Palestine Statehood (Recognition) Bill [HL]

Baroness Northover Excerpts

2nd reading
Friday 14th March 2025 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Baroness Northover]

That the Bill be read a second time.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, thank you for being here today for my Private Member’s Bill on the recognition of Palestine. In the light of recent proposals by President Trump and huge global instability, I think that this Bill has become even more vital. The idea that Gaza should be cleared out and its population moved to other countries to become an American riviera is deeply shocking. My Bill would require the Government to recognise Palestine as a sovereign and independent state on pre-1967 lines, just as almost 150 of the 193 UN countries have done. Some say that recognition is merely symbolic, not changing anything on the ground, but recognition has importance—that Palestinians have the right to self-determination, national rights and the legal benefits of that, just like Israelis.

Some say that it is too late: the Swiss cheese effect of Israeli settlements, roads, walls and checkpoints in the Occupied Palestinian Territories means that a contiguous Palestinian state is no longer viable. The actions and words of the current Israeli Government seem intent on making it even less likely. Several Israeli Ministers have been clear that they will never accept such an outcome.

Nevertheless, most countries, including the UK, remain committed to a two-state solution. Probably most speakers today, including the Minister, will support this, but if it is to be delivered it becomes urgent to take it forward, lest it becomes impossible, with ramifications both for Palestinians and for the long-term future security of Israel.

Some say that recognition now would be seen as a reward for the Hamas terrorists who carried out the atrocities of 7 October. Absolutely not: this would be the long-overdue recognition of a state for the Palestinian people, not for a particular group. As Sir Vincent Fean, former British consul-general in Jerusalem, has said:

“The voices of moderation on both sides need encouragement”.


They need the hope of a political process. As three Israeli former ambassadors—who, by bravely speaking out, face much opposition—have said,

“recognition would not benefit the Palestinians alone. At this point in time, there can be no greater contribution to peace and security for us Israelis as well”.

Britain, of course, has a special responsibility. The 1917 Balfour Declaration was made here. Balfour spoke of a national homeland for Jewish people in Palestine, but he also spoke about safeguarding the

“civil and religious rights of … non-Jewish communities”.

Israel was recognised in 1948, in the wake of appalling Nazi horrors and centuries of persecution, but no state was established alongside for the displaced Palestinians. This was never likely to be settled and stable, and so it has proved.

We know that Israeli Governments have opposed Palestinian sovereignty and sought to freeze out those countries, most recently Norway and Ireland, that have recognised Palestine. The former ambassadors state:

“Reluctance by key western states to recognise Palestine has fed Israel’s misguided belief that the bestowal of Palestinian independence is its prerogative, to be conferred when the Palestinians meet its requirements”.


But it cannot be the case that an established state should be able to veto the recognition of a neighbour in its own territories. Neither can this be subject to negotiation and conditions.

In 2019, Luxembourg called for the EU to recognise Palestine. Its Foreign Minister said:

“Recognising Palestine as a state would be neither a favour nor a carte blanche, but rather a mere recognition of the right of the Palestinian people to their own state. It would not be meant against Israel”,


but a measure intended to pave the way for a two-state solution.

In 2011, William Hague, the then Foreign Secretary—and now the noble Lord, Lord Hague—stated:

“The United Kingdom judges that the Palestinian Authority largely fulfils criteria for UN membership, including statehood”.—[Official Report, Commons, 9/11/11; col. 290.]


Palestine was granted observer status at the UN General Assembly in 2012.

In 2014, the Commons voted for recognition, with the Minister’s support. In putting that Motion, Grahame Morris MP argued:

“Recognition is not an Israeli bargaining chip; it is a Palestinian right … As it stands, Israel has little motivation or encouragement … to enter into meaningful negotiations”.—[Official Report, Commons, 13/10/14; col. 64.]


Alan Duncan, as Minister, concluded that recognition was

“the other half of the commitment that our predecessors in this House made as part of the British mandate in the region”.

