Neighbourhood Planning Bill

Debate between Baroness Parminter and Lord Kennedy of Southwark

Committee: 3rd sitting (Hansard): House of Lords
Monday 6th February 2017 Grand Committee

[Baroness Parminter (LD)]

My Lords, I have Amendment 38 in this string of amendments. With one in six homes at risk at present, it is quite clear that homes need to be built which protect residents from increasing flood risk. I have put down this amendment because I noted that the Government, both on Report and in Committee in the Commons, were remarkably un-keen to delete this clause, so my thinking is that there is more than one way to skin a cat. If one feels as I do about the issue of flood risk, there is perhaps the potential for exemptions. I have tabled this amendment because all the evidence from around the UK shows that we need drainage standards and designs for drainage to be agreed up front. If they are not, it is not good for the housebuilder or the local authority, and it is certainly not good for the home owner.

In Scotland there is a legal requirement to have sustainable drainage on any development, but developers are not obliged to engage with Scottish Water on the design and building up front. This results in housebuilders producing their own designs, which Scottish Water then has issues with. The result is that 90% of these drainage systems are not adopted by Scottish Water. In Wales, however, developers have to have an agreement with the sewerage undertakers on a specific design before they start on-site. This system works and does not hold up developments. This shows that the designs for sewerage and sustainable drainage need to be settled at the beginning of the process, and local authorities need the powers to enable that to happen. If the prohibition on local authorities imposing pre-commencement conditions goes ahead, that cannot happen. What then will happen is that developers will not be certain about the drainage, the adoption or the maintenance, there will be commuted sum disagreements, developers will in all likelihood put the arrangements into a private company with no quality assurance on the drainage—it will probably end up being a tank somewhere in the ground rather than a scheme that enhances the environment or the area for the homeowner—and future flooding issues will be left for the local authority and the homeowner to pick up.

The Government have given us no evidence that there is a problem. The examples the Minister sent round in the letter to noble Lords were just a series of quotes, mainly from the annual reports from the housebuilders. I have gone through the government consultation and there is no indication of the scale of the so-called problem, and no single citing of a concrete example. It is therefore no surprise that only a minority—44%—of those who undertook the government consultation supported the proposal to prohibit local authorities from imposing pre-commencement conditions. Therefore, there is not majority support from the Government’s consultation for this measure to go ahead.

Of course, planning conditions imposed by local planning authorities should be reasonable and necessary. However, as the Government themselves said on 24 January in response to the EFRA Committee’s report on flood prevention,

“the robust planning approach in place is the best way to control development so that it does not add to flood risk”.

As such, pre-commencement conditions should be seen as a positive tool to deliver this, as well as to ensure that permission can be granted.

To be blunt, this approach is also putting the cart before the horse. After a battle with noble Lords, Clause 171 of the Housing and Planning Act requires the Government to review planning law on policy relating to sustainable drainage in England. That review by DCLG and Defra is currently under way and is due for completion by April. At this point I must say that I am grateful to the Minister for the offer of a meeting on that issue, which I understand is now scheduled for later this week.

The Government have provided no real evidence that there is a problem. Evidence from Scotland and Wales shows that we need to ensure that flooding conditions are settled up front, and there is a real risk here of pre-empting any decisions following the Government’s own review, which we are expecting in the next few months. On that basis, it is absolutely essential that the Government address the issue, and if they will not go as far as removing the whole clause, they should make exemptions for important issues such as dealing with flood risk; otherwise, we will be putting home owners of the future in real danger.

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark (Lab)]

My Lords, I will make my usual declarations as we start this the third day in Committee on the Neighbourhood Planning Bill. I am an elected councillor in the London Borough of Lewisham and a vice-president of the Local Government Association.

This first group of amendments is concerned with Clause 12 and Schedule 3. Government Amendments 28, 35, 40 and 42 all seek to add the word “relevant” before “grant of planning permission”. Perhaps the noble Lord can tell us a little more about why this is deemed necessary and it was not in the Bill in the first place. All the amendments tabled by myself and my noble friend Lord Beecham, who will be with us later—he is attending a funeral at the moment—are probing in nature. They seek to understand the Government’s thinking so that we can be clearer on the objectives, challenge the Government and provide alternative solutions.

Amendment 29 tabled in my name and that of my noble friend seeks to put in the Bill a provision for the Secretary of State to allow local planning authorities to make exceptions to the power being taken by the Government in Clause 12(1)(a) to (c). It is becoming clear how inappropriately named this Bill is—it is a complete misnomer. In this clause the Government are again taking more powers to order local authorities to do things. I can see nothing “localist” about that and nothing that supports neighbourhood planning in any way, so Amendment 29 would allow in a small way some discretion for local planning authorities to make exceptions. But of course, the clause is in the Bill because the Government believe that local planning authorities are holding up the planning process with lots of irrelevant conditions. As I have said many times before, I am a member of a planning committee and I have never had a developer come before the committee and say, “The conditions you are attempting to impose on us are holding up the development”. I agree with the noble Baroness, Lady Parminter, that the Government have provided no evidence for this whatever. It is just not the case, and if there are delays, the Government should be looking at how local government can recover the full costs of its fees so that it can afford more resources in its planning departments.

