National Lottery

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Wednesday 14th July 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The noble Earl makes a very interesting point. I know that all the lottery distributors pride themselves on their ability to reach deeply into communities and to make those local connections.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the National Lottery is a significant success and enjoys huge public support. Research shows that there is also public support for other national lotteries, such as the Postcode Lottery. Will their needs for greater parity of prize money and reach be reconsidered so that more funds can be made available for good causes?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The noble Lord will be aware that we are planning to carry out a review of society lotteries, to which he refers. It will be an early check based on evidence to see whether the increased limits have had the intended impact and that the limits are enabling the sector to increase the proportion that goes to good causes.

Covid-19: Broadband

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Monday 5th July 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

It is within the role of Ofcom to monitor that effectiveness.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

The Minister said earlier that 100,000 homes would miss out on broadband access under the current plans. Does this mean that they will not even achieve the USO of 10 megabits per second, let alone the real target of a gigabit-enabled economy? Can she say when we will reach 100% coverage?

Channel 4: Funding and Governance

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Thursday 1st July 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I do not think it is anything to do with a melting ice sculpture. The Government are committed to having a thriving PSB sector. I know the noble Baroness understands full well what the trends are in advertising revenues for linear television. We are trying to address that and make sure that Channel 4 has a secure, sustainable and thriving future.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, in earlier eras, matters of important public policy such as this would have been preceded by Green Papers and White Papers before Parliament considered any primary legislation that it felt necessary. On broadcasting, this Government take a rather different approach, preferring to set up ad hoc advisory committees, such as the one looking at public service broadcasting. So what is it to be this time? Can the Minister spell out what the Government will do here and explain how Parliament is going to be involved?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The noble Lord refers to the expert advice that Ministers will receive from the independent PSB panel but he overlooks the digital radio and audio review that we will be publishing this summer, the Ofcom review of PSBs that will be published in mid-July, and the consultation that we are carrying out on Channel 4 and video on demand, which will result in a White Paper and legislative proposals. I do not think that looks like taking decisions in secret.

Choirs: Restrictions

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Wednesday 30th June 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The noble Lord’s tone expressed very well what many people feel. We absolutely hear that frustration. He will be aware that all ministerial and MPs’ inboxes are full of correspondence on this issue, so we are aware. We are also aware that some amateur groups perform in a professional context, as the noble Lord set out. As a department we cannot advise on individual events or activities. It is up to the organisers to operate in accordance with the published guidance.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab)]

I think all of us share considerable dismay about the answers we have just heard. Although we feel sorry for the Minister for her attempts to try to add a veneer of respectability to her responses, neither the science nor the reality of common sense back her up. As a member of the Parliament Choir, I want to meet with other members in a socially respectable way to sing the music that inspires us and to lead our lives as close to normality as we can. What we want is a road map and a timescale.

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I can only repeat what I said in response to an earlier question: we will provide that road map as soon as possible and in time for step 4.

Events Research Programme

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Wednesday 23rd June 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

As I am sure the right reverend Prelate is aware, the Government are very concerned about, and keen to uphold, freedom of religion and expression. I will take back the specific question on religious events and write to him.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab)]

My Lords, I declare an interest as a member of the parliamentary choir. Research into disease transmission is obviously very important, and I am sure that the results will be helpful for future planning. However, common sense should not be ignored. Can the noble Baroness now answer the question posed by the noble Lord, Lord Berkeley:

“is it not utterly ridiculous that shouting, chanting and drinking fans can congregate and hug each other”—

and be seen on television doing that—

“but a small, amateur, vaccinated and socially distanced choir cannot meet to rehearse?”—[Official Report, 21/6/21; col. 18.]

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

Obviously, the scenes that were broadcast of people singing in pubs around the events outside the scope of the pilot events are governed by step 3 of the road map, which is absolutely clear that such behaviour is not permitted.

Music Festivals: Covid-19-related Cancellations

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Tuesday 27th April 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I can reassure the noble Lord that we are in conversations with individual member states focusing particularly on improving guidance regarding entry and work permit regulations. We are also looking carefully at proposals for a new export office to support this sector.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the Budget extended the film and television insurance scheme to its present level of £2.8 billion, and it has supported 200 productions and saved an estimated 24,000 jobs. It therefore seems a little strange to recall that only yesterday the Minister said that the Government

“are trying to understand the market failure and how it impacts on different forms of live events.”—[Official Report, 26/4/21; col. 2074.]

She did not repeat that when she responded to the Question today. Will she explain what specific issues the department does not understand about this process?

Gambling: Early Mortality

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Tuesday 20th April 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The right reverend Prelate raises important points. He will be aware that Public Health England is doing research at the moment, looking at how to reduce gambling harms and how to recoup the costs to society, which I hope will go some way to reassuring him.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the excellent Select Committee report may not have endorsed the current split in policy leadership but it made it very clear that DCMS had a lot to do. In that context, can the Minister confirm that the online harms Bill will deal with underage gambling and issues raised by the question put by the right reverend Prelate, such as an association between gambling and early mortality—and if not, why not?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The main focus for addressing the issues that the noble Lord rightly raises is through our review of the Gambling Act. The online safety Bill, as he is aware, will focus on user-generated content in particular.

Data Protection Act 2018: Children

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Thursday 4th March 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I reject the noble Baroness’s suggestion that the Government are blocking off meaningful means of redress. Our current data protection laws already offer strong protections to people, including children and other vulnerable groups, and we will continue to assist them in exercising their rights. Through the review, we sought, and have listened to, the views of children and their parents, and we are working with the Information Commissioner’s Office to raise awareness of the redress mechanisms available to them. Finally, civil society groups can still make complaints on behalf of children, as the noble Baroness suggests.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, it is very hard to square the two strands that the Minister is dwelling on: that children were in favour of more legislation to help them challenge the issues concerned with their data, but also that there was not a strong enough case for introducing legislation. Given that the consequence of that decision, as has been said, is more children suffering from identity theft, online grooming, data profiling and microtargeting, can the Minister help us by explaining what would have been a strong enough case?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

As the noble Lord is aware, we considered the views of children and business, but the real issue here is less what would be a strong enough case and more whether the existing law is adequate—which we believe it is—and whether it needs to be implemented in a way that allows all data subjects to seek redress more easily, which it does; that is what we are working on.

EU: Musicians

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Thursday 28th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The noble Lord makes a serious point. In relation to the first part of his question, he will be aware that the arrangements are different in different countries. For example, the requirements to tour France are much more straightforward than some other countries. Obviously, musicians may choose to adjust to that. I cannot give him the detail of what will be proposed. What I can say is that the round table that the Secretary of State held with the industry on the 20th of this month was extremely constructive in tone in addressing all those points.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, going back to the answer given just a few moments ago to the noble Lord, Lord German, will the Minister confirm that the plan seems to be that since the Home Office will not provide reciprocal arrangements on the basis that the EU has proposed, we are talking about bilateral deals right across Europe, and that a working group has been formed which is meeting to draw up plans? Is that where we have got to?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I think where we have got to is that we have secured a deal with the European Union extremely recently. The agreement cannot be renegotiated. It needs now to be implemented. We aim to do that in collaboration with the sector to make sure that it can thrive in future.

Telecommunications Infrastructure (Leasehold Property) Bill

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

3rd reading & 3rd reading (Hansard) & 3rd reading (Hansard): House of Lords
Thursday 28th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I am glad that the noble Lord, Lord Alton, has rehearsed the background to his Report stage amendment and explained the reasons for bringing it back to your Lordships’ House today. We simply cannot turn a blind eye. Standing aside or ignoring what is happening in China is tantamount to condoning the appalling actions described by the noble Lord in his powerful and moving speech.

