recognised as part of customary international law, human rights abuses are still rife, even by countries that are signatories to the declaration.

The principles of equality and non-discrimination are at the heart of human rights, but we know that, across the world, including in the UK, the rights of women are constantly ignored. Our right to life is ignored: in some parts of the world, girl babies are seen as less important than boy babies. Our right to education is ignored: girls are still prevented from being educated, as we are seeing today in Afghanistan. Our right to marry whom we wish is ignored: forced marriage and female genital mutilation are still happening in the 21st century. So are our right to work in whatever job we wish, limited only by our abilities rather than by prejudice and discrimination; to be paid the same as a man doing the same work; and to be treated equally under the law and have domestic violence and rape recognised and responded to as the serious crimes that they are.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I congratulate the hon. Lady on bringing the matter forward; I very much support what she is saying. Does she agree that the increase in domestic violence during lockdown has shown that, even in our great nation, there is an endemic of gender-based violence that must be addressed? One way to do that is through education at a young age, which she referred to, and through prosecution of domestic abuses to a much higher degree. In other words, we must be hard on those who are carrying out the violence.

[Debbie Abrahams]

I agree that the rise in domestic abuse during the pandemic is a real issue. Yes, I believe that we need further strict enforcement, but I also believe that we need to educate not just the victims, but the perpetrators. Two women a week in the UK will die at the hands of a partner or ex-partner; as the hon. Gentleman mentioned, that gender-based violence has increased during the covid pandemic.

In conflicts across the world, where violence against women, including sexual violence, is used as a weapon of war, we must reaffirm and re-emphasise that women’s rights are human rights by holding those who commit such atrocities—they are atrocities—to account. As the UN has stated:

“There are deep inter-connections between ending such blatant violations of those rights, providing freedom from fear, and the right to security, dignity, equality and justice.”

To mark the International Day for the Elimination of Violence against Women last month and the start of 16 days of activism against gender-based violence, I hosted a virtual event to look at those issues locally and internationally. I was joined by activists, experts, campaigners and people from across Oldham and Saddleworth to discuss not just the issues, but what we can do to tackle violence against women and girls.

--- Later in debate ---

[Debbie Abrahams]

I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for her timely intervention, and I could not agree with her more. This is something that I want to raise in a moment, particularly in the context of Afghanistan. I congratulate her on all the work she does in the all-party parliamentary group, and I hope that I will be joining it soon.

It is hard to follow those words, but I would appreciate the Minister’s response on the gaps in support for victims and also on the need for a public health approach with a greater focus on prevention.

Turning to human rights and women’s rights at a global level, we know that in far too many countries they are ignored. As chair of the all-party parliamentary group for Kashmir, I have repeatedly raised my concerns regarding the human rights issues across Kashmir, which were documented most recently in 2019 by the United Nations Human Rights Office. The UN’s reports raised concerns about women’s rights and the reported use of gender-based violence in Jammu and Kashmir. Just in the last few weeks, a prominent human rights activist, Khurram Parvez, has been arrested by the Indian National Investigation Agency after he criticised Indian security forces for killing civilians and surreptitiously burying their bodies. I would appreciate a response from the Government on this issue. I raised it as soon as I became aware of it, but to date I have received no formal acknowledgement or information on the results of the Foreign Office’s investigations, and no response to my request to the Indian high commissioner.

The human rights abuses occurring in Kashmir may be the longest running, but that is by no means the only region where there are occurring. At my virtual event, we heard harrowing testimony about how sexual and gender-based violence is consistently used as a weapon of war with impunity. We heard from Christina Lamb, who has written widely on this, describing the testimonies of survivors she had interviewed from Syria to Myanmar to Nigeria. She said:

“The first time I realised the scale of rape as a weapon of war was when I was speaking to Yazidi girls who were kept as sex slaves by ISIS. One girl I spoke with was passed on 12 times between people as if she was a goat. One of the hardest stories I had ever heard was a 16-year-old girl who was kept as a sex slave by an ISIS judge and she told me the worst night of her life was when he came back with a 10-year-old girl and he raped the 10-year-old girl and she heard the girl crying for her mother all night. This should not be going on. This is a war crime, and these women need justice.”