This was not, he argued, about recognising a particular Government:

“It is states that are recognised, not Governments”.—[Official Report, Commons, 13/10/14; cols. 71-72.]


In 2017, this House’s International Relations Committee stated:

“The Government should give serious consideration to now recognising Palestine as a state, as the best way to show its determined attachment to the two-state solution”.


It is my party’s position to recognise Palestine. The noble Lord, Lord Collins, as Labour’s foreign affairs spokesperson, stated repeatedly Labour’s commitment to the two-state solution. Thus, in 2024, he said that we need to

“give hope to that process and move towards recognising a Palestinian state, rather than waiting for the end of the process”.—[Official Report, 5/3/24; col. 1539.]

It is something with which the noble Lord, Lord Cameron, as Foreign Secretary, appeared to agree in early 2024, until reduced back to the traditional government line. As the noble Lord, Lord Collins, noted,

“when the Foreign Secretary made the original statement, he was very clear that we need to show irreversible progress towards a two-state solution … My right honourable friend David Lammy welcomed the Foreign Secretary’s comments, arguing that recognition should not wait for the final status agreement but should be part of efforts to achieve one”.—[Official Report, 13/2/24; cols. 148-49.]

The 2024 Labour Party manifesto stated:

“Palestinian statehood is the inalienable right of the Palestinian people. It is not in the gift of any neighbour and is also essential to the long-term security of Israel”.


So, to my very straightforward Bill. Clause 1 requires the recognition of Palestine

“as a sovereign and independent state on the basis of the pre-1967 borders, and the inalienable right of the Palestinian people to self-determination in the State of Palestine”.

The wording is taken from UN Security Council and General Assembly resolutions, specifying in the UN’s own terms what it means to be a recognised state. Clause 1(2) specifies that “pre-1967 borders”

“has the same meaning as in resolution 76/10 (2021) of the UN General Assembly”

and other such resolutions. Clause 2 recognises the mission of Palestine in London as “a full diplomatic mission”. Clause 3 requires the Secretary of State to report to Parliament within two months of the passage of the Act on steps taken to implement it.

This is all very familiar and all in line with what other countries have done: to recognise Palestine according to the pre-1967 borders, with any change to that to be achieved through negotiation. For those who argue that we cannot recognise a state without settled borders, we recognise Israel, rightly, but Israel itself does not declare its own borders; indeed, it claims the territory of other states. Britain recognised Israel in 1950 without the defining of borders or its capital; it did not wait for the outcome of negotiations.

This is solely a bilateral issue between Britain and Palestine. Labour’s stance in opposition created the hope that it would recognise Palestine, but hope for the Palestinians always seems to be over the horizon.

So if we hear once again that it is not the right time, in effect denying the same rights to self-determination that Israeli citizens have, then I will find myself thinking back, among other things, to a visit I made to Saudi Arabia with other parliamentarians in the mid-2000s. It was a time when the rights of women there were severely curtailed. In a break in our meetings, I went down to the pool in our hotel. “You can’t swim now”, I was told, “It isn’t the ‘woman’s hour’”. “When is the woman’s hour?”, I asked. “There isn’t one”, came the reply.

Recognising two states should have happened long ago. My short little Bill seeks to rectify that. I beg to move.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

I thank everyone for their contributions, including the one that we have just heard from the Minister. Strangely enough, I particularly appreciate noble Lords’ support, but here I single out how amazing it was to hear from the noble Lord, Lord Dubs, a Kindertransport child whose wise, generous and constructive contributions in Parliament over so many years bring him now to support my Bill. I am humbled and honoured that he did so.

I have been in this House for many years. I can hardly count the number of Ministers who have held the line, “Recognised but not now”, but have, when out of government, often deeply regretted that action on this was not taken. So I certainly hope that this Government will move forward, as the Minister indicated. The instability in the region and globally, which is terribly affecting Israelis as well as Palestinians, demands that this is more than urgent.

Bill read a second time and committed to a Committee of the Whole House.

