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Lord Godson
To ask His Majesty’s Government what assessment they have made of the threat from Hezbollah to the United Kingdom (1) since the group was proscribed in its entirety in 2019, and (2) since the assassination of its leader, Hassan Nasrallah, on 27 September.
Lord Godson (Con)
My Lords, there is now an impressive consensus across all the mainstream parties in this House on the global threat of the Islamic Republic of Iran and its allies in the so-called axis of resistance. Hezbollah, which has been proscribed here in its entirety since 2019, is of course the jewel in the crown of Iranian proxy organisations. Its reach extends across south Asia, south-east Asia, North America, South America and Africa. Its part in forging its own unique version of a Shiite crescent in the Middle East under the tutelage of the regime in Tehran is well known, above all to many of the UK’s closest allies in the region.
However, my focus today is on the impact of Hezbollah on the domestic security and extremism policies of the United Kingdom. Noble Lords will be only too aware that this widespread agreement on the danger of Iran has been powerfully articulated in testimonies from the director-general of the Security Service, Ken McCallum, and the assistant commissioner for specialist operations, Matt Jukes.
How do we build on this widespread political agreement to shape more effective policy, the better to protect ourselves and our allies? The current rapid review of extremism being conducted by the new Home Secretary gives us a chance to undertake a reappraisal of counter- measures against Hezbollah, its allies and its sponsor in Tehran. In particular, the review needs to look at every aspect of the Home Office’s work, from security and policing to immigration policy. All these functions, interconnected though they are, are still too often not regarded as such.
That does not simply mean countermeasures against the use of physical force by Iran and its proxies. It also means countermeasures against violent extremism and proselytisation: as my noble friend Lord Cameron of Chipping Norton, once put it, the need to combat the spread of a grievance culture that poisons the minds of some young Muslims.
It also includes the disruption and prosecution of criminal activities by Hezbollah, described by my right honourable friend Tom Tugendhat MP, an outstanding Security Minister under the last Government, as the most prolific traffickers of drugs and children in the Middle East. Indeed, such is its criminality that the former US FBI official Matt Levitt, in his new book on Hezbollah, has described it as not so much the party of God as the party of fraud.
First, we need much more public information from the Government about the nature of the threat of the so-called axis of resistance to our society. There is a growing tendency of successive Governments of all hues—and I very much hope that the new Government will break with this approach—to take refuge in the formula that they cannot discuss basic public policy questions in this area by invoking “operational reasons”. The term “operational reasons” is thus beginning to suffer from real mission creep.
There is one other dimension to this lack of information. I noticed that in recent weeks the noble Baroness, Lady Hoey, asked two Written Questions that to my mind did not receive the Answers they deserved. First, she inquired how many convictions there had been in the past year relating to Hamas and Hezbollah. The noble Lord, Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede, replied that it is not possible to identify offences relating to specific groups and that it would be too expensive to examine individual court records for that. I have the greatest respect for the for the noble Lord and have enjoyed my dialogue with him, not least on the affairs of Northern Ireland, but I do not agree with that formulation in this case.
Likewise, in response the next day to the second Question from the noble Baroness, Lady Hoey, on how many had been arrested and charged for Hamas and Hezbollah offences in the last 12 months in this country, the Minister here, the noble Lord, Lord Hanson of Flint, referred her to the data in the quarterly Home Office publication, Operation of Police Powers under the Terrorism Act 2000. There is a welcome breakdown in that document by nationality but, again, not by proscribed organisation. Once more, I have the greatest respect for the noble Lord, Lord Hanson, not just for his service in Northern Ireland and his work on the Intelligence and Security Committee but for being so open and having his doors open to Members, just as he pledged he would in his maiden speech last July, but I wonder whether Ministers should start taking a harder look at the time-honoured approach of the official line—and of some of their officials—that it is simply not worth the effort to provide the requisite breakdown by proscribed organisation. The interests of officialdom are not always identical to those of the political echelon. At a minimum, surely someone in counterterrorism policing must know the figures at hand.
In this connection, under the Pursue strand of the Contest strategy, I ask the Minister how many priority investigations are currently being undertaken by the agencies on the activities of Hezbollah and the wider so-called axis of resistance? What percentage of priority investigations do these investigations into the axis of resistance comprise?