Amendment 31 seeks to remove lines 37 and 38 on page 10 of the Bill. This extraordinary provision again seeks to give additional powers to the Secretary of State. Amendment 21 seeks to add two specific points which are important, in that account should be taken of the public interest and the sustainability of any development. I hope that all noble Lords agree that these are important considerations in making regulations and therefore should be included. Amendment 33 seeks to amend the Bill so that consultation should include local authorities. I am sure the Minister will tell us that of course the Government intend to consult local authorities, and I will be pleased to hear that, but it would be useful if he set out on the record clearly and specifically whom they intend to consult, because leaving it to chance, very broad and off the record is not the best way to ensure that the relevant bodies and organisations can come forward with their views.

These proposals also need some kind of appeals process built into them. This taking of new powers is a considerable step forward on the Government’s part, and an appeals process would allow a local authority to make its case by bringing in relevant local factors, hence my tabling Amendment 34. Amendments 36 and 37 address the need to seek a bridging agreement to pre-commencement conditions. This is a controversial part of the Bill and we are seeking to delete the provision or, if it remains, a way of dealing with the situation when agreement cannot be reached. A determination through a mediation process may be a way forward. As noble Lords will know, mediation is of course an established way to resolve problems. Again, it would be useful if the Minister told us today what he envisions will happen when the authority and the developer cannot reach agreement.

Housing and Planning Bill

Debate between Baroness Parminter and Lord Kennedy of Southwark

Tuesday 10th May 2016 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Parminter (LD)]

My Lords, I very much welcome the comments made last night by the Minister in the other place, who said that he intends,

“to work with colleagues to ensure that neighbourhood plans enjoy the primacy that we intend them to have in planning law”.—[Official Report, Commons, 9/5/16; col. 462.]

I wholeheartedly endorse and welcome that commitment. However, I have prepared what I believe to be a significant compromise on the proposal that was agreed by this House during our last debate as a means to do just that.

Our previous amendment included a right of appeal—a limited one, but a right of appeal nevertheless. I understand that the Government saw that as a third-party right of appeal, which they did not wish to agree to. Therefore the amendment before your Lordships today does not push a third-party right of appeal but proposes a right to be heard. The proposal makes it clear that local authorities should have special regard to the policies in neighbourhood plans. It proposes that planning authorities must consult with neighbourhood plans and take account of their views before decisions are taken and, crucially, it provides for a call-in decision. I heard what the Minister said about call-ins if neighbourhood plan groups wish to ask for a call-in before a local authority makes a decision, but, crucially, they do not have that right once local authorities have refused an application which is contrary to that within a neighbourhood plan. That is a major barrier to encouraging more local groups to get involved in neighbourhood planning, which this House—and the Government—has said on many occasions we want to achieve because we know that neighbourhood plans deliver more homes.

The Bill needs to do all it can to ensure that local people invest the time and the effort in putting together neighbourhood plans so that we get the housing we need through consensus. Giving this extra weight to neighbourhood plans by allowing for this right to be heard—not a right of appeal—will mean that their plans will not be ignored or easily overturned. That seems a key to encouraging more neighbourhood plans to come into being, which is what the Government and all noble Peers have made it quite clear we want to achieve. This is a compromise amendment, therefore, on that basis, I beg to move.

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark (Lab)]

My Lords, first, I refer noble Lords to my declaration of interests and declare that I am a locally elected councillor in the London Borough of Lewisham.

We have discussed the neighbourhood right of appeal on a number of occasions in your Lordships’ House, and I was convinced that the limited right of appeal, which the noble Baroness, Lady Parminter, has put forward on a number of occasions, was the right approach. However, despite that and numerous discussions, the Government have not been persuaded that this is the correct way forward. That is disappointing.

The government amendment agreed in the Commons makes some moves in the right direction but, as the noble Baroness told the House on 4 May, what is proposed here, set out on page 5 of the Marshalled List before us today, is what you would expect any good local planning authority or planning officer to do anyway. Therefore, I am under no illusion that what is before us from the Government is a particularly significant concession. As I said earlier, that is disappointing, and we should go a bit further.

When I look at this Bill, I often reflect back on the Localism Act. It appears that the government Benches are less keen on localism than they may have been a few years ago. In general, they talk about localism when they like what is going on, and when they do not like it, we have to do what they say. As I said, there is a bit of a hokey-cokey on localism from the government Benches. That is not the way to go, and it is disappointing. The noble Baroness has given us another possibility, and maybe we will have some good news from the Minister.

Housing and Planning Bill

Debate between Baroness Parminter and Lord Kennedy of Southwark

Wednesday 4th May 2016 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Parminter (LD)]

My Lords, we all believe that neighbourhood plans deliver more homes. However, it is not just a belief; it is also the evidence that the Government accept. We heard them accept it in both Committee and on Report. Therefore, we wish to do all we can to encourage more neighbourhood plans to be produced in order to deliver the housing that we all know we need.