A lot has changed since June. I am sure that the Minister will update us on subsequent government action, particularly in relation to Huawei equipment. As a number of noble Lords have said, other legislation—including the Trade Bill, before your Lordships’ House again next Tuesday—has amendments bearing on this issue. The case made by the noble Lord, Lord Alton, is unanswerable, as I have made clear. However, tabling this amendment to this Bill is perhaps not the best way of achieving his wider objectives. It might, I suppose, adversely affect the chances of the big win that we hope to achieve on Tuesday with his amendment to the Trade Bill.

Everyone who has spoken today has supported the noble Lord, Lord Alton, and paid tribute to his campaigning and his ceaseless tenacity on this cause. If he chooses to divide the House, we will support him, but I hope that he will feel able to accept the Government’s position on this narrowly focused Bill and that it would be better to defer the decision to Tuesday’s debate on the Trade Bill.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (Baroness Barran) (Con)]

My Lords, I thank all noble Lords for their contributions to this important debate. We all agree that this is a matter of great importance, which is why, on Report, I committed to bringing the issue back at this stage. I said:

“We will endeavour to find all the time possible to have sufficient ground to bring back a government amendment.”—[Official Report, 29/6/20; col. 538.]


I would like to reassure noble Lords that, working with officials in my department, I have tried my utmost to find a way forward.

I thank the noble Lord, Lord Alton, for his generous words. I have virtually met and spoken with him and other noble Lords on several occasions to discuss their concerns. My officials have had discussions with their colleagues in the Home Office, the Foreign Office and the Public Bill Office on how the Government might bring forward a legislative provision that—to quote the noble Lord, Lord Alton, on Report—had “teeth”.





We put two different versions of a government amendment forward to do this but were advised by the Public Bill Office that they were out of scope. It has been unequivocal that this includes any amendment addressing issues in the supply chain, such as those issues rightly raised by the noble Lord. Such issues—and thus, amendments seeking to address them—are therefore out of scope of this Bill. As a result, regrettably the Government have been unable to table an amendment to this effect, as I set out in my letter to all Peers on 26 January.

This also means that this amendment will not impact on the supply chain in the way that its sponsors intend. Indeed, it does not touch the supply chain at all. This is why we are resisting the amendment today, but along with other noble Lords, I commend the noble Lord, Lord Alton, for beginning a very important new stage of the conversation about modern slavery, particularly in Xinjiang, and human rights more broadly.

Several noble Lords invited me to share some of the actions that the Government have taken, and I am pleased to do so. On 12 January, the Foreign Secretary announced a series of measures to ensure that UK businesses and the public sector are not complicit in human rights violations in Xinjiang. This includes four main actions: first, strengthening the overseas business risk guidance to make clearer the risks to UK businesses investing in, or with, supply chains in Xinjiang; secondly, a review of export controls as they apply to the situation in Xinjiang, to ensure that we are doing all that we can to prevent the export of goods that may contribute to human rights violations in Xinjiang; thirdly, the introduction of financial penalties for organisations which fail to comply with the Modern Slavery Act; and, fourthly, ensuring that government and public sector bodies have the evidence that they require to exclude suppliers that are complicit in human rights violations in Xinjiang.

This announcement is a clear demonstration of the UK’s global leadership role in standing up for the rights of Uighurs and other ethnic minorities in Xinjiang. I thank all noble Lords who acknowledged that Government’s work in this area. These measures will help to ensure that no British organisation, whether public or private sector, is contributing inadvertently to violations in Xinjiang. As we know, consumer opinion and reputational considerations can and do play an important part in influencing corporate behaviour, and we as a Government are sending a strong signal that we will not stand by as these violations continue, and that there is a reputational and economic cost to them.

The noble Lord, Lord Alton, asked me three questions. The first was about the timing of putting into practice the legislation from the Home Office. We will legislate as soon as parliamentary time allows us to introduce penalties for non-compliance, and other measures which will strengthen the transparency legislation.

Regarding our conversations with BT, I am sure that he will understand that it would not be appropriate to comment on conversations with an individual company, but I think that he will also agree that we, like him, want respect for human rights to be at the centre of all business that takes place in this country.

On the role of the judiciary and state genocide, which the noble Lord understands much better than many people, and certainly me, state genocide clearly is very difficult to prove in a judicial context. The evidential threshold is high, and proceedings tend to be long and costly. It would be difficult for the High Court effectively to determine genocide, with the inevitable constraints that would exist on access to evidence and witnesses, and it would be wrong for the Government or MPs to subcontract to the courts our responsibility for deciding when a country’s human rights record is sufficiently bad that we will not engage in trade negotiations. Parliament’s responsibility is to determine when sanctions take place and with whom we negotiate. We continue to believe that responsibility rests with Parliament.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

My Lords, as noble Lords will be aware, this piece of legislation, though short in length, has taken many months to reach this stage and has sparked impassioned debate from all sides of this House. It is a Bill that will benefit huge numbers of people, and I appreciate the dedication with which your Lordships have scrutinised it. Our debate and your Lordships’ questioning have exposed important global issues, particularly in relation to human rights, and no one watching the passage of this Bill could doubt the rigour of your Lordships’ scrutiny.

I am particularly grateful for the openness and co-operation shown by Members on the Front Benches opposite: the noble Lords, Lord Stevenson, Lord Livermore, Lord Clement-Jones and Lord Fox. I must of course mention the noble Lord, Lord Alton, from whom I have learned much in our conversations during the passage of the Bill. He has shone a light on some terrible human rights abuses. I also thank his co-signatories: my noble friend Lord Forsyth, the noble Baroness, Lady Falkner, and the noble Lord, Lord Adonis.

I will take this opportunity to congratulate the noble Lord, Lord Stevenson, on his appointment to your Lordships’ Communications and Digital Committee. I thank him for his generous advice behind the scenes and his friendly challenge in the Chamber. I will miss seeing him opposite me, virtually or physically, but look forward to working with his successor.

I am pleased with the shape in which the Bill leaves the House. Once it comes into force, it will ensure that those living in apartments and blocks of flats are supported in accessing fast, reliable and resilient connectivity. I do not need to remind your Lordships how important that is.

Finally, I take the opportunity to thank the Bill team and officials across government who have worked tirelessly and very patiently with this Minister to deliver this important piece of policy. I beg to move.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I thank the Minister for her kind words. We have enjoyed working with her over this period. The Bill has been an exemplary one in terms of making sure that the House is able to do its job and that the processes necessary to make it fit for legislation once it leaves Parliament are carried out in the best way. That can be done only if there is a spirit of mutual support and trust, and we certainly had that.

I actually took this Bill over at a relatively late stage. Most of the heavy lifting was done initially by my noble friend Lord Griffiths of Burry Port, and the show was kept on the road by Dan Stevens, our legislative assistant, whose skills and expertise I have drawn on mercilessly. I join the Minister in thanking members of the Bill team, who made themselves very much available and answered our detailed questions in the private meetings that we had.

This is a small but important Bill. As the Minister said, it will affect a lot of people; it will make their lives better and give them access to what has become a utility necessary for modern living. It has been scrutinised carefully in this House, and I am confident that it will play a part in helping to achieve a gigabit-enabled economy across the whole country—something that we need as soon as possible. There remains a lot to do, as we picked up today, but it is good to hear that the consultations on the remaining issues are taking place, particularly on the rollout of 5G and the development of fibre to the home. I urge the department to up its game on this and on a number of other issues that we talked about, and I will be watching from the sidelines.

