National Health Service (Integrated Care Boards: Exceptions to Core Responsibility) Regulations 2022

Baroness Merron Excerpts

Monday 20th June 2022 Grand Committee

Does the Minister agree that, for the individuals in these two senior NHS roles, who were directly associated with the FDP contract and NHS data use, to be poached and then immediately work for Palantir Technologies raises serious ethical issues that will give Palantir an unfair commercial advantage, and raises issues about senior NHS staff working for commercial companies immediately after leaving the NHS—more or less allowing a revolving door to a career with these companies and creating issues with the letting and award of multi-million-pound contracts?

[Baroness Merron (Lab)]

My Lords, I start by thanking the Minister for his extremely helpful introduction to these regulations. It is a pleasure to follow the noble Lord, Lord Scriven; I want to pick up some of the points he made. Let me say at the outset that we on these Benches support the regulations, which we accept are consequential and will not change services for people.

The words that have been used are that this is a “tidying-up exercise”. I want to dwell for a moment on the general point that there has been considerable time for this. The Health and Care Bill was introduced in July 2021 and we all know how long it spent in Committee, both in this House and in the other place. We also know how extensive the consideration of it was so it seems strange for us to find ourselves back discussing what are described as “consequentials”. This may be a simple tidying-up exercise—I accept that is what these regulations are—but calling it that ignores how we could have avoided the need to tidy up and, therefore, the amount of bureaucracy, time and effort that has been spent, not least in the department, in having to make these changes. Perhaps the Minister could address the general point that has been made in the course of this debate about why we find ourselves in this situation.

In the debate in the other place, the Minister talked about five more consequential statutory instruments that we should expect as part of this so-called tidying-up exercise. Perhaps the Minister can advise us on those. It is important that everybody, including system managers, knows what is coming down the track. I say that particularly given the record waiting lists and waiting times that the NHS is seeking to manage, yet we are talking about regulations that must be in place for 1 July so that everyone has certainty about what needs to be put in place and to be done. I accept the Minister’s assurance that this does not affect services to patients in a practical sense, but whenever we discuss regulations there is always an air of uncertainty around. Patients need to be assured that they will have a seamless service wherever they live or wherever they are. Therefore, knowing that we will be considering similar consequentials raises questions about certainty.

We hope that the regulations go through and that the Minister will respond to the points of concern that have been raised today. I hope that the regulations will ensure that the NHS can get on with the job that it is here to do.

[Lord Kamall (Con)]

My Lords, I thank both noble Lords who have spoken in this debate. The noble Lord, Lord Scriven, said this statutory instrument is not controversial, as reflected in the attendance at the debate, but when I saw that the noble Lord, Lord Scriven, was present I thought, “What’s controversial? I’d better look into it.” The noble Lord did not disappoint in that way. He quite rightly holds the Government to account.

Before I conclude I shall try to address some of the points that were made. The department has laid eight instruments so far to support the ICBs for 1 July. They ensure the continuation of the existing policy and provide the supporting legislative framework. The Health and Care Act 2022 (Commencement No. 1) Regulations 2022 were made on 6 May to commence a small number of preparatory sections from 9 May to enable preparatory steps to take place for the establishment of ICBs on 1 July. There are six negative resolution statutory instruments and one affirmative instrument—this regulation. The Health and Care Act 2022 (Commencement No. 2) Regulations 2022 are planned to be made by 30 June. This SI will commence major elements of the Health and Care Act on 1 July, including, but not limited to, ICBs, ICPs—integrated care partnerships—and the merger of NHS England Improvement, TDA and Monitor. We will be laying a further consequential statutory instrument which will amend redundant references to previously existing bodies and update legislation to support the implementation of ICBs.

On the point that the noble Lord, Lord Scriven, made about the federated data platform, I assure him that I have been in conversation with NHS England, particularly the transformation directorate, and it has been quite clear with me that it is an open tender. There is no preferred bidder. It has seen all the speculation in recent press articles and I have asked it directly about it. I will be quite clear: this is a very difficult for me to walk because as a Minister I do not want to interfere too much in those technical solutions and favour one or the other, but at the same time I have to warn about the politics around this. When I was speaking to the officials, they were very clear about that. We have to be clear about this. Whatever you chose, there will be some story out in the press, so we must make sure it is as open as possible.