Our central contention is that we do not believe that local communities will go to the trouble of putting forward neighbourhood plans if they know that a local planning authority can drive a coach and horses through everything they have submitted by reaching a decision that conflicts with what is in the neighbourhood plan. The appeal that we propose in this amendment is extremely limited and would apply only to parish councils and neighbourhood forums. It addresses the issues that Members have rightly raised on this and previous Bills about the scope for a limited right of appeal to allow vexatious complainants to come forward. As I say, this measure is purely for parish councils and neighbourhood forums.

We have listened to what noble Lords said on Report. Eagle-eyed noble Lords will have noticed that this is an even more limited appeal than that for which we argued on Report. At that stage, we argued that it should be open to local councils and parish councils which were concerned about a policy in an emerging plan as well as a made plan. This amendment addresses purely a proposal which is contrary to a neighbourhood plan.

The government amendment does nothing more than what good planning officers should be doing anyway. Noble Lords who are local councillors will know that planning officers are already doing this. The measure does not address one of our fundamental concerns—namely, if a local planning authority opposes, and turns down, an application which is contrary to a neighbourhood plan, it cannot be called in. The Minister said that a call-in process applies, but it does not apply if a local council accepts a proposal which is contrary to a neighbourhood plan, so, effectively, under the government amendment, councils can just ignore it anyway.

As I say, we are proposing an extremely limited appeal. It had the support of the House of Lords Select Committee on the built environment and civic society groups. In addition, a considerable number of Conservative Members supported it last night in the other place. One went so far as to ask the Minister in the Commons to give further weight to neighbourhood plans. That is what this limited right of appeal would do. I beg to move.

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark]

My Lords, it is remiss of the Government not to accept the amendment agreed by your Lordships’ House in respect of a neighbourhood right of appeal. The noble Baroness, Lady Parminter, has tabled a revised amendment which would restrict the right of appeal in certain circumstances only in those areas where there is an approved neighbourhood plan. As she said, this is a much narrower right of appeal than that originally proposed. If she wishes to test the opinion of the House, noble Lords on these Benches will support her. I support neighbourhood planning. This amendment would give a limited right of appeal, as has been outlined.

As I have told your Lordships’ House before, the ward I represent in Lewisham—Crofton Park—is in the process of drawing up a neighbourhood plan. We have not yet obtained full approval for it, so this amendment would not apply to us. However, it would give impetus to our efforts to carry on consulting local people and getting the local community plan approved. Then we can help local people.

The noble Baroness’s amendment would enable communities to be involved locally. The Government should support it. The Government have adopted a rather hokey-cokey approach to localism during the Bill’s passage. When they agree with measures, they trumpet the fact that they are in favour of localism and letting local authorities decide things. However, when they do not like something, they say that local councils cannot obstruct the will of central government, which needs to decide these matters. The Government have no consistency—it is in; it is out; it is in; it is out. That shows no respect for localism, local people or local communities and is no way to formulate policy. It makes a mockery of the Government’s own Localism Act, which was passed only a few years ago.

We heard the myth from the noble Baroness, Lady Evans, about local planning authorities holding up housebuilding. I tabled a Parliamentary Question on this. On 4 April, I was told by the noble Baroness, Lady Williams of Trafford, that there were permissions for 658,000 homes to be built in England that had been either not started or not completed. These are approved homes. Therefore, I do not think that local planning authorities are holding these things up. We need to get these homes built; the permissions are there.

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark]

Before the noble Baroness sits down, she originally implied that local authorities and planning committees were holding up all the development. The Parliamentary Answer of 4 April stated that hundreds of thousands of planning permissions have already been agreed and approved but the houses are not being built. That is the problem. It is not local authorities or planning committees which are doing this.

[Baroness Parminter]

My Lords, I stand by my assertion that the Government’s amendment offers nothing beyond that which good local planning authorities are already doing. It does not address the issue; even if they are doing it, councillors can then go on to make a decision that overturns the policy of a neighbourhood plan or forum and that the call-in cannot be used by that local group, because there cannot be a call-in if a local council approves a policy that is contrary to a local plan. Equally—this is really important for rural areas—call-ins do not apply for housing developments of less than 10 homes. Given that so many neighbourhood groups and parish councils are putting together their neighbourhood plans in rural areas, we need something that gives them a sense of certainty over their plans.

I accept what the noble Baroness, Lady Evans, said—this could be interpreted as a limited third party right of appeal. But it is not for individuals; it is only for neighbourhood councils and parish councils, which have to go through a process of getting their plan to go through a public referendum and then be approved by a council before they can have their plans approved. Secondly, the limited right is only if they then get a two-thirds majority of the parish council or neighbourhood forum to agree to proceed with an appeal. It is a very limited right that I have asked for. We have moved some way; I am sorry to say that I do not think the Government have moved far enough and I wish to test the opinion of the House.