Procurement Bill [HL]

Baroness Northover Excerpts

Consideration of Commons amendments
Monday 11th September 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab)]

My Lords, I will speak to my Amendments 102A and 102B. It is a great pleasure to follow the noble Lord, Lord Alton. I very much agree with the thrust of what he said and look forward to the results of his eagle eye, which I am sure will come to your Lordships’ House over the next months and years. Like him, I also thank the Minister for her stewardship of the Bill. It has taken so long that I recollect that on our first day in Committee, the noble Baroness herself had laid many amendments which she seemed to have to refute later on in proceedings on the Bill. At least she knows how it feels to have a government Minister reject so many well-argued points.

I thank the Minister also for what she said about the Government’s view of the appalling atrocities being committed in China, with the removal of organs from a living prisoner of conscience for the purpose of transplantation, killing the victim in the process. It is state sanctioned and widespread throughout China. The victims at the moment are known to be primarily Falun Gong practitioners, but most recent evidence suggests that Uighur Muslims are also being targeted on a massive scale, particularly in Xinjiang.

My amendment was supported by noble Lords all around the House on Report. Essentially, it gave a discretionary power to exclude suppliers from being awarded a public contract if they have participated in forced organ harvesting or unethical activities relating to human tissue, including where they are involved in providing a service or goods relating to such activities. The effect of the amendment would have been to prevent any service or goods that may have been involved in, or developed off the back of, the forced harvesting trade entering the UK. When it went back to the Commons, the Government took the provision out in Committee. This was challenged on Commons Report, led by my honourable friend Marie Rimmer. Despite support from MPs of all parties, that was not successful, so I am asking noble Lords to send it back to the Commons for further consideration.

My reasons, briefly, are threefold. First, the scale of the atrocities being carried out in China, specifically in Xinjiang, are becoming ever clearer and more horrific. Secondly, I believe that Ministers were wrong in dismissing the need for the amendment, both in the response they gave in the Commons to my colleagues and in the comments that the Minister has given tonight. Thirdly, I have to agree with the noble Lord, Lord Alton, that the context in which this is being debated is, frankly, that government policy towards China is completely inadequate to the threats that country poses to the interests of the United Kingdom.

On the scale of the atrocities, I can do no better than to quote what Sir Iain Duncan Smith said on Report in the Commons. He referred to the 2022 UN report, which found serious human rights violations in Xinjiang. He said:

“They seem to be about the most significant human rights abuses currently happening in the world,”—[Official Report, Commons, 13/6/23; col. 205.]


whether we use the term “genocide” or not.

What the Minister has essentially said is first that we do not need to do this because there is a discretionary power in the Bill already, and secondly that there is no evidence, as far as the Government are aware, that a supplier to the UK public sector has been involved in forced organ harvesting. On the first point, I believe that there is considerable merit in making explicit reference in the Bill to this matter, so that public authorities are in no doubt whatever that they can use a discretionary power to deal with companies that may be dealing, maybe inadvertently, in this abhorrent trade. Secondly, I think there is evidence of taxpayers’ money being spent on companies involved in forced organ harvesting. For example, pharmaceutical companies may be supplying immunosuppressant drugs to hospitals that have been reported to remove organs from prisoners of conscience.

As I have said, we cannot consider these matters without seeing them in the context of UK policy towards China. I am not going to repeat what the noble Lord, Lord Alton, said, nor to requote. We have now had our Lordships’ Select Committee, then chaired by the noble Baroness, Lady Anelay, the Intelligence and Security Committee and the Commons Foreign Affairs Select Committee, in its report only last month on the Indo-Pacific tilt policy. They all draw attention to the Government’s woefully inadequate response to the threat that China presents and to the very ambiguity there is in policy. We can see the obvious tension between our security, on one hand, and the willingness and wish of the Government to trade with China and to encourage Chinese investment, but I am afraid that, in trying to get a balance, we have ended up with a Government with a wholly inadequate and incoherent policy.