But the task for Ministers goes beyond that of focusing on the immediate threat of physical force from terrorism; it also entails countering in the ideological realm. Thus, the 2023 Independent Review of Prevent stated of the Home Office’s Research, Information and Communications Unit, RICU:
“Since early 2019, the government has proscribed both Hizbollah and Hamas in their entirety. I would have expected to see research from RICU providing an in-depth investigation on the pro-Hizbollah support network within the UK, and a commitment to do so for the more recently proscribed whole of Hamas”.
The Prevent review was accepted in full by the previous Government. Will the Minister tell us today what research into Hezbollah networks in the UK has been or is now being conducted by RICU and how many Prevent referrals relating to Hezbollah and key entities in the wider so-called axis of resistance there are?
I also ask the Minister whether we should not now consider following the example of Germany’s Office for the Protection of the Constitution—the Verfassungsschutz —and other European partners to produce regular analyses for public consumption of key ideological strains in Islamist and other very real extremist challenges. In particular, can the Minister assure us that rebuttal is being undertaken by RICU of relevant narratives emanating from some supporters of all branches of the axis of resistance?
For example, when the Houthis began attacking western shipping lanes in the Red Sea, leading to retaliatory strikes, so-called “anti-war protesters”, as we all know, chanted “Yemen, Yemen, make us proud, turn another ship around”. The threat posed by the Houthis and their patrons to our economic well-being is obvious, and the Security Service Act 1989 states that one of MI5’s statutory responsibilities is that of
“the economic well-being of the United Kingdom”.
Another area where Ministers need to keep a close eye is the interaction between the security and immigration workstreams of the department. In the last Parliament, I asked the then Conservative ministerial team at the Home Office how many minister of religion and religious worker visas had been issued to Iranian nationals. It emerged that just under 100 such visas to enter the UK had been issued since 2005. Doubtless, there will be many genuine individuals among that bunch, but we cannot be sure. Similarly, the UK has now allowed 52 Lebanese civilians to enter the country on religious worker or minister of religion visas since 2005. Again, information is not recorded in terms of the denomination or the sectarian affiliation of those Lebanese citizens who have received visas. Should they not now start to be recorded as such? Is it not time to consider giving a more detailed breakdown of those to whom we accord the significant privilege of the right to work in this country?
Indeed, when the right honourable Member for Newark, Robert Jenrick, was Immigration Minister, a review of visa policy concerning Iran was flagged prominently in the media; was that review ever conducted, let alone completed? If not, will those issues now be addressed in the rapid review of extremism policy and security policy being conducted by the present Home Secretary?
I come back to the long-term question of charitable networks and giving. Inevitably, after the events of 7 October last year and following recent events in Lebanon, there will be a rise in giving to alleviate genuine human suffering in the region. This is, of course, to be welcomed, but it inevitably poses new challenges to our overstretched system of charitable regulation when funds may go to those posing as humanitarian bodies but which have other sectarian and even terrorist agendas. How many regulatory cases or statutory inquiries does the Charity Commission have open in relation to those involving Iranian, IRGC and other Iranian proxies such as Hezbollah, bearing in mind that the Charity Commission is accountable to Parliament under the Charities Act 2011?
I end, as I began, with the point about cross-party consensus on the threat of Iran and its proxies. Considering the measure of accord here in Westminster, there is no excuse now for an absence of action. As things have worked so far with successful proscriptions, there is a suspicion that it is too often treated as a symbolic act, as a kind of glass ceiling, and too often not implemented in full. I very much hope that this will change with the outcome of the forthcoming review by the Home Secretary. If the Minister in responding today can show real progress towards addressing the global threat of the axis of resistance more effectively, bringing all the elements of national power together, both at home and abroad, then I am sure those measures will enjoy the widest possible support across this House.
Lord Browne of Ladyton (Lab)
My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Godson, for affording us the opportunity to examine this Question today. It is a debate that is timely and of significance, and the forensic nature of his opening remarks is wholly concordant with the significance of the issues we are discussing. Mindful of severe time constraints, I wish to ask my noble friend the Minister three questions. Before I do, though, I think it is worth examining one of the premises of the Question before your Lordships’ House, and that is the efficacy of proscription.
In examining that, I do not resile from the basis on which Hezbollah was proscribed in its entirety in 2019. I concur with the judgment of the then Home Secretary that a distinction between the political and military elements of Hezbollah had become academic, if not meaningless. Equally, I concur with all those who have highlighted the appalling anti-Semitism that is not an adjunct to Hezbollah’s world view but central to it.
But we must be clear that such proscription largely is a symbolic gesture, offering British police the ability to prevent open displays of support domestically, but little more. Our proscription of Hezbollah does not degrade its operational capacity nor its ability to foment violence and conflict in the Middle East. In this context, proscription puts me in mind of Douglas MacArthur’s somewhat jaded observation:
“Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword … never encountered automatic weapons”.
