United Kingdom Internal Market Bill

Baroness Noakes Excerpts

Consideration of Commons amendments
Monday 14th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Bennett of Manor Castle (GP)]

My Lords, I will speak very briefly in favour of Motion F1 in the name of the noble and learned Lord, Lord Thomas of Cwmgiedd. I thank him for his strong and determined pursuit on this issue over the many stages of this Bill. I join the noble Lord, Lord Adonis, in hoping very much that we will see our Opposition Front Benches support this and push it forward.

I will refer to many of the same issues that I raised on Motion B; we are talking about local control and local prioritising, as the noble Lords, Lord Adonis and Lord Liddle, have said. Without this amendment, this Bill would take financial control away from the devolved Administrations—money is power, as we know. I think it was in Committee that I raised the phrase “pork barrelling”, which has reappeared again and again. This is heading towards an American-style politics, and we have many reasons why we would not wish to head in that direction.

This means in practice that if you have, as we do, an Administration in Westminster who are keen on building new roads—even though they just create more air pollution and new traffic—and airport expansion, and not on spending on nature, that priority will be forced on to local devolved Administrations.

I slightly disagree with the noble Lord, Lord Liddle, who held up as a model local enterprise partnerships and the previous model under the coalition Government; business and elected people is one partnership, but I would like to see something which is much broader and takes in all elements of the local community.

I have been seeing a great rise in enthusiasm across many parts of government for deliberative democracy, for the climate assembly and the people’s assembly approach—the chance to bring together representative groups of people to make decisions. Given that increase in enthusiasm, I would like to see it written into the Bill. Perhaps we will pursue it in the future.

I come back to my point from the debate on the previous amendment about the issue of coercive control raised by the Domestic Abuse Bill. That explicitly looks at financial control as a way in which people in households exercise unequal control. I hope that your Lordships’ House would agree that in an ideal household, everyone has a real and equal say in the spending of financial resources and a real chance to have their say. I would be interested in the noble and learned Lord’s comments on this; the noble Lord, Lord Adonis, said that this was in consultation. I agree that we should have the word “consent” in this amendment. We are talking about democracy, about people having their say and about how we would like to see our nations run.

[Baroness Noakes (Con)]

My Lords, when the Minister introduced the Motion, she explained clearly that the other place had claimed financial privilege and that it was customary for this House to respect that decision made by the Speaker. The noble and learned Lord, Lord Thomas of Cwmgiedd, said that this was not a financial issue. I respectfully say to the noble and learned Lord that it is not for this House to determine whether or not it is a financial issue. As I understand it, it has been accepted by this House for a very long time that the final arbiter of what is or is not a financial issue for which privilege can be claimed is the other place, through its Speaker. If we continue to disregard the Commons claim of financial privilege in relation to amendments we send to the other place for consideration, we not only show a lack of respect, particularly to the Speaker, but might be starting on a route to a constitutional clash with the other place, which would be most unfortunate.

When I sat where the noble Baroness, Lady Hayter, sits, many years ago, we often faced financial privilege being invoked against amendments we were pleased with ourselves for having sent back to the other place for consideration, but we always respected that decision when it came back. I hope that the noble Baroness, Lady Hayter, will continue that tradition in this place. Does the Minister know of any precedence for this place insisting on its amendments not once but twice in the face of a financial privilege claim by the other place, and does she agree with me that this is not a path down which this House should go?

[The Deputy Speaker (Lord McNicol of West Kilbride) (Lab)]

Does anyone else in the Chamber wish to speak?

UK-EU Future Relationship Negotiations and Transition Period

Baroness Noakes Excerpts

Tuesday 8th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I underline totally the importance of a manufacturing sector to this country. It is absolutely central to this Government’s strategy and policy of levelling up. So far as the negotiations are concerned, a huge amount of progress has been made but the UK’s position has been absolutely clear from the outset. A negotiation needs each of the two partners to understand the position of the other.