Again, I would appreciate it if the Minister described what the Foreign Office is doing to get justice for these women, especially given the Foreign Secretary’s recent announcement of her campaign. The Minister will be aware that we have had years of words but little action, which is why perpetrators think they can rape and torture at will. Given that the Foreign Secretary has described this as a red line, what consequences are there from the UK Government for those countries that are not acting to tackle this?

The Minister will be aware of the plight of millions of Afghan women, many of whom are at serious risk of harm by the Taliban and to whom the UK has an obligation. The plight of Fatima Ahmadi, a former Afghan police officer, is just one such example. The Taliban beat her badly and pulled clumps of hair from her scalp in front of her nine-year-old son, who was also held at knifepoint. She has since fled to Pakistan but knows that her time there is also limited.

[Jim Shannon]

The right hon. Lady has a big heart, and perhaps that is the reason that we always come to support her debates. I commend her for her passion for her stories. Just today I applied to the Backbench Business Committee for a debate on the Afghan resettlement scheme, which will enable people from Afghanistan who need to move to another country to start a new life to come here. If she has the time, would she like to come to that debate in the new year?

[Debbie Abrahams]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman, and I would like that. I am just about to come to that subject. Given that it is now four months since the Afghan resettlement scheme was announced and it still has not got off the ground, I would be grateful if the Minister told us what is going to happen. I share the deep concerns expressed by several speakers at my event about the devastating manner in which the Taliban have rolled back the rights of women and girls in virtually every area—education, paid employment, freedom of movement and so on.

In conclusion, ultimately the issues of human rights and freedoms should not be politicised: they are universal and should be seen as such across the globe. However, the wide gap between men’s and women’s rights continues to plague our society. The 16 Days of Activism for the elimination of violence against women or one Human Rights Day is not enough to untangle the challenges we face. It is time for strong leadership advocating concrete action to ensure that it happens.

On a global level, our co-operation with countries should be based on our common interests and our common values. Co-operation with regimes that do not value individual rights and freedoms, that do not have the necessary internal legitimacy, or that are part of extremist terrorist groups is detrimental to our progress. As such, human rights need to be at the heart of UK trade policies and deals. As one contributor to the event, who has recently escaped persecution, said:

“Humanitarian aid, the protection of the rights of women and children, and the handling of the humanitarian crisis, should not be sacrificed in a game of politics and individual interests. Regimes with such discriminatory politics and policies should be held accountable for their actions towards their people internally and externally.”

Social Security Benefits: Claimant Deaths

Debate between Jim Shannon and Debbie Abrahams

Monday 24th February 2020 Commons Chamber

[Debbie Abrahams]

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I shall speak up.

As I was saying, the leadership determines the culture in an organisation. In a Department, that culture is determined by Ministers. It is a question not just of the policies and their implementation, but of the tone and culture that are related to their delivery.

We know that the Government’s health assessment process and sanctions regime leave sick and disabled people in fear and dread as they wait for the inevitable envelope to drop on their doormat inviting them to participate in a work capability assessment or a personal independence payment assessment, or possibly both. More than three quarters of claimants who appeal against assessment decisions telling them that they are fit for work have those decisions overturned, and that is because these are poorly people. We also know that in 2013 the death rates among people on incapacity benefit or employment and support allowance were 4.3 times higher than those in the general population, an increase from 3.6 times higher in 2003. That showed the level of sickness and ill health in that group of people.

Peer-reviewed research published in the Journal of Epidemiology and Community Health estimated that, between 2010 and 2013, work capability assessments were independently associated with an additional 590 suicides, 280,000 cases of self-reported mental health problems, and 725,000 antidepressant scripts. Not only are those assessments not fit for purpose; they are actually doing harm.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I congratulate the hon. Lady on her assiduity. She has made a name for herself in the House not only on behalf of her constituents, but on behalf of everyone affected by this issue. Does she agree that, in this day and age, for anyone to die in stress while awaiting rightful help and aid from the Government should be deemed nothing short of obscene and disgraceful, that the shame of it has an impact on every person who takes a seat in this place, and that what we need is an urgent change in the present system?