My amendment is very modest. All it does is give the decision-maker discretionary powers to exclude a supplier from a procurement contract if it

“or a connected person has been, or is, involved in … forced organ harvesting, or … dealing in any device or equipment or services relating to forced organ harvesting”.

It would be the first piece of UK legislation to include and define forced organ harvesting. It would be a huge step in preventing UK complicity in forced organ harvesting, and I urge the House to support it.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, I was a signatory to earlier amendments and we have just heard the noble Lord, Lord Hunt of Kings Heath, make a very cogent case for the Commons to think again about his amendments. I will be very brief, given the hour. The noble Lord built on what the noble Lord, Lord Alton, outlined just now, and his case is backed by international investigation and evidence. Thus, for example, the Office of the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, not an institution that would say this lightly, concludes in relation to Xinjiang:

“Allegations of … torture … including forced medical treatment … are credible”.


The Minister in the Commons and now the Minister in the Lords have argued that current legislation covers the problem identified in this amendment, but noble Lords will have heard the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, make a very persuasive case that this is not so. My noble friend Lord Fox will comment further shortly but, if the noble Lord decides to put this to a vote, from these Benches we will support him.

[Lord Fox (LD)]

Very shortly, it seems.

I thank the noble Lords, Lord Alton and Lord Hunt, for bringing forward these two amendments. I shall address them sequentially. I do not share the surprise of the noble Lord, Lord Alton, about supermarkets being able to lead. I am sure the Minister will probably agree that supermarkets are in contact with their customers. They sense the morality and the feelings of their customers, so they do not just lead—they follow. Perhaps we are a bit slow in picking up the moral revulsion that people have out there, and also the fear of scrutiny from a totalitarian regime. I think both those issues play with the public, the public play those back to the supermarkets and the supermarkets have very good antennae for picking them up. We should share their sensitivity to these issues.

The noble Lord made an excellent speech for which he is to be congratulated because, working from here back to the Commons, we have seen significant progress. We have seen a great deal of progress, and I support him in not having to move his Motion this time. He mentioned en passant the role of the Intelligence and Security Committee, and I endorse what he said. The Cabinet Office is now responsible for the National Security and Investment Act—there is a team there working on that—and it now has a team working on this. It behoves those teams, if they are not the same people, certainly to be close to one another, close to the ISC and able to feed off the intelligence that the ISC can give them, which no other committees can. I hope the Minister is able to reinforce that.

Procurement Bill [HL]

Baroness Northover Excerpts

Committee stage
Monday 24th October 2022 Grand Committee

Further action is urgently needed. This forced organ harvesting amendment to the Bill is essential to protect United Kingdom citizens. It will send a clear message to the Chinese Communist Party that the United Kingdom is a country that upholds medical and business ethics to the highest possible standards, and that we will speak out when we see the interests of Chinese people also being compromised in the way in which they have been.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, I am a co-signatory on this amendment and, from the Lib Dem Benches, we strongly support the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, in his endeavours to combat the appalling issue of forced organ transplantation. He has made a strong and comprehensive case, as did the noble Lord, Lord Alton—as ever. Like them, I am glad that Ministers have been responsive over the past few years in relation to these appalling practices. I hope that this continues. As the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, said, the amendment is designed to exclude suppliers located in a country

“at high risk of forced organ harvesting”

from being awarded a public contract involving

“any device or equipment intended for use in organ transplant medicine”

or in related regard—for example, research.

As the Minister will know, this House has a very well-informed and cross-party approach to combating forced organ transplantation. She will be aware of the significance of such obvious and lengthy cross-party working. I assume that this might rightly be in red on the risk register for the Bill. I have noticed that that might be the case.

