Private International Law (Implementation of Agreements) Bill [HL]
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park Excerpts(4 years ago)
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Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
That the order of commitment of 17 March be discharged and that the Bill be committed to a Virtual Committee.
Business of the House
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park Excerpts(4 years ago)
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Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
That the debate on the motion in the name of Baroness Boycott, which is set down to take place in a Virtual Proceeding on Thursday 14 May, be time-limited to 3 hours and that the time limit may be varied by the unanimous agreement of the members taking part in that Virtual Proceeding at the commencement of proceedings.
Business of the House
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park Excerpts(4 years ago)
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Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
That the debate on the motion in the name of Lord Boswell of Aynho, which is set down to take place in a Virtual Proceeding on Tuesday 12 May, be time-limited to 3 hours and that the time limit may be varied by the unanimous agreement of the members taking part in that Virtual Proceeding at the commencement of proceedings.
Business of the House
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park Excerpts(4 years ago)
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Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
That the debate on the motion in the name of Baroness Williams of Trafford, which is set down to take place in a Virtual Proceeding today, be time-limited to 2 hours.
Business of the House
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park Excerpts(4 years ago)
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Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
That the debate on the motion in the name of the Lord Archbishop of York, which is set down to take place in a Virtual Proceeding today, be time-limited to 3 hours.
Amendment to the Motion
Lord Stoneham of Droxford (LD)
Perhaps I may be of help. Obviously talks have been taking place in the usual channels. I understand that she cannot support what the noble Lord, Lord Adonis, is saying, but we are making every effort to end these time limits by widening opportunities in debates, extending our hours and sitting for an extra day. We are moving towards that and I wonder whether she would formally give that backing so that eventually we get back to the point where we do not have time limits or limits on the number of speakers who can take part.
The Lord Privy Seal (Baroness Evans of Bowes Park) (Con)
I entirely agree that today’s debate is extremely important and I am delighted that we have been able to facilitate it. Our Benches have, quite rightly, given a Conservative Party debate to the most reverend Primate the Archbishop of York and I look forward to what I am sure will be an extremely interesting and informed debate by all noble Lords taking part.
I have to reiterate to noble Lords that the House authorities, the Digital Service and the broadcast team are at maximum capacity. They are not able to facilitate longer debates or those with more than 50 Members taking part. I know that it is frustrating but I am afraid that there are practical, administrative and broadcast restrictions, and we are working within those strictures.
I do not dispute that that is frustrating. As a Government, as the usual channels and as the House authorities, we are doing our best to facilitate the Virtual Proceedings, but I am afraid there are limits to what everyone is able to do. I know noble Lords are frustrated but I cannot stress enough how hard people are working—and the hours they are working—to do this. The House of Commons is using broadcasting procedures, as is our House. This is not about trying to curtail discussion and debate, but about trying to facilitate as much as we can within the boundaries within which we are having to work. I am sorry to keep saying it, but it is important to put that on the record.
I am sorry that I cannot agree to the noble Lord’s request at this point—I am afraid it will not be possible—but I hope that everyone who participates in the debate enjoys their time in it. I have no doubt that they will make extremely important points that we as a Government and everyone listening will take into account and reflect on.
Lord Alderdice (LD)
I want simply to draw the noble Baroness’s attention to one reason why people find this frustrating: the repeated assertions about what was technically possible and possible for practical reasons have turned out not to be the case at all. She needs to understand that some of us have been working online and virtually for a long time and in many circumstances, both nationally and internationally. We know what is possible and what is not. There seems to be a lack either of imagination and creativity or of something else. She needs to understand that that is one reason why trust is breaking down on this point.
House of Lords: Allowances
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park Excerpts(4 years ago)
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Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
1. The Resolution of the House of 20 July 2010 (House of Lords Allowance) shall temporarily cease to have effect in respect of attendances after 20 April 2020.
