Ukraine: Forcible Removal of Children

Debate between Baroness Chapman of Darlington and Lord Swire

Monday 24th November 2025 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Chapman of Darlington (Lab)]

First, I pay tribute to the right reverend Prelate for his knowledge and experience and the care and consideration that he brings to this and other matters. I know that he will soon retire from this House, although I hope not entirely from these issues. He is absolutely right to remind us that the removal of children, horrendous as it is, was not just to use children as a pawn in this conflict; it is absolutely about diminishing the identity of Ukraine and removing all vestiges of its own sovereignty. For so many reasons, we will continue to work to see these children returned. I look forward to continuing to work with the right reverend Prelate in future on these and many other issues.

[Lord Swire (Con)]

Last week, some of us were privileged to hear the testimony of two former Ukrainian prisoners of the Russians here in this House—we listened to their harrowing testimony. Can the Minister reassure us that in any peace deal articulated by the Americans or with the EU, the egregious infringement and abuse of human rights through torture, false imprisonment and everything that goes with it will not be lost in any settlement, and people will be pursued, if necessary to the International Criminal Court?

[Baroness Chapman of Darlington (Lab)]

Accountability and responsibility for breaches of international humanitarian law and atrocities matter a great deal to this Government, and we will not compromise on that in any situation. As for what this agreement may finally look like, I hope that there is one because we all want to see a lasting peace sustained. The negotiations at the moment are between the US and Ukraine, with the support of the United Kingdom and others, but what matters more than anything, in order to get that sustainable peace, is to hear the voices of the Ukrainians and for the peace agreement, whatever it might look like, to be something that the Ukrainians can accept.

Conflict in Sudan

Debate between Baroness Chapman of Darlington and Lord Swire

Tuesday 11th November 2025 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Chapman of Darlington (Lab)]

Absolutely, and I would like to take this opportunity to pay tribute to the work that the noble Lord, Lord Collins, did on Sudan for many years: certainly, during his role as Minister for Africa, it was outstanding. The leadership that he showed on an issue that, at many points, must have been quite a lonely place to be, given the lack of interest that there was at various times, is highly commendable.

We engage regularly with all members of the Quad. I have spoken to the UAE and the US and my ministerial colleagues at the FCDO do likewise. We are absolutely committed to doing whatever we can, both as penholder at the UN and through our role at the Human Rights Council, and just as a concerned partner and ally, to make sure that we do everything that we are able to do to bring about a ceasefire and then a lasting peace.

[Lord Swire (Con)]

The Minister is saying we are doing everything, and indeed we are the penholder at the UN, but there are some concerning reports that we are not doing as much as we should be due to financial constraints, particularly with our responsibilities towards women as victims of rape and crime and so on. Is the noble Baroness concerned about that? Is she equally concerned, as the situation there continues to deteriorate, about the possibility of migratory pressure on the UK from that part of the world?

[Baroness Chapman of Darlington (Lab)]

Of course I am concerned. I think the reasons why the Prime Minister insisted that we protect our aid to Sudan speak for themselves, and we will be making sure that Sudan receives as much, or perhaps even more, support than it has done previously.

I visited the Adre crossing and spoke to many of the women that the noble Lord refers to, and I heard first-hand accounts of their horrific experiences. We will continue to work to support those women who have made it to Chad, to South Sudan and to other neighbouring countries.

We will also continue, difficult though it is, to work with NGOs and mutual aid groups within Sudan to provide support as much as we possibly can. I should emphasise that this is not a question of a lack of aid. There are real difficulties with access for organisations, but we continue to do everything we possibly can.

Gaza: Humanitarian Situation

Debate between Baroness Chapman of Darlington and Lord Swire

Thursday 30th January 2025 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Chapman of Darlington (Lab)]

I could not agree more. We are doing what we can. As my noble friend says, this is not something that you just fix. It is a trauma that can be felt through many years—indeed, through generations. UK support has meant that more than half a million people have received essential healthcare, 647,000 have received food and 284,000 have improved access to water, sanitation and hygiene. As we have said today, whether or not UNRWA is able to continue will in large part determine whether some of that work can happen in the future.

[Lord Swire (Con)]

My Lords, is it not time to remind ourselves of the obligation that this country made through the Balfour Declaration? It stated clearly that

“nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine”.

Does the Minister agree that that includes the population of the West Bank and Gaza? Will she update the House on the noises coming from Washington about the possible emptying of Gaza into neighbouring countries—namely, Jordan—and does she agree that not a penny of British taxpayers’ money should be spent on the reconstruction of Gaza if it is to be forcibly emptied of its Palestinian population?

[Baroness Chapman of Darlington (Lab)]

The noble Lord might be getting ahead of where I was planning on going today, but I have been very clear on our view of the importance of Gazans being able to return to their homes should they wish. That is our position and, I think, something that the noble Lord will probably agree with.