Television Licence Evasion

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Tuesday 26th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

My Lords, there is no raid going on of the BBC; quite the reverse. We are working towards much more transparency around the licence fee settlement and my right honourable friend the Secretary of State has written to the director-general of the BBC asking for a breakdown of spend against the five charter purposes, so that we can work with a transparent and clear focus.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, last week’s announcement heaps uncertainty and unfairness on the BBC as it keeps the threat of a further loss of revenue in play, instead of following the clear message from the recent consultation and the Perry review that the current system is the most effective of the available options. Can the Minister confirm that no further action will be taken in this area until agreement has been reached between the Government and the BBC on the licence fee level for the remainder of the charter period?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

Perhaps it would help if I quote directly from the Government’s response to the consultation in relation to the noble Lord’s valid and important point. We said that:

“The government considers that a future decision on decriminalising TV licence evasion would benefit from a clearer picture on the wider drivers of BBC income in the face of market and other trends.”


So, we need a rounded picture of those issues on which to take a decision.

Social Capital

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Monday 25th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

My noble friend raises a very important point. The Government are absolutely committed to trying to capitalise on the surge of good will that she describes and build a real volunteering legacy. We are developing a new volunteering strategy and, within that, reviewing a number of options, including a volunteering passport, and really trying to understand where the need for volunteers is greatest.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the noble Baroness, Lady Barran, is also Minister for Loneliness. Does this ONS report signal any adjustment to the Government’s current loneliness strategy, which was set up in memory of Jo Cox MP? If so, can she point to any policy areas that might be adjusted?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I start by saying that it is an enormous honour to be the Minister for Loneliness. My inbox on loneliness is fuller than on any other subject that I am responsible for, and it is something that absolutely touches every one of us. Our strategy will continue predominantly along the same lines; namely, talking about loneliness and the stigma, and making sure that funding goes to organisations that connect people. During the pandemic we have brought together a group of around 70 organisations in our tackling loneliness network that are advising us on particular themes in relation to young people, digital, place and older people.

UK Musicians: EU Visa Arrangements

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Wednesday 20th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, despite the helpful exchanges on this topic yesterday, this seems to be about how DCMS can square the Home Office red lines on freedom of movement. We need greater transparency. Will the Minister place copies of all correspondence between the EU and the UK on this issue in the Library? Secondly, we need trust. Can she confirm that the Government will take full account of the views of the ISM and others that the short-term business visitor model is not appropriate and that any final agreement for visitors from the EU to the UK should be based on a 90-day permitted paid engagement model? Finally, we need a plan. Will the Minister spell out what the original UK proposal was and commit to writing to us about what the new negotiating objective will be—assuming that the EU’s door is indeed still open?

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (Baroness Barran) (Con)]

I thank the noble Lord for his questions. I do not think the red lines were between DCMS and the Home Office; I think they were between the UK and the EU. We proposed a tailored deal for musicians and other cultural professionals and the EU did not accept it. On the correspondence and the discussions, my noble friend the Minister for Digital and Culture said yesterday in the other place that she would talk to BEIS and Home Office colleagues with a view to publishing the details of those discussions. On the noble Lord’s final point, we are consulting extensively with the sector to understand what it needs to be able to thrive once we emerge from the pandemic.

European Union: Visa-free Touring for Musicians

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Tuesday 19th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am sure the noble Lord is right that mutual blame probably does not get us much further forward. However, as I said, in the meantime we are doing everything we can to try to simplify the procedures now in place and to understand the needs of the sector so it can continue to flourish and thrive.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the Minister’s opening response was very carefully crafted but, reading between the lines, it seems the creative industries have lost out in an unseemly internal government squabble. If the door is still open for discussion, what are the Government doing to develop an agreed position which will also deliver the backing of the Home Office and Border Force?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The Government had an agreed position, which was to extend the list of permitted activities for short-term business visitors. The EU rejected that.

Gambling

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Thursday 7th January 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

As the noble Lord is aware, the review will look at all options for funding this area. The Government are open to alternative funding mechanisms, but it is only fair to acknowledge that the five major gambling companies have committed to an extra £100 million over four years.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, gambling legislation is a strange mixture of voluntary codes and inadequate self-regulation of advertising, all supervised by a regulator recently accused of needing to “up its game”. Can the Minister confirm that the long-awaited review will consider imposing a duty of care on operators, as the Government are doing regarding online harms?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

Unfortunately I cannot confirm that to the noble Lord today, but we are inviting evidence on the effectiveness of the regulatory regime and of what reduces problem gambling. The noble Lord shakes his head, but we do not want to pre-empt the outcome of the review. We would welcome him contributing the evidence he has, which we would consider carefully.

Covid-19: Arts Sector

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Tuesday 15th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The announcement on the London decision happened only yesterday, so I hope that my noble friend will give us a moment to work that through. However, Arts Council England has made over £26 million in awards to over 8,200 individuals through non-CRF funds this year, including £17.1 million through the emergency response fund for individuals.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, as my noble friend Lady McIntosh says, the current schemes have clearly not worked to support freelancers. Will the Minister please accept that and has she read the Museum Freelance report, which says that fewer than half its respondents have even been able to access government income, let alone survive over this period? What is she going to do about it?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

We would accept that some freelancers have either believed that they are not eligible for these schemes or are not eligible. But we have announced considerable funding, and £378 million was claimed by freelancers in the arts, entertainment and recreation sector under phases 1 and 2 of the scheme.

Gambling Legislation

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Wednesday 9th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I reassure the noble Lord and my noble friend Lord Smith of Hindhead that unlicensed sites are within the scope of the review. Again, we very much encourage your Lordships and those in your networks to submit evidence.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, following up on the question of the noble Lord, Lord Alton, I welcome the review, although we point out that it is much delayed. I particularly like the Secretary of State’s description of it as a review of

“analogue law in a digital age”.

As has been said, most of the egregious behaviour is caused by companies that, in this digital age, operate outwith our boundaries and so evade UK statute. We will surely need digital solutions in a digital world. Will the review really consider this issue?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am slightly puzzled by the noble Lord’s question, because the location of the gambler is where our laws prevail, irrespective of the location of the operator.

Public Service Broadcasting Online

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Wednesday 9th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I think that the new director-general, and the most recent comments from Ofcom, support my noble friend’s final comments about breadth of views and voices—but, as he will know, the BBC is editorially independent, so decisions in relation to Radio 3 rest with it.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, British broadcasting relies to a significant extent on keeping the funding of public service broadcasters separate. What response do the Government have to the decline of mass advertising revenue referred to in the Small Screen: Big Debate consultation recently issued?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I think that the Government are concerned, and my colleagues in the department are working closely with the industry to understand what a sustainable funding model looks like.

Streaming Platforms: Age Ratings

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Tuesday 8th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The noble Lord raises some wide-ranging points. In addition to what I have already mentioned regarding our approach, we are taking forward a media literacy strategy and developing a one-stop shop which will give companies guidance on how to keep children safe online.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, is it true that the content guidelines carried by Netflix are primarily derived by applying algorithms? Does that not differ significantly from how the BBFC arrives at its clear and consistent advice on content? If that is true, is it accurate for Netflix to say that it is carrying BBFC age ratings on all its programmes?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

My understanding is that the system that has been agreed between Netflix and the BBFC is that Netflix takes a self-rating approach in line with the BBFC’s classification, which is then verified and audited by the BBFC. Both parties appear to be content.