I seldom quote that observation, save with disapproval, but it finds an unfortunate echo in this context.
Hezbollah and those who range themselves under its banner care nothing for our moral disapproval. In the longer term, the only answer to Hezbollah is to degrade its capacity, cut off its avenues of funding and vigorously contest those who seek to give it endorsement or legitimacy. Given the limited ability of proscription, it is surely important that the few provisions it does offer are enforced.
Could I ask my noble friend the Minister about the recent comments of a Metropolitan Police officer who, in the face of open support for Hezbollah evinced at a recent march in London, responded with the somewhat circular statement “Your opinion is your opinion”. It is, of course, contrary to the provisions of the Terrorism Act 2000 to display or incite support for a proscribed organisation. Proscription is not merely a gesture but an empty gesture unless the police are briefed adequately in advance of such events.
On a related matter, I should be grateful if my noble friend could update your Lordships’ House on the Government’s current thinking around the possibility of proscribing the Iranian Revolutionary Guard. I ask that not because I am hoping to elicit a specific answer but because I am conscious of the possible cost of so doing in relation to our diplomatic channels with Iran.
In my last few seconds, I would like to ask for the views of my noble friend on the first speech given by Sheikh Naim Qassem, the successor to Hassan Nasrallah. In the same address, he claimed that he “doesn’t want war” and is only aiming to “respond” to aggression while also threatening to strike the Israeli Prime Minister’s residence and expressing his contentment for the current conflict to last many more months. Given this, to put it generously, somewhat opaque set of remarks, I close by asking my noble friend to share any assessment the Government have made of any changes to Hezbollah’s operational approach, consequent on the change of leadership.
Lord Carlile of Berriew (CB)
My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Godson, for his inspiration in having this debate and for his searching speech. We look forward to the Minister’s answers.
I would like to approach this issue in a slightly different way. In my view, one of the answers to the question posed by the noble Lord, Lord Godson, is by increasing the efforts that our country makes in diplomacy in Lebanon and the region. If Lebanon could emerge from its current political stasis and from the tragic situation it finds itself in militarily, then Hezbollah would matter but little in that country. It would be diminished by Lebanon becoming once again part of the comity of nations.
As it happens, I have a very close friend, Dr El Zein, who is a distinguished academic working in Beirut. He is a family man who is connected with many politicians there; he is not a politician himself. He and I have been speaking every day for the last few weeks, and he has been sending me his daily diary which includes his family moving to their little flat in the mountains but with another 20 people there with them. It is part of what has been happening in Lebanon.
I ask our Government to recast their approach to Lebanese politics and to resist merely following in the slipstream of the United States, which since 2006 has been responsible for what has become inept diplomacy and the increase of the power of Hezbollah. The Lebanese people are now hugely angry with Iran, the proxy warrior that supplies the weapons and experiences almost none of the grief.
Our Government should engage with other European Governments, as well as with the United States, and with all parliamentarians in Beirut, including Hezbollah. I know that our Government are very reluctant to talk to even Hezbollah members of parliament there, but that is an unrealistic approach. They do not like what is happening in their country at the moment either.
Why do we not help them towards, for example, the election of a new President, through the parliament system of electing a President? They have been without a President for two years. There are candidates who could become President of Lebanon who would be recognised throughout the world for what they have done as economists, bankers and businesspeople, and in other ways. Lebanon will not have its place in the world without a new President. This would also increase the respect in which our country and our Foreign Office are held. Iran has betrayed Lebanon. We can help the Lebanese back into a position of welcome among nations.
Baroness Foster of Aghadrumsee (Non-Afl)
My Lords, I thank my friend, the noble Lord, Lord Godson, for bringing this important issue to the Floor of the House today and for his comprehensive introduction to this short debate. As someone who has lived with and through terrorism, I want to reflect, albeit briefly, on the nature of terrorist organisations and what must be done by democrats to fight them. Iran-backed Hezbollah is a vicious terrorist group that must be defeated.
There are three elements in the battle against terrorists. First, at a strategic level, democratic Governments must engage and destroy the narrative of the group. The noble Lord, Lord Godson, referred to this. Propaganda, of course, provides a strong crutch to these terrorist factions and in some cases allows them to justify their existence and operations to those who do not know better. I would like to see from the Government a stronger action plan—if there is an action plan at all—to deal with the claims put forward by Hezbollah and its proxies here in the United Kingdom. We should not just condemn their actions but deal with the narrative, including their ultimate goal of the eradication of Israel.
