Baroness Bull
Main Page: Baroness Bull (Crossbench - Life peer)Department Debates - View all Baroness Bull's debates with the Ministry of Justice
(1 day, 13 hours ago)
Lords Chamber
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Ministry of Justice (Baroness Levitt) (Lab)
My Lords, these amendments relate to private prosecutions. I start by expressing my thanks to all noble Lords for their thoughtful contributions to the Bill throughout its passage.
I thank the Opposition Front-Bench team, in particular the noble Lord, Lord Sandhurst, and the noble and learned Lord, Lord Keen, for their scrutiny and for all the time they have given in these debates. The noble Lord, Lord Sandhurst, gave up his time on Monday to meet me and my officials and we had a productive discussion, for which I thank him.
I would especially like to express my sincere gratitude to the Liberal Democrat Front-Bench team, in particular the noble Baroness, Lady Brinton, and the noble Lord, Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames, for their constructive, helpful and friendly engagement throughout this Bill. While we have not always agreed, it has been a real pleasure doing business with them.
It is clear that this Bill has benefited from the quality of scrutiny in this House and has been strengthened by the considerable expertise and insight contributed by Members of your Lordships’ House, both during debates and in the informal discussions we have had around the edges.
I turn to Motion A, relating to Amendments 4B and 4C, tabled in the name of the noble and learned Lord, Lord Keen. I am grateful to both Houses for the depth and seriousness with which Clause 12 has been scrutinised. I will briefly explain the Government’s position and set out the statutory assurances that we have brought forward for your Lordships’ consideration.
From the beginning, we acknowledged the concern about a possible chilling effect on private prosecutions and I reiterate the Government’s reassurances that this is not, and never has been, the intention. We recognise that Amendments 4B and 4C were aimed at encouraging scrutiny and bringing transparency in relation to any regulations that may be made to determine the rates at which private prosecutors can recover costs from central funds. The Government share those objectives. Where we differ is not on the importance of oversight but on the appropriate and proportionate legislative mechanism by which that oversight should be secured.
Amendment 4C would require any such regulations to be subject to the affirmative procedure. The Government recognise the desire for parliamentary scrutiny, and we are committed to ensuring that any use of this power is subject to proper oversight. The question is not whether there should be scrutiny but what form of scrutiny is proportionate to the power that Parliament is being asked to confer.
As I have said on many occasions, Clause 12 is merely an enabling provision. Self-evidently, it does not itself prescribe rates, and, as matters stand, it is not yet possible to know the degree of technical complexity or granularity that future regulations may contain. To require in primary legislation the affirmative procedure in every eventuality would mean that there would have to be full debates in both Houses on regulations that may prove highly technical, detailed and/or operational in nature. The Government’s view is that such an approach would not represent a proportionate use of Parliament’s time, nor would it necessarily enhance the quality of scrutiny.
The negative procedure strikes the right balance. It ensures that regulations are laid before Parliament and are subject to scrutiny, including by the Secondary Legislation Scrutiny Committee, and that they may be prayed against, debated and annulled where either House considers the substance of the regulations, the supporting evidence or the consultation undertaken to be insufficient. That procedure preserves Parliament’s ability to intervene where there are genuine concerns, while allowing the detail of implementation to be addressed in a practical and efficient manner.
I turn to Amendment 4B, which would require the Ministry of Justice to publish an impact assessment prior to the laying of regulations. Again, I wish to make it clear that the Government believe in the importance of transparency and evidence-based policy-making. That said, as drafted, this amendment is not appropriately framed for the established process. Proposed new paragraph (b) appears to be based on a misunderstanding of how impact assessments operate. The Government do not respond to an impact assessment; rather, an impact assessment is published alongside a consultation to inform it. It is then updated to reflect the final position when the Government respond to the consultation and bring forward regulations. That is the established and proper process.
However, we have listened carefully to the strength of feeling expressed in your Lordships’ House about the need for proper evidential underpinning and stakeholder engagement before any rates are set. For that reason, we are now tabling an amendment in lieu that embeds those objectives effectively by placing clear, workable and enforceable requirements in statute.
First, the amendment will place in primary legislation a statutory duty requiring the Lord Chancellor to consult before laying any secondary legislation to set rates. This will not be a discretionary power but a legal obligation. The consultation will be full, thorough and public, engaging those with relevant expertise of those who may be affected, as well as those who may be affected—for example, charities and specialist lawyers. As part of the process of setting any rates, the Government will publish a full response to the consultation. This will not be a box-ticking exercise. The Government remain open minded about where the rates should be set. The consultation will take place at a formative stage, allowing evidence to inform and shape the rates in a meaningful way.
Secondly, the amendment requires that an impact assessment be published before any regulations are made. This will provide Parliament, and others with an interest in these matters, with a clear assessment of the likely effects on any groups affected by the proposed policies. Overall, the amendment in lieu will embed consultation, evidence gathering and impact analysis directly into the statutory framework governing the exercise of this power. It will ensure that the decision-making is transparent and accountable, while preserving the necessary flexibility for an enabling power to operate proportionately and effectively in practice.
I hope that this explanation demonstrates that the Government have listened, reflected and responded constructively to the concerns raised by your Lordships’ House. The alternative approach we now propose strikes the right balance between parliamentary oversight and practical administration, while ensuring that any rates set are founded on good evidence and tested through full and open consultation. I beg to move.
My Lords, the noble Baroness, Lady Brinton, is taking part remotely. I invite the noble Baroness to speak.