Covid-19: Support for Entertainment and Music Industry Freelancers

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Monday 9th November 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The Government absolutely recognise the importance of touring for musicians and other creative talent from this country. We continue to seek a reciprocal agreement with the EU, which would allow UK citizens to undertake some business activities in the EU without a work permit on a short-term basis. Unfortunately, however, I cannot comment on the detail of these arrangements.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, in response to the noble Lord, Lord Vaizey, the Minister mentioned that her department had done some research into the problems facing freelancers and the self-employed, most of whom have not been paid since March 2020. Does her research show how much funding the DDCMS estimates is needed to create a safety net for those workers in cultural industries? How much of the Culture Recovery Fund has actually been received to date by freelancers and the self-employed, and will she publish that information?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am happy to share the detail of that information in a letter to the House and put a copy in the Library. We are working very hard. We have already disbursed over £500 million to 2,000 organisations as part of the Culture Recovery Fund. As I mentioned, that includes specific pots for music venues and cinemas, and we were pleased to announce additional funding for heritage and arts organisations just this weekend.

Covid-19: Cultural and Creative Industries

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Monday 26th October 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I agree with my noble friend that there are many brilliant examples of where the arts have helped to promote positive mental health. Indeed, the launch of the National Academy for Social Prescribing is an important recognition of exactly that point.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the music sector is the original gig economy: no play literally means no pay. To its credit, the sector has come up with several suggestions to help it reboot, including a cut in VAT on tickets and, as the noble Baroness, Lady Bonham-Carter, said, backing an insurance scheme to encourage venues to reopen. The Minister seemed sympathetic to this last point; what more information does she need before she can support it?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

As I said to the noble Baroness, Lady Bonham-Carter, we need absolute clarity that insurance is the real barrier to reopening, and, at a time when the pandemic is changing from week to week, obviously a number of wider issues have to be taken into consideration.

Historic Statues

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Monday 19th October 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am not aware that there are plans for a task force as the noble Lord suggests, but I am happy to take that back to the department. Obviously, move versus remove versus retain and explain has been carefully considered. Our view is that retain and explain is the best approach. My right honourable friend the Secretary of State will shortly have an online round table to discuss many of these issues with key stakeholders and arm’s-length bodies.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab)]

My Lords, we welcome the Government’s suggestion that the policy should be retain and explain. I think that gets across the point very well. Does the Minister agree that resolving this issue might be an opportunity for collaborative work with schools? What would children make of the way our local communities currently view local history through their statues? Will she pursue this with her colleagues?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

The noble Lord’s suggestion chimes very well with our approach. It would be enlightening to hear what children think: they normally tell us the truth. I am happy to pick that up with colleagues.

Amazon

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Monday 12th October 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I cannot claim to have read every page of the US report, but I have looked at the headlines. There is a great deal of overlap with the principles that we have already accepted, both on anti-trust measures and on data interoperability and portability. Where the report differs, if I have understood correctly, is in its promotion of structural separations within the industry.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the Government recently said that they could scrap the digital services tax to facilitate a trade agreement with the United States. Is that still our negotiating position? Can the Minister tell us whether the Government support the challenge that India and South Africa are making to the WTO moratorium on customs duties on goods transmitted electronically?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

We are keen to have a free trade agreement with the US that strengthens our economic relationship with our largest bilateral trading partner. Once a global digital solution is in place, we will remove the DST. I will write to the noble Lord on the second part of his question.

Covid-19: Regional Theatres

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Monday 28th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I thank the noble Earl for helping me to answer the question. He is quite right that there are two key criteria in the culture recovery fund: institutions of national importance, and making sure that we use that money to continue to help level up all our communities.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, some 90,000 jobs are currently at risk in the creative industries, and regional theatres right across the country are under threat. As my noble friend Lord Foulkes said, Treasury schemes have not helped the creative freelance sector, and we now know that this is because the Chancellor does not regard them as being viable jobs. Does the Minister agree with him? The film and TV sector now has a government-backed plan to help it restart productions. Why cannot that scheme be extended to regional theatres with immediate effect?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am not clear where the Chancellor said he did not see these as viable jobs. We have used every effort to make sure that the unprecedented level of support for these sectors is as wide and comprehensive as possible.

Covid-19: Creative Industries

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Tuesday 22nd September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

We are absolutely clear that the role of the creative industries in protecting our mental health in particular has been vital during lockdown.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the Film and TV Production Restart Scheme’s rules, which were published last week, say in rule 11 that it is expected that funding granted under the scheme will comply with social commitments that address issues such as lack of diversity. This is very welcome. However, there appears to be a let-out clause for pre-existing productions. Can the Minister confirm that the Government will scrutinise this issue carefully and that any attempts by producers in receipt of these funds to weaken commitments to diversity will be rigorously challenged?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am very happy to take back the noble Lord’s point and ensure that this is looked at carefully, as he suggests.

Music Industry

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Thursday 10th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

There are no current plans that I am aware of to extend the self-employed scheme to that group, but the £95 million fund announced by Arts Council England is trying to maximise employment opportunities, including for those early in their careers.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, while the total funding made available by Her Majesty’s Government is welcome, the Minister will be aware—we have raised this with her before—of the problem facing freelancers who operate under a limited company and take dividends as a source of income. They are unable to claim through the current SEISS. This issue also affects high-tech start-up entrepreneurs. It is clearly a problem that has not been properly addressed. Can the Minister take this up with the Treasury and press for support to be extended to this group?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I am happy to raise this issue as the noble Lord suggests, but one issue that we have struggled with is separating out and identifying dividend income in the kind of examples that he has given us for those getting dividend income from their investments.

Gambling Legislation

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Thursday 10th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

My noble friend will be aware that we committed in our manifesto to tackle issues around loot boxes. We have announced that we are launching a call for evidence to inform the next steps on this.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) (V)]

My Lords, is not one of the great problems the lack of statutory control of advertising, which largely lies in the hands of the industry? I am delighted to hear that the long-delayed DCMS review of gambling legislation is to be restarted. Can the Minister confirm that it will cover this important lacuna?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

I cannot be specific on the scope of the review, but the evidence is not clear about the link between advertising and problem gambling, particularly among young people. The evidence points rather to the behaviour of parents and peers in influencing them.

Covid-19: Artificial Intelligence

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Wednesday 9th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

My understanding is that the consultation on the data strategy is open to everyone, but I am very happy to go back to the department and explore whether we can have a webinar for those Members of this House who are interested in taking part. Obviously, your Lordships’ Select Committee on Artificial Intelligence has been very influential already in our thinking. In relation to social care, the noble Lord referred to training and funding; it is also fair to say that the fragmentation of that sector is also a barrier to the adoption of AI, but we are also focusing on this.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) (V)]

My Lords, the EU White Paper of February 2020 promises legislation in Europe on public trust and regulation for AI next year. Will the Government commit to keeping our legislation on, and regulation of, AI in step with our former EU partners so as to benefit our creative industries?

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

This Government want to be a leader in the regulation of AI, balancing a pro-growth, pro-innovation economy with one upholding the highest ethical standards.

Telecommunications Legislation: Human Rights

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Tuesday 21st July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran]

The decisions on Huawei’s place in the 5G network were driven by security considerations. As a Government, we clearly have multiple responsibilities, of which national security comes highest. The advice we received from the National Cyber Security Centre changed and therefore our policy has changed.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the Secretary of State said last week that the Government have a clear and ambitious diversification strategy to replace Huawei. On closer inspection, that rather appears to be based on persuading the existing suppliers, Nokia and Ericsson, to step up and hoping that Samsung and NEC will get involved. Given our world-leading creative industries, can the Minister list which British companies have been approached?