2. Members of this House, except any Member who receives a salary under the Ministerial and other Salaries Act 1975 and the Chairman and Principal Deputy Chairman of Committees, should be entitled to an allowance in respect of each day of attendance on or after 21 April 2020.
3. “Attendance” means attendance—
a) at a sitting of this House or a Committee of this House,
b) at a virtual proceeding of this House or a virtual meeting of a Committee of this House, or
c) on such other Parliamentary business as may be determined by the House of Lords Commission.
4. The amount of the allowance payable to a Member in respect of a day of attendance should be £162.
5. In respect of attendance at a physical sitting or virtual proceeding of this House only Members who speak during the sitting or the proceeding, or who are otherwise necessary to the proceedings, should be entitled to an allowance.
6. In respect of attendance at a Committee of this House, only Members of that Committee or Members authorised to attend a meeting of such a Committee by the Chair should be entitled to an allowance.
The Lord Privy Seal (Baroness Evans of Bowes Park) (Con)
My Lords, both Houses have been operating under unprecedented circumstances over the last few weeks and I know I speak for the whole commission membership when I convey thanks to all those who have heeded government health advice and remained away from the House to take part wherever possible in remote proceedings.
Over recent weeks, many of your Lordships, myself included, have had to adapt to considerable technological changes, which have been challenging at times. Although there have been teething issues along the way, we can be both proud and grateful to all those involved who have supported and enabled us to continue to perform our roles as parliamentarians, be that communicating government policy or holding the Government to account.
However, these unprecedented circumstances have raised specific issues around allowances—a situation we are seeking to address through this Motion. The overwhelming majority of Members of your Lordships’ House are not paid a salary but instead are entitled to claim an allowance which recompenses noble Lords for the costs incurred and associated with physically attending the House to undertake parliamentary work. Now that we are working remotely and in the majority of cases not attending the House in person, the commission has agreed that the amount Members are able to claim needs to reflect this new, temporary situation.
Alongside a change in the rate of the daily allowance, the commission has also agreed that we should more precisely define participation in our proceedings. After careful consideration and lengthy discussions, the commission has proposed that the current allowance system be temporarily suspended and the maximum daily claimable rate be reduced from £323 per day to £162.
Eligibility for the temporary allowance will be based on direct contributions in the proceedings of the day, which will be reflected in the public record. This reduced rate applies to Members whether they are actively participating online in a Virtual Proceeding or in the significantly reduced number of physical sittings that take place in this Chamber. Members participating directly in the important work of our Select Committees will also be eligible for the new temporary allowance at the same rate. Simply following proceedings online or signing up to a speakers’ list does not meet these eligibility criteria.
The commission agreed that the half-day flat rate of £162 was the most appropriate amount for the temporary allowance as it aligns with the amount available to those participating in parliamentary business away from Westminster under normal circumstances. Of course, the proposals before your Lordships’ House also retain the current position that a Member does not have to claim anything should they feel so inclined.
The Motion proposes that the temporary allowance arrangements be applied retrospectively from 21 April, when we returned from the Easter Recess and began our new way of working, so that Members are able to claim for remote participation from that date. These changes to our allowance system will of course be kept under constant review.
I am aware that there are very different views across the House and across all Benches about the detail of these proposals. No commission member took these decisions lightly. However, at a time when millions of people across the country are having to adapt to working remotely and are facing considerable financial challenges of their own, it is right that we have adapted our financial arrangements and our burden on the taxpayer to reflect the current working environment we face. I beg to move.
Amendment to the Motion
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
I thank all noble Lords for their comments. I am going to restrict my comments on this Motion to allowances, because we will come on to some broader points that noble Lords raised on other issues in debating the next Motion. However, I am very happy to reiterate the words of my noble friend Lord True yesterday: there is absolutely no basis to the Sunday Times story. It is not government policy and nothing that I recognise, and I am very sorry for the hurt and upset it has caused in your Lordships’ House. I put on record again that it is not true.
