The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Housing, Communities and Local Government (Alex Norris)
I am grateful to my hon. Friend the Member for Bexleyheath and Crayford (Daniel Francis) for securing this debate and for setting such a beautiful tone at the start of his speech. He speaks with enormous power as a parent of a child with cerebral palsy who requires full-time care, and also as someone who has a very long record—before his time in this place—of working with local parent groups and national organisations such as Scope and the Changing Places campaign. I know that there will be people watching this debate who relate strongly to the experience he talked about, and the experience that my hon. Friend the Member for Thurrock (Jen Craft) talked about. By bringing those people into this debate, he will have given them such a sense of peace. He did so with such power, and I pay tribute to him for that. His message, which I double underline, is that campaigning works, and I wish to show that, as a Government, we are bringing that spirit to bear as well, because this is such an important issue.
I am proud to have been a long-standing supporter of the Changing Places toilet campaign—long before my time in this Parliament. I have never officially been the toilets Minister, but I have spoken it into existence by telling anyone who will listen what I think. It is a simple truth that access to toilets—Changing Places in this case, and standard public facilities—is about dignity, independence, inclusion and ensuring that everyone, regardless of their needs, can fully participate in their community. No one, as my hon. Friend the Member for Thurrock said, should ever get the message—explicitly or implicitly—that they are not welcome in their own community.
We know that for many people, especially those with complex needs or health conditions, the lack of appropriate toilet provision can be the deciding factor in whether they leave the House, visit the town centre or spend time with friends and family in their community. Without suitable facilities, what should be a normal day out can become a source of stress, exclusion and even risk, and we do not want that for anybody in our communities. That was the spirit not only of my hon. Friend’s speech, but of all the contributions from our colleagues.
The Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government has done remarkable work through the £30.5 million Changing Places toilet programme. I have in the past recognised the work of the previous Prime Minister in this space, and I would like to do so again. These facilities provide the equipment, the space and the security needed by more than 250,000 people across the UK—people for whom standard accessible toilets are simply not suitable for their needs.
The fund has supported the installation of 483 new facilities across 220 local authority areas, and has been a jumping-off point for best practice guidance, mandatory technical design training to local authorities and operational training. I heard what my hon. Friend the Member for Thurrock said about where that has fallen short. We note that and we will make sure that we are communicating as best we can to make sure that, where these valued facilities have been installed, they are accessible, because the people who work in those spaces can help in the appropriate way.
My hon. Friend the Member for Bexleyheath and Crayford was right that investment has been targeted to address gaps where provision is limited or non-existent, particularly in rural towns and coastal communities. It is important to recognise the vital role that transport plays in supporting independence and inclusion, so it must overlap with this agenda. Again, I acknowledge the important work of the Department for Transport, which has made available more than £2.5 million of funding to install Changing Places toilets at motorway service areas and railway stations across the country. My hon. Friend the Member for Newcastle-under-Lyme (Adam Jogee) recognises the well-loved Keele services, but I know that there are many others across the country. Changing Places facilities make it easier for disabled people and their families to travel however and wherever they want and to be confident that their needs will be met. We have heard a bit about how the facilities are made available, and I think that tool is really important.
The Government’s inclusive transport strategy commits us to improving accessibility and ensuring equal access to the transport network for disabled people by 2030. My hon. Friend the Member for Bexleyheath and Crayford has made a very important suggestion about how that could be improved with a single integrated app. I would be keen to meet him to talk further about that, and I assure him that the same goes for my colleagues in the Department for Transport.
Melanie Ward (Cowdenbeath and Kirkcaldy) (Lab)
The Minister is talking about the importance of a single integrated app that would bring together accessible toilet facilities and transport. Does he agree that we need this across the whole of the UK so that my constituents in Fife and constituents in Scotland can travel across the UK? We are, after all, one country, and we need these facilities to be integrated and open to all our constituents. Will he join me in congratulating my hon. Friend the Member for Bexleyheath and Crayford (Daniel Francis) on his amazing campaigning on issues like this?
Alex Norris
On the second question, I absolutely will. My hon. Friend’s contribution to this debate was outstanding, as is his wider work. On the first point, as we begin summer recess, a great number of colleagues will be crossing national borders within the UK—in my case to west Wales, but others will be going to Scotland. It is important that people know where facilities are and that we have integration. I am always keen to work with my counterparts in the devolved Governments, and I certainly would be keen to work with them on this issue.
My hon. Friends the Members for Congleton (Sarah Russell), for Carlisle (Ms Minns) and for South Derbyshire (Samantha Niblett), and all of us to some degree, have talked about a lack of provision in our communities, notwithstanding that there are now 2,600 Changing Places toilets. I hope to give a degree of succour, given the very important change that was made by the previous Government, which I want to recognise. The important change in building regulations in January 2021 meant that new large public buildings, from shopping centres and arts venues to motorway services and sports stadiums, have to have these toilets in them. I can give confidence to colleagues that as developments take place, they will naturally get these facilities.
That is really good news and a very important sign. It shows that although things such as building regulations might sound esoteric, if done thoughtfully and to reflect the lived experience of our communities, they can significantly improve quality of life for people across the country. That change will be coming.
Sarah Russell
That is fantastic, but could the Minister please think about how we can address this issue for those of us with predominantly rural communities that have smaller towns that are unlikely to have very large buildings?
Alex Norris
I will take up that point in the same spirit. The intent of the original programme was to try to fill in the gaps, but clearly from my hon. Friend’s contribution there is more to do, so I will reflect on that and talk with colleagues.
These changes do not happen by accident, so I want to recognise the tireless campaigning of individuals, charities such as Muscular Dystrophy UK, and local authorities, which have been progressive in this space. I would like to personally thank a very good friend of mine in Nottingham, Martin Jackaman, who was at the very heart of this campaign at the beginning. It was he who introduced me to the importance of this issue was when I was a young portfolio holder on my council nearly 15 years ago. The action of such individuals has meant that progress has been made and that we can be confident of more progress to come.
John Slinger (Rugby) (Lab)
Does my hon. Friend agree that there is quite a large amount of ignorance among people who do not need to use these facilities, and that it is incumbent on all of us in this House, our councillor colleagues and others to raise awareness so that people do not just walk on by in towns, not realising the needs of others?
Alex Norris
It is so important that in our naturally busy lives we all do not cut corners, whether by parking in places or using toilets that are not designed for us. We must understand that, when we do so, what may seem a pretty harmless—I suspect it is thoughtless—act could have a profound impact on an individual who needs those spaces that affects not only their day but whether in future they will be willing to venture into that amenity. I do not think anybody would want to have that impact. We must all reflect on the impacts we have and, therefore, on how we might mitigate them in the future and stop these things from happening.
This has been an important debate. As we can see from the number of colleagues in the Chamber, we could have done with much longer—there is certainly much more I would like to have said on public toilets—but I know that we will have such opportunities in the future. The progress that has been made so far is a result of really heroic individuals, campaigners and charities, and has happened because people have shared what are often some of the worst experiences of their and their families’ lives. We are better for their willingness to do so. I want them to hear me say from the Dispatch Box that, yes, we want them to keep campaigning and fighting—that is what we will all do—and that in us they have a Government who understand the issues they are talking about and want to be their partner in improving them.
Question put and agreed to.