[Baroness Barran]

I fear I cannot list the British companies but I am more than happy to write to the noble Lord. I am not sure whether that information is in the public domain. However, I reassure him that my honourable friend the Minister for Digital Infrastructure is actively working on this as we speak.

Digital Platforms: Impact on Democracy

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Thursday 16th July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran]

I cannot comment more widely on committees but, judging by the report produced by your Lordships’ committee in this area, it has been an exemplar of rigour.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I join others in congratulating my noble friend Lord Puttnam and his committee on their excellent report. As it says in paragraph 294, the Government already have the powers to introduce a requirement to include digital imprints on online political adverts. They have already consulted and committed to action in 2019; indeed, this is already the law in Scotland and it can be done by secondary legislation. The case is overwhelming. Will the Minister explain when we can expect this legislation?

[Baroness Barran]

I believe that this will form part of the online harms legislation.

Covid-19: Performing Arts

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Monday 13th July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran]

The noble Baroness is right that travel and working within the EU have been important for freelancers in many artistic disciplines. I remind her that we have been clear that we are not asking for anything special in relation to freelancers, but to replicate some of the deals that have been struck with other countries.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, following the Question asked by my noble friend Lady McIntosh, the Minister implied that the funding package recently announced included funding for freelancers but how that is to be done is opaque. Will the Minister write to me setting out precisely the quantum of financial support expected to be available to freelancers in the creative industries and what the take-up has been to date? Will she also set out fully the plan for how freelancers will survive until the full opening of the sector?

[Baroness Barran]

I am always delighted to write to the noble Lord—I feel that I do so at regular intervals, which is entirely appropriate. It is hard to be precise about the specifics of take-up to date on a sector-by-sector basis to see exactly where particularly the self-employed income support scheme has been used, but I can give the noble Lord the data that we have. How it will work will be up to individual institutions to judge in their applications for funding.

Arts, Culture and Heritage: Support Package

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Wednesday 8th July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, we welcome this much-needed, albeit long-awaited, injection of cash for the arts and cultural sectors. The announcement has been well received, although some concerns have been expressed. I hope the noble Baroness will agree that it is vital that this money does not go just to the biggest venues or to those with the loudest voices. The creative sector’s crown jewels are very well distributed throughout the country, and all parts, including in the devolved Administrations, need to be nourished.

Can the noble Baroness explain why, according to the department’s own briefing, funds will not actually arrive until the autumn? The arts bodies we are in touch with are already in substantial need, and further delay may push several into bankruptcy, which would be a tragedy. As she knows, the creative industries rely on freelancers, many of whom have been excluded from the Treasury’s Covid-19 schemes. What steps will the Government take to make sure not only that arts and cultural sector buildings are saved, but that they will have creators, actors and performers delivering live performances too?

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (Baroness Barran) (Con)]

I am grateful to the noble Lord for welcoming the package of £1.57 billion of new money for the arts and culture that has been announced. I can reassure him that the plan for the package is not just to prioritise the largest institutions, although they are very important and £100 million is set aside for them, but to nurture the ecosystem of arts and culture organisations, which will also have important implications for freelancers in the sector and for the whole supply chain. As regards getting the funds out quickly, I can reassure the noble Lord that colleagues are working tirelessly to do that as fast as possible.

Television Licences

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Monday 6th July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran]

The noble Baroness has raised an important point, which I will share with colleagues in the department.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, the BBC is not solely responsible for the cuts that it is now having to make. This was a budget cut imposed on it by the then Chancellor in a crude attempt to evade the Government’s statutory responsibility for welfare policy. One of the proposals that was rejected by the Government during the passage of what became the Digital Economy Act was for an independent assessment to be made of the BBC’s funding needs in order to deliver its charter responsibilities. Will the Government look at this fair and equitable policy during the next licence fee round?

[Baroness Barran]

The noble Lord is critical of the last settlement, but I would remind him that the BBC itself regarded it as a good deal.

Covid-19: Orchestras and Cultural Venues

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Wednesday 1st July 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran]

Our understanding is that, as I am sure the right reverend Prelate is aware, there is a risk of increased transmission involved in singing and the use of wind instruments. That is why non-professional choirs and orchestras will not resume for the time being, although professional orchestras can start rehearsing from 4 July on a socially distanced basis. As the right reverend Prelate mentioned, we have commissioned scientific studies, which are being carried out by SAGE, to try to build a really robust evidence base. That advice will be used to inform future policy and guidelines.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, do the Government accept that, as the creative industries are distinctive in that they are mainly freelance and self-employed, they may need special continuing support as the recovery gathers pace? Can she explain why the practical guidelines for live music-making have been delayed? Without them, organisations cannot plan and audiences are deprived of the benefits of live performance.

[Baroness Barran]

We absolutely recognise the nature and important role of freelancers in these sectors. They are in the region of 72% of the workforce, compared with 16% across the rest of the economy, so the noble Lord raises an important point. Colleagues are working night and day to get the guidelines out.

Telecommunications Infrastructure (Leasehold Property) Bill

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Report stage & Report stage (Hansard) & Report stage (Hansard): House of Lords
Monday 29th June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, this has been a very interesting debate, not least, as others have said, because of the way in which it has been structured. I do not think anybody who has seen “Hamlet” will have seen the death of Hamlet and the ensuing chaos placed right at the beginning of the play, but things seem a bit like that tonight. I jest—I should not do so because it is a very serious issue—but in some ways it was not unhelpful to have heard the Minister earlier on. She was certainly able to reassure us that it is in her mind to make an opportunity for this issue to come back at Third Reading; I hope that the Government back this when she responds.

Between now and then we may have a bit more time than we originally thought to engage with those who have spoken today, as I believe there is no date yet set for Third Reading. The noble Lord, Lord Alton, in particular made a wonderful speech and covered the ground so carefully, but others came in behind him and raised issues of substance. I hope these will be put forward in the best possible spirit as a rallying call for those who have concerns in this area to seize this opportunity, even though it is not perfect, to begin to stake out ground that should be at the heart of all our engagements with manufacturers and others concerned with the sorts of issues that have been raised today.

I ask the Minister to be as explicit as possible in her responses to a number of points. Is she content for this issue to come back to the House at Third Reading in a form that allows the noble Lord, Lord Alton, to raise the issues covered by his amendment? We do not have a date for that. Can she assure us that we will have time to meet the noble Lord, Lord Alton, and his co-sponsors, and to engage with other voices in your Lordships’ House who care about this, with the aim of finding sufficient common ground to table an amendment that will do justice to the case that has been made today? Will she confirm that her earlier statement, mid-debate, did not stifle this process? I suggest that, as a result of the amendment which we hope to get together to discuss, we start by ensuring that at least we have a process in Parliament that clearly demonstrates that Ministers take Section 54 of the Modern Slavery Act seriously, and are prepared to bring their decisions to Parliament for discussion.

[Baroness Barran]

My Lords, I start again by thanking your Lordships for giving me the opportunity to speak, rather unusually, in the middle of this very important debate. In no way was there any intention to shut down the debate. I hoped that clarifying the Government’s position would allow noble Lords to focus their remarks. I offer my thanks again for that flexibility.

I would like to address two things. First, a number of noble Lords raised the point about companies needing to do the right thing. Of course the companies that we are talking about are in compliance with the Modern Slavery Act and Section 54 but, as the noble Lord, Lord Alton, knows better than probably the rest of us put together, there are problems and issues with the teeth of Section 54; that is, in a way, at the heart of his amendment and will be at the heart of our response to the consultation later this summer. Secondly, I would like to reflect on the comments of the noble Lord, Lord Stevenson, and others, so as to bring absolute clarity to my remarks.