Secondly, at an operational level, we must erode and subvert the networks these organisations work through for money and support generally. Hezbollah, as we have heard, is a global terrorist and criminal organisation and works through often complicated systems to build its empire. We must do all we can to make it not just difficult but impossible for these people to work in the way they do at present. Sadly, without proscription of the IRGC in the UK, any threat of Hezbollah will continue to rise under its protection and support. I ask the Minister why the Government appear to have changed their stance on IRGC proscription since taking office in July.
Thirdly, at a tactical level we must be intelligence led to deter and prevent attacks not only here in the UK but across the world and particularly in our British Overseas Territories, such as our sovereign base in Cyprus. It is so important that we break up the terrorist infrastructure and reassure the public that they are being protected. In that regard, I pay tribute to our security services for all their unseen work in keeping us safe.
Strategic, operational and tactical: these are the three levels at which we must deal with terrorism whether domestically or internationally. Operationally and tactically, on the whole the UK Government and security services were good at dealing with the IRA and terrorism in general in Northern Ireland. Unfortunately, they did not deal with and challenge the narrative and the propaganda set up by terrorists and their spokespeople, and we still live with that legacy today.
I ask the Minister, who knows Northern Ireland very well, to bear the lessons of Northern Ireland in mind when dealing with the threat from Hezbollah. I ask him and his colleagues to engage and destroy the narrative of these evil men, to proscribe the IRGC and, by doing this, to take the propaganda rug from under their feet.
Baroness Foster of Oxton (Con)
My Lords, the threat of terrorism has increased. Long before the recent and welcome assassination of Hassan Nasrallah, we can recall 7/7, the Manchester Arena suicide bomber—the worst atrocity carried out on British soil—and others not that long ago.
Like many here, I have spent my entire life being aware of the consequences of inadequate security, both national and international. As a young woman I was trained to deal with hijackings and bomb threats, and witnessed terror groups such as the PLO, Black September and the IRA causing carnage and death. But the influence of the Muslim Brotherhood and the rise in Islamic extremism across Europe and the West, along with the barbaric regime of the Islamic Republic of Iran and its proxies, are without doubt the most potent threat.
The massacre and slaughter of men, women and children last October in Israel, along with the hostage-taking, were war crimes. Yet the UN and its corrupt agencies turned a blind eye and continue to kowtow to our enemies, such as Russia, North Korea and the Islamic Republic of Iran. Meanwhile, authorities here have permitted weekly protests—screaming mobs spewing hatred, death and destruction of Jews. Anti-Semitism is the order of the day, with Nazi placards held high and anyone daring to challenge often arrested and locked up. These people are sympathisers who are guilty by association and have been allowed to become emboldened by weak leadership. The police and too many spineless politicians stand by, wringing their hands and clutching their pearls like so many others.
Multiculturalism is a myth, while political correctness has stifled debate, particularly if you are on the right, like me. Clerics from mosques across the UK are still calling for jihad, whipping up hatred and brainwashing children. There is concrete evidence and nothing is done, leaving many decent people too scared to speak out. As I said a year ago, staying silent is not an option.
In conclusion, as Lady Thatcher once said:
“The first duty of any Government is to safeguard its people against external aggression. To guarantee the survival of our way of life”.
Without that, there is no future. What steps are this Government taking to strengthen our protection?
Lord Bew (CB)
My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Godson, for securing this debate. I know, as I read the wording of the debate, that when he refers accurately to the proscription of Hezbollah in its entirety since 2019, some noble Lords in this House will sigh—noble Lords whose opinions I respect—and say “Proscription? Is this all we can talk about? What use is that really?”. I am sure that is an inevitable emotion that accompanies this debate. However, we are still in a world where proscription is necessary and required, and possibly has to be extended for the reasons given by the noble Baroness, Lady Foster.
While we are in this world, let me explain that for 12 years I was the chairman of the Anglo-Israel Association. I regularly argued to my Israeli audiences that there was a requirement to support a two-state solution. I regularly said to them, “Do not be obsessed with the ideology of the other side”. Had David Trimble been so obsessed in 1998 about what the IRA was saying —every word in the green book—there would never have been a Good Friday agreement. In the aftermath of that, I was very keen to say, especially to Israeli audiences, “Don’t be obsessed about this talk of Hezbollah leading to the extinction of Israel and so on. Let’s see if we can have a dialogue; let’s see what understanding we can have”. I am well aware that there are many people who still believe in that. They look at the reference to proscription and say that it is the wrong way to go and that a free-flowing, open dialogue is the way forward, however difficult it is.