Regarding the number of contributions, this debate has made clear the difficult decisions and balances that the commission had to strike in coming up with these proposals. I completely recognise, as we all do, the very real-life consequences once decisions have been made. That is why, as I said in my opening remarks, the allowance will be under constant review. We are in a moving picture and in unprecedented times, as I think everybody recognises. We are doing our best to move as and when we can to ensure that we take all this into account.
The voting Lobbies have been set up, but I very much hope that the noble Lord will not feel the need to use them today. I reiterate that this is under constant review. It is temporary, along with all the proceedings that we are undertaking. However, despite all the issues raised by noble Lords, and the restrictions we are dealing with in the Virtual Proceedings, I believe that we are able to do our job in very difficult circumstances. We are all very grateful to all those supporting us in being able to do so, notwithstanding the very real impact this is having on so many people’s lives.
Lord Newby
The noble Baroness has not really addressed the amendment in the name of my noble friend Lord Alderdice. Can she confirm whether she personally, and on behalf of the Government, believes that there should be a review? If so, when does she believe that should happen by? If she does not think so, on what basis does she think we can continue with what everybody accepts is an unacceptable, temporary situation, without any sense of when it might come to an end?
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
As the noble Lord is aware, since he is on the commission, this is not a government decision but a decision of the commission, on whose behalf I am speaking. The Motion makes it clear that it is a temporary arrangement. As noble Lords know, I have said that it is under constant review. We can discuss with the Lord Speaker what that reviewing may look like, but it is not my decision alone as I am part of the commission.
We will have to see when and how we start to move. We are anticipating new guidance over the weekend on what restrictions will be happening. I am sure that all of us in the House will look at how to implement them. We all want to return as a House, as everyone has stated, but we have to stick to government guidelines and ensure that we have a safe working environment for Peers and staff. We have put Virtual Proceedings in place and are trying to roll them out. We are trying to increase the amount of business being done in Virtual Proceedings, which we will obviously discuss on the next Motion as we look to take more legislative stages online.
This is a constantly moving issue. I can assure noble Lords that—whether they know it or not—my staff and team, through the usual channels and with all the other leaders, are working constantly to ensure that we are doing our best to allow noble Lords the opportunities to address the issues that they want to.
Baroness Smith of Basildon
I want to press the noble Baroness further, because I asked about her role as the Lord Privy Seal. I appreciate that she speaks as a member of the commission, but she is a member of it as the Lord Privy Seal and Leader of this House. What discussions has she had with the Government? In her role as Lord Privy Seal—a position that I think Thomas Cromwell held as well—it would be nice to know that she had been discussing the role of this House with the Government.
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
Yes, I am very happy to say so. One of the only other items on an agenda largely about coronavirus, in Cabinet and elsewhere, is that of parliamentary business. I am therefore able to give regular updates on the work of the Lords. I have been discussing with my Commons colleagues the work they are doing and how we can roll that out, and I am of course raising House of Lords’ issues on a regular basis within government; that is my job and that is what I do.
Baroness Northover
Will the noble Baroness show the leadership that one would expect of the Leader of the House and halve her salary also?
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
I am not going to make a commitment to do that now, but I will certainly reflect on it.
Lord Adonis
I fully accept the Leader’s commitment to these arrangements being temporary, but the best guarantee that the House can have of that is a sunset clause. Why will the Government not agree to that?
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
As I have said, these issues are under constant review. We are looking at them all the time, but a sunset clause sets an arbitrary date. These are temporary measures and we are looking to develop things. Lots of ideas have been mentioned today about how we may wish to move forward, and we are committed to that. I think that that negates the need for specific dates.
Lord Stoneham of Droxford
I do not think the noble Baroness answered the question that I raised. In showing leadership, she must go back to the commission this week, or next week—whenever it is due to meet—to start some of the work that will be required when this scheme ends. It is not good enough to wait until the end of June. We have work to do to define what business in the House means. Is she prepared to go back to the commission and recommend that that work should start straightaway?