[Baroness Noakes (Con)]

My Lords, is my noble friend the Minister as surprised as I am that none of the noble Lords who has spoken from the Benches opposite has acknowledged, let alone praised, the amazing commitment of my noble friend Lord Frost as he has valiantly sought to negotiate a deal in the UK’s interests? Will the Minister join me in expressing this House’s thanks for my noble friend Lord Frost’s outstanding public service during the negotiations?

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I profoundly agree with what my noble friend Lady Noakes says. It has been an outstanding programme of public service from my noble friend Lord Frost and his team. Let us hope that what we all seek is crowned with success.

Spending Review 2020

Baroness Noakes Excerpts

Thursday 3rd December 2020 Grand Committee

[Baroness Noakes (Con)]

My Lords, I support what the Government are doing to support the economy. I wish that our Covid policies had not themselves been so harmful to the economy—but we are where we are. The resultant debt and deficit forecasts are scary and leave us exposed to interest rates that will inevitably rise at some point. The fiscal challenge is huge, but my simple plea to the Government is: do not turn to taxes as a way to solve this problem.

I have three points to make, and one parting shot. The first is a reminder that the Laffer curve is a real thing. Yield goes down when rates rise. For example, any short-term gain from raising the rate of capital gains tax, as the Office of Tax Simplification has misguidedly suggested, will be illusory, as behaviours will change and asset markets will be distorted. Secondly, raising income tax rates should be off the agenda until the economy is much stronger. All it will do is reduce disposable income and hence demand in the economy. We will need as much demand in the economy as we can get. Thirdly, the business sector must be encouraged to invest. The best way to do that is to reduce the rate of corporation tax and return to the aim of 17% or less.

My parting shot is that the Treasury must take time to understand what it takes for businesses, especially SMEs, to be profitable and to grow. Too many initiatives, such as making tax digital, ignored the real-life problems of SMEs trying to run successful businesses. We need SMEs more than ever now to rebuild our economy.

Ministerial Code

Baroness Noakes Excerpts

Tuesday 24th November 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I am grateful for the right reverend Prelate’s first comment. It is not the case that this Government do not value civil servants. Indeed, the joint letter sent out by the Prime Minister and the Cabinet Secretary yesterday reaffirmed their admiration for the work of civil servants.

[Baroness Noakes (Con)]

My Lords, does my noble friend the Minister agree that it is a strength of the Ministerial Code is that it does not require the removal from office of a Minister who breaches it but emphasises that the Prime Minister is the final arbiter on whether a breach has occurred and, if so, what the consequences are, which then allows him to make considered judgments in cases that are not black and white?

[Lord True (Con)]

Yes, my Lords, these things are a matter of judgment. No one has referred to the fact that my right honourable friend the Home Secretary has made a very strong apology for her actions.

EU Exit: Negotiations and the Joint Committee

Baroness Noakes Excerpts

Wednesday 21st October 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, a Written Ministerial Statement was issued. I am sorry if the noble Earl feels that more could and should be said. I always enjoy my engagements with him. The Statement referred to a number of matters discussed in the joint committee on 19 October. In addition to that, if he wants, I can be more helpful: the committee discussed work on the establishment of a list of individuals to sit on an arbitration panel, as required under the WA. Both parties are progressing work to establish a list of suitable arbitrators. As the noble Earl knows, it was agreed to have a further meeting of the committee in November, and other work will continue in the interim. The discussions are obviously ongoing, and I know that he understands, and I respect that, that there are some constraints on what one can share at a time of active talks.

[Baroness Noakes (Con)]

My Lords, following last week’s EU Council meeting, Angela Merkel said:

“We also acknowledge that the UK would like to have a certain amount of independence”.


I emphasise “a certain amount”. Does the Minister agree that until the EU fully understands and respects the fact that we will have 100% independence, the EU alone will be responsible for the lack of a free trade deal, along with the damage that will do to the economies of many of its member states?

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, of course it is essential that that point is recognised. I have made a practice, since I had the honour of taking on this brief, of not criticising the actions of any EU member state or anybody within the EU, and I shall forbear to comment on what any individual European leader may or may not have said. However, my noble friend is absolutely right that our independence, our right to set our laws, to control our own waters, and all the well-known expectations—not requests or demands—of an independent state need to be recognised by the other party.