However, the truth is that since 7 October the world has changed in this respect. I can no longer make the advocacy I made for so many years as chairman of the Anglo-Israel Association. I still believe in a two-state solution—at least, I refuse to rule it out—but I can no longer say, “Forget the underlying ideology of the other side, in the way that we did”. The ideology of Hezbollah and its amazingly self-destructive decision to back Hamas following the events of 7 October show that the form of dialogue that one once advocated no longer exists. Therefore, unfortunately, we are in a world where we have to talk about proscription. That is the realpolitik at the moment.
Baroness Fox of Buckley (Non-Afl)
I thank the noble Lord, Lord Godson. I would like to follow his excellent introduction by raising concerns about the very same ideological threat posed by Hezbollah to the UK that we just heard about. It is extraordinary how normalised it has become at demonstrations on UK streets that, alongside aggressive, inflammatory anti-Israel chants, we are likely to see placards or hear slogans lauding Hezbollah as freedom fighters and rebranding its recently killed, warmonger leader Nasrallah as a brave warrior. We might ask: are such attitudes solely the spontaneous reactions to a brutal geopolitical conflict?
Something that might give us pause for thought are the words of Mohammad Raad, head of the Hezbollah group in Lebanon’s parliament, who boasted in an interview with Russia Today in June:
“We’re currently investing in protests and demonstrations in Western countries, especially among college students. We already have Muslim students agitating, but it’s the Western students themselves who will destabilize their own countries”.
No doubt there is a bit of hyperbole here, but it is really chilling to hear this explicit threat to the stability of western society, and it needs to be taken seriously. Can the Minister respond to the claim that Hezbollah is investing in demonstrations in the West? Do the Government have any knowledge of such financial support for UK street protests and campus encampments?
There seems to be a concerted attempt by agitators to give popular legitimacy to proscribed organisations, such as Hezbollah, Hamas, the Houthis and so on, whose USP is the destruction of Israel and whose propaganda is dripping in visceral anti-Semitism. Can the Minister explain how the criminal offence of supporting a proscribed organisation such as Hezbollah is understood? When it is so brazenly vocalised on our streets, but seemingly ignored by the police or authorities, it causes public confusion.
I am resistant to criminalising such verbal support, not only because of the importance of freedom of speech—one of those western values that Hezbollah and other Islamists want to destroy—but because I think we need more speech to counter this threat. If pro-Hezbollah propagandists are agitating on campus, we need to join that battle of ideas to win hearts and minds; but it feels like there is some inconsistency here. The Government seem unabashed at calling out some forms of extremism—rather promiscuously, in my view, calling too many people far right—but where is the high-profile government campaign to name and shame and expose the ideas of those peddling Hezbollah et al’s hateful anti-Jewish ideologies?
In a week that has witnessed the daubing of red paint on Jewish charities, for God’s sake, and respectable opinion calling for boycotts of Jewish authors, perhaps we must take more seriously the bigotry being peddled in the West and realise just how urgent it is that we tackle radical Islamist ideas in public.
Baroness Helic (Con)
My Lords, I thank my noble friend for securing this debate, though I regret that it is a brief one. The Middle East’s challenges profoundly affect our national security, our social cohesion and the security and well-being of our citizens. Given this, I hope more time can soon be allocated to ensure a thorough debate, not only about the crises themselves but about their profound impact on communities in Britain, including the Jewish community, in the wake of the terrorist attack last year.
The proscription of any group that could endanger British lives and interests is an essential part of any Government’s strategy to disrupt terrorist organisations and their supporters. Whether it is al-Shabaab, Hezbollah, Sonnenkrieg, Hamas or the Wagner Group, the Government’s response sends a strong and important message of our society’s rejection of terrorism and support for measures against it. This we must support. But while proscription may be a visible and necessary short-term measure, achieving what is best for the United Kingdom and her citizens also requires more comprehensive strategies that address the root causes of extremism itself.
Two immediate examples come to mind. The first is Lebanon. While the original confessional formula—derived from the French colonial dispensation—was good for civic peace and gradual democratic development, it created other problems, including an eventual extension of regional politics into domestic affairs. This system has been maintained by various groups, particularly the Shia community in southern Lebanon, where Hezbollah holds influence. It has also enabled external actors—especially Iran, Syria and occasionally Israel and Saudi Arabia—to interfere in Lebanon’s affairs. It is tragic to see the people of Lebanon pay the price for the lack of peace in the region.