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
I am sure that all members of the commission—a number of whom are here today—including me, will take that on board. We meet regularly, and I am sure that such discussions will happen. The noble Lord is absolutely right: as this develops, there needs to be thinking on allowances, our proceedings and a move to a hybrid House. We will need to have regular conversations to make sure that we can come up with solutions that work for Members and for the business of this House.
Lord Alderdice
My Lords, I am grateful to all noble Lords who participated in this debate—a slightly longer one than perhaps we might have expected, but that shows the strength of concern and feeling. I confess to a degree of disappointment. I do not think that the noble Baroness, or the Government in general, quite understand the import of what was being said. I focused more on the institutional than the individual consequences, which other noble Lords spoke to— I shall not name everyone who participated.
As she finished, the noble Baroness spoke about the fact that we are expecting announcements at the weekend on what will happen, and of course we look forward to that. But it is another example of the same problem. Her right honourable friend the Prime Minister chose not to do it in the House of Commons but to do it on a Sunday evening, when he would be the focus. The Speaker in another place has made it clear that that is not proper parliamentary process or procedure. It is crucial that these matters are brought back to Parliament and that Parliament is given its place.
The noble Baroness could have, without accepting the amendment, given an undertaking to fulfil its requirements on her own word, and I would have accepted that. I think that we will all have to go away and reflect on the consequences. I hope that she and her colleagues will realise that they have now created a situation where trust has got to be built, rather than depended upon, because some of it has simply evaporated. With that, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment, as is the proper process in your Lordships’ House. I do so not because I agree with the Motion, but because it is what we have to do.
Business of the House
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park Excerpts(4 years ago)
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Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
That until 21 May 2020:
(1) debates on statutory instruments taken in a Virtual Proceeding shall be time-limited to 1½ hours; and
(2) this time limit may be varied by the unanimous agreement of the members taking part in any such Virtual Proceeding at the commencement of proceedings.
The Lord Privy Seal (Baroness Evans of Bowes Park) (Con)
My Lords, this time last week, the House agreed that certain types of business could be taken in a Virtual Proceeding. So far, we have had virtual Oral Questions, debates, Statement repeats and PMQs and, generally, they have worked well. From next week, we will begin taking legislation in this way. Following discussions through the usual channels, my noble friend the Chief Whip has scheduled a small number of debates on statutory instruments to take place virtually. The House has already agreed in principle to doing so.
Today’s Motion will, until Whitsun, time-limit the SI debates that we take virtually to one and a half hours each. This will make timings more predicable for Members taking part and the IT professionals who will support them, and we thank them all for their hard work in helping us get this far.
All the virtual business that we have taken so far has been time-limited in some way. This time limit is identical to that which routinely applies to SI debates in the House of Commons. The Motion also provides a mechanism by which the time limit can be adjusted for specific debates should that be required. Noble Lords will need to sign up to speak in these debates. While this is not our normal practice for SIs, it is necessary so that the Parliamentary Digital Service knows which Members to admit to the Virtual Proceedings. Of course, any noble Lord is able to sign up to speak in them.
I should make it clear that these Virtual Proceedings are not empowered to approve SIs on behalf of the House as a whole. Those SIs debated virtually will need to come to the Floor of the House for approval in a similar way to how SIs are debated in the Moses Room before being decided in the Chamber at a later date.
I am pleased to say that our Virtual Proceedings will be broadcast to the general public via Parliament TV from today in the same way as are our physical proceedings. This is one week earlier than was anticipated. I put on record our thanks to all those who have worked so hard to make that happen. I beg to move.
Business of the House
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park Excerpts(4 years ago)
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Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
That the debate on the motion in the name of Lord Addington, which is set down to take place in a Virtual Proceeding on Thursday 30 April, be time-limited to 3 hours and that the time limit may be varied by the unanimous agreement of the members taking part in that Virtual Proceeding at the commencement of proceedings.