I hope that I echo exactly the suggestions of the noble Lord, Lord Stevenson, if I confirm that I am happy and content to bring this issue back at Third Reading. We will also allow time for the noble Lords, Lord Alton and Lord Stevenson, and others who have spoken today to address the issues raised by the noble Lord, Lord Alton, in his amendment. We will endeavour to find all the time possible to have sufficient ground to bring back a government amendment. I hope that the concerns of the noble Lord, Lord Alton, will be rooted in that amendment and with that, I ask him to withdraw his amendment.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Barran]

My Lords, Amendment 6 raises the important issue of competition, about which I think we are all in agreement. Of course the Government think that no operator should be able to prevent another from providing their own service to potential customers living inside a building. We believe that the Bill already ensures that no one is locked into services provided by a single provider. It allows for subsequent operators to apply for and make use of Part 4A orders in the same block of flats, and regulatory measures are already in place to ensure that operators, whenever they install their equipment, not just in this scenario, do not do so in an anti-competitive manner.

I direct noble Lords’ attention to paragraph 27E(4) of the Bill and the terms that will accompany a Part 4A order. These terms set out how Part 4A orders are to be exercised—for example, the time of day that operators can carry out works and that they conform to health and safety standards. We have set out in the Bill the areas that those regulations must include. It has always been our intention that the terms of an agreement impose by a Part 4A order would set out that the operator must not install their equipment in such a way as to physically prevent others from installing their own.

However, as the noble Lord, Lord Fox, put it very elegantly, we aim to simplify the lives of consumers. In response to his remarks and those of my noble friend Lord Holmes, the noble Lord, Lord Clement-Jones, and of course the noble Lord, Lord Stevenson, if it would reassure noble Lords then the Government would be willing to table an amendment to the Bill at Third Reading to that effect. We consider it fair to amend the Bill so that it is absolutely clear that these terms should include measures to ensure that an operator must not install their equipment in such an anti-competitive way. If the noble Lord, Lord Stevenson, is content with that approach, I ask that he withdraw his amendment.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara [V]]

Yes, my Lords, I am extremely content. I thank the Minister for that, and I am very happy to beg leave to withdraw by amendment.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Barran]

It is still the Government’s intention to deliver gigabit-capable connections to every home and business in the UK as soon as possible. We seek to do that by 2025. The noble Lord will remember that we talked in Committee about the impact of Covid on the rollout; I think that I clarified that we know that there is a short-term impact and we are doing everything we can to try to work through it—but, obviously, none of us can predict the future.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara [V]]

My Lords, I am grateful to those noble Lords who contributed to this short debate. I am particularly grateful to the Minister, who has spent a lot of time going back through some of the discussions that we had on this issue in Committee, and indeed further back than that, to come up with a comprehensive response, which I recognise and welcome. However, the argument that I was trying to make through the amendment—indeed, it carries on from discussions in Committee—was precisely illustrated by what she had to say in her response. The attempt to do this for every property in the country by 2025 must, by its very definition, range across departments other than DCMS, so it would be extraordinary if there was no central planning document at the very least, or legislative background at the highest end, to allow that to work through in the way that we do.

Those of us who have been around the block in government or close to government for many a year recognise that cross-departmental issues—the wicked issues, as they are often called—are always the ones that bring people down. Here we are, trying to suggest to the Government that we recognise that this is what they need; they may not like it and they may find that it causes more difficulties than it solves in the initial stages, but by goodness they will need it by the end of the process—and, as we get closer to 2025, they will definitely wish that they had taken this advice at this time.

To take an example, just on the simple question of reporting and accountability to Parliament, it was said in Committee and repeated today that the combination of Ofcom reports, Oral Questions, debates and Select Committee reports would be tantamount to a regular review carried out by the Government. But it would not. Ofcom is a regulator with separate focuses and functions. Oral Questions are random and not always coherent, and Ministers are expert at making sure that we get the least information for the maximum effort on our part. Debates, Select Committees and special reports are what they are. They are random and they come forward in response to particular and different pressures. They are not in any sense a replacement for a coherent approach in the way that we have talked about in this arrangement.

Having said that, the record of what the Government are currently doing is not to be decried. They are moving on new build and thinking about street works. There is money in the back pocket—£5 billion for hard to reach properties—and there are other lessons to be learned. There will be difficulties—these things are always difficult—but at least there is progress. What we are offering is a coherence and a shape and the legislative back-up to do that. I do think that the Government could have taken our advice and accepted the amendment. But, in the interim, even though it is late, I would like to test the opinion of the House.

Gambling Advertising

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Thursday 25th June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran]

I regret I can only repeat what I have already said in terms of the close work that is going on with the social media companies and the commitment from the Gambling Commission to address any additional gaps that are identified. However, the noble Baroness makes an important point, which we recognise.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

As a recent APPG report confirms, gambling companies have done extremely well out of the pandemic, mainly because of the growth in unregulated activity. There is a lot of talk about working with the social media companies, but no action seems ever to follow. Will the Minister confirm that one of the real and meaningful steps that the Government actually could take to safeguard children and vulnerable players would be by blocking certain online platforms? Will she do that? If not, why not?

[Baroness Barran]

Just to be clear again on the data, unsurprisingly, because there has been no sport during lockdown, 75% of people have not increased their expenditure either of time or money on gambling during lockdown. We should not be surprised about that because there has been no sport broadcast. We are looking at a range of measures and waiting for evidence being published by Public Health England and the National Institute for Health Research. We are preparing a national addiction strategy. The Government are absolutely committed to addressing the problems that arise from gambling and other addictive behaviours, but doing that in the round rather than in a piecemeal fashion.

Data Strategy

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Wednesday 24th June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran]

The noble Baroness makes an important point; I think it is one she has perhaps made previously, but it definitely bears repeating. We are clear in what we have said already that this will never be successful without raising data literacy skills, not only within government but across the nation. That is work in progress and her point about the importance of strong leadership, given the complexity and scale of this challenge, is well made.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, there was press comment recently about the Centre for Data Ethics and Innovation’s report on immunity passport technology. The Full Fact chief executive officer, Will Moy, asked whether this was

“a poor exercise in public reassurance”

or a “contribution to policy thinking”. Which is it, and what is the current status of the CDEI? Is it an independent public body or part of DCMS?

[Baroness Barran]

I trust that the work in that report, and all the reports from the CDEI, is there to help us advance our understanding of these extremely complex issues. The department certainly finds the work of the centre extremely valuable in informing our thinking.

Covid-19: Television Licences

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Tuesday 2nd June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran]

The noble and right reverend Lord will be aware, as I said earlier, that this has been decided. The transfer of responsibility for the licence fee was made in the Digital Economy Act and debated at length in both Houses in 2017.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab)]

My Lords, the Government have clearly made a complete mess of their blatant attempt to cut the BBC by making it responsible for their welfare policy. Does not the delayed start until 1 August simply emphasise that? Given the scale of their other contributions to offset the impact of Covid-19, as others have said, what precisely do the Government gain by removing free TV from older pensioners?

[Baroness Barran]

The Government are not removing free TV from older pensioners. The Government struck a deal with the BBC over the licence fee settlement in 2015 which was described by the director-general— the noble Lord, Lord Hall—as providing the BBC with financial stability. That is how we understood the situation and continue to do so.