I recall a few years ago that a Peer, who is a current government Minister, was praising the Chinese for the speed and apparent efficiency of their transplant programme. I am certain that they would not have expressed that view had they known what we know now. That is surely thanks to the assiduous work of the noble Lords, Lord Hunt and Lord Alton, and others. They, in turn, have been supported by the meticulous examination of the evidence by the China and the Uighur tribunals, both headed by Sir Geoffrey Nice, former prosecutor in the Balkans war-crimes tribunals. They shone a light on the terrible practice of forced organ harvesting. I noted that they found—as others have noted—that victims in China were targeted because of their religion, beliefs or ethnicity.

As the noble Lord, Lord Alton, has just said, the China tribunal concluded that forced organ harvesting has been committed for years throughout China on a significant scale; and that commission of crimes against humanity against the Falun Gong and the Uighurs have been proved beyond reasonable doubt. Noble Lords have also heard the view from the United Nations; securing that was very difficult to achieve. The noble Lord, Lord Alton, as ever, calls some of the individuals concerned into our view, so we cannot say that we did not know.

The medical profession has been accused in the past of turning a blind eye to such practices. The BMJ criticised the transplant community for failing to implement high ethical standards. I note, however, that, in the BMA’s briefing for the Bill, it states that,

“upholding ethical procurement standards is essential.”

It refers to the procurement of medical equipment, including PPE, from the regions in which labour abuses have been alleged. It states that it would support

“any amendments to strengthen the legislation to help ensure ethical procurement and transparency throughout the supply chains of health-related goods.”

That would certainly apply to this amendment. In addition, as we have heard, the UK enjoys a global reputation for high-quality medical research. It is something that the Government emphasise as being key to the United Kingdom’s future. As the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, has indicated, it is thus vital that we protect medical researchers from inadvertent involvement.

During the summer, in the then Conservative leadership debates, Rishi Sunak was asked about dealings with China. It is good that he acknowledged the potential human rights challenge. However, he also said that he sought to have a constructive engagement. This amendment would close a loophole, given that he has now been chosen by the Conservatives to be the country’s newest Prime Minister. It will help to ensure that the Government do indeed properly pay attention to human rights, which the new Prime Minister said was an aim of his.

In regard to the issue raised by the noble Lord, Lord Alton, in relation to the hospital in China, will the Minister say whether UK Export Finance funds were given in this case? If she cannot tell me now, can she write to me? In summary, I commend this amendment to the Committee, and I hope that we will see progress and engagement with the Government.

[Lord Coaker (Lab)]

My Lords, I apologise; I will see how long my voice lasts—not long, I imagine some people hope, but we will see how it goes.

I too congratulate the Minister on her promotion. She has already learned some of the tricks of the ministerial trade: she has gone through what she has previously said and asked her civil servants to have a look and see what she could say back if anyone raised it, which relates to what she opened with about simplification.

The serious point is that the fact that she has questioned the Bill will make her a very good Minister. That does not mean undermining the Bill, but you have to have a Minister who challenges it and listens to what people say, otherwise the whole process is pointless. From that point of view, we are all reassured by her appointment.

Overseas Development Assistance

Baroness Northover Excerpts

Wednesday 14th July 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Agnew of Oulton (Con)]

My Lords, it is important to remind the House that we have done this in the largest crisis to affect our country since the war and the largest recession in 300 years, with borrowing of £300 billion—14% of GDP—to deal with the crisis. It means that there has had to be some give in the system. We are committed to re-establishing it as soon as the economy allows it, and I am sure that the information the noble Lord asked for will be available soon.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

As the Minister who took the Bill through the House, I can tell the noble Lord that this is totally contrary to the spirit, let alone the letter, of the law. Has the Treasury made an impact assessment of its new policy on the validity of the integrated review and the UK’s ability to deliver a successful COP 26?

[Lord Agnew of Oulton (Con)]

My Lords, I respectfully disagree with the noble Baroness that it is in breach of the Act. The Act provides for accountability to Parliament in the form of a Statement in the event that the Government do not meet the 0.7% target, to include the fiscal reasons on which the Government rely at that time. This week we have set out clearly and transparently how the Government will approach that task.