Business of the House
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park Excerpts(4 years ago)
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Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
That, in the event of a debate on a motion relating to the United Kingdom’s Convergence Programme being set down in a Virtual Proceeding on Tuesday 5 May, the debate be time-limited to 1½ hours and that the time limit may be varied by the unanimous agreement of the members taking part in any such Virtual Proceeding at the commencement of proceedings.
Business of the House
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park Excerpts(4 years, 1 month ago)
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Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
That, until 21 May 2020, and notwithstanding any prior resolution of the House:
(1) only public bills sponsored by a Minister of the Crown shall be considered;
(2) no motions for balloted debate shall be taken; and
(3) no Questions for Short Debate shall be asked, except for balloted topical Questions for Short Debate on Thursdays.
The Lord Privy Seal (Baroness Evans of Bowes Park) (Con)
My Lords, the Coronavirus Bill and the Contingencies Fund Bill will receive Royal Assent this evening, and that will be notified to both Houses tonight. This means that the House will no longer sit tomorrow or next week. Noble Lords who have tabled an Oral Question will receive a written response from a Minister.
The House will return after Easter on Tuesday 21 April as planned. The usual arrangements for the recall of Parliament will apply, should the House need to meet before then. The previously announced adjournment for the VE Day bank holiday weekend will go ahead as planned.
When we return, we will make some changes to the way that our business is arranged. In light of the circumstances, and having consulted the usual channels, it has been agreed that, for the first three weeks after Easter, the House will sit only on a Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. So the House will sit on 21, 22, 23, 28, 29 and 30 April, and on 5 and 6 May, when we will rise for the VE Day long weekend. Further discussions will take place to inform what happens after that.
It has also been agreed that until the Whitsun Recess—until Thursday 21 May—we will not consider any Private Members’ Bills, balloted debates or ordinary Questions for Short Debate. No Back-Bench Member will lose out. My noble friend the Chief Whip, who I am pleased to report is feeling better, will be in touch with those Members who had an agreed slot for their business to discuss alternative arrangements.
For the convenience of Members and those staff who have to come in, the House will sit earlier on Tuesday and Wednesday, at 1 pm on Tuesday and at 11 am on Wednesday. This will enable business to conclude at around 7 pm on both days rather than the usual 10 pm. Tuesdays and Wednesdays will be used as, they are now, to scrutinise the Government’s legislation. Grand Committees will be scheduled only if absolutely necessary. Party debates and topical Questions for Short Debate will continue on Thursdays, so the Opposition parties, Cross-Bench Members and Back-Bench Members will retain the ability to initiate debates to maintain the House’s key function of holding the Government to account. Oral Questions will continue as normal at the beginning of every sitting day, with a topical Question asked on each day the House sits. A new Forthcoming Business will be issued as soon as possible.
We will also have to think about how we conduct our business, not just what we consider and when. We will have to look carefully at what sensible adjustments can be made to our working practices and procedures. We will continue to work with the usual channels and the House authorities on these issues, but I can tell the House that a working group of senior officials from both Houses and the Parliamentary Digital Service has been set up to develop effective remote collaboration and videoconferencing. The Parliamentary Digital Authority is doing all it can to enable rollout to Members as soon as possible.
The social distancing measures we have put in place this week will need to continue for the foreseeable future. Noble Lords who do not need to attend the House should not do so, and that particularly applies to those in the vulnerable groups. We have all seen noble Lords in their 70s and 80s in their places this week. I simply say, as the Speaker said last week, that as parliamentarians we have a duty to show leadership and to heed the advice of the public health experts.
Finally, I am sure all noble Lords will join with me in putting on record our thanks to all those members of staff who have supported us so ably in recent days. On a personal note, I express my thanks to my fantastic team for all the help they have provided to me ever since I became Leader. I know that all staff will continue to work very hard on our behalf in the weeks ahead, and we are lucky to have them. I beg to move.
