Renters’ Rights Bill
Baroness Bowles of Berkhamsted Excerpts(3 weeks, 3 days ago)
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Baroness Bowles of Berkhamsted (LD)
My Lords, I added my name to this amendment and spoke during previous Bill stages. I declare my interests as a private landlord, in my own right and also as a trustee, and as having a relative who purchased the flat above theirs when a carer was needed, which was going to be the case in due course. That planning is now, of course, in some disarray: they wonder whether they must evict the present tenant and bring forward the employment of a carer, even though that is not yet necessary.
Since the discussion in Committee and since speaking with the Minister, whom I thank for her time, I have spoken to various care organisations, which are all supportive of the amendment. They made some recommendations that lie behind the changes in language since the amendment was tabled in Committee. The care organisations have taught me that there is a very wide way in which carers are used, both in the regulated sector and outside it, on which many people rely for vital tasks, health and personal care. Absent the voluntary sector, a lot more costs would fall on health and social services.
However, it is not always easy to find a family member who can do this. Families are much smaller nowadays—my husband and I were adding up what has happened in our own family and, if we chase it back, 14 at our age level will end up being replaced by far fewer at the grandchild level. With those kinds of circumstances, with many more people working, women not wanting to stay at home and families spreading much further from where they grew up and from where parents or others needing care within the family might be, the care organisations say that the reliance is on what they term “loved ones”. It is a very wide phrase; quite often, it means friends and neighbours whom they have lived close to who have helped one another during their lives. When one of them falls ill or becomes disabled or, in many sad cases, is a survivor of cancer who has been left with life-changing circumstances, they become the carer who helps them. As their condition deteriorates, it may be necessary for the carer to be nearby.
The care organisations that I have spoken to, and which support the amendment, are the Homecare Association, Care England, the National Care Forum, the National Care Association and Carers UK. I thank them for their time and recommendations.
We are quite aware that the Minister does not want to create loopholes—that was the main feature of the discussion that we had. For that purpose, we have provided that regulations can be made to amend the definition of “carer”. In many ways, I would prefer it if we did not have that there, because the Minister could make regulations that took away anything useful, but I am hoping that it would be done only in the light of experience if one found that the term was being somehow abused.
In considering carers, we also need to look at care patterns. Many people who need serious care have several carers, who have to operate in shift systems, whether that be daily, weekly or monthly. Sometimes, the carer may come from overseas and stay for six weeks, and then they go back and somebody else comes in, so there is a rolling pattern. It will be very difficult if they cannot necessarily be conveniently located.
So I ask the Minister to think again. Yes, there may not be a great number of people who would be helped by the amendment in the way that a huge number of renters will be helped by the Bill, but in a civil society being a minority has never been a ground for discrimination. Therefore, I ask the Minister to think about this and to understand that, like her, we do not want cheaters to abuse this; we want people who are in need of this service to be able to avail themselves of properties that, often, they have bought to plan for their care—and, indeed, in order not to be a burden on the state. Should they not be allowed the peace of mind that they will be able to fulfil those plans?
Baroness Neville-Rolfe (Con)
My Lords, I also support Amendment 21 in the name of the noble Lord, Lord de Clifford, and the noble Baroness, Lady Bowles, to which I have added my name. I am particularly grateful for the warm words of my noble friend Lord Jamieson and for the support of the various carers organisations which do such an important job in our society.
The Bill will allow a landlord to take possession of a property for a family reason. Our small extension would allow a nearby property to be taken back in hand if it were needed to house a carer. In the meantime, it would be available, for example, as a dwelling for a struggling local couple or an individual seeking a home.
With ever-growing numbers of the aged and disabled, with the move to smaller homes and smaller families, and with a scarcity of care homes and hospices, the provision for short-term housing of professional carers, often changing at short notice, will become more and more important in coping with our ageing population. This is particularly true in rural areas, which are being so battered by other changes the Government have felt it necessary to make.