European Union (Future Relationship) Bill

Baroness Northover Excerpts

3rd reading & 2nd reading & Committee negatived & 2nd reading (Hansard) & 2nd reading (Hansard): House of Lords & 3rd reading (Hansard) & 3rd reading (Hansard): House of Lords & Committee negatived (Hansard) & Committee negatived (Hansard): House of Lords
Wednesday 30th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Northover (LD) [V]]

I want to pick up a theme from my noble friend Lord Newby’s speech: British global influence. The Prime Minister claimed after the referendum campaign that post Brexit we would become

“a great European power, leading discussions on foreign policy … to make our world safer”,

as if being in the EU hampered rather than helped that or as if we could, for example, do more if we left NATO or the UN. We were the bridge for the United States to the EU; that will now be Germany or France, which is also a permanent member of the UN Security Council.

As my noble friend Lord Wallace pointed out, the EU agreement has no provision for British involvement in foreign policy. That was not an EU decision but a British one, even though the UK working within the EU meant that we were able to maximise our influence. Thus we led across EU capitals on tackling climate change, helping to secure the agreement in Paris. The EU, working together, helped to bring about the Iran agreement.

The treaty states:

“The Parties shall continue to uphold the shared values and principles of democracy, the rule of law, and respect for human rights”


and “promote” these “in international forums”. How exactly will we do that? In advance of key UN votes, we will not be in the meetings that decide the EU position. Take the example of Hong Kong. When China enacted its national security law, we had newly threadbare support at the UN. What of Gibraltar? As the noble Baroness, Lady Hooper, has just said, the Government said they would not agree a deal without including Gibraltar; they have done just that. Can the Minister explain exactly how and when the Government will resolve Gibraltar’s position, and why they failed to finalise it as we rushed towards their self-imposed deadline of 31 December?

Those who urged Britons to vote for Brexit pointed to sunlit uplands. Now, those claims are rarely made; the Government do not even dare to commission an impact assessment. What do we hear? The circular argument: “The British people voted for Brexit, and this is what we have delivered for them”—nothing about how they sold this to the British people: the cake and eating it, to which the noble Lord, Lord Maude, referred. The Minister spoke of asserting global Britain and said that now we could play a leading role on the world stage. However, we are already seeing in foreign affairs that we have, in fact, made it more difficult, not easier, to play that global role.

Summit of Democratic Governments

Baroness Northover Excerpts

Monday 30th November 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

No, I do not agree with either of the final points. I answered a question on this last week. The UK remains the second-largest donor of foreign aid in the G7, spending £10,000 million in the planned programme next year in assistance to the world’s poorest countries. On the question of 10 nations, the Government did not bring this concept before the House today. I have expressed our view that we wish to reach out to all the world’s leading democracies in various fora.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, is the Minister aware that when China introduced the anti-democratic national security law into Hong Kong, very few EU countries, and none in Asia, Latin America or Africa, supported the UK at the United Nations? How do the Government propose to ensure that the UK’s global influence is not diminished by leaving the EU?

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I said in reply to an earlier question that the United Kingdom sits in a range of vital and important multinational organisations, including the Commonwealth and NATO. We will remain there, and I have no doubt that the United Kingdom is very widely respected in all those fora.

Finance Bill

Baroness Northover Excerpts

2nd reading & Committee negatived & 3rd reading & 2nd reading (Hansard) & 2nd reading (Hansard): House of Lords & 3rd reading (Hansard) & 3rd reading (Hansard): House of Lords & Committee negatived (Hansard) & Committee negatived (Hansard): House of Lords
Friday 17th July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Northover (LD) [V]]

My Lords, we are in unprecedented times. We had a weak economy and have now been hit badly by coronavirus, which itself is having a massive effect globally, which will affect our future trading figures. Pandemics have long been on the UK’s risk register. The Government were distracted at the beginning of the year, wanting to project the union jack onto Big Ben on 31 January, rather than looking at what was happening in China, South Korea and, by then, on our doorsteps in Italy. The Government have also decided that we are leaving the single market and the customs union, decisions which cannot be laid at the door of the referendum, when those promoting leave promised that that would not happen.