EU Exit: End of Transition Period

Baroness Noakes Excerpts

Thursday 24th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, as far as local deliveries are concerned, the Kent Resilience Forum is putting material in place. I sought to explain that an effort will not be made to stop every vehicle. The expectation is that before they move to ports, vehicles should have the proper documentation. That is good for hauliers, traders and the country. The system being put in place will enable the interception of certain vehicles, which will be required to comply and be subject to a fine if they arrive at port having not complied. It is an exemplary system which we hope will encourage all to comply, as most traders will want to.

[Baroness Noakes (Con)]

My Lords, I congratulate the Government on the progress that they have made in being ready for 1 January and on the support that is being given to businesses. The former EU Internal Market Sub-Committee of the EU Committee, of which I was a member, issued a report in 2019 on Brexit and the implications for transport. It reported that the majority of the UK’s exports and imports of goods was handled by overseas hauliers, primarily in vehicles registered in Poland, Romania and Ireland. I know that the Government have been working very closely with the UK haulage industry. What has been done with foreign hauliers to ensure that they are ready, especially in view of their limited language skills?

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, the Government are certainly reaching out to all hauliers. I will provide my noble friend with details on those specific countries as soon as I can.

EU: Future Relationship

Baroness Noakes Excerpts

Wednesday 23rd September 2020 Grand Committee

[Baroness Noakes (Con)]

My Lords, it is a pleasure to take part in this debate. I thank my noble friend Lord True for his usual masterful summary in opening the debate. It is also a pleasure to follow the noble Lord, Lord Kerr of Kinlochard, and to confirm that our views remain some way apart. Given the amount of excitement in the House that is normally engendered whenever our relationship with the EU is raised, I am quite surprised that our numbers today are rather modest. However, I am grateful for the fact that at least we have a decent amount of time to speak, which is rare in this ghastly hybrid House, and we must treasure the opportunity.

When we celebrated our freedom from the EU on 31 January this year, it seemed such a huge relief. We had put behind us the disastrous negotiations by the previous Administration and the prolonged period when Parliament tried to thwart the will of the people. We might briefly have cherished the thought that negotiating the future relationship was going to be the easy part after all that. But that did not last, and we have had to face the reality of trying to negotiate with an EU that does not yet accept us as a sovereign equal. It is completely natural for the EU to prioritise its own interests, but the EU seems also to want to punish the naughty child across the channel for its temerity in leaving. The EU knows that if we make a success of Brexit, other EU countries may well question the value of staying locked into the European project.

I pay tribute to my noble friend Lord Frost for the calm, measured and thorough way in which he has conducted the negotiations so far. It is certainly not his fault that we have failed thus far to deliver a deal on the basis of our own very reasonable requirements. We have asked for a free trade agreement like those that the EU negotiates with other trading partners. The EU has responded by saying that, because of our geographical proximity, we must have more restrictions placed on us, in particular in the area of the so-called level playing field. We have been clear, as my noble friend Lord True emphasised, that sovereignty is of paramount importance, but I do not think that the message has yet been received in Brussels. In the case of the level playing field, we do not need anything beyond WTO terms.

The issue of sovereignty is also at the root of the lack of agreement on fisheries. Our fishing industry was decimated by the EU’s quotas, which allowed France and Spain in particular to take our fish. We have said, perfectly reasonably, that we want sovereignty over our fishing waters back and that we will set the agenda for access for other countries. The EU thinks that it can carry on as before.

Northern Ireland was never going to be easy. It was the most difficult part of the withdrawal agreement, and it looks as if it is going to be the most difficult part of the long-term arrangements. The EU’s bully-boy tactics of threatening to stop food imports into Northern Ireland from the rest of the UK are completely unacceptable, and I have it on very good authority that those threats were actually made. We should perhaps have expected trouble. Although he has denied it, Martin Selmayr is believed to have said that Northern Ireland is the price that the UK will pay for Brexit. While Mr Selmayr has been moved to somewhere he can do less damage, I expect that his spirit lives on in Brussels.