The second example is the instability of the Middle East, including the unresolved issue of a Palestinian state. Addressing the interconnected challenges of Israel’s security and broader Middle East stability is impossible without resolving the Israeli-Palestinian conflict through a commitment to justice and adherence to international law, bringing about a two-state solution premised on two states living side by side with secure and recognised borders, with Jerusalem as the shared capital of both.
What is my noble friend the Minister’s assessment of the future of the Middle East peace process? If it is truly over in the form in which we have known it for years, what is going to be put in its place? For absolute clarity, I fully support the proscription of organisations that endanger Britain and her interests, but we cannot treat only the symptoms without looking at the causes. For long-term security, we must make sure we do both.
Lord Alderdice (LD)
My Lords, I have listened with great interest to the various contributions to this debate on the threat to the UK from Hezbollah. My concern for a peaceful outcome to the tragedy of the Middle East goes back many years. After the negotiation of the Belfast/Good Friday agreement in 1998 and the IRA’s decision in 2005 to decommission its weapons, I explored similar possibilities elsewhere. I met with Hezbollah in Beirut in July 2005, and it asked me to prepare a paper on the decommissioning of weapons. After it received and studied the paper, it asked me to return and discuss with it the possibilities for a process, and I did that. Sadly, the 2006 south Lebanon war destroyed the prospects for that initiative: of course, groups do not give up weapons if they think they might need them. Since then, as the noble Lord, Lord Bew, said, the situation has deteriorated, and we face a very different world now.
Every community has the right to defend itself, including ourselves in the United Kingdom. Tonight we focus on the defence of the United Kingdom. My concern, however, is that, while it is appropriate, and indeed vital, for the security services to do all they can to protect us and for the Government to take this seriously—we will listen with interest to what the Minister says—it is important for us not to focus all our thoughts on the escalation of rhetoric and force. That is happening globally and is leading us to an existential crisis that could envelop the whole of that region—and much more widely—in a terrible war, going beyond even that which there has been.
For that reason I particularly welcome the intervention by the noble Lord, Lord Carlile of Berriew, talking about trying to engage with those constructive people in the Middle East and more widely. Of course it is true that this may not work, but we must be careful not to focus all the time on force as the way to address it. This is why I called in the SDR debate for us not only to build up our forces and our matériel but to focus on the stratagems for de-escalation. In all the wars we are currently facing, the situation is getting worse; people are increasingly tossing around the possibilities of the nuclear option in almost all these conflicts. It is said so easily—it drops so easily from the tongue—and I think that people have forgotten the consequences of any kind of nuclear intervention: they are utterly catastrophic. So in all that we say and do, while we take care to defend and to oppose those who do and say what is wrong, we must try to de-escalate rather than add fuel to the fire.
Lord Wolfson of Tredegar (Con)
My Lords, I thank my noble friend Lord Godson for securing this admittedly short debate on such an important matter. I apologise to him and the House for missing the first five seconds of his remarks.
I will make three short points, picking up some of the points made by others. First, who or what is Hezbollah? It is an Iranian proxy. Iran’s recent direct attacks on Israel are a stark reminder of the existential threat that Israel faces. These Benches unequivocally support Israel’s right to defend itself, including in Lebanon against Hezbollah, whose attacks have led thousands of Israelis to be and remain refugees, in effect, in their own country. I hope the Minister can reassure us that the Government will rally the international community to reaffirm its commitment to the implementation of Security Council Resolution 1701, which is the basis for the peace we all crave.
My second point is on Hezbollah’s threat to the United Kingdom. There is a clear risk that the UK could be threatened through an attack on our sovereign military bases in Cyprus. In April, the then leader of Hezbollah—the leadership of these organisations has recently changed so quickly—issued a threat to Cyprus, which was widely seen as a threat to our bases there. The head of MI5 has warned that the threat of Iran-backed terror activity in the UK itself is very high, confirming that the agency had dealt with 20 Iranian-backed plots on British soil in the last couple of years. Of course, Hezbollah has form for such attacks. Earlier this year, an Argentine court ruled that the 1994 bombing of the Jewish community centre in Buenos Aires, which killed 85 people and wounded more than 300, was carried out by Hezbollah, at the direction of Iran.
