Draft Armed Forces Act 2006 (Continuation) Order 2023

(Limited Text - Ministerial Extracts only)

Wednesday 21st June 2023 General Committees

[The Minister for Defence People, Veterans and Service Families (Dr Andrew Murrison)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered the draft Armed Forces Act 2006 (Continuation) Order 2023.

It is the job of parliamentary draftsmen to make legislation sound as dry and routine as possible; in this particular case, the title of the draft order that we are considering does not do the measure justice. Although I am confident that His Majesty’s loyal Opposition will not oppose the measure—because of the consequences that so doing would bring—it is important to reflect on the historical provenance of what we are debating.

[Luke Pollard (Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport) (Lab/Co-op)]

We are backing the draft order because Labour backs our armed forces, not because of the consequences of not doing so. I want to put that on the record, so that the Minister is not under any false impression about why we are here. We are here to support our armed forces.

[Dr Murrison]

I am very grateful for that, because the consequences of opposing the draft order would be that our armed forces would effectively become ultra vires. That has been the case since 1688 and 1689. It is important to understand that the legislation that underpins the continuation of our armed forces has to be renewed regularly. That is why we are here today.

The statutory instrument extends the Armed Forces Act 2006 until the end of 2024. It is an expression of this Parliament’s right to ensure the continuation of a standing army. That is the basis of the legislation. Without supporting the draft order and extending the legislation, we would have no statutory basis for continuing with our armed forces, with all the consequences that that would bring. Our annual consideration of this legislation is very much a standard piece of parliamentary business, but it is also an opportunity for Committee members to reflect on the professionalism, the personal and collective bravery, and the sacrifice of our service personnel. That is particularly the case as we approach Armed Forces Day on Saturday.

My colleague in the other place, the Defence Minister the noble Baroness Goldie, has mentioned many of the change processes that are happening or have happened in defence recently. She mentioned the imminent defence Command Paper refresh, the Haythornthwaite review on Monday and the Etherton report earlier this month, which came hard on the heels of the Selous and Atherton reviews. I do not intend to focus on those today, but I mention them for the record.

Operationally, we have recently seen a spectrum of engagements by our armed forces, ranging from the successful airlifts from Sudan to Operation Cabrit in support of Estonia. Our armed forces are committed to supporting that which is right, and, of course, nowhere is that more the case than in Ukraine. Many tens of thousands of Ukrainians have been or are being trained across 33 partner nations. I am very pleased to say that the UK is shouldering a very large part of that. Our people have been working tirelessly—I have seen it in my constituency—as part of an operation to ensure that brave Ukrainians are capable of facing down Putin’s illegal aggression. I am particularly proud that our armed forces are inculcating what they are world renowned for doing, which is exercising professionalism, service ethos and fighting practices of the sort, of the standard and at the level that I am confident will ultimately prove decisive in the fight.

The Committee may be reassured that we in the UK, along with our international allies and partners, remain resolute in our support for Ukraine against the Kremlin’s barbarous behaviour, which, I am afraid, will stain Russia for years and years. Last week, defence announced a major new fund that will see a significant package of vital air defence equipment delivered to Ukraine. To achieve that, the UK is working closely with allies so that Ukraine is better able to defend itself against air threats to its people and infrastructure.

I hope that Committee members will support and approve the draft continuation order, which simply provides a sound legal basis for our armed forces to continue to operate.

--- Later in debate ---

[Dr Murrison]

To address that point head on, the SNP spokesperson, the hon. Member for Glasgow South West, will be aware that there was a debate this morning on veterans’ welfare and Veterans UK in Westminster Hall, in which his colleague, the hon. Member for Midlothian (Owen Thompson), spoke very well. I would refer him to the printed record in due course.

I am pleased to hear from the Opposition spokesperson, the hon. Member for Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport, that Labour backs our armed forces. I accept that, although it is worth reflecting that, until relatively recently, the Labour party was led by a politician whose support was hardly unequivocal. Heaven loves a sinner brought to repentance, and I am pleased that in the run-up to Armed Forces Day, the hon. Member for Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport, whose personal commitment I reflect fully, has reiterated his party’s support for the men and women of our armed forces.

I also noted an implied spending commitment. While it is easy for all of us to stand up in this place and say what is wrong, it is more difficult to say how we will put it right. As we get closer to the general election, no doubt those themes will be explored to their fullest. Since we are approaching Armed Forces Day, and in the spirit of some level of collegiateness, perhaps we can reflect upon cuts and reduced headcount not being the exclusive province of one particular political party. Indeed, the peace dividend has weighed upon politicians of both hues as we try to grapple with the competing demands made upon us in terms of our public services.

On headcount, and what the hon. Gentleman cited as cuts, it is important to reflect that what is vital in defence is capability and output. By that measure, our armed forces are punching well above their weight, not because of investments in kit, but because of the excellence of the men and women who operate that kit.

I am very pleased that Lord Terence Etherton has completed his report. The hon. Gentleman knows that Lord Etherton brought his work to a conclusion at a reception that he hosted at the Imperial War Museum earlier this month, which was well received by the community. I had the privilege of speaking at that event. I hope that his report will hit the streets very soon, and, equally, that the Government’s response will be published soon. The hon. Gentleman is right to raise this. The way people were treated between 1967 and 2000 was truly shocking on occasion, and left a stain on defence. It is right that we acknowledge that and do what we can to make amends. I am confident that the Government will do just that.

The hon. Gentleman mentioned Haythornthwaite. I think we are all gradually coming to terms with the enormity of what Haythornthwaite has recommended. It is a complicated report, with 67 recommendations, most of which, it is probably true to say, are strategic in nature. They are overarching and will profoundly affect the way we do people business in defence. We cannot simply do nothing; that is not an option. To do nothing would mean that, as defence, we would wither and die. All militaries have to grapple with demographic change and changing societal mores and attitudes. We are no different, but if we are to compete in the marketplace, we have to change. We cannot expect the remit population to change.

I am confident that when we produce our response to Haythornthwaite, which will be carefully considered, we will have a blueprint to establish how the people side of the business proceeds in the years ahead, but it is a long haul. I hope that the hon. Gentleman will support Rick Haythornthwaite. I have already said that I think his work is sound, and the best basis for proceeding with the recruitment and retention of our people in the years ahead. As for the detail of the Government’s response, the hon. Gentleman will understand that there is quite a lot of work to be done, so that when we come to say what we think about this, what we have makes sense and will convince not just him, but, more importantly, the men and women of our armed forces. Without their consent and that of their families, I do not think we will make progress at all.

My nightmare is the report ending up a little like the Bett report of the 1990s—the last big review of its kind. Although it was useful at the time, much of it sat on a shelf gathering dust, and we have not implemented a lot of it to this day. I said to Rick Haythornthwaite that I do not want that to be the destiny of his report. It therefore needs a proper response from the Government. I am seized of the importance of doing it quickly, and of the importance of doing it properly. That is what we will do.

I think I have addressed most of the points raised by the hon. Members for Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport and for Glasgow South West, but I will happily respond to anything that I have missed in writing.

[The Chair]

Before I put the Question, may I say that it is customary for Members to request permission to remove their jacket in a sitting, and not to assume that permission has been granted?

Question put and agreed to.