I shall support the Government when the internal market Bill comes to your Lordships’ House. I believe that it is necessary to create the powers that are in that Bill to allow us to reconcile the conflicts between the withdrawal agreement, including the Northern Ireland protocol, and the Belfast agreement. I regret the clumsy initial characterisation of it as a breach of international law, because it is no more than a reserve power to deal with problems. I hope that we do not have to use it, but the EU needs to recognise that we are not giving it carte blanche in Northern Ireland, which remains a sovereign part of the United Kingdom.

I do not know how many other problems remain in the negotiations with the EU. While it would be interesting to have a bird’s-eye view of the negotiations, they are best conducted behind closed doors. I was grateful for the update from the Minister on the negotiations when he introduced this debate. At the weekend, however, I read with incredulity that the Channel Tunnel, governed by the bilateral Canterbury agreement between the UK and France, is now part of the EU’s power grab. I certainly hope that that story is untrue; perhaps the Minister can comment on it when he winds up.

I have always said that, while I favour a deal with the EU, it would not be the end of the world if we left without a deal. It would certainly be inconvenient and would cause some confusion in the early part of next year, which would not be helpful given the damage already done to our economy from the public health response to the coronavirus pandemic. But we would survive. We are a resilient nation and are capable of overcoming that. In the meantime, the Government are pressing ahead with free trade agreements with other countries, and will seek to join the Trans-Pacific Partnership next year. While the EU is certainly a large market, around 90% of global growth is expected to arise outside the EU, and that is where we must set our sights.

Brexit: Civil Service Code

Baroness Noakes Excerpts

Thursday 17th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I think it is mildly wide of the Question before the House. Also, some quite serious allegations were made by the noble Lord. I simply repeat that there are very clear procedures available for civil servants who believe that they are being required to act in a way that conflicts with the code. They can start by taking it to their line manager, and the process goes on. As I have said, I am happy to circulate the appropriate procedures to the House.

[Baroness Noakes (Con)]

My Lords, noble Lords have focused on one particular aspect of the Civil Service Code, but there are many other requirements, one of which is that civil servants must not

“frustrate the implementation of policies once decisions are taken by declining to take, or abstaining from, action which flows from those decisions.”

Will my noble friend agree that the balancing of the different requirements in the Civil Service Code is best handled by the Civil Service under the procedures he has referred to, and not by a party-political Parliament?

[Lord True (Con)]

Yes, I strongly agree with my noble friend. I do think this is a matter that should be left to the judgment of the leaders of the Civil Service—the Cabinet Secretary of the time being the main one. My noble friend is of course quite right to say that—and this was reinforced in the Constitutional Reform and Governance Act—certain duties and responsibilities do apply to civil servants.

House of Lords: Number of Members

Baroness Noakes Excerpts

Wednesday 16th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, the voice of Wales is extraordinarily important, and it is well served in this House by some of the outstanding Members who come from that great Principality. The noble Lord makes a point of policy. The last coalition Government presented to your Lordships and the other place proposals for an elected House, but they did not at that time find favour.

[Baroness Noakes (Con)]

My Lords, last year, your Lordships’ House demonstrated that it was spectacularly out of step with the country as a whole over Brexit. Does the Minister agree that it is more important to remedy that than to focus on the numerical size of the House?

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, every Member of your Lordships’ House has the right to express a personal opinion, and long may we do so. However, it is important, as my noble friend says, that the House reflects on the risk of becoming out of step with public opinion on this great question.

EU Trade Agreement

Baroness Noakes Excerpts

Tuesday 8th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord True (Con)]

My Lords, I completely reject the idea that the Government are imperilling the Good Friday agreement. I repeat what I said a minute or two ago: the peace process has an east-west as well as a north-south aspect, which the Government fully respect. The purpose of our approach is to protect peace in Northern Ireland and the Good Friday agreement.

[Baroness Noakes (Con)]

My Lords, does the Minister agree that it would be better if the noble Lords who are getting so excited about this just waited until the internal market Bill is published later this week?

[Lord True (Con)]

As usual, my noble friend makes a very important point. As I have already said, we will have a great opportunity to discuss the proposals.