Food and Feed Hygiene and Safety (Miscellaneous Amendments) (EU Exit) Regulations 2019

Debate between Baroness Thornton and Baroness Walmsley

Tuesday 4th June 2019 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Thornton (Lab)]

My Lords, I congratulate the Minister on her explanation of this statutory instrument. We are of course back in the territory of whether there will a deal or no deal. Even more bizarrely, this will depend on the machinations of her party over the coming weeks and on who ends up as our Prime Minister. It is a bit surreal really, much like the parliamentary world we inhabit at the moment.

Earlier this year, as we approached the Brexit deadline of 29 March, we were regularly rushing through statutory instruments. It is just as well that the Prime Minister was able to secure a Brexit extension because, if we had left on 29 March, some of the so-called minor deficiencies that emerged with regard to food and feed safeguarding, which we are discussing today, might have turned out to be major quite quickly.

Crashing out of the EU means that the regulatory framework for food and feed, which has protected us in the UK for so many years, will cease to exist. I can see that the proposed amendments are critical to ensuring minimal disruption of food controls in the event that we leave the EU without a deal, and we on these Benches will support them. The changes seek to ensure a robust system of control which will underpin UK businesses’ ability to trade both domestically and internationally.

The first question I have concerns trichinella, a parasitic nematode worm which can be extremely serious and can cause disease in people who eat raw or undercooked meat from trichinella-infected domestic animals or game. I appreciate that this instrument provides assurance that testing requirements that ensure protection will continue after EU exit. However, is the Minister confident that we have enough capacity in this country to continue testing for that worm and its associated health risk? How quickly can the government put in place our own testing facilities? I would be grateful if the Minister could tell the House how much extra resource her department has allocated to make sure that we do not allow a loss of control in this area. I am aware that extra funding has been made available to the FSA to deal with Brexit, but the Minister could help the House by being specific about the amount of extra resource that would be available to ensure that those particular nematodes do not infect meat that might be imported into this country and eaten by people here. I am aware that the Minister in the Commons, Seema Kennedy, offered to write to my honourable friend Angela Eagle about this matter. Did she do so and can the letter be made available here?

The instrument states that facilities approved by EU member states would in future no longer be automatically approved for food imported from the UK. I repeat the question that my honourable friend Sharon Hodgson MP asked in the Commons: does the Minister know what impact that will have on supply and businesses? How long will the process be to approve facilities for food imported from the UK, and when will a list of approved facilities be available?

The instrument also includes provisions to set minimum charging rates for hygiene controls for fishery products by amending, as the noble Baroness said, the Fishery Products (Official Controls Charges) (England) Regulations 2007. Will the Minister outline what the charges will be and what impact any new set rates could have?

The Explanatory Memorandum for the statutory instrument states that functions currently undertaken by the European Commission in adopting some implementing regulations rendering applicable the controls on imported food will in future be the responsibility of the Secretary of State. Can the Minister provide information on how decisions on those controls will be made and managed? What will the arrangements be for collecting data monitoring the effectiveness of the regulations and for regularly reporting the findings? What bodies will be able to scrutinise performance and delivery? What assessment has been made of their capacity to take on that work, as my honourable friend Angela Eagle mentioned in the Commons?

Finally, what conversations has the Minister had with the devolved nations regarding this statutory instrument? Although the issues seem fairly technical, and potentially innocuous, they raise a few worries. This is about food safety, safety for consumers, consumer protection and food supply in general. Should we leave the EU European Union, a range of duties will transfer from where they have been carried out in the past for many years, in the EU, not just back to the UK but to four different bodies due to devolution, one of which is not even sitting at the moment because of what has been happening in Northern Ireland. So will the resources be available in the devolved authorities to cover these issues?

My honourable friend Angela Eagle said in the Commons:

“Despite the Minister’s attempts to engage with some of my questions, I am still not entirely sure whether this is irradiation of things such as collagen, which in specific instances is derived from animals for human consumption, or whether it is about more general irradiation of meat and vegetables that are for public consumption, which happens in the US”.—[Official Report, Commons, Third Delegated Legislation Committee, 13/5/19; col. 9.]


I agree that the answer the Minister in the Commons gave begged more questions, so let us have another go. That is probably appropriate today, when the President of the United States of America has made it clear that all our regulatory regimes will be on the table and up for negotiation, along, of course, with the NHS.

It is important to remember that the horsemeat scandal was not discovered by the enforcement processes in this country, but by testing in the Irish Republic. So we are right to be concerned that, post Brexit, things could go wrong due to weaknesses that have been created in our own enforcement system. I am looking for further reassurance from the Minister that the system we have, weakened by austerity and divided by devolution, will be robust enough to take on the extra duties that the Minister is adding through this statutory instrument.

[Baroness Walmsley (LD)]

My Lords, I too thank the Minister for outlining all the technical details of this SI. Of course, this instrument has been withdrawn from the Order Paper twice before. Some of the changes made since we originally saw it are small but crucial. We are lucky that they have been spotted, but that raises concerns for the industry that there may be others. Now that the leaving date has changed, are the Government planning on conducting additional scrutiny on the other SIs that are being rushed through this House to make sure that they are up to scratch? How do the Government intend to convey these changes to the relevant individuals and companies on whom they will impact?

I add my support to the question asked by the noble Baroness, Lady Thornton, about the capacity of the FSA. This is probably about the 16th time that we have asked the same question and we are still concerned about the capacity to replace all of the other measures.

Some of these changes reflect very recent EU law that has come into force, as the Minister mentioned, so what do the Government intend to do about any new EU law that might come into force between now and 31 October or whenever we happen to leave? Will these SI and the ones that preceded them have to be further amended if there are other changes to EU law?

The Minister mentioned that the system for minimum charging rates for hygiene controls of fishery products is somewhat out of date. Will the Government confirm whether they aim to change the pound-euro exchange rate from the 2008 level at which it is currently set? Although these charges, as we know, are rarely levied by local authorities, any change in the exchange rate, which could happen after Brexit, could have a big impact on the ability to pay of those against whom the charge is levied. We saw a big difference in the rate of the pound against the euro after the 2016 referendum, and the way in which we might, unfortunately, leave the EU, could have a similar serious effect on the exchange rate. What are the Government planning to do about those charges if there is such a big change in the exchange rate? Are they planning to bring it up to date from 10 or 11 years ago?