I declare an interest, recorded in the register, as the owner of such a cottage bought specifically for a carer and generally let to a local on a shorthold tenancy. Such tenancies have expanded the rental market hugely in this country and will be completely swept away by the Bill. So, we need to do what we can together in this House to moderate its perverse consequences—notably in this case to make things better for carers. Fortunately, neither my husband nor I yet need a carer, but we may need one eventually, and my concern, like that of the noble Lord, Lord de Clifford, is a general one. I can guarantee that I am not alone.
I have no idea how the Government will find the 1 million more rented homes Savills believes we need by 2031 unless they make some sensible technical changes to the Bill, which is being constructively debated by knowledgeable experts here in this House. Our Amendment 21 falls into that category. I hope others will join us in the Lobby and in calling on the Government to think again on this issue.
Baroness Taylor of Stevenage (Lab)
I simply add that it does not have to be another carer; it could be any of the key workers who we talk about so often who are in need of housing. There are other options for people. If landlords are receiving rent for that property, while I appreciate that there may be further shortages making it difficult to find somewhere near enough to the property, but there is the option of using the rent secured on one property to rent alternative accommodation for a carer.
Baroness Bowles of Berkhamsted (LD)
Those of us who deal with economic matters will have to point out that there would be tax paid on the rent, so there would not be a great deal left to be able to rent the next home. That is not an economically viable solution, even if there were another adjacent property to rent with what was left of the rent after deductions.
Baroness Taylor of Stevenage (Lab)
I am sorry; I can only come back to my point. It does not seem equitable to evict one family to house another family. I ask the noble Lord to withdraw his amendment.
Renters’ Rights Bill
Baroness Bowles of Berkhamsted Excerpts(3 months ago)
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Lord de Clifford (CB)
My Lords, Amendment 64 in my name is in regard to the family. I thank the noble Baronesses, Lady Bowles of Berkhamsted and Lady Neville-Rolfe, for their support for this amendment. The Bill allows a landlord to take possession of a property for a family reason. This is a small extension to the number of reasons for which a landlord could take possession of a property. That reason is that a property is to be used by a carer for a family member who requires full-time care.
The amendment clearly sets out that the property needs to be in close proximity to the landlord’s family home and be used by the carer. The reason for the close proximity is so that the carer can attend not only on a daily basis but, more importantly, be available to attend in emergencies, quickly and efficiently. These can be on a regular occurrence in some cases. The types of properties that I have in mind are: annexes on homes; a flat in a block of flats where the landlord’s primary residence is located; properties in less urban areas, such as rural villages, hamlets and remote farms; and small property clusters where properties are in short supply.
I appreciate that tenants would be forced to leave a property, but this amendment does not seem to shorten the four months’ notice period. The Bill allows some landlords the opportunity to gain possession for an employee or a worker for agricultural purposes under ground 5A in Schedule 1. I have assumed that the reason why this exemption has been included is that agricultural workers need a property close to their place of work due to the nature of the work, and at all times of day. The need of a carer is similar to that of the agricultural worker: they need to be close to the patient and could be on call and work unsociable hours.
Most landlords’ and tenants’ relations are generally good, and most likely, the landlord would make the tenant aware that the tenancy could be terminated if a property needs to be for a carer. To leave a property is an unsettling upheaval for a tenant and their family, but they would be given four months’ notice. If there is good communication between parties, everybody lives in the knowledge that this could be a possible outcome and plan accordingly.
Financially, if you own an appropriate property, this is the most practical way a landlord or their family can provide the most cost-effective accommodation for a long-term carer, and when the family is facing a high demand on its finances. Only a limited number of landlords will use this possession right, but if needed, it would be welcomed by the family, as it would give flexibility in times of sadness and when time requires the need for it.
I thank the Minister for her engagement on the Bill and for our short discussion on the amendment. I note the Minister’s suggestions that alternatives could be found to house a carer, but my response is that to find a property in the correct location and which is suitable for a carer would be extremely difficult in this current high-demand rental marketplace.
The second suggestion was that the tenant has the right to a secure home. The other side of that debate would be: would it not be a reasonable case that the landlord has a right to gain possession of their own assets for the benefit of their well-being or a family member’s own caring needs?