My third and final point is on enforcing the law, and there are two parts to this. First, in the UK, as we have heard, Hezbollah has been proscribed as a terrorist organisation in full since 2019—that means that inviting support for Hezbollah is a criminal offence. But we also invite the Government to enlighten us again this evening on the current status of proscribing the IRGC. The noble Lord, Lord Coaker, was very vocal about this, as is his wont, and we look forward to the Minister updating us on this issue.
Secondly, Parliament makes the law and our independent police and the independent CPS enforce it. When people chant at a demo, “Yemen, turn a boat around”, they mean not Yemen but the Houthis. When they shout, “Lebanon, turn a tank around”, they mean not Lebanon but Hezbollah. So we as a Parliament are entitled to look to our independent police and CPS to enforce the laws that we have passed. We on these Benches will support the Government in working for peace in the Middle East but also in keeping the peace on our streets here in the United Kingdom.
The Minister of State, Home Office (Lord Hanson of Flint) (Lab)
I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Godson, for securing this debate, and to all noble Lords who spoke. I have a little more time than I initially anticipated to respond to the points made. I hope I can cover them in that time. A lot of ground has been covered, but it is worth reflecting back.
I note the points made by the noble Baronesses, Lady Helic and Lady Fox, on the reasons why Hezbollah was proscribed in the first place. It was proscribed as an external security organisation in 2001, the entire military wing was proscribed in 2008, and it was proscribed in its entirety in 2019. I put on the record that this reflects the assessment that was made then by the previous Government that the political and military wings were no longer distinguishable and the whole organisation was concerned with terrorism.
It is important that I begin my response to the noble Lord, Lord Godson, by reflecting upon that because, when Hezbollah was proscribed in 2019, this House heard about the organisation’s long history of involvement in terrorism; I note the reflections of the noble Baroness, Lady Foster, on those issues. The Home Secretary then was extremely clear that Hezbollah was an organisation that was committed to armed combat, that violently opposed the Israeli people, that destabilised a fragile Middle East, and whose terrorist attacks had reached into Europe. I hope that reassures the noble Lord, Lord Wolfson of Tredegar, that this new Government share that assessment and that view.
Hezbollah has been involved in, or responsible for, numerous atrocities over decades. Hezbollah’s attacks on Israel over the past year, referred to by the noble Lord, Lord Bew, have driven more than 60,000 people from their homes, and the terrorist violence directed by Hezbollah over many years is, quite simply, unacceptable and intolerable—that view is shared across this House. This House should support the proscription, as it has previously.
It is important to put on the record that proscription is a powerful counterterrorism tool. It sends not only a strong message but a message about the morals of this House, this Government and the cross-party consensus on that. That has served not just in this context but in others, as was mentioned by a number of noble Lords and noble Baronesses across this House. It is right that the Government call out terrorism wherever it exists in the world. I say to the noble Baroness, Lady Foster, that this Government share the aspiration that the first duty of government is to protect its citizens from attack. I hope that that is not a dividing line between the noble Baroness and this Government, because we will not stand for terrorist attacks on our people or for organisations permitting the undertaking of terrorist attacks.
The UK’s proscription regime is respected around the world, and I say to my noble friend Lord Browne that it is an opportunity for us to ensure that proscription does in fact make it harder for Hezbollah to finance and fundraise. It makes its assets subject to seizure as terrorist property, and it makes it an offence to wear clothing or carry articles in a public way to arouse reasonable suspicion that an individual is a member or supporter of Hezbollah. Those linked to Hezbollah may be excluded from the UK using immigration powers. I say to the noble Baroness, Lady Fox, that those are severe and strong penalties, and it is the job of the law enforcement agencies to make and continue that assessment. RICU, which has been mentioned in this debate, continues to make ongoing assessments of these matters, reporting to Ministers across government. Those are key issues that we need to reflect on concerning the powers that can be exercised by this Government.
A number of issues were raised, and I will refer to each in turn. First, what are the Government doing to tackle individuals who support terrorist organisations such as Hezbollah in the UK and online? The tools and powers captured in government policy on Pursue, Prevent, Protect and Prepare are flexible and agile enough to make the assessment—with the support of the security services, the crime agencies and RICU—to ensure that the Government can tackle all forms of terrorism, including support for proscribed organisations.
In response to the noble Lord, Lord Godson, I say that this House should note that, since October last year, there has been a 15% increase in intelligence submissions following the 7 October attacks, compared with the same period the previous year. By June, the national counterterrorism referral unit had received more than 3,000 public referrals relating to the conflict between Israel and Hamas. We will take those issues into account, assess them and examine them in key ways. Some of those were due to other forms of radicalisation, but certainly there is an assessment that that pressure is still there, which is why proscription exists to date.