The Government have now decided that we will leave the transition period with the EU at the end of the year. Have the Government made an assessment of leaving the EU in December or extending the transition period? If not, why not, and if so, will they publish it? One would hope that the Chancellor would apply his agile brain to this challenge. He should be commended for a number of his measures in the pandemic. As he looks to the future, it is the most vulnerable in society and building a green economy that must be key. There must be worry about older people, who may not get back into the jobs market again. There is, rightly, huge concern about unemployment levels among young people.

We compete globally as countries such as China and India are rising, with a great emphasis on training their young people, but we are undermining our higher education sector by leaving the EU, reducing our ability to join mutual research programmes and attract staff and students. What level of unemployment do the Government anticipate and what analysis have they made of it on an age and regional basis?

We have also become extremely grateful to those from overseas who have been helping in our hospitals, care homes and other essential services. The measures here set in place help for some of those in this crisis. The Government have suddenly seen how important they are. What are we doing to make sure this is sustained? Are we really now going to turn our backs on them?

As it looks like we are not heading for a V-shaped recovery, I look forward to the Minister’s response.

Beyond Brexit (European Union Committee Report)

Baroness Northover Excerpts

Tuesday 12th May 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Boswell, for all he has done to lead the European Union Committee with such skill and dedication. However, I note that aiming to “win friends and influence people” does not seem to be the UK’s strategy in its current negotiations with the EU. We hear that the Government almost seem to want them to fail, with lasting damage on both sides.

Leaving the EU with no deal, or an inadequate deal, is the next major crisis we may face. We could not stop a pandemic hitting the United Kingdom; we can stop the damage that would result from crashing out of transition on 31 December. At the height of this pandemic, surely the Government must extend the transition period.

As this report indicated, so long ago now, we need to relearn how to work constructively with our neighbours, with whom we share the closest approach to global challenges. With Trump in the White House and China increasingly dominant, the EU must play a major global role. As Sir Ivan Rogers pointed out, we will need to do more than ever before to make our new relationship work. That will need engagement from the very top.

We have another global crisis threatening us: climate change. A vaccine will not take that away. The Government have said that they wish to work with the EU on issues such as this. We used to maximise our influence by leading in the EU; now, we need to ensure that we are at least involved. That will be a difficult, but essential, task.

This report laid out some of the ways in which we can stay informed and engaged. I hope that it does not fall on deaf ears.

Budget: Economic and Fiscal Outlook

Baroness Northover Excerpts

Tuesday 5th May 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, the House of Commons did not even debate this assessment or vote on it. In fact, the Commons approved this without even seeing it as it was not published until yesterday. I am glad that the House of Lords is considering it.

The Budget and the OBR report on which it is based are, of course, very much out of date. Nevertheless, the Convergence document has just been produced. It notes:

“Early data releases suggest the short-term impact of Covid-19 on the global economy may be significantly larger than that of the global financial crisis.”

I note the word “short-term”.

The document states that the increase in borrowing is likely to be temporary. These findings assume a V-shaped bounce-back. That now looks highly unlikely, both in the United Kingdom and globally. There are therefore major implications for tax revenue and employment. Even when the lockdowns are lifted, certain industries will be affected long term. In China, it is noted that, whereas after the 2008 crash there was a problem with demand, now there is a problem with supply.

What we do when this pandemic is over will matter. We will have an economy to rebuild and a debt to address. People have drawn comparisons to the war, but closer comparisons surely need to be drawn to each post-war period. After the First World War, there was little co-operation and a financial crash with terrible consequences and the resultant rise of deadly populist movements. After the Second World War, a number of international organisations were set up. The Marshall plan was initiated for Germany. In the United Kingdom, the promises made during the war of a better, brighter future, including free healthcare, were largely delivered, though without social care.