Properties are owned for many purposes: in some cases, for financial reasons, like investments, and to provide regular income or pension funds. It may be available to rent during a job relocation or as a future residence in a desired location. All these landlords who own such properties could gain possession under the Bill when needed. However, if the property owner who may wish to use a property for a legitimate family reason, to care for a family member, cannot gain access to the property at the time of need, then this amendment seeks to rectify this.
In summing up the group beginning Amendment 10 in Tuesday’s Committee, the Minister said that those amendments did not meet
“the bar to overrule the general principle that private renters should have secure homes”.—[Official Report, 22/4/25; col. 615.]
I believe that a long-term carer of somebody crosses that bar to enable possession for a family.
Baroness Bowles of Berkhamsted (LD)
My Lords, unfortunately, I was unable to speak at Second Reading, but I saw that the noble Lord, Lord de Clifford, raised an issue that I wanted to raise, concerning the matter of carers, and I have been pleased to co-operate with him to produce Amendment 64. First, I declare my interests as a private landlord for over 25 years, both in a personal capacity, with lettings in Hertfordshire and Buckinghamshire, and also as an experienced—though unpaid—trustee-type director for lettings in Buckinghamshire.
Being a landlord started accidentally: when I rented a property, I intended to sell to a friend in need. Then, like many self-employed people without an employment-linked pension, I saw its value as pension provision instead of selling it and that it kept the asset available, if needed, for business-loan security. I have had conversations about the extra risks and costs, should we sell and what it means for rents. I have, as the Minister said we should on Tuesday, examined our business models. Even without exposure to mortgages, the effect is that rents will rise and will track market rates sooner rather than risk larger, less frequent adjustments that are more likely to attract challenge, which, of course, would exert an inflationary feedback loop on rents. In a nutshell, it has made it riskier to be a benign landlord.
Baroness Bowles of Berkhamsted (LD)
With regard to the amendment concerning carers, the main reason for rejecting it seems to be that it would not be widely required; that it would only be a small minority who might find themselves in that situation. But is not the majority of this Bill based on the actions of a small minority of landlords? Therefore, we should look at both sides of the minorities argument.
The Minister said that the ground could be exploited. If such an amendment were to come forward in a fuller form on Report, it could clearly lay out the evidence that it would be necessary for the court to see—just the same as for a sale or any other purpose. For the purposes of a probing amendment, of course, that is not there.
I would ask to have another meeting with the Minister—I know that the noble Lord, Lord de Clifford, has had one, but perhaps those of us who are interested could have another. I do not see that there is any substance in saying that because it is a minority it does not apply; the whole Bill is about minority behaviour. Therefore, it is very relevant that any minority should be considered.
Baroness Taylor of Stevenage (Lab)
I thank the noble Baroness for those further comments. I am of course always happy to have a further meeting with her and the noble Lord, Lord de Clifford, on this subject. A core principle of the Bill is to increase the security of tenure that tenants enjoy. We want to keep our focus on that, but I understand the point the noble Baroness is making and the reason for putting forward the amendment. I think the words I used were that there was likely to be very limited use of this ground and a risk of abuse and that, where a family member would act as carer, there is another possession ground that can be used, but, of course, I am happy to meet and discuss it with her before Report.
Baroness Taylor of Stevenage (Lab)
I thank the noble Lord, Lord Cromwell, for his further clarification. I considered that we had a very useful meeting earlier on this and I have thought about it very carefully. I think the current 12-month restriction on re-letting is the right one to prevent abuse of those possession grounds, but of course I am happy to meet him and discuss it further.
Baroness Bowles of Berkhamsted (LD)
Can I also ask whether the Minister can provide any advice or evidence that she has been given concerning the issue of the European Convention on Human Rights and the right of access to property, as spoken about by the noble Lord, Lord Pannick?
Baroness Taylor of Stevenage (Lab)
The analysis on the ECHR is published in the ECHR memorandum. That information is set out in that document.
Baroness Taylor of Stevenage (Lab)
The advice I have is that it is in the ECHR memorandum, so I refer the noble Baroness to that. If she wants further advice once she has looked at it, I am happy to take that back to the department.