The noble Lords, Lord Alderdice and Lord Carlile, mentioned the relationship with Lebanon. I think they would wish it to be reconfirmed that the UK Government have given aid to the Lebanese authorities of some £10 million in the last month to respond to issues of shelter and reduced access to clean water. But there is a need to ensure that we have that dialogue and communication, which were mentioned, to tackle some of the long-term areas of concern. To do that, we need a dividing line—and proscription is it—between this Government, their international responsibilities and organisations that seek to commit terrorism.
That brings me on to the assessment, rightly mentioned by the noble Lord, Lord Godson, made by the director-general of MI5, who outlined on 8 October that, since the start of 2022, the UK has responded to 20 Iran-backed plots presenting potentially lethal threats to British citizens and UK residents. This debate is on Hezbollah, but he has mentioned the link with Iran, and it is important that we recognise that link to date.
We have been clear that the behaviour of the Iranian regime, including the actions of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps, poses a threat to the safety and security of the United Kingdom and our allies. That is why we will continue to take strong action and hold the Iranian regime to account. More than 450 Iranian individuals and entities have been sanctioned to date, including the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps in its entirety. As the Home Office, we will lead work on countering those Iranian state threats, making use of the full breadth—and please understand what I mean by that—of expertise of this Government and our world-class intelligence services and law enforcement agencies.
A specific question was asked about proscribing the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps. I am clear that Iran has malign activities and those activities, including the work of the IRGC, are unacceptable. We will continue to keep the full range of tools and powers available to us to tackle the threats that we face from Iran under continuous review. Both the noble Baronesses, Lady Foster of Aghadrumsee and Lady Foster of Oxton, raised a similar issue and both understand, I hope, what that sentence means in terms of our continued assessment of those powers.
My noble friend Lord Browne, among others, mentioned policing of public disorder and the response by police officers to particular protests. As someone who has taken part in many a protest, not necessarily on this topic, I fully accept, understand, respect and wish to have the right of peaceful protest entrenched in our society, but that does not extend to criminal activity. The proscription order on Hezbollah sets down certain actions which are dividing lines between peaceful protest and criminal activity and spreading hate. I say to my noble friend who raised the issue of comments that he has reported from police officers that I think we should give the police powers to act on criminality when they make that judgment. It is not for me, as a Minister, to determine whether a criminal act has taken place, but it is for the police to make their judgments, to use the powers that are there independently—rightly—of government operationally to ensure that if criminal activity in protests takes place, it is dealt with by the police authorities.
Overall, our priority as a Government is to ensure that the decisions that we take strengthen the UK’s national security and support our intelligence services and law enforcement agencies. However, I am sure that noble Lords will understand, and I hope that they will bear with me on this, that many of the points raised about operational issues of the monitoring and deliberation by our security services are ones on which I cannot comment because I do not wish to give succour to anyone. We cannot routinely comment on whether groups are being considered for proscription; we cannot routinely comment on operational activities. However, the National Security Act 2023 provides a significant toolkit for us to fight against individuals working for state entities, like the IRGC, and the UK is now a harder target than it was two years ago. We will continue to keep under review hostile acts against this United Kingdom, including espionage, interference in our political system, sabotage and, indeed, assassination. I hope that noble Lords can be assured that the full armoury of government powers is continually being monitored. Ministers will be kept informed and will report to this House in the event of any changes or decisions on policy issues as a result of that monitoring.
The noble Lords, Lord Carlile and Lord Godson, mentioned Prevent. It is important that we look at the Government’s Prevent programme in the broader sense; it is at the core of reducing the threat from terrorism in the United Kingdom, not just from Hezbollah but across the board. It will continually evolve, and the Shawcross inquiry in February 2023 had 34 recommendations to the previous Government about how Prevent can be improved. We have met 33 of those recommendations. It is important, and transparency is important, but we will soon release further statistics on the referral period from April 2023 to March 2024 in a new publication. I hope, again, that this will be something that this House can scrutinise.
In closing—my 13 minutes are coming to an end— I thank the noble Lord, Lord Godson, for shining a light on the issues in this debate, and thank Members who have contributed. It is of the utmost importance that the Government focus on the security of our citizens at home and abroad and the security of our allies at home and abroad. For this Government, and indeed any Government, the top priority will always be the security of our country and safety of our citizens. Through the deployment of the tools we have, we as a new Government have a resolute commitment to tackling terrorism in all its forms.