Week after week, we have been standing outside clapping the NHS and essential workers. It will be very difficult for the Government not to address their needs. Can the noble Lord tell us the Government’s thinking? Does he agree that a further period of austerity brings huge social and political risk and that a different approach will be needed? As part of that, we need to look at our relationship with the EU. Clearly, we will not conclude adequate discussions with the EU by June, as it is required for all parliaments to approve the agreement; therefore, the transition must be extended. Surely the Government would not take the risk of crashing out and further damaging our economy and society at this time of crisis.

G20 Summit

Baroness Northover Excerpts

Monday 8th July 2019 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Howell, for securing this debate. I think he may have hinted at a case against the G20, although he then concluded in the other direction, so perhaps we did not need a debate at all. The noble Lord, Lord Grocott, certainly seemed to hold this position.

This was Theresa May’s last summit as PM, and it also reflected Britain’s position as half in and half out of the EU. The Minister will know that we on these Benches deeply regret the intention to leave the EU. Besides the economic damage we would do ourselves, the noble Lord will also be acutely aware, I am sure, of our consequent decline in global influence, which the noble Lord, Lord O’Neill, referred to. He will have registered exactly what our global partners think about our current path.

On leadership, the noble Lord, Lord Grocott, referred to the notion that the G20 was like a Cabinet without a Prime Minister. This perhaps reflects a changing balance in the world. Whatever criticisms were thrown at the US in the post-war years, until now it did seem to speak for democracy, liberal attitudes and human rights—something that the current President has no interest in doing. Its leadership may have grated on some, but maybe we will miss it when it has gone.

As China displaces the US, we have a US President who promotes “America First”. Others follow, as we see with Bolsonaro in Brazil. Nationalism and populism endanger multilateral engagement. Of course countries look after their self-interest, but the terrible bloodshed of the 20th century reinforces the fact that there needs also to be a recognition that some problems require global partnership—a point made by the noble Lord, Lord Judd.

Two issues that need to be tackled globally were on the agenda of the G20, climate change and trade—whatever else may have been listed there. I commend President Macron for his lead in ensuring that 19 out of the 20 reiterated their commitment to the Paris Agreement. That still matters. The separate paragraph on the supposedly “negative economic impact” of the Paris Agreement on “American workers and taxpayers” makes it crystal clear who is out of line here.

Then there is trade. The global effect of the trade war between the US and China shows how interlinked we are. The noble Lord, Lord O’Neill, has just warned us of the signs of a global slowdown. China and the US reached a tentative truce. President Trump also decided to allow US companies to sell to Huawei. Christine Lagarde, however, emphasised that resuming trade talks is not enough and that the tariffs already implemented were damaging the global economy.

The G20 also agreed that the WTO needed further reform, particularly in dispute resolution. Brexiteers might wish to look closely at what we may have to rely on if their wishes come true. They might also wish to note that Mercosur and the EU finally reached a trade agreement 20 years after trade talks began. My noble friend Lord Purvis rightly notes the absence of consideration of the free trade area in Africa. I might ask the Minister whether the UK is encouraging the inclusion of countries from Africa in the G20—but I think that the UK has little influence, so perhaps it is not relevant even to press that.

Other important issues came up, as the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, and the noble Lord, Lord O’Neill, mentioned. Mrs May held her first meeting with President Putin since the Salisbury attacks, after he had given a most helpful interview to the Financial Times about how liberalism was now obsolete. I am sure that his citizens agree. Then, of course, we look to the next G20 summit, which is due to be hosted in Saudi Arabia—despite the recent conclusion of the UN special rapporteur on the Khashoggi case. She wants to ensure that the G20 does not “become complicit” in this international crime. Can the Minister comment?

Noble Lords point to how the G20 is falling short, as the noble Lord, Lord Hannay, put it. But surely he, my noble friend Lord Purvis, the noble Baroness, Lady Anelay, and others are right that the G20 meeting shows the continuing importance of multilateral engagement in a polarising world—even if the family photos had some strange and difficult family members among them. I look forward to the Minister’s response to this interesting commentary on an imperfect body.