Telecommunications Infrastructure (Leasehold Property) Bill

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Committee stage & Committee: 1st sitting (Hansard) & Committee: 1st sitting (Hansard): House of Lords
Tuesday 19th May 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab)]

My Lords, the benefit of making one or two Second Reading-style comments at the start of the debate on these amendments has been well proven by what has been said. A lot of context has been brought out, as has the theory underpinning some of the lines of argument. That is all to the good.

I want to make a couple of initial points. I take it as read, and I am sure that the Minister will confirm this when she responds, that we are all supportive of the speedy and complete rollout of a gigabit-capable economy. There is no question about our support in terms of previous chances because we have focused on or around this topic for a number of years now. Indeed, we have had a couple of Bills on it. It is on the record that, on our side of the House, we have tried hard to raise the unambitious USO target, as my old friend, my noble friend Lord Adonis, mentioned. We have also brought forward other measures—they were picked up on by other speakers, including the noble Lord, Lord Clement-Jones—which may have helped us to get a bit further down the line to where we are.

In the Digital Economy Act and subsequent legislation, we asked how to get everyone together on the path and moving toward a gigabit economy. The Government chose to go down the voluntary route. Of course that ended in tears, with very few respondents happy with where they are—so here we are again. I will not go into that in any detail. Having said that, times have changed. Other noble Lords have said it but I am sure that the Minister will agree that the internet’s role has changed as a result of Covid-19. It would have changed anyway but it has certainly been brought into focus because of the crisis. We certainly do not want a situation where individuals or families could be left behind because they have not been given access to gigabit-capable broadband.

Underneath the general points that have been made, there are probably a couple of major positions that we ought to focus on as we go through these amendments. Surely the default position should be that, like water, gas and electricity, gigabit-capable connections should be available to all premises. The acid test for us on this Bill is whether its measures advance that. The noble Lord, Lord Haselhurst, said that there were points that we could agree did bring us forward, but I think the general feeling so far is that perhaps there is not a deep enough cut being taken from those issues.

My second point is: where are the other pieces of legislation that will back this up? Where are the points that address bringing forward access to all properties on the same terms as other utilities? Where are the measures that will help with works that have to be done on a village-wide or town-wide basis in order to get access to cables? When will we get some sense of the overarching position and the legislation for that?

We support the amendments of the noble Lord, Lord Clement-Jones, and the one raised by my noble friend Lord Adonis. There needs to be broader support for legal occupiers to be able to initiate and unblock the process. I particularly liked a comment made in the middle of the debate about the future ownership of Openreach, and I look forward to the Minister’s response.

Throughout all this we are not in any sense saying that the owner of the property is diminished by any proposals to improve the quality of what is available in the premises. However, we clearly need it to be possible for all properties to be supplied with public utilities, and I think the internet has to be regarded as one. If this is not the case, it is up to the Minister to make very clear today why not. Can she address that point? Will she take back, perhaps for further consideration on Report, the wider concern—it was expressed by the noble Lord, Lord Clement-Jones, and the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh, in particular, but I think was raised by just about everybody—that the Bill actually has not tackled the essential question of who it is talking about when it deals with property rights?

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (Baroness Barran) (Con)]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Stevenson of Balmacara, for his support and that of his colleagues for the Government’s work in this area; I thank all noble Lords in that regard. I also thank the noble Lords who tabled these amendments, which seek to clarify who is able to make a request for a service, and therefore begin a path for an order process.

The noble Lord, Lord Clement-Jones, and my noble friends Lady McIntosh and Lord Holmes raised questions about our 2025 manifesto target and the impact of Covid-19 on achieving that. As many noble Lords noted, the current pandemic has re-emphasised the importance of digital infrastructure in the UK, and we are fully committed and resolved to deliver on this. Obviously, Covid-19 is likely to have an impact on the pace of the rollout in the short term, but we cannot assume that we cannot recover that, make up ground and still meet our target. We are doing everything we can to assure this, including investing £5 billion in the hardest-to-reach areas such as the rural areas to which my noble friends Lord Haselhurst and Lady McIntosh referred.

Questions were also raised by several noble Lords, particularly the noble Lords, Lord Adonis and Lord Clement-Jones, about investment and competition. I cannot comment on the rumours about the status of Openreach, which is obviously something for the BT Group to announce or comment on, but our understanding from subsequent press reports is that the original Financial Times report was inaccurate. Officals will continue to engage with BT and Openreach, but it is ultimately a private company. [Inaudible.] They also raised a number of other questions, particularly in relation to the status of broadband connections as a utility—if I may, I will comment on those in a later group. Some specific and quite detailed questions were also raised which I will respond to in writing, including the question from my noble friend Lord Holmes as regards learning from previous Openreach rollout.

Turning to the specific amendments, I note that Amendment 6 is similar to an amendment tabled in the other place during the passage of the Bill there. I believe that the noble Lords who have tabled the amendment are seeking to ensure that tenants are covered by the Bill. If noble Lords are indeed seeking clarification on that point, I am able to confirm that as currently drafted, the provisions in this Bill can be used by people who rent their homes. This includes people with assured shorthold tenancy or assured tenancy agreements which, as many noble Lords will be aware, are the most common forms of tenancy agreement. These will include second homes and sub-lets as long as they meet the requirements in the Bill. I will confirm this in writing, but my understanding is that in relation to renewable tenancies—a point raised by the noble Lord, Lord Clement-Jones—if they have the characteristics of a lease, they would not be affected by this Bill. [Inaudible.] They would not be covered by this Bill. I can cover the impact of that in a letter to noble Lords.

Our concern is that the amendments as tabled would have a significant effect on the Bill. They would significantly expand the scope of who is able to make a service request to include anyone who is the legal occupant of a property, tenancy, or a freeholder. For example, the amendment could bring into scope a tenant who rents their property from an individual who is illegally sub-letting the property or a short-term lodger in a single room in someone else’s home. I am sure noble Lords will agree that, while the Government are committed to providing widespread access to fast, reliable and resilient broadband, it is important to ensure that the ability to make fundamental changes regarding the rights over property begins with an individual who has a legitimate interest in the property. Furthermore, Amendment 6 would considerably increase the ambit of the Bill and make it very different from the model which was consulted on. The Bill as drafted already works in respect of tenants, so noble Lords will appreciate the unintended consequences of extending the definition to those who may begin a Part 4A process.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Barran]

I thank the noble Lord for his remarks. Just to clarify, I am sorry if the language sounded pacifying. The noble Lord will remember that in an earlier amendment I talked about the spirit of the Bill being about incentivising communication between landowners and operators. The aim of this is to bring clarity and certainty to all involved, including consumers.

In the consultation we had responses from landowners and local authorities. The noble Lord will not be surprised to know that some who responded thought this was too short a period and some that it was too long, so this feels like a bit of a Goldilocks moment. There is a balance to be struck between the flexibility that the noble Lord rightly points to and clarity and certainty. Based on the consultation responses that we received, we hope that we have achieved that balance.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara]

I am very grateful to all those who have contributed, particularly the Minister, whose detailed explanation deserves further consideration and I will read it very carefully in Hansard. I am also delighted to have escaped at least one amendment that did not get criticised for having unexpected consequences, so I must have got something right on that one.