Baroness Wheeler (Lab)
My Lords, I thank the Leader of the House for her Statement today and for the constructive usual channels discussions held away from the Chamber, including with my noble friends Lady Smith of Basildon and Lord McAvoy, who have, while working at home, continued to be active and involved throughout the week. It is vital that Parliament continues its essential role of scrutiny, particularly at a time of crisis, and this House must continue to play its part. It is right that the Leader of the House referred to the programme planned for after the Easter Recess, which has been discussed by the usual channels. It is also right that the business that the Government outline keeps to a more limited programme while ensuring opportunities for scrutiny of ongoing legislation, as well as preserving time for Opposition parties and groups. She will know that the leaders in the usual channels are all fully committed to keeping in close contact between now and when we return.
The Leader will know that Members across the House are very keen to see the introduction of changes to how we work in future, using new technology such as remote collaboration and videoconferencing. For example, committees can meet online, but there are many other ways in which we can fulfil our obligations and maintain social distancing, as a number of noble Lords have outlined in speeches this week. Many businesses are being far more innovative, and we should also be taking a lead on this. I underline that the working group the Leader of the House referred to needs to work with a sense of urgency so that new technological solutions to the current situation can be agreed and introduced as soon as possible, preferably in time for when we return from the Recess.
I also thank her for emphasising that the House returns on 21 April, as previously planned, as there was some confusion in the media, not for the first time, on this issue. Normal procedures will apply, even in this situation. However, should there be any significant change or action required, a recall of Parliament has to be an option.
I also thank the Leader of the House for her comments about the staff of your Lordships’ House. I too thank all the staff of the House, including the cleaners and the security and catering staff, as well the House administration and party staff. Whatever decisions are made on the future working of this House, we must consider them, too.
Lord Harris of Haringey (Lab)
My Lords, I recognise that the Statement was agreed by the usual channels; I therefore do not deplore it.
First, I support what the Lord Privy Seal said about the staff of the House, who have been put under enormous pressure during this period. We must be extremely grateful for their efforts and commitment. That is an extremely important message and anything said in these exchanges is certainly not intended to detract from it.
It is in the Government’s interests to demonstrate that they are operating as transparently, openly and accountably as they can. On us coming back on 21 April, I am pleased that that guarantee has been given; I am sure that Parliament will be recalled before then if necessary. May I make a practical suggestion about accountability? This is an enormous crisis and there will be lots of decisions to be taken. Rather than simply having one topical Question per day, we should have two, or even three.
If that is not possible, there should be a firm commitment from the Government to a Statement at least twice a week, if not every day, when we return so that there is full opportunity for the Government to explain issues arising and report back on how their various measures are working. That would also allow the House—it will not be all of us since, as we have already seen, people are self-selecting and deciding who comes in; we should find ways to enable people who cannot be here for whatever reason to engage—to question and hold the Government to account. Above all, by being transparent, the Government will continue to have the nation’s support in trying to deal with the coronavirus.
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
I thank noble Lords for their comments. I will pick up on some of the points raised.
First, I assure noble Lords that the working group looking at digital technologies and how we can be more effective is very cognisant of the urgency and importance that the House places on it—I can see the Clerk of the Parliaments nodding. It will be taking this forward and, I am sure, would welcome any suggestions from noble Lords about technologies they have used such as apps, et cetera. This work will be taken forward over Easter with a lot of urgency.
As I said, we will come back on 21 April. We will be publishing Forthcoming Business so that noble Lords will be able to see what government business we have. As I said, Thursdays will be set aside for opposition and Back-Bench issues, so there will be ample opportunity for issues that noble Lords wish to raise.
In relation to Statements and UQs, I think we have had a Statement pretty much every day so far and, in light of the circumstances we will find ourselves in, I suspect that will continue. However, I hear what the noble Lord has said.
It is up to Select Committees to decide how to conduct their business, and they can work remotely if they wish. That is for Select Committee chairmen and their committees to decide.
I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Purvis, for acknowledging the engagement of Ministers in this House. I assure him that we will continue to do so. It is a responsibility that my Front Bench and I take extremely seriously. I assure the House that we will continue to do so when we return after Easter.