--- Later in debate ---

[Debbie Abrahams]

My right hon. Friend hits the nail on the head. There are systemic failures within the Department and they have to be addressed. This is just not good enough.

Jodey Whiting, who was from Stockton, died on 21 February 2017. She was a vulnerable woman with multiple physical and mental health illnesses, which left her housebound and requiring 23 tablets a day. That meant that she was entirely reliant on social security support. In late 2016, the DWP began to reassess Jodey’s entitlement to ESA. Jodey requested a home visit as she rarely left the house due to her health, and she had made it clear in her reply that she had

“suicidal thoughts a lot of the time and could not cope with work or looking for work”.

Despite this, the DWP decided that Jodey should attend a work capability assessment in January 2017. Unfortunately, Jodey missed that appointment and, on 6 February, the DWP decided to stop the fortnightly ESA payments that Jodey relied on. She was immensely distressed to learn that her last payment would be made on 17 February. With the help of her family, Jodey wrote to the DWP to explain the severity of her health conditions and to ask the Department to reconsider the decision to terminate her ESA, but that did not happen until after her death. She also received letters informing her that her housing benefit and council tax benefit would be stopped because they are linked to ESA. She told her mum, Joy, “Mam, I can’t walk out of the house, I can’t breathe, how am I going to work?” Jodey took her own life just three days after her last ESA payment on 21 February.

The Independent Case Examiner concluded that DWP was guilty of “multiple” and “significant” failings in handling Jodey Whiting’s case and found that the DWP failed to follow its own safeguarding rules five times in the weeks leading up to the suicide. In addition, a report by psychiatrist Dr Trevor Turner says that Jodey Whiting’s mental state was likely to have been “substantially affected” by the DWP’s decision to remove her out-of-work benefits for missing a work capability assessment that she did not know about. The case is now the subject of an appeal to the Attorney General for a new inquest, and I know from speaking to Jodey’s family today that they are desperate to know when they may hear from the Attorney General.

Then there is Stephen Smith. Last April, we learned that Stephen, the Liverpool man many people remember from the front pages of various newspapers and whose emaciated body was more reminiscent of someone from a concentration camp than 21st century Britain, had died of multiple organ failure after being found fit for work. But there are many, many more cases of DWP claimants dying, some of which I raised in last year’s Westminster Hall debate.

Jimmy Ballentine took his own life in 2018 after being found fit for work. Amy Nice also took her own life in 2018 after being found fit for work. Kevin Dooley committed suicide in 2018 after losing ESA. Brian Bailey died in July 2018, again taking his own life after being found fit for work. Elaine Morrall died in November 2017, taking her own life. Daniella Obeng died in December 2017, again taking her own life. Brian Sycamore died in September 2017, taking his own life after leaving a note blaming the DWP after failing his work capability assessment.

Mark Scholfield, who died in July 2017, was a terminal cancer patient who did not receive any UC before he died in spite of his illness. Chris Gold, who died in October 2017, was found fit for work following a stroke and was facing foreclosure when he died because he could not work. Lawrence Bond collapsed and died in the street in January 2017 after being found fit for work. Julia Kelly died in 2015, taking her own life after losing ESA for a third time. Ben McDonald took his own life in March 2015 after being found fit for work. Chris Smith, who died in 2015, had cancer and was found fit for work despite a terminal diagnosis.

David Clapson could not afford to power his fridge to store his insulin and died as a result in July 2014. Michael Connolly took his own life on his birthday in 2014 after losing his ESA. George from Chesterfield died of a heart attack in May 2014, eight months after being found fit for work despite having had three previous heart attacks. Robert Barlow died of cancer in April 2014 after losing his ESA. David Barr died in September 2014, taking his own life after losing ESA. Trevor Drakard took his own life in 2014. Shaun Pilkington—

[Jim Shannon]

The hon. Lady is referring to a number of names. When someone comes to my office or to the office of another MP talking about anxiety, depression or suicide, we always say to ourselves, “These people need help.” Is it not time for the Government to instruct office staff that action must be taken when they hear someone threatening suicide or meet someone who has tried to commit suicide?

[Debbie Abrahams]

Absolutely. I thank the hon. Gentleman.

This is unforgivable. These are people’s family members and we are failing them. We must not let this continue.