This is very difficult to get right and I appreciate the difficult issues that have been raised. I will reflect on what has been said. In the meantime, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Data Protection: Age-appropriate Design Code

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Monday 18th May 2020 Lords Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (Baroness Barran) (Con)]

The age-appropriate design code will play an important role in protecting children’s personal data online. The Government notified the final draft of the age-appropriate design code to the European Commission as part of our obligations under the technical standards and regulations directive. The standstill period required under the directive has concluded. The Data Protection Act requires that the code is laid in Parliament as soon as is practicably possible.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab)]

I am delighted to hear that, my Lords, although no date has been given. The Government have a bit of ground to make up here, so perhaps it will not be delayed too long. Does the Minister agree that the Covid-19 pandemic is a perfect storm for children and for young people’s digital experience? More children are online for more time and are more reliant on digital technology. In light of that, more action needs to be taken. Can she give us some information about when the Government will publish their final response to the consultation on the online harms White Paper, for example, and a date for when we are likely to see the draft Bill for pre-legislative scrutiny?

[Baroness Barran]

I spent some time this morning with a group of young people, in part discussing their experience online. The noble Lord is right that the pandemic presents significant challenges, and they were clear that they wanted a safe space online as well as physical safe spaces. The Government share that aspiration. We expect to publish our response to the online harms consultation this autumn and to introduce the legislation this Session.

Covid-19: Holiday and Caravan Parks

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Monday 23rd March 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran]

I agree with my noble friend that we all have a part to play. I also accept that, as human beings, all our lives have been turned upside down in the last few weeks. I am sure that some of the people whom we saw on the TV heading to the countryside perhaps did not appreciate quite how many people were going to be there with them. My noble friend puts her finger on the critical point that we must all be practising social distancing and that must include not undertaking any non-essential travel. However, that is only one part of the strategy. The Government are aiming to have an absolutely comprehensive strategy in this regard.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab)]

My Lords, those who are temporarily resident fall under the points previously made; the Minister has carefully explained how that is happening. However, is there not also a danger that, for those who have more than just temporary residence in parks—which may not have sufficient local resources—that aspect of their lives may not be taken into account? Can the Minister confirm that detailed information about those residences is collected and shared with health providers in the area, to ensure that there is no gap in provision for those who think themselves covered in one area but turn out not to be?

[Baroness Barran]

The noble Lord will be aware that there is a huge amount of mapping of exactly that sort of data, particularly in relation to the most vulnerable groups. An enormous amount of work on this has been going on for several weeks.

Wuhan Coronavirus: Tourism

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Wednesday 26th February 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran]

As I tried to explain in answer to the noble Lord, Lord Lee, the Minister for Tourism is working closely with the industry and the Government. As the noble Lord, Lord Clark, will be aware, we recently announced a tourism deal to meet a number of the issues that he rightly raised.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara (Lab)]

My Lords, the noble Baroness mentioned the work that VisitBritain is doing to try to understand better what the impact will be of this awful situation. I looked at its website this morning and noticed that it was still suggesting that there will be an increase in overseas visitors this year of some 2.9% and a growth in income from £25 billion to £26.6 billion. Does she have current figures to share with the House? Are there any plans that are not just reliant on hope, such as suggesting staycations and other ways in which we might increase the volume of traffic to those who have to suffer disbenefit, from internal resources?

[Baroness Barran]

Obviously, VisitBritain is responsible for the data on its website. I asked the same questions of officials that the noble Lord put to me. Rightly, the view is that there are many moving parts to this and that trying to come up with a number is probably not helpful. What is helpful is to be in constant communication with the sector, listening and engaging with it, and working across government, which is what we are doing.

European Union (Withdrawal Agreement) Bill

Debate between Baroness Barran and Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

Committee: 2nd sitting (Hansard continued) & Committee stage & Committee: 2nd sitting (Hansard continued): House of Lords
Wednesday 15th January 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Barran]

As the noble Baroness understands very well, the adequacy discussions will be broader than strictly personal data and data protection, and will cover these issues. It will be our role to explain to and convince the EU of that, which we are confident we can do.

Similarly in relation to immigration data, which the noble Baroness raised, we believe that there are some misunderstandings about how this provision works. Rather than going into that detail tonight, I can write to her on this. However, we are confident that the provisions included in the Act are fully compatible with EU law, although clearly we recognise that they will be closely scrutinised.

The noble Lord, Lord Stevenson, asked about the independence of the Information Commissioner’s Office. We believe that the ICO is a strong, independent and effective regulator and that its relationship with DCMS upholds that independence. We really do not have concerns that this will be an issue in relation to adequacy.

The noble Baroness referred to the opinion received today from the Advocate-General of the EU; as she said, the opinion is non-binding and the impact will happen only when we have the court’s judgment, although I note her comments on the probability of that. Since the opinion was published only a few hours ago, my officials are currently digesting it, so noble Lords will understand that our ability to comment on these proceedings is limited.

The noble Lord, Lord Stevenson, asked about recitals in the future UK GDPR which still include the EU terminology. Recitals are non-binding in both EU GDPR and future UK GDPR. They are there only as an aid to interpretation and we do not believe that the references to the EU will be confusing.

The noble Baroness, Lady Ludford, referred to the Schengen Information System. I understand that the House will discuss the UK’s access to several EU law enforcement databases on the next amendment. If she will permit it, I think it would be easier to return to that question then.

Both noble Lords asked what will happen if an adequacy decision has not been granted at the end of the implementation period. Obviously both sides have committed clearly, and it is an absolute priority, to make this work, but in the event that an agreement is not reached, the Government have already done a huge amount around no deal, working proactively to communicate companies’ responsibilities in this area—particularly in relation to smaller companies, which we know might find this more challenging. The Information Commissioner’s Office produced a portal to support organisations preparing the standard contractual clauses referred to by the noble Lord, Lord Stevenson.

I fear that time may not permit me to answer any more questions but I will endeavour to write and cover all the important points made. I hope that I have managed to reassure the noble Lord that, once adequacy discussions are under way, both Houses will continue to use all the available scrutiny tools at their disposal to ensure that they are absolutely appropriately informed on the Government’s data adequacy progress and policy. I hope that he will feel able to withdraw his amendment.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara]

Before the Minister sits down, I hope that she can respond to one section of what I was asking about, on the interaction between existing responses to the data adequacy question and the new legislation that the department is working on. Does she feel that the new legislation as previously conceived—and, indeed, as set out in her party’s manifesto—is being progressed and that there is no adverse fallout from that?

[Baroness Barran]

Yes, I can confirm that.

[Lord Stevenson of Balmacara]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lords who have contributed to this short but good debate. It was a robust response. I thank the Minister for the various points that she was able to cover and I look forward to her letter.

I did not raise it, but sitting a bit behind those on the Benches opposite is the question of why such a mess was made on the age-verification issues relating to children’s safety online. In a sense, that is why I asked about future policy in relation to where we were. This is a moving target. I do not want to be critical about this in any sense because it is right that we keep things moving and do not stick on where we were, in some sort of pre-Brexit mode. We must move forward. Life is changing, attitudes are changing and technology is moving forward at a huge pace.

We must be ready to anticipate that but it must not be at the expense of some hard-won decisions that were reached after a lot of debate. They were good decisions in relation to the Bill; both the Home Office and DCMS were heavily involved in them and I am sure that they are joined at the hip over this wonderfully named data adequacy hub. I wish it well in its future negotiations; I am sure that it is raring to go and that it will be very successful.

That leaves us with a bit of an information gap. Yes, the existing arrangements for getting information can be used, but they are never as efficient or effective as the Opposition want and are probably too frequent and difficult for the Government to respond to. How much better if we had a plan where we could say, “Every two months, you’re going to stand up and say something about it.” Perhaps we can make this work but I hope that this important issue is kept very much at the forefront of the department’s work, that there is an all-government response to this because it applies across the piece, and that we see